SoiBiker

It's standard big city behaviour - when you live surrounded by millions of people there aren't enough hours in the day to greet them all. Small town provincial hicks might find it a bit rude, but it's just the way things are.

LOL at the grumpy old bastards that can't spare a smile or a "hello" in passing.

The needy losers who get upset when a stranger isn't interested in them are funnier.

Why would anyone travel thousands of miles just to hang out with the same people?

Someone just learnt how to use photoshop, I guess.

I didn't say hello to every random I bumped into before I lived here. Why would I start now?

You're kidding yourself if you think everybody aspires to the whoremonger lifestyle. Pity, laughter or embarrassment are more likely reactions.

They're presumably being moved to allow a walkway into the new mall to be added.

Yeah. Nothing like a stroll down Soi Cowboy to soak up the 'culture', eh?

Good points indeed. The fact of the matter, is that I do not believe this is against Thai culture. That is a pretty strong statement, and I doubt it has any basis in fact. The more accurate thing to say may be that "we are not used to doing that, and we are afraid, uncomfortable, and unwilling to do things we are not used to doing. Thai people have a lot of lovely qualities, but they are amongst the most conventional minded people on the planet. It is extremely hard for most of them to think outside of the fairly small box they confine themselves to live within. So, when you introduce something like kissing for an introduction, I could see how that could blow their minds. Even some of my girlfriends friends, who i have known for years, I hesitate to kiss when I say hello. They seem to like to keep a physical distance unless you are intimate. Even my girlfriend, when she greets her Mom and Dad, after not seeing them for 9 months, never used to hug or kiss them. She does now, as I insist. It seems unnatural to not greet your folks warmly after that much time. I give her Mom and hug and a kiss, and she thinks it is strange, but I think she likes it.

So when they're culturally uncomfortable with something, they're being small minded - but when you disagree with something, it's unnatural and they should bend to your will?

Prostitution is illegal in Thailand...if you did not know...

Sadly the legislation against stupidity hasn't made it's way onto the statutes yet.

Besides which, if you think people are jealous of the fact you have to pay for it, you're seriously deluding yourself.

Excuse my ignorance but when people use "monger", does that mean Whoremonger? I've never come across that term so I'm just taking a shot in the dark.

It is just a normal man living in Asia. The term is used