Laulen

Council of Political and Administrative Reform set up - several of Thaksin's closest aides have been arrested.

Seizure of power is 'temporary' states a Lt.Col of the Thai Army.

Source: http://news.bbc.co.uk

From http://news.bbc.co.uk

Over ten tanks on the streets of Bangkok. Pictures are being shown of Government House, with a security cordon around the perimeter.

Some collusion alleged with the Royal Thai Police.

They are going to set up a commission to decide upon the future progress of democracy in Thailand. Latest reports.. from Shawn Crispin, Asia Times...

Foreign Office UK says expats should avoid crowds.

Thaksin sacks Army Commander.

'stacker10' date='2006-09-13 16:14:55' post='892571'

I agree of some things you say,but I tell you my story.Iam married with thai,dont have money to get marriagevisa(400.000)at the moment.I get income from familycompany in Europe so i have good salery so i dont need to work but Iam only44 years old so no retairement.We also having a

baby soon so what I <removed> should I do??

For your information, 400,000 THB is 8,411 EUR, 10,685 USD, and 5,713 GBP

Does it have to be cash only, or could it be a property bond? Who else has this sort of money swilling about as cash? It should be safely locked up in stock, property or some other investment 'vehicle'!

Laulen

illegal workers" who have been visa running will change to obtaining tourist visas from overseas consulates. How will that force them to get work pertmits and pay tax?

Maybe? Though i dont think this is totally directed at ONLY illegal workers. But from what i can understand by talking to someone today. They are trying to target some criminals in places like Pattaya! Not my words. Just what i heard! How about the government making it easier for teachers to get a work permit? Just because you have a degree. Doesn't mean you can teach! Seems like alot of / whats and what ifs! We can only wait and see!

Jockstar you are spot on! A degree does NOT mean you can teach, especially when Thais often make judgements on a teacher's competence by whether they like them or not! Personality, politeness, and professionalism count for more in LOS.

By the way, Immigration Department don't care about degrees for teachers, it is the Education Minister that you should be speaking to. If teachers have professional teaching qualifications recognised internationally, whether they have a degree or not, it is high time Thai authorities recognised this, as both Government schools, even Government ministries have (excepting Education!)

Perhaps obtaining a WP would be just that much easier??

Laulen

There's nothing like a Visa press report to get everyone on to Forum!

Currently there are 346 users including 257 guests reading this post!

I wonder who the 1 Anonymous User is; Thai Immigration Department?

Kat, your reply is most informative and knowledgeable.

I believe, on a wider global scale, there is a continuing struggle between the traditional agrarian societies and nomadic peoples, who see their ways of life continually threatened by the ever greater numbers of people who have abandoned the 'rhythmic living with nature' in favour of the bright lights and expensive consumption of energy that are the cities.

As for me, I live in a city, but regret the loss of that ability to look out upon a starry night without the haze of orange street lamps, erected for some 'health and safety' reason.

Laulen

Chua, if they do make a movie of John Karr's life up to now, I would suggest that they will display all that is undesirable, embarrassing, and illegal in the States and particularly in LOS.

This will lead to yet another ban 'by the Thai authorities' on a Western-financed movie that fails to take into account Thai cultural sensitivities. Well, how else could you write a film script about a crazy alleged child molester without alluding to the seamier side of Thai life?

Laulen

What is just as surprising are the countries languishing outside the top 30.

Where are France, Spain, Italy?

And what about Russia, or is that stretching things too much?

Well done Thailand, although please pay heed to the remarks made by Mr. Kazi M. Martin!

Laulen

It is a sad state of affairs, and another example of the 'marketplace' of pure business with no other rules or regulations.

Perhaps this explains why it is that the British Embassy are one of the busiest embassies in the world for processing visas of Thai females.

Laulen

Ultimately, with this sort of 'terrorist' 'freedom fighter' type of violence all sides involved will need to put down their arms and talk.

In talking, both sides will need to compromise on their goals. It seems, for now at least, that this solution is likely to take a very long time to resolve itself.

As for the people creating this violence, there must be sufficient supporters within the local community to allow them to carry out these illegal acts; unless, of course, these 'supporters' are scared witless and fearful for their own futures!

