PaullyW

Regarding Thais abroad

I would imagine that it makes sense they are generally that way. As an expat here in Thailand, I don't give a toss when I meet a Thai here who can speak my language. I'm busy with all manner of emotions and difficulty or social withdrawal or work or wondering why the dogs in my neighborhood are so dam_n noisy starting precisely at midnight or struggling to learn the language of my host country or missing my relatives ect ect ect.

Immigrants all over the world have this in common. We are all grumpy, hard working sacrifices to one degree or another.

To be fair, maybe the concept of 'Sanuk' is a Thai value. However, I would imagine that most cultures that have made great contributions to the global community would find such a permeating value as rather childish. Especially knowing that true accomplishment most always requires some great sacrifice. Not sitting around on one's bum all day relaxing and having fun?

Expats from nearly all countries complain about the local majority population in nearly any country. But, by and large, in the larger countries, expats do find certain core values to respect about their hosts.

Look at any Chinese expat forums, Singapore, Malaysia, Japan, Korea, south America, western Europe, even some of the Arab states, Vietnam, US. Etc.

Thailand is in a group of a handful of countries where expats by and large (working, clean and normal expats at the top of industry here in Thailand) have scant anything good to say about their host's values or culture. That's true.

People might not agree with the Chinese, but It hard to deny that their civilization has brought much to the world. Same to varying degrees with many countries around the world.

Then, gaze on Thailand. What values do they claim as Thai? Surely most of the stuff that you might here from a wealthier Thai abroad is actually co-opted Chinese culture. Hard work and valuing education and all that. The culture? Much of the most visible culture is no doubt co-opted khmer culture. Food? Sure, but much of it is actually Lao in origin. And we know how the Thais generally feel about the Lao.

So, what is Thai culture and what are Thai values. I note that the usual defenders of everything Thai are conspicuous by their absence.

As far as marketing and what not, Mrs Yingluck does not have a terrible idea. Look at how well South Korea did? When you guys think of South Korea, surely most of us don't think of it as a place with the largest sexy industry in the world exporting fine Hookers all over the world (which is true).

The problem though is that Koreans have earned respect through other endeavors. Smart populace. World class products and tech. Ect. FACE as a generally honourable vehicle to motivate positive action (rather than something to hide a fragile ego behind and to use in avoiding responsibility, hard work or anything honourable).

At this time in their cultural development and achievement, Thais are really at the lower rung. They have not much about which to be outwardly proud. Unless they are spreading Thai culture to the North Koreans, or central african failed states.

I don't hate Thais, but I just want one of them to give me a straight answer on this. It's a fundamental area of concern for their futures as a respectable nation.

So interesting that Thais (especially educated, well-traveled Thais) would think that they and their culture as practiced are in a position to spread it. It's as if they think they have something to be very proud of that most of the world would agree with.

Can ANY THAIS out there, PLEASE, explain what Thai core values are. I cannot find any written works that describe such culture or core beliefs.

Many cultures of people have something. Just a shorthand list

Chinese - hard work, respect for education and knowledge

Japanese - deep respect for others in society & concern for fellow man well being, efficiency in everything, beauty in simplicity

Americans - every man created equal, religious freedom, belief that anyone can rise up from his/her 'station' in life, hard work

I simply cannot think of what Thai (respectable) values are. Does anyone know? I'm dying to know. Thais trying to promote Thainess abroad might be in for a very uncomfortable surprise when most of the world either ignores them or challenges them very frankly on their alleged values/culture. They won't find most of the people in the places they study or live abroad to be as gullible as many of the tourist they may have grown up encountering in Thailand.

Good luck to them

I don't understand. Why would she apologise for acting in a commercial ????

You farang, you no unnerstan Thailand..

Sorry just need to correct you.

It's "you Farang, you no unDuursataann"

My wife (Thai) told me he is a ladyboy.

I asked my Thai staff, and they said the same. Ladyboys often, not always, have a predisposition to acting out in the way he/she did.

Yes, they often do have trouble communicating succinctly.

Having a pretty good grasp of Thai, my theory is that Thai does not lend itself well to precision in communicating. It's a very vague and rudimentary language.

If you ever listen to Thai people talking, listen for what percentage of the communication is "alai?" or "what?". Sometimes I think many Thais spend 10-20% of their communication trying to negotiate meaning long after the meaning should have been clear.

Very simple language and simple people. It is also what makes it beautiful in a way.

i have bought numerous things online and could always pay by at least one of these VERY easy options:

. cash on delivery

. paypal

. pickup (and pay) at local 7/11

Go to the Soken website and you will see that the ONLY option is to pay by bank transfer, and they aren't the only Thai online company to use this method.

ok and what's the big deal? kasikorn has netbanking (i don't know for other banks) which i use too. the problem is not thailand being in the stone age as some genius mentioned. the problem is that some farang will always complain, no matter what. i don't see any problem with paying with banktransfer. sending proof with fax is optional. if u have netbanking just pay, take a print screen of payment, optionally add to pdf and send it to them. i do tons of payments like that in europe too with firms that don't accept paypal. sending the proof of payment is fully optional. u can also just wait til the accountants mark your order as paid and the goodies get shipped.

Right, what's the big deal? Efficiency and convenience don't matter in business. You must be either 1) Thai-minded or 2) old and irrelevant as a market.

Will your silly print screen stand up to legal scrutiny? Childish.

When I flew into the Thai airport yesterday, after clearing immigration, the first 5 people I encountered were scammers, so it set the tone.

Makes me think all Thais are scammers......

Welcome to Thailand.

And, you'd not be wrong for thinking so.

Spotted next to the Tiger Kingdom at Mae Rim, Chiang Mai.......

