Scottish independence: Yes camp hails 'momentum'

[pitrevie]

Well here is a delightful article that shows very clearly what may well happen if Scotland goes it alone.

Note though the Scots are not going it alone the remaining piece of England and its peoples are liable to pick up the bill.

However the short term may be a breeze for the Scots but long term, indeed a very bleak future socially and politically for the Scots.

The S.N.P. are indeed going to be inflicting a serious wound to themselves and the Scottish people in general in their quest for power.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/finance/economics/11082976/Britain-faces-storm-as-giant-global-investors-awaken-to-break-up-dangers.html

It appears we are all in for a bumpy ride I am sure that those now advocating this course of action will not want to complain when they get considerably less baht to the pound.

[jpinx]

Lost 'billions '??? That sounds like the exaggeration of someone with a weak grasp of what is happening

[rajyindee]

It appears we are all in for a bumpy ride I am sure that those now advocating this course of action will not want to complain when they get considerably less baht to the pound.

Why would we complain? My pensions will continue to be paid by the FUK taxpayers in FUK Pounds (or whatever they choose to call their currency).

[loppylugs1]

I know you guys are in a passionate debate, but the News here in Australia has been focused on the Vote next week.

Prime time Radio (drive time afternoon) and TV discussions (Morning Breakfast News).

So many Aussies, who may have been unaware the auspicious Vote about to be undertaken are now the wiser.

.

I'm in the UK at the moment and I can tell you now, not many people really care. Not in England at least. There's a vague passing interest at best.

...and it never will be of much interest

A NO vote will be a disaster for scothland,cowards all,hiding in the shame of things scotsman in kilt used as a mobile pissing post for englishman,their womenfolk used and abused by any passing Englishman, those loud drunken voices now reduced to a whisper.

Oh! the utter shame of it No dancing the highland jig up and down those fairy glens

Shame Shame Shame

[pitrevie]

It appears we are all in for a bumpy ride I am sure that those now advocating this course of action will not want to complain when they get considerably less baht to the pound.

Why would we complain? My pensions will continue to be paid by the FUK taxpayers in FUK Pounds (or whatever they choose to call their currency).

I am sure you are right and that all those guys working in the money markets are bluffing.

[MJP]

I know you guys are in a passionate debate, but the News here in Australia has been focused on the Vote next week.

Prime time Radio (drive time afternoon) and TV discussions (Morning Breakfast News).

So many Aussies, who may have been unaware the auspicious Vote about to be undertaken are now the wiser.

.

I'm in the UK at the moment and I can tell you now, not many people really care. Not in England at least. There's a vague passing interest at best.

...and it never will be of much interest

A NO vote will be a disaster for scothland,cowards all,hiding in the shame of things scotsman in kilt used as a mobile pissing post for englishman,their womenfolk used and abused by any passing Englishman, those loud drunken voices now reduced to a whisper.

Oh! the utter shame of it No dancing the highland jig up and down those fairy glens

Shame Shame Shame

I've yet to hear anyone ridicule the Scots for this, they're just not really bothered either way. There's no ill will. They're just too busy struggling to get by with their stressful day to day existence.

[David48]

The value of the pound has fallen in the wake of an opinion poll which suggested the pro-UK campaign had lost its lead ahead of the Scottish independence referendum.

Sterling fell by about 1.3% against the US dollar to a 10-month low of $1.61.

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-29105565

Mate, I can see where you are going with this ... but to be fair, it was just a contributing factor, abet, a major one.

The USD climbed on the back of this from the Stock Broker ...

But forget stocks, the big move at present is in the Aussie dollar. On Monday night the San Francisco Fed published research warning current low volatility suggests markets are underestimating just how quickly US interest rates could rise. Fed chair Janet Yellen came from the San Fran Fed. On this news, the Aussie spent the night drifting off.

Last night a rumour suddenly spread around Wall Street that a critical phrase will be dropped from next week’s Fed policy statement, that being the longstanding suggestion of rates remaining low for “a considerable time”. We recall that in her debut press conference earlier this year, Yellen put her foot in it when she defined a considerable time as being “six months, something like that”. She subsequently back-pedalled fast, given stock market panic, but most assumed the cat was now out of the bag.

Here

I know, as an investor ... uncertainty is not something that is desirable, and even worse at a Sovereign level.

.

