GOLDBUGGY

5 minutes ago, IslandLover said:

 

She previously worked in Khanom.  That is a known fact.

By who? Or was this the post with WP Unknown?

Do you want to take a vote here and find out how many people knew that from this headline? 

8 minutes ago, IslandLover said:

 

There was tittle-tattle that she was giving people riding lessons.  Presumably she was paid for her services.  That's employment in my book.

That tittle-tattle is not employment in anyone's books! That is Gossip and a Rumor!

When the day comes we start convicting people on rumors and gossip, we are back to Witch Hunting again in the Middle Ages. If she was caught working I am pretty sure they would have said so. Or at least have no reason to hide this information from us. If you can prove otherwise then by all means do so.   

9 hours ago, mikebike said:

In post #44 I did allude to the FACT that she was working in another province recently, and had to vacate that riding business and province. 'Nuf said. 

What you said in post #44 was:

"She worked in another province that I know of, WP status at that time unknown." 

So when you said unknown it was not a Fact anymore but just your guess. 

Nuf said.

5 hours ago, Wazza1 said:

I'm sure if she was worth returning to Thailand for he would have.

That is your view and you are welcome to it. But now let me share mine. 

I have lived in Thailand a long time now, and I have seen a lot of Farangs who treated there Thai Wives terribly. In fact I have seen much more of that here then I did in the West. Maybe because of all the excess booze and free time they have to drink and get drunk with friends.

I remember the guy next door to me and where I used to live who used to go out drinking every night without his wife. Every night he would come home late and drunker than a Hoot Owl and bang on the front door to wake his wife up. Then yell at her like a a crazy man for an hour or so no reasons I could see or understand.

She finally left him but still came around during the day to clean house and make sure he was okay. I met her and she seemed like a fine woman.

No I don't know there relationship or who is to blame. All I know for sure is I could never live with anyone like that and don't blame anyone else who couldn't either.

Maybe you had a rough divorces and got screwed! That doesn't mean all women are bad. I know! I have been through 2 times myself!   . 

5 minutes ago, Old Croc said:

See post #72 for a clue.

Yes, I read this before. 

So just because the Immigration Officer was with an Employment Officer when she was arrested for an Overstay while riding a horse you assume she was working illegally? Well, maybe she was? But it certainly doesn't say she was, which I would think they would mention that, so I don't assume anything like that.

All we know for sure was that she was arrested, deported, and banned, for her Overstay. 

4 hours ago, stevenl said:

But there was a crime committed, she was working illegally.

I am sorry but I have never see it written anywhere that she was working illegally. So how did you come to this conclusion?

All that I can see what it says was she was banned from Thailand for 5 years for her Overstay. She was caught while riding a horse at a Horse Ranch, which many people do for fun and don't require a Work Permit to do.

If you have inside information, please do share.  

I don't know! I still think a 5 year ban on a person for no crime committed other than an Overstay is too strict. I think a Fine, and increase that if you have to, would be better option for this kind of Offense. 

No doubt what she did was against the law, but so is speeding. In my own personal view a speeder on a highway zooming by me at 150 kilometers per hour is more of a danger to me and everyone else, then a French Woman riding a horse.

Again if they made it easier for people to stay here, even even if they have to prove they have sufficient funds in the bank every 90 days, what take a lot of this Overstay away.   

I say put the Poppy on for Remembrance of our War Hero's and forget the rest. War is War! The US dropped the A-Bomb on Japan to, and China has done so many things in the past, and what China is known to do.

Pointing fingers now makes no sense at all. Also having some Government Official say they are sorry, and hold his hand over his heart, when he really doesn't mean it, and he could care less, means nothing at all either. Even the kids of the people killed at Pear Harbor and where old enough to remember them, would be 85 years old now.  

On 28/12/2559 at 1:24 PM, Wazza1 said:

Never take out another mans garbage.

With a 50% Divorce Rate in the West, and the other 50% Married or who have partners already, I am wondered who is left to date after age 40, if you have the view all Divorced Women are garbage?

