PalMan

Obviously the love doesn't come from the money, you have to earn it just like any other relationship.

And I don't need to tell anyone anything, nor do I care what others judgments are.

And the fact that she decides to leave for financial reasons doesn't mean the love isn't real, just shows its relative importance in life.

Love is a luxury that only the comfortably well off can afford to indulge in.

Anyway we've been repeating the same stuff to each other ad nauseum enough is enough, thanks for, whatever. . .

Looks like this is an example of where you can't find out everything on the Internet.

Like I said, do half best you can up there in RMB the other half into USD and then report back here which worked out better for you.

It does matter how it starts. If it starts off as P4P then, in 99% of cases it'll always be P4P. No money? Fergedabowdit !!

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<deleted> you!

My point isn't that she'll stay with no money, it's that the P4P aspect doesn't preclude the genuine emotional intimacy.

In your case, due to your attitudes I dare say it might. Maybe when you're older that will change for you, for your sake I hope so.

Otherwise your choices are old & ugly, or empty & shallow, and I personally wouldn't want to have created such a world for myself.

As it stands now I can have a mix young & hot & athletic & eager to please & empty & shallow, or if I work at it over time, every once in a while young & hot & athletic & eager to please & real love.

Of course nothing lasts forever, but I'm OK with that, nice thing about Thailand is a never-ending supply of fish in the sea.

Until we get priced out of the market by Asia's ascendancy concurrent with the fall of the West.

Oh stop kidding yourself and trying to flannel everyone here with your insipid waffle.

What would you rather have;

A woman who loves, cares, respects, appreciates and empathises with you without a moment's thought about money

or

A woman who, upon realising you've got a few bucks in the bank eventually comes to love, care, respect, appreciate and empathise with you???

If, by virtue of your age, looks, corpulence or whatever, that's only possible with a woman older, less aesthetically-blessed and fatter than what you go for in Thailand then yes, by all means, go ahead and fill your boots but don't bang on about how a relationship that grows out of a P2P arrangement is anywhere near as valid as one with real foundations because, if the money runs out, how much grace do you reckon your woman will grant you before hooking up with someone else?

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Sorry, just as valid is my verdict.

And I'll also take the Marxist position (Groucho, not Karl) that I'd never want to have a relationship with the kind of woman who would move in with me for free.

In my case as you point out I'm just being realistic.

Great post Nan Laew.

I was reading this article about mental shortcuts causing one to jump to conclusions:

http://www.slate.com/articles/news_and_politics/politics/2013/05/tea_party_irs_will_the_irs_s_profiling_of_tea_party_groups_convince_conservatives.html

And thought it had some bearing here. . .

Plus most Dutch learn to ride a bike real young, we masters at it there are more bikes as people in my country.

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Plus actually encouraging bike usage for commuting, especially designing the urban streetscapes properly for bike safety.

Most of our communities "back homes" are designed as if they assume the private auto is the only decent mode of transport and will continue to be possible into the far future.

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At least Thais don't actually try to knock you off the road:

http://www.thetimes.co.uk/tto/public/cyclesafety/article3771013.ece

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-22614569

The local vs tourist pricing here has nothing to do with race, much less any racist "attitudes".

Are you really that naive? From my experience in Thailand it most certainly does.

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Then why does a copy of my tax return or my Thai drivers license - or sometimes just the fact that I speak Thai - get this honkey in at the Thai price?

Bullshit.

It's just as likely that the guy's deluding himself as it is that his boyfriend genuinely loves him.

The mere presence of financial imperatives for the paid party introduces perfectly reasonable doubt over the veracity of said love whereas, with the romantic aspect you're so quick to dismiss as little more than folly, there is often more underpinning said love.

Go ahead, dispute it but outside the Thailand bubble, there are billions of people who are in and remain in love with each other even in the face of financial challenges.

I prefer not to let the bubble brainwash me or make me super-cynical about relationships between men and women (or in this other guy's case, men and men). In m y experience, it doesn't come down to financial imperatives as much as it does to genuine feeling, respect, appreciation and empathy for another person.

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Likely or not, other than a respectful and gently warning - if you have reason to think he's being overly naive, getting scammed - your speculation isn't appropriate - more strongly it's reprehensibly rude.

And genuine feeling, respect, appreciation and empathy for another person are not at all excluded by the initial/underlying financial arrangement, I'm sorry it's just not, I've had a lot of experience in this area.

Sure you have to be more careful, more protective of your heart and your assets, but I would say that same attitude would have been very helpful to me as a callow youth who followed his lovesick puppy hormone flushes.

This is from India, and coming from the other end tertiary studies, but perfectly captures the exact same syndromes that permeate the Thai education system.

http://qz.com/86903/students-are-the-victims-and-culprits-of-indias-broken-higher-education-system/

You and I (if I were that way inclined) would be under no illusions whatsoever but for every one of us, there are loads who expect to get what they're paying for - namely, loyalty.