Looks like it's needing a good feed

I call those pathetic looking Thai cows "Soi Cows". The milk they produce lacks a normal amount of fat which is why you get that weird "off" taste in Thai milk.

I'm sorry, but are you really saying you don't care what hitler did?

Don't care at all, nor do I care what Genghis Khan, Slobodan Milosevic, Stalin, the Japanese, the IRA, Pol Pot, et al did.

It's in the past, forgive and forget.

Those are pretty strange values, forgiving and forgetting about anything that's ever happened in the past is a license for everyone to do what they please on the basis their action will be forgiven and fogotten moments after it happened. We trust you are unique in this world in havving those values!

I have the same values. What impact does his indifference have on the world? Answer: probably none. Why spend life caring deeply about things you had no part in and cannot change? Isn't that a total waste and completely illogical?

Granted, his indifference does not mean that he agrees (or disagrees) with what those people did and nor does it mean that he is teaching or encouraging others to take his view. I'm really not sure what the problem is.

You don't need to get 300 people together for a junket at the taxpayers expense. The Ambassadors have been telling you over and over what the problems are. The high end farangs are not going to come to Thailand whilst the beaches are dirty, the streets and rivers are littered with garbage, duel pricing and scams are rampant. Setting up safety zones leads one to think that the rest of the areas are no go zones and doesn't sound attractive for a holiday.

The problems are been plastered all over the international media for years but Thailand has always put the earplugs in the blindfolds on putting it down to farang hysteria.

Very true. I agree 100%. and you can include middle level farangs also.

I can only share my observations as an American traveler. And I've noticed that Americans are a small fraction of the travelers here.

1) I believe most Americans would be shocked by the conditions in Thailand unless you spend lots of money

2) If you're going to spend as much $ as you would in Miami, Las Vegas, Honolulu, Jamaica, or Cancun, Why would you come to Thailand? What is the draw of Thailand?

3) see #1 above again

But you maybe able to increase the quality of visitors (meaning willing to spend more money) from Russia and China. Thats probably low lying fruit that Thailand can take advantage of quickly.

I cant believe I agreed with chooka on a topic

Agree. I think the draw is

1. Thailand is something far removed and very exotic for most Americans

2. You'd be hard pressed to find an American man who doesn't know of all the cheap (from Thai men and women) -- I think nearly everyone underestimates the sex scene

3. Good food

That's truly it. People just want to see what a place so different is like. Even if most of them come to the conclusion that Thailand is sh!tty (which they do), it's part of the experience, so they are fine with it. When they get back to the US, they go on and on about how sh!tty things in Thailand are and how much fun it was because of it.

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Interesting read on the topic.

http://meebal.com/why-is-thailand-failing-to-lure-wealthy-expats-in-greater-numbers/

I wish to thank the Nation for a job well done. I enjoyed listening to K. Suthichai in the evening on his talk radio broadcast, in the 90's. One of the conversations we had was about a young Thai, graduating top of class at the USAF Academy, which some people could not understand how a Thai man which came from a poor background would do that. My comment was that he had to be one of the best to qualify.

People criticize the Nation because it appears to be right leaning and support democracy, but I hope it up the good work and continues true democracy. Some governments have called them selves supporters of democracy, but were only in politics for the money.

Perhaps, but some of us criticise The Nation for their often juvenile writing style, horrid use of English-like language, timid opinion pieces and sometimes simply unintelligible rubbish. Whether or not we can agree with the opinions of the authors, we usually cannot even determine because the pieces most often either say nothing (and certainly nothing interesting) or cannot be deciphered by native English speakers.

Given the terrible lacking of English language in the majority of Nation writing, and their inability to follow any internationally well-established journalistic best practices, such as performing true investigative research, following up with their reader base on any number of important matters (such as the abused Karen girls, for example), or taking on tough topics involving the powerful and/or wealthy, I can't understand why they would endevour to bring any of their lacking of capabilities to countries which don't have them.

Singapore

Hong Kong

Myanmar -- even Myanmar has far better English ability and their people not scared to challenge the rich and powerful and perform true journalism.

I can't really understand their goals for expansion. It doesn't add up. They bring nothing to those countries, and would be far better to focus their efforts on employing some decent English speakers and writers and learning how to truly be useful in their space. The entire image is completely amateurish.

I work in what many would consider a very high end finance firm. There are many Thais who went to school abroad (some from high school) and some for college or post grad etc. What is astonishing to me is that most of them (with the exception of those who start in in English speaking countries in college) cannot really even hold a conversation in English beyond things like learned/memorised responses.

Well, astonishing might not be reasonable.

I think a serious issue among even the elite is that there is a very palpable separation of Thais at this end of Thai society from intimate relationships (friendships, etc.) with Westerners. From what I understand non-Thai Easterners (like Japanese) have similar trouble getting close to Thais at the upper end. Most of the Western expats I'm close to in my firm, those on my staff and Westerners I've met out and about have expressed the same trouble.

All that to say that even educated Thais get very little practice speaking English with non-Thais and thus their English becomes more of a status symbol really.

Anyone on here really close (as in a very close, serious friendship) with well educated Thais from the upper end of society? Does your experience match with this?

"Sleep with any man's wife (esp knowingly), and you should essentially prepare for extraordinary violence."

Not from me.

The Thai culture must have penetrated you...

Ah, yes. It is a uniquely Thai characteristic. You got me. Cheers

Yingluck is a good looking one I tell ya.

I don't care about the story. Just enjoy seeing her in different outfits and situations.

http://blogs.wsj.com/searealtime/2013/06/07/thailands-credibility-risks-beating-over-rice-dispute/

http://www.establishmentpost.com/lead-contamination-a-blow-to-thailand-rice/