Laulen

Yes, I do. We bought 3 rais and house for our personal residence. Location Bangkok.

Bush

When you say 'we' do you mean your Thai partner and you? If so, is it not true that Thai Land Laws allow your Thai partner to purchase land, but not you?

Land ownership I seem to recall is an emotive issue with most Thais.

Laulen

The American media are pretty exercised about this case as well. Here's a transcript from CNN's Live From programme...

Meanwhile, we're also talking about JonBenet Ramsey's father. Warned against a rush to judgment on John Mark Karr, now DNA rules Karr out. So what happens next in JonBenet's unsolved murder and what happens to the man whose admissions sparked a legal and media firestorm? We'll pretty sure Nancy Grace has a few things to say. She joins us between her gigs on "COURT TV" and "CNN HEADLINE NEWS." Nancy, why do so many people feel this case has just been jinxed since the very beginning.

NANCY GRACE, COURT TV: It has been, and it's not just a feeling it's a legal practicality. Now, you will hear defense attorneys sing to the moon that, yes, the prosecution can go forward when they find the right killer. That is totally bogus. Of course, under the law, if you read a law book in a law library, of course you can go forward. But practically speaking Kyra, let's have a reality check here. You really think a prosecutor can stand in front of a jury and say, yes, we thought it was the parents, yes, we thought it was Santa Claus, yes, we thought it was hel_l Garth.

Yes, we brought John Mark Karr all the way from Thailand. Well we were wrong. But now we're pretty sure it's this guy. It's not going to work. And I don't care how nice the district attorney Mary Lacy comes across in a press conference. I'll give you that. She's a nice lady. But this is a colossal blunder of biblical proportions. There's no way they can, with a straight face, go forward with a new suspect. And what was Pete McGuire talking about in the press conference today? Saying that they had an airtight case other than the DNA not matching? Hello! The guy was not in Boulder, he wasn't even in Colorado. No DNA, no fingerprint, nothing but the musings of a madman, x-rated e-mails? What are they thinking about?

PHILLIPS: Speaking of that news conference, let's take a listen to Mary Lacy.

(BEGIN VIDEO CLIP)

MARY LACY, BOULDER CO. DISTRICT ATTORNEY: On a separate occasion, they obtained a cup that he used to drink from and a tissue or wipe that he used to wipe his hands. The bottom line is that, after we did that, our expert -- and we put a great deal of respect in our expert from the Denver lab -- said that the sample in the underwear of the victim was a mixed sample and that we do not want to compare a mixed sample with a mixed sample. We need a pristine sample. That means a buckle swab. A buckle swab can only be taken by consent or by court proceeding or court order.

(END OF VIDEO CLIP)

PHILLIPS: Oh, boy. Just make it all confusing. Mixed, pristine, buckle? Help me out here. Please explain who messed up and what should have been done over seas and should he have even been taken here?

GRACE: Absolutely not. Based on e-mails that he was writing to a professor, a journalist? Come on, as much as we don't like it, and if you go into some of these chat rooms on the internet, anybody can do it, you get musings about child pedophilia all the time. That's what this amounted to. And what I really resent, having been a long- time victims' rights advocate, is for the district attorney to hide behind the skirts of the safety of children. People, wake up. This guy has been subjected to children, been teaching in schools, had a daycare, for Pete's sake, out of his home, six months after JonBenet was murdered. He's been around children for years, but suddenly they have to bungle the case to protect children? That is so bogus.

Let's talk about DNA. When you go out to a bicycle that's been outside and you try to lift DNA, imagine Kyra, for instance, you work out on a treadmill or on a (INAUDIBLE) and you grab it. Of course there's going to be other DNA on that equipment, on that bicycle. Ridiculous! Don't tell me in Bangkok, Thailand, the child sex capital of the world you can't get this guy's DNA. And let me remind you, as sad as I am too, this guy offered on the third request to give authorities DNA. But guess what? The Boulder authorities didn't have their DNA kit with them. It's one thing after the next. Snake bit is a mild way to put it.

PHILLIPS: Nancy, final question, is he going to be back on the streets? Is he going to be allowed to teach in schools? Is he going to be around children? Is he going to walk free?