[nontabury]

The value of major Scottish companies has fallen by billions of pounds after the stock market was spooked by polling giving the yes vote a lead ahead of the referendum.

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/08/scottish-independence-companies-billions-of-pounds-value-loss-pro-independence-poll-lead

A while back one of the Nationalist was gleefully making predictions of an economic Armageddon to the UK in the event of separation, implying that somehow, miraculously Scotland would not be affected. Well what is happening, yes the £ has lost approximately 2% of its value against the US dollar, yet I recall reading articles a few months back in which currency traders considered the £ to have been overvalued by approx 5%, just think back one year ago, how many Bhts were you then receiving.

Will this economic uncertainty and turbulence effect everybody's mortgages,pensions savings etc, of course it will, maybe for 3 months or maybe for 18 months, who knows it's anybodies guess, yet to suggest that the Scottish people will be exempt from this upheaval is stupidity at the highest.

What is more telling is what is happening to the stock market, so far it's only gone down slightly, yet on closer analysis of the numbers it would appear that it is mostly Scottish institutions who are seeing their value plummet "why" simple because the markets do not share the nationalist view of a future Scottish economy, in fact Paul Krugman an American ( and also an unbiased observer) Noble award winning economist, says that the Scottish people should be very,very afraid of the economic consequences of separation, while Nicola Sturgeon says the markets are acknowledging the strength of the Scottish economy. Who do you believe has got it right?

=================>>

I agree totally that the current sterling rates dip is much more likely to be a continuation of the trends that sterling has been set on for some time. Sterling will benefit from a yes vote and Scotland continuing to use sterling. The Scottish economy will bloom when it's road into the future is clear. Meantime the "economists" will continue to predict gloom for 2 reasons --

1. They have a reputation to keep and a negative prediction is much easier to justify when it proves to be wrong.

2. They have backed the negative option and have a vested interest in it.

Meantime the stock market putters along with no major trends showing - and that shows investor indifference to the effects of the vote either way. Close analysis of those "Scottish institutions" which are going down will reveal that the effect is for reasons other than looming independence. How many Scottish institutions are actually rising?

As for the bookies, it is well-known that big money has been placed to force the odds in the direction they have gone -- again for reasons of vested interests. There's some people are going to make a killing on a Yes vote

Again a nationalist says Scotland Will continue to use sterling, this they may do, however they will have no control over it, unlike in the present Union. Most if not all the financial institution will re-locate to the UK, taking with them many jobs,contingency plans are already in place, added to this is the knowledge that many government jobs will also move south to areas that at the moment are less prosperous such as the north east and Yorkshire, and for this I do thank you Nationalist. In addition do not forget that many manufacturing jobs such as in the naval shipyards will have to move Back to Portsmouth and other areas in the UK.

Agree the stock market is puttering along, however if you look at those companies linked to Scotland you will notice an increasing slide Down.You mention the reason for Scottish institutions such as Standard Life and Scottish Widows losing millions in value is due to reasons other than separation, please expand on that theory, it certainly is in contrast to the views of the markets and economist.

One last point jinx, why is it you and other Nationalist always accept any data, however biased and negligible it may be,if supplied by the "Yes" campaign, yet strangely completely

brush-off any data supplied by independent sources, such as those Australian analyst, see post 489 and those from an American Noble rise winning economist.

[JockPieandBeans]

It appears to me that the Scots lack any conviction for wanting independence. At least when the Irish expressed the same wish they set up their own currency and they had their own head of state. All we have had from Scotland is a shopping list of what they want to keep while telling us that they really do want independence.

Have to agree. All I see is I want, I want, I want, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. With absolutely no substance.

Reminds me of that little trollop in the programme " Just William "

Here is a pretty hard hitting, and I believe unbiased article.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article47228.html

[nontabury]

It appears we are all in for a bumpy ride I am sure that those now advocating this course of action will not want to complain when they get considerably less baht to the pound.

Why would we complain? My pensions will continue to be paid by the FUK taxpayers in FUK Pounds (or whatever they choose to call their currency).

You may still receive your pension in whatever currency Scotland creates or follows( without any

control over that currency) what pitrevive is alluding to is how many Bhts will you receive for that currency. If for example you were only to receive half the amount you presently receive will you still take that attitude.

For your information the £ converted into Bahts at a rate of 76, this was only 10 yrs ago, not a blip as in 1997 with a rate of 97. Today the rate is 51, next year what? And a Scottish currency probably lower, maybe 30.