Many times it is the mans fault! A Husband who refuses to come back to Thailand to see his wife after 2 years sounds like a pretty good reason to get a Divorce from this man to me. What do you think?

Had a problem sort of like that with my last Lap Top Computer I bought.

The CD Player didn't work from day one. It kept popping open on its own to. Took it back to the store and after 2 days it now became warranty work. Which took a full month to fix. If I paid they would have fixed it in a day, barring not needing a part. 

11 hours ago, LivinLOS said:

Have spent the last year setting up exactly this.. From a few years ago buying 5 rai for the grand villa and maybe a bunch of rental homes around a pool (estimated 30 mil inward) to dropping off extensions back to a ME visa, going and setting up a fall back home in the west, starting a biz back there, and the full lifeboat option to be on a plane in a day or two without any real interruption to my life just in case.. 

 

What I discovered this summer was

1) the UK is probably cheaper, for the life I lead and the things I consume these days than Thailand is

2) theres sooo much to do that I had forgotten I loved (track days, racing calendar, flight lessons, music festivals, bands, etc).. 

3) making money is so easy back there that not only is it not costing me anything, its set to me making me multi 100k doing it. 

 

I am younger than some at 43, been 'retired' here since I was 28.. Allowed myself to become brainwashed by every expats complaints of trips home, the self validation of 'how great it was to be back' or holiday makers gushing over how lucky it is to be here.. Sure it may be fine at 60 to wind down and live slow in a semi decent climate but this last year has me enthused with the action of being back in europe, my only problems involve the wife / travel / our dog / etc.. 

 

Of course its cold and dark in the UK now.. So I am here.. Counting the days until the winter is over to get back. I am really wondering if I wouldnt do far better having a villa in portugal for the winter rather than here. The biz I have started can easily pay for that cost without touching any of my nestegg. 

 

So what did you do as a living in the West to Retire here at age 28 in a 30 M Villa? Rob Banks?

8 hours ago, IMA_FARANG said:

As Admiral Yamamoto asked when he heard about the Pearl Harbor results, "And the carriers, how maay aircraft cariers did we sink?"

When he was told there were no aircrat carriers as thry were not in Peal Harbor but out on a training exercise at the time, Yamamoto reportdly said, "Now we have wakened a sleeping Tiger, and he has powerful claws"

In 1945 the U.S. naval ship building  industry actually built and launched more aircraft carriers in one  single day than the IImperial Japanese Navy had left in their entire Navy fleet by then.

The sleeping Tiger had woken up, and by 1944 the bombs were being droped from the Tiger's aircraft carriers on Japanese cities.

Although it is a seperate topic, my father acually joined the U.S. Army in early 1942 about 2 months after Pearl Harbor, and eventually served in North Africa, Sicily, Italy, France, and eventually into Austria  by the war's end.

I was born in October 1946 after my father was demobed frm the Army in 1945.

 

 

 

 

Had the war lasted 5 more years, you would be 5 years younger now. 

The THB held Interest Rates Unchanged, which is support for the Thai Baht. What you might want to keep and eye on though is the price of Oil. Thailand is a major Importer of Oil and thus a high price hurts the Economy. Although this helps Rubber Prices and the AUD and CAD Dollars.

The USD is strong and it will remain strong for the time being. I expect it to remain unchanged. 

With the GBP, I believe that the planned exit from the EU caused an overkill of this currency. The fear of the unknown, which markets don't like. I expect to hold and even go up some against the THB and other major currencies.  

1 hour ago, Savilesghost said:

You need a work permit in certain cases even when there is no compensation...this is why your confused and let me show you why 

 

Farang X owns a business in Thailand in which he plays no direct role in running the business, but hold "majority" shares.... doesnt require a WP ? Correct

 

Farang X gets paid a dividend from said company, ie "compensation " still doesnt need a WP correct ? 