It doesn't matter whether they're young or old - that's irrelevant but, in my experience, the majority of those who do expect loyalty and exclusivity are older.

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IMO it's mostly the naive newbies who expect that.

And those with more experience (= wisdom) tend to be older.

Sure he loves you.

Sure !!

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And that's just nasty, uncalled for, completely unjustified, you have no idea of the setup.

That's my main problem with you and your posts, you make unwarranted assumptions based on nothing but your idiotic prejudices.

Lots and lots of relationships here start out as straight P2P and then develop true intimacy over time.

Sure they're likely to end if the money runs out, but that's just as true for traditional "romantic" relationships back home or anywhere.

Doesn't mean there isn't real love there. Just that basic survival needs are - quite rightly - more important.

Doesn't mean the love isn't real. . .

True - I thought of saving some money when going to the UK last year by not renewing my kids passports, but then thought there might be a problem if something unexpected happened.

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Yes if the only motive is to save a little time and money, that would IMO be silly, keep travel docs current and ready to go, especially if you have family on the other side and may need to hop on a plane quickly.

What is wrong with you? Those are the types of guy I'm referring to; the ones who expect monogamy/loyalty because they're paying for it.

Because you keep talking as if "the guys that are paying for it" - or "the guys that are with much younger girls" - are more likely to expect their girl to be faithful.

My point is that none of these very separate factors have anything to do with each other, and the fact that you keep mixing them all up causes your statements to be false over-generalizations.

I think guys in more-or-less-explicit P2P relationships are much LESS likely to expect their girls to be faithful, much MORE likely to be realistic and OK with them fooling around than guys in supposedly "love" based traditional marriages.

Bottom line is faithfulness isn't what most of us are paying for and I think most of us aren't kidding ourselves.

Is it ok if you have your ID?

I know it's OK for a British citizen to enter the UK without a passport.

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I guess you're talking about boarding the plane with the UK passport but then entering Thailand as a Thai without a passport?

I think there isn't a country in the world that would turn their citizen away at their own border crossing if you can prove your citizenship.

However you really want to slide on through meeting the normal expectations, never mind the technicalities.

International travel's enough of a hassle already these days.

Oh dear, has it really been that long.

Humble apologies

There really should be a direct p'town - snookyville connection. . .

How on earth do you work in a bucket??

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Used to be cheap travel agencies.

Now bars that sell cheap booze, couple hundred baht per - wait for it - bucket, as in with a straw.

Note that if there's no need for the PASSPORT itself, not a big deal until you want to return to Thailand.

Giving up CITIZENSHIP requires taking active steps, she'll keep that her whole life by default, and can always replace a lapsed passport through her embassy, just realize it takes a while. . .

Wasn't addressed to you specifically at all Joe, very much "generic you".

Interesting. Apparently King Chula's spirit's preferences also include:

Black coffee, Scotch, Hennessy cognac, Winston cigarettes and bundles of red or pink roses.

He was a big fan of farang culture of course. . .

Well I hope it has worked out for you but it sounds very much like wishful or theoretical thinking.

I don't have to wait for my sector to become unstable. I have found most of the people I know that have retired did so because they just couldn't accept the alternative that required change and adaptation. I suspect the same will happen to me.

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Up to you.

Keep learning new skills, expanding your networks of contacts in the area you want to move into next, be ready when circumstances look right or you get bored with the same-old.

Life's too short to keep doing stuff you don't enjoy. Ultimately you want to find a way to make a living that you'd be willing to do for free.

That way you don't even want to "retire", you just adjust your work patterns to your changing preferences.

Obviously once you're getting past the age most people consider appropriate for retirement you need to be in an industry / skillset where being perceived as ancient doesn't matter anymore, and unlikely that will be a job with an employer, need to be fully freelance by the time you hit 60 IMO.

If all that seems too much of a challenge, consider yourself lucky to have that luxury, that's the way the world of work is heading for the next generations, few employers will want stuck-in-a-rut fulltime staff costing full benefits, most jobs will be in industries and job categories that currently don't exist.

Which is why our kids' education needs to be all about creativity, keeping curiosity and the desire for learning new things burning their whole life long. The actual content they're teaching these days is mostly obsolete by the time people hit the job market, never mind future decades.

Yes, that all goes without saying, but why has this version suddenly become a record breaker, up there threatening Suriyothai and King Narusan for the number one spot?

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Serious, long, dramatic, tink-too-mutt historical epics vs ghosts+comedy with popular super-stars?

And you're surprised?

You're right, the "COLLETION" should pop it up, not on the web.

Except for this thread - wow Google's quick, must be crawling this site hourly+ !

It's still yours - as long as you can prove it.

The cops probably won't bother a receiving stolen property even if there is such a charge here.

But you could offer a reward for him turning in the guy he got if from if you're that motivated.

Personally I'd settle for just getting the phone back, pushing it further could yield unintended consequences.