GRACE: He will not be allowed to teach children in this country, but he can go overseas and probably get a position there in a private school. He is looking at extradition back to California. That is a misdemeanor child pornography charge, carrying only six months per charge. He'll probably do about half that time and be back out on the street.

PHILLIPS: Nancy Grace, you don't want to miss her on "HEADLINE NEWS" or "Court TV."

GRACE: Goodbye friend.

Laulen

Mr Karr sure caused a mess in the LOS.

ilyushin you highlight the problem just spot on! What a mess for LOS.

Life as we know it, may not be the same again!

This will create a few new jobs for the Education Ministry, checking out all us 'dodgy' teachers!

This thread is dangerously close to a 'handbags at dawn' meeting!

Perhaps a more mundane answer to the title of this thread is that airport costs, particularly the most expensive and regular ones, are often sourced in US dollars. With the Thai Baht quite high at present, this may in part be a reason for these increases.

Another, as previously mentioned elsewhere, is the introduction of increased security measures, with the 'scanners'!

I wonder whether the John Karr case will have the same effect on Thai governance of foreign language teachers and work permits as a certain Dr. Harold Shipman has had with doctors and GPs in the United Kingdom?

GPs are now no longer able to practise in single-person surgeries, and all doctors now have to undergo annual appraisals of their clinical work. This will be much welcomed, not least by the relatives of these tragic victims of Dr. Shipman.

Both individuals, who sent shockwaves through government systems designed to protect the vulnerable have now led to the creation of or proposed plans to introduce bureaucratic assessments, checks and additional costs to ensure 'protection.'

Is this the price we pay for 'peace of mind' and honesty in both the teaching and medical professions?

Laulen

So, it is the end then, of the English teacher who is qualified to teach English, (Cambridge and Trinity Certificate and/or Diploma) but yet lacks a degree certificate?

Whatever happened to so-called 'Expert' Work Permits?

As I understand it, the Immigration Department happily issue Work Permits to anyone who applies; it is the Education Ministry who INSIST on a person having a degree qualification, before they give them a 'licence' to teach in Thailand.

Could Sunbeltasia advise here?

Thanks

Laulen

Apparently there are quite a few people posting here who regard themselves as "teachers", yet have no teaching degree/qualification.

Why is it so difficult to understand that if you want to teach you need the proper qualifications? and I don't mean the Kao-Sarn type of degree!

Especially when it comes to teaching children, knowledge about a language is just not enough. A proper education in pedagogical science is an absolute must!

opalhort

I have to say this is a good move... teachers with no qualfications have no business working in Thailand.. it's about time they cleaned this up.

The only people who should be scared are the ones with no real degree and no formal teaching qualifications.. about time they sorted out the backpacker teachers here.

Bingo dude, I couldn't have said it better myself

There seems to be a lot of knocking of non BA teachers since this latest probe developed.

Being a very lowly TEFL certificated teacher, who has taught a number of years here, I have seen a great many M, BA, etc, ( my piers according to many posts on here) who seem to be unable to teach basic language skills & are removed from their schools.

Its not the qualifications that count it’s the ability to teach foreign students.

It’s very different from teaching in western schools as many find out to their cost.

Yes there may well need a shake up in the system but lets do it on teaching skills not on yet more qualifications.

John Mark Karr, 41, who had worked as a teacher of some international schools as we understand, was fully qualified, was removed because of his poor altitude to his pupils.

So the system we have now is working to some extent.

Several of my piers (M. B.A) have been removed from schools I have taught at for poor teaching skills, losing their temper etc.

Again the system does work in some schools.

It’s no good being an over educated idiot if you can’t do the job.

Paul.

Exactly! If you can do the job, as reviewed by your peers, then you should be allowed to teach.

As for Opalhort's views,

Apparently there are quite a few people posting here who regard themselves as "teachers", yet have no teaching degree/qualification.

Why is it so difficult to understand that if you want to teach you need the proper qualifications? and I don't mean the Kao-Sarn type of degree!

Especially when it comes to teaching children, knowledge about a language is just not enough. A proper education in pedagogical science is an absolute must!

opalhort

that may be the ideal, but in practice is highly unlikely. How many teachers of English in Thailand have a 'proper education in pedagogical science'? I doubt if there are more than 100 of such expat. people in LOS, and most of them may not be teaching English. What happened to 'on the job' training and Accreditation of Prior Learning? What about common sense, a real interest in the subject your teaching and an interest in meeting the educational needs of your students?

Incidently, I had Thai schools inspectors from the Bangkok Metropolitan Authority observe a class of mine, and I also wrote a primary schools curriculum outline for Pathom levels 1 to 6 for a prominent English language school. And still I cannot 'regularise' my employment status with a Work Permit in Thailand.

My attitude is, if I am professionally recognised and approved to teach in the United Kingdom, then I should be accorded the same professional respect and acknowledgement in other countries. As someone elsewhere noted, in this globally connected world it is not difficult to check up on my credentials or my teaching experience. Failure on the part of the Education Ministry in Thailand to take account of these 'non-standard' expat teachers will guarantee even fewer Thai children and adults come to that, learning English. The country could well be the poorer economically as a result.

Laulen

quote name='george' date='2006-08-22 22:19:00' post='860582'

Update:

Foreign Ministry can help screen foreign teachers

BANGKOK: -- To avert potential 'bad cases' from occurring, Thailand's Foreign Ministry is ready to cooperate with schools nationwide to screen prospective foreign teachers before they come to

Thailand........

Interesting news. If they really check the home country before a teacher arrives in LOS perhaps there is hope for us non-degree holders with years of teaching experience backed up by Criminal Record Bureau checks and teaching qualifications!

If you know teaching is how you want to spend your professional life, than why don't you just get a degree? There are all kinds of paths to obtaining degrees; online, night school, intensive summer schools,etc. I think it would provide you the work security you seek and likely far better compensation.

It is a common suggestion, but one that is really a non-starter with me. I have no finance, I currently have three jobs, a wife and a child to care for plus a mortgage. Where I would find the time (at least three years at the last count) I do not know.

And all this for what is, arguably, a relatively poorly paid profession of which I have already spent nearly three years in Thailand doing perfectly well. I fail to see what benefit a degree qualification would give me in my teaching in Thailand, apart from your observation of better compensation.

My experience suggested otherwise. My attitude, professional approach and 'can do' ability seemed to 'open doors' to some surprising teaching opportunities that were well paid, while they lasted.

Perhaps I'll just have to remain in Britain, or perhaps try my luck in more 'frontier' countries like Laos, Cambodia, or, heaven forbid, Burma!

Laulen

quote name='george' date='2006-08-22 22:19:00' post='860582'

Update:

Foreign Ministry can help screen foreign teachers

BANGKOK: -- To avert potential 'bad cases' from occurring, Thailand's Foreign Ministry is ready to cooperate with schools nationwide to screen prospective foreign teachers before they come to

Thailand........

Interesting news. If they really check the home country before a teacher arrives in LOS perhaps there is hope for us non-degree holders with years of teaching experience backed up by Criminal Record Bureau checks and teaching qualifications!

Well, Mr. Karr has done it for us teachers who have taught in Thailand with validated and internationally recognised teaching qualifications (Cambridge DELTA or Trinity Diploma) and without a degree.

What are we, competent and experienced teachers to do? Leave and teach in another country? A degree is NO EVIDENCE of a person's ability to teach. The MOE should exercise more common sense over the allocation of licences to teachers wishing to teach in bilingual schools.

Laulen

It will be a sad day if visas are required for all visitors to LOS. The trouble the authorities face is the protection of air passengers and the prevention of terrorist activities on Thai soil.

It seems that all law-abiding citizens are 'damned if they do, and damned if they don't' as regards wanting easy access to nations and minimal delays at airport entry and departure points.

Perhaps the British sense of 'resignation' to ever longer delays at check in and Passport Control is the attitude. After all, better a safe uneventful journey than one you might not even complete!

One wonders what might happen to the reciprocal arrangements will be where a nation's citizens suddenly find themselves no longer enjoying visa free access (for 30 days). Would all air travel, certainly to countries outside major trading blocks of North America and Europe require visa clearance first?

From this evening's news - according to education chief Khunying Kasama Varawarn na Ayutthaya, permanent secretary of education there is to be an immediate clampdown on the 7,000 foreign English teachers working at Bi-lingual/International schools in Bangkok.