 

Farang X decides to take an active role in running said business but will draw no salary or other considerations with the exception of taking the dividend in said company..Farang X now needs a WP 

 

 

 

 The only thing confusing to me is why you keep saying I am confused about something? There is nothing in your post I haven't said already. 

Of course you A & B Examples don't need a WP. They are not providing any work so why would they need one? This goes along the lines of someone renting out a Condo and having his wife collect the rent money.

Example C is a bit iffy. He is preforming a service and working. You say he is not being compensated for his work other then drawing a Divided from the company. Is a Dividend not a form of compensation? Does not the profit of this company depend on the amount of this Dividend Payment? That by cutting one or two staff members by cleaning these tables himself, and cooking, not make this company more profitable and now not having to pay these wages, which can be returned in the form of a Dividend?.

Him working and being, or not being, compensated for this is a debatable issue. But what isn't up for debate is by him cleaning off tables he is doing a job a Thai could do. If you don't believe that the WP Systems was designed to protect the Thai Worker then please tell me why they have such a thing in the first place.   

4 minutes ago, muzmurray said:

 

I never mentioned anything about money - the fact was that she did not get a work permit because she was not working for anyone, (paid or unpaid)

 

freelance = A freelancer or freelance worker is a term commonly used for a person who is self-employed and is not necessarily committed to a particular employer long-term.

 

No mention of money there either.

 

Also, it is not about taking away someone's job, it is about performing a job that a Thai is unable to, they are totally different things.

So now you are saying that all these people who own businesses cannot get a WP as they are not working for anyone else? That a Freelancer is self-employed not committed to a particular employer, and then say no mention of money there either.

Gosh! How many people do you know who is self-employed or otherwise, and works for free? 

You also go on to say that you are not taking away anyone's job as you are performing a job that a Thai is unable to do. I am saying that the whole idea behind a WP System is so that you don't take away a Thais Job. That a WP is issue to people who are doing the job a Thai can't. You continue to argue that point with me. But can't you see we are saying the same thing here!  

No! They won't go very far! They will just move to a country next door, like Niger or Chad, and continue there campaign through cross border fighting and from their. This is far from being over. 

When you kick a Rat out of your shed he doesn't give himself up. He just runs and finds a new place to hide. 

7 minutes ago, muzmurray said:

 

No, it was refused because she was not working for a registered school or language centre, you can not just freelance teaching legally here. In her case it was absolutely nothing to do with "taking a job from a Thai", that is why they employ native speakers.

Yes I do know there are several English Language Teachers here, who have a WP. All I mentioned in this case is that she did not qualify for a WP. I didn't go into details as that was not the point I was trying to make, and the ins and outs in getting a WP. 

The point I was trying to get across was that this woman wasn't "Freelancing" and trying to earn extra money on the side, and as you imply. She was offering her services totally for free and without any consideration at all but wasn't allowed to do this without a WP. 

I doubt she would have been taking anyone's job away as the reason she wanted to teach English to the village kids is that they did not have an English Teacher at there local school. But having said that, if all the Native English speaking teachers decided to work in Thailand for free, you can be sure there would be more of them. So what would then happen to the paid Thai English Teachers as they have them to?

20 hours ago, Savilesghost said:

I told you no story of a man who cant cook his own breakfast, your confused...all the premise you offer are confused as well...and you are being silly 

 

Thailand is not complicated, the DOL will tell you what does and doesnt constitute work and whether something requires a WP or not....you seem hell bent on trying to make things more complicated than they really are, your making up rules and interpreting said rules where no such rules exist 

 

What is so confusing for you when I say if your work in Thailand, and get paid some sort of compensation, you need a WP? It was you who complicated things by saying a man can't even cook in his own breakfast in his own kitchen, without a WP, which me, and others, find it very difficult to believe.

But don't feel bad as I was not 100% Correct in my statements either. There are time in which you need a WP even when no compensation is involved or being paid. So I was wrong and man enough to admit that now.