[transam]

It appears to me that the Scots lack any conviction for wanting independence. At least when the Irish expressed the same wish they set up their own currency and they had their own head of state. All we have had from Scotland is a shopping list of what they want to keep while telling us that they really do want independence.

Have to agree. All I see is I want, I want, I want, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. With absolutely no substance.

Reminds me of that little trollop in the programme " Just William "

Here is a pretty hard hitting, and I believe unbiased article.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article47228.html

Very informative..... ..........Thanks.

[JockPieandBeans]

It appears we are all in for a bumpy ride I am sure that those now advocating this course of action will not want to complain when they get considerably less baht to the pound.

Why would we complain? My pensions will continue to be paid by the FUK taxpayers in FUK Pounds (or whatever they choose to call their currency).

You may still receive your pension in whatever currency Scotland creates or follows( without any

control over that currency) what pitrevive is alluding to is how many Bhts will you receive for that currency. If for example you were only to receive half the amount you presently receive will you still take that attitude.

For your information the £ converted into Bahts at a rate of 76, this was only 10 yrs ago, not a blip as in 1997 with a rate of 97. Today the rate is 51, next year what? And a Scottish currency probably lower, maybe 30.

It matters not who is paying your pension. If that currency is worth buttons, that is exactly what you will get buttons.

[pitrevie]

It appears to me that the Scots lack any conviction for wanting independence. At least when the Irish expressed the same wish they set up their own currency and they had their own head of state. All we have had from Scotland is a shopping list of what they want to keep while telling us that they really do want independence.

Have to agree. All I see is I want, I want, I want, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. With absolutely no substance.

Reminds me of that little trollop in the programme " Just William "

Here is a pretty hard hitting, and I believe unbiased article.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article47228.html

Great article and has cheered me up no end, now even I am hoping for a YES vote, good luck to the Scots with their journey into the unknown I am sure that Alex Salmond a former RBS banker is going to be a very popular man in Scotland a few years from now.

[smokie36]

It appears we are all in for a bumpy ride I am sure that those now advocating this course of action will not want to complain when they get considerably less baht to the pound.

Why would we complain? My pensions will continue to be paid by the FUK taxpayers in FUK Pounds (or whatever they choose to call their currency).

You may still receive your pension in whatever currency Scotland creates or follows( without any

control over that currency) what pitrevive is alluding to is how many Bhts will you receive for that currency. If for example you were only to receive half the amount you presently receive will you still take that attitude.

For your information the £ converted into Bahts at a rate of 76, this was only 10 yrs ago, not a blip as in 1997 with a rate of 97. Today the rate is 51, next year what? And a Scottish currency probably lower, maybe 30.

Yes it was over 70 not so long ago....and for the UK its now 51.

Yes again.....is that what better together equates to?

Better we pack our bags and leave you little Englanders who can't add up to get on with it!

[loppylugs1]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

[MJP]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

Loopy, why would you want to see either English people or Scottish people "hurting"?

I'm English/Welsh and I've lots of Scottish friends who are very conservative and clean living, smart and hard working. In fact my oldest and closest colleague and friend in my business is a Scot.

Or are you just trying to bait Scottish posters here into a similar diatribe for laughs?

[JockPieandBeans]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

Is there really any need for your diatribe ?

[nontabury]

It appears to me that the Scots lack any conviction for wanting independence. At least when the Irish expressed the same wish they set up their own currency and they had their own head of state. All we have had from Scotland is a shopping list of what they want to keep while telling us that they really do want independence.

Have to agree. All I see is I want, I want, I want, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. With absolutely no substance.

Reminds me of that little trollop in the programme " Just William "

Here is a pretty hard hitting, and I believe unbiased article.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article47228.html

Very good article written by Nadeem Walayat, this is what all these Nationalist should be reading. Thankfully they are so blinkered they will not, thus charging into economic ruin, resulting in the remaining UK being free of these parasites.

[transam]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

Is there really any need for your diatribe ?

Agreed, come on now loppy, some of us bear no grudge or animosity towards Scots, even the ones that slag us Union guys off...

[smokie36]

It appears to me that the Scots lack any conviction for wanting independence. At least when the Irish expressed the same wish they set up their own currency and they had their own head of state. All we have had from Scotland is a shopping list of what they want to keep while telling us that they really do want independence.

Have to agree. All I see is I want, I want, I want, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. With absolutely no substance.