According to Khunying Kasama - she has been informed that many of the 7,000 foreign teachers are working either degreeless or holding fake degrees.

Khunying Kasama has declared 'immediate verification' of every foreign teacher's qualifications teaching at privately owned schools.

"Any teacher found to be violating this regualtion is to be arrested, deported and blacklisted"

Source: Local Thai Evening News

Shocking, predictable, and it will do nothing to meeting the 'insatiable' desire of people who want to learn English. Khunying Kasama Varawarn na Ayutthaya has missed an opportunity to streamline foreign teacher's qualifications and instead sought to reassure nervous parents through political grandstanding.

What value is there given to Cambridge or Trinity ESOL teaching qualifications, especially at Diploma level? None, from the journalist who wrote this report.

Thank goodness that I am back in the UK teaching at a senior level (A/DOS) in a well-known private language school, and on top of that a 'survivor' of not one but two British Council inspections.

I would love to teach in Thailand again, but with this crackdown I stand not a chance. And before anyone asks, the Interior Ministry are quite happy to issue Work Permits; it is the Education Ministry who need to evolve and change.

Laulen

Let us hope, despite all the reported scepticism that the Thai authorities get any proposed review of teaching qualifications and work permits more streamlined than is currently the situation.

In my three years in Thailand I never did manage to get a Work Permit, although I had plenty of renewed Immigrant B visas.

As I changed my employer during my time in LOS there was no transfer facility on the Work Permit, so applicants go straight back to Non Immigrant B status again, with a further bureaucratic wait for an official Work Permit.

If the Thai authorities were serious about collecting income tax, then they would streamline the Work Permit process, and thereby increase the tax take.

Also, the Ministry of Education needs to review its 'any old degree qualification' will do, and stop ignoring teachng experience and teaching qualifications without a 'degree'. A degree is not evidence of a person's ability or competence to teach!

Good luck to the Thai authorities if they intend using CRB (Criminal Record Bureau) type checking system. In the past 15 months, doing the same work, I have had to make two applications for an Enhanced CRB check, as one 'CRB Registered Umbrella Body' was not 'acceptable' to my new employer! Bureaucracy rules whatever country you are in.

A final thought; just like a map a CRB check is out of date the day it is printed!

Laulen

This BBC article is just typical of the current 'environmental religiosity' spewed out by former Socialist leaning pressure group intellectuals looking for a 'safe haven' following the 'Centre Ground' or 'Middle Way' approach of Britain's two major political parties.

The Trade Unions have succumbed to the behemoths of big business, political correctness reigns supreme, and the lily-livered insurance companies have all but emasculated all sense of 'risk' out of such childish pastimes as conker-bashing, conger eel slapping at Lyme Regis, and childrens' tug-o-war.

The fact of the matter is that while the US, India, and China continue to pursue growth at any cost without regard to the environment, the UK's feeble attempts at going green will matter not a jot to the overall effect on global climate change.

Having said that, it is no excuse to do 'nothing'. Taxes on airline fares is just a cheap, lazy way for politicians to say 'look we are doing something.' Why don't they tackle the horrendous mismanagement of water resources in the UK? what long-term (a joke) planning is there for integrated public transport across the country?

So, going to Tenby, Torbay or Thailand should remain a matter of personal choice, without the last option being priced out of existence for those with relatives or other connections in LOS.

Give it a go, as whatever happens, Thailand will change his life and that of his fiancée too.

Little more to add to the already excellent posts full of sound advice.

Do not worry about Work Permits; I survived for three years without one, although I did have to make a Visa trip (read 1 week's holiday) every 90 days, during which I was still paid a salary from the school I worked for. A great way to see Laos, Cambodia, Singapore and Malaysia if you are on a budget.

You may find life a challenge after a while, when both you and your fiancée are from Britain. My experience suggests that each of you might find different aspects of Thai culture you like, and dislike.

If you are lucky enough to have property in Britain, do not sell it for any reason; just rent it out like I did. Best advice I was ever given, as I had a place to come back to.

Cherish each hour of this day for it can never return.

Og Mandino (1923 - 1996)