I remember later a case years ago when someone wanted to Teach English to the village kids for free, as they had no English Teacher. She was refused to be able to do this, and required a WP. If she had the qualifications, I suppose she could have got that, but she didn't. 

But it still goes back to the number one rule, which is taken a job away from a Thai who could do that. So even though she was not being paid or given any form of compensation, they ruled her job could be done by a Thai and therefore refused to work for free even. Maybe one of those special circumstances that come every once in awhile that a lot of people don't believe happens.         

12 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Look up any website on volunteering in Thailand and see how much they have to pay to "volunteer" and they certainly have to pay to get to and from Thailand. Thailand is not Africa.

 

The man not able to cook breakfast was about doing so in his restaurant. If he wanted to do so in his home he could do so, of course.

 

The rules do not mention benefits. ANY "work" ( other than at the family home ) requires a WP whether paid or not, whether with benefits or not.

 

I will not debate this with you any longer. It is all on google. Read it or not. OTY.

Your example of a man not being able to cook his own breakfast in his own restaurant is all full of holes to. The first question I would ask is why would a man want to do that when he has a paid cook and it is during business hours? I mean if he doesn't like the food she cooks it is time to find a new cook, I would think. 

Now if his restaurant is closed down for the night and he stays late to do the books, there is no problem in him cooking up a hamburger. Nobody is going to fault him for that or believe you if you say different.

I like another poster comments when he said he has heard plenty of B.S, on this subject but nobody steps forward to prove what they say is true. So by all means prove it. . 

3 minutes ago, thaibeachlovers said:

Look up any website on volunteering in Thailand and see how much they have to pay to "volunteer" and they certainly have to pay to get to and from Thailand. Thailand is not Africa.

 

The man not able to cook breakfast was about doing so in his restaurant. If he wanted to do so in his home he could do so, of course.

 

The rules do not mention benefits. ANY "work" ( other than at the family home ) requires a WP whether paid or not, whether with benefits or not.

 

I will not debate this with you any longer. It is all on google. Read it or not. OTY.

You are the one who brought it up here and said Volunteers pay all of there own way included flight ticket, accommodations, and meals. It was me who doesn't believe you.

So why should I try to prove your bar talk is wrong when it is you who said that? Seems to me the onus is on you. 

1 minute ago, thaibeachlovers said:

You are incorrect. Many volunteers in LOS pay their own way, but still volunteer their time and expertise, but are required to have official approval. The Chiang Mai immigration office has provision to authorise volunteers, but I have not looked into exactly what that entails.

 

You obviously didn't read all the replies as I already pointed out that it is not necessary to have a WP to do anything in the family home. That is not volunteering.

In post 37 you said this:  

" I met a farang that owned a restaurant, but could not make himself breakfast in his own kitchen "

So did you say this or didn't you? 

Since there are many volunteers in Thailand paying there own way then this should be easy for you to prove. Oh Yeah! I almost forgot! You also said they were refused work because they needed a WP they couldn't get. So what do you call a Volunteer who comes to Thailand but not allowed to work here? A Tourist? A Back Packer? A Dreamer? .  

7 hours ago, Savilesghost said:

 

Why are you making up legal definitions and then interpreting your own definitions when under the current rules no such clarifcations or definitions exist, why would they have rules to cover special circumstances ?

 

If your go to the trouble to define all special circumstances, they are hardly special circumstances anymore, are they ? 

 

Currently its the DOL who decide and define what is and isnt considered work on a case for case basis...and your examples of washing dishing helping Mrs or doing your own garden are just plain silly and even the DOL one suspects would not interpret these as "working" contray to what the all knowing farangs, who have never worked in Thailand or ever had any dealings with the DOL, this gov department is one of the better ones and quite professional

 

In the case of the Tsumani  volunteer thing, one suspects this decision was made by some jobsworthy who may have been making decisions outside his remit in that case, Goverment officals going off half cocked does not just occur in Thailand 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

Your scenario of a Volunteer being unable to work in Thailand for free makes it a special circumstance. I didn't suggest that! It was only you who said this happened and I gave you the benefit of doubt of not calling you a liar, and said in YOUR case then this must be a special circumstances.