Reminds me of that little trollop in the programme " Just William "

Here is a pretty hard hitting, and I believe unbiased article.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article47228.html

Very good article written by Nadeem Walayat, this is what all these Nationalist should be reading. Thankfully they are so blinkered they will not, thus charging into economic ruin, resulting in the remaining UK being free of these parasites.

Its just one opinion of many. Plenty other articles with different spins on this.

I'm voting YES to rid Scotland of Tory rule forever. Happy days!

[MJP]

It appears to me that the Scots lack any conviction for wanting independence. At least when the Irish expressed the same wish they set up their own currency and they had their own head of state. All we have had from Scotland is a shopping list of what they want to keep while telling us that they really do want independence.

Have to agree. All I see is I want, I want, I want, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. With absolutely no substance.

Reminds me of that little trollop in the programme " Just William "

Here is a pretty hard hitting, and I believe unbiased article.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article47228.html

Very good article written by Nadeem Walayat, this is what all these Nationalist should be reading. Thankfully they are so blinkered they will not, thus charging into economic ruin, resulting in the remaining UK being free of these parasites.

Its just one opinion of many. Plenty other articles with different spins on this.

I'm voting YES to rid Scotland of Tory rule forever. Happy days!

In fairness Smokie, it was the Tories who've given the Scots the option to vote on this. I stand to be corrected, but I believe this to be the case.

[nontabury]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

Loopy, why would you want to see either English people or Scottish people "hurting"?

I'm English/Welsh and I've lots of Scottish friends who are very conservative and clean living, smart and hard working. In fact my oldest and closest colleague and friend in my business is a Scot.

Or are you just trying to bait Scottish posters here into a similar diatribe for laughs?

True, Not all Scots are narrow minded, English hating nationalist, however I suspect that "loppylugs" has over the years become fed up with those who continue to moan about those horrible English people, see post 46, noticing how none of the Nationalist supporters have distanced themselves from these views.

As I said in a previous post I became a supporter of separation 50 yrs ago, again after listening to Some Scots continuously whining about how they are oppressed by those nasty sassanachs

, well seemingly more and more English people have come over to this view. Let's all hope that a separated Scotland will be able to prosper. Just not on the tailcoats of the remaining UK.

[JockPieandBeans]

It appears to me that the Scots lack any conviction for wanting independence. At least when the Irish expressed the same wish they set up their own currency and they had their own head of state. All we have had from Scotland is a shopping list of what they want to keep while telling us that they really do want independence.

Have to agree. All I see is I want, I want, I want, Gimme, Gimme, Gimme. With absolutely no substance.

Reminds me of that little trollop in the programme " Just William "

Here is a pretty hard hitting, and I believe unbiased article.

http://www.marketoracle.co.uk/Article47228.html

Very good article written by Nadeem Walayat, this is what all these Nationalist should be reading. Thankfully they are so blinkered they will not, thus charging into economic ruin, resulting in the remaining UK being free of these parasites.

Its just one opinion of many. Plenty other articles with different spins on this.

I'm voting YES to rid Scotland of Tory rule forever. Happy days!

Smokie

It is your prerogative to vote whichever way you want.

Having read through this thread.

It is very apparent that the nationalists can only see positives and no negatives.

Now only a lunatic would believe that.

So, what do you see as the negatives ?

[MJP]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

Loopy, why would you want to see either English people or Scottish people "hurting"?

I'm English/Welsh and I've lots of Scottish friends who are very conservative and clean living, smart and hard working. In fact my oldest and closest colleague and friend in my business is a Scot.

Or are you just trying to bait Scottish posters here into a similar diatribe for laughs?

True, Not all Scots are narrow minded, English hating nationalist, however I suspect that "loppylugs" has over the years become fed up with those who continue to moan about those horrible English people, see post 46, noticing how none of the Nationalist supporters have distanced themselves from these views.

As I said in a previous post I became a supporter of separation 50 yrs ago, again after listening to Some Scots continuously whining about how they are oppressed by those nasty sassanachs

, well seemingly more and more English people have come over to this view. Let's all hope that a separated Scotland will be able to prosper. Just not on the tailcoats of the remaining UK.

I think the Scots have stunted their own development blaming and hating the English rather than just getting on with it. Been too easy to not bother and blame English people for individual woes. I actually got this from a Scot by the way.

[JockPieandBeans]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

Loopy, why would you want to see either English people or Scottish people "hurting"?

I'm English/Welsh and I've lots of Scottish friends who are very conservative and clean living, smart and hard working. In fact my oldest and closest colleague and friend in my business is a Scot.

Or are you just trying to bait Scottish posters here into a similar diatribe for laughs?

True, Not all Scots are narrow minded, English hating nationalist, however I suspect that "loppylugs" has over the years become fed up with those who continue to moan about those horrible English people, see post 46, noticing how none of the Nationalist supporters have distanced themselves from these views.

As I said in a previous post I became a supporter of separation 50 yrs ago, again after listening to Some Scots continuously whining about how they are oppressed by those nasty sassanachs

, well seemingly more and more English people have come over to this view. Let's all hope that a separated Scotland will be able to prosper. Just not on the tailcoats of the remaining UK.

I think the Scots have stunted their own development blaming and hating the English rather than just getting on with it. Been too easy to not bother and blame English people for individual woes. I actually got this from a Scot by the way.

It is a symptom of delusion that the blame for your woes always lie at the door of others.

Hence the reason that Salmond is pushing for a CU and EU membership.

Its always easy to blame someone else.

[MJP]

^^ We tend to blame our woes on the City of London (as well as the EU). But the English did do it to themselves when they decided house price inflation was to be worshipped like a God and they could have whatever they liked, whenever they liked and all on the never-never.

[siampolee]

It was interesting to my mind back and reread the book ''the elite'' (1991) written by the then Helen Liddell concerning political shenanigans and power struggles and intrigues revolving around Scotland and England.

One is led to wonder whether or not the book may have been a blueprint to a lesser degree in the current situation and also to enhance her and her allies rise to political prominence at the cost of the English people and the parliamentary system.

Strangely enough in the book the central character achieves a delightful sinecure too as a reward for past services and actions performed

http://www.parliament.uk/biographies/lords/baroness-liddell-of-coatdyke/573

Helen Lawrie Liddell, Baroness Liddell of Coatdyke PC (born 6 December 1950) is a British Labour Party politician who was theMember of Parliament (MP) for Monklands East from 1994 to 1997, and then for Airdrie and Shotts until 2005, whereafter she became the British High Commissioner to Australia until 2009. She also served as a Cabinet Minister as Secretary of State for Scotland.

On 28 May 2010, it was announced in the Dissolution Honours List that she would be made a life peer.

[wilcopops]

One of the good things out of this the scoths are going to be hurting a lot more and a lot lot longer than the English.

Also well and truly despised,like to see them in action with their loud slobbish drunken voices down south of the border in the future

Loopy, why would you want to see either English people or Scottish people "hurting"?

I'm English/Welsh and I've lots of Scottish friends who are very conservative and clean living, smart and hard working. In fact my oldest and closest colleague and friend in my business is a Scot.

Or are you just trying to bait Scottish posters here into a similar diatribe for laughs?

True, Not all Scots are narrow minded, English hating nationalist, however I suspect that "loppylugs" has over the years become fed up with those who continue to moan about those horrible English people, see post 46, noticing how none of the Nationalist supporters have distanced themselves from these views.

As I said in a previous post I became a supporter of separation 50 yrs ago, again after listening to Some Scots continuously whining about how they are oppressed by those nasty sassanachs

, well seemingly more and more English people have come over to this view. Let's all hope that a separated Scotland will be able to prosper. Just not on the tailcoats of the remaining UK.

I think the Scots have stunted their own development blaming and hating the English rather than just getting on with it. Been too easy to not bother and blame English people for individual woes. I actually got this from a Scot by the way.

"rather than just getting on with it" - isn't that what independence is all about?

[MJP]

^ Well yes. I hope Scots find a renewed confidence when they vote yes.

[wilcopops]

Billy Bragg seems to agree with me.....

"Now that the English are waking up to the possibility that the Scots may leave the UK, I'm getting tired of reading articles by commentators who say they will feel sad if this happens. They need to grow up - respect for self-determination is the mark of a mature democracy.

While they get all emotional, I'm pleased to see that there are some at Westminster who recognise that the Scots have done us a huge favour by putting English devolution on the agenda."

http://www.theguardian.com/politics/2014/sep/09/scottish-devolution-timetable-powers-english-regions?CMP=twt_gu

Billy Bragg probably just wants to create more civil servants.

I'd say that's a pretty fatuous comment.