But this time I am not going to give you the benefit of doubt. I have never heard of an Official Volunteer Working coming to a place like Africa, or East Asia, and volunteer his time or skill on some project, and yet having to buy his own airplane tickets, food, and finding his own shelter that he has to pay for. Never! If you can prove that then by all means do so.

You call me silly because I discussed how a man helping his wife with the supper dishes is not considered official work, then you tell us a story of a man who can't cook his own breakfast in his own kitchen as this is considered official work. Who is really being silly here? 

Look! It is not that complicated and as you make it out to be. The WP Rules are in place to protect Thai Workers, by being turned down a job he could do, but was filled with a Foreign Worker. Every Country has these rules! So these rules are simple also.

If you are doing work in Thailand in which you are receiving some sort of payment for that work, either in cash or benefits, then you need a WP. That is it and that is all there is to this! If you want to complicate things with dribble, then you are just confusing the issue because you are confused yourself. That is it and all that is to that as well.    

3 hours ago, Savilesghost said:

So why did the volunteers after the Tsunami who were tourists and offered to help told they needed work permits then, they were prepared to help for no considerations 

 

The reason volunteering requires a WP is the fact it fits the defintion of "work" irrespective of any "considerations" 

I am sorry but I don't recall this particular incident you mention here, so I can't really comment on why the government wouldn't allow Volunteers to help for free. I can only guess that a Volunteer is classified under government regulations as needing a Work Permit, as under normal circumstances they are given some form of consideration to do that type of work. As in free housing and food. It appears they don't have any laws in place to cover special circumstances, as in your case when a Volunteer is willing to work totally for free.

You said not all work in Thailand is paid work and I agree with you. But let me expand on that further to define "Paid" as not only including a cash payment, but also any form of Consideration that has value. For example if you were a Condo Manager who was given a free place to stay to collect rent and keep the place clean, then you would actually be a paid worker and therefore require a Work Permit.  

So understanding "Paid Work" as meaning to receive anything of value for your labor is very important to know when you consider who needs a Work Permit, and who doesn't. Surely you don't believe that if a man who helps his wife doing up the supper dishes he risks being thrown out of the country and banned, for not having a Work Permit. Or a man working on his garden. Or a man picking up rubbish and paper bags that blew into his yard requires a Work Permit.

However if this same man working in his garden has plans to sell all of his vegetables at he open market,  or the man picking up rubbish is on;y picking up empty beer cans and pop bottles he plans to sell later, then technically he would need a Work Permit. See  the difference?

2 hours ago, wildewillie89 said:

 

So wait...you just assumed I go up to women and say 'bar girl' to their faces? How could you even come up with that assumption? What evidence do you have to suggest I do that from what I have written? And if you dont have evidence then why did you even bring the point of terminology up? 

 

Ah so it's not that you know all 'Thai' girls now, it is that you you think every person deserves respect? That is a little more understandable. However, if someone puts themselves in positions where people disrespect them and continuously do this (OP said he has known her for a while), then doenst it reach a point where it is his own stupidity if he gets hurt?

No! Actually I didn't make any assumptions about you. I certainly didn't think you would go up to a Working Girl and call her a Bar Girl, as I feel you never actually even met one in you life to say that to. So why would I think this now?

If someone puts themselves in a position to be disrespected, then it is them who has to live with that. You are not some High Judge Above High that can put such a tag on a Human Being! The Good Book says: "Judge and be Judged!' In another example" "Who can cast the first stone?".

So it is not for you to decide who can say what here. Or the Op shouldn't post here. This is up to the Moderators! For the other things you said this has to go to a much higher level. But I do know that it is certainly not up to you to judge other people. I know you will say you never said that or did that, so I will save you the trouble.

Yes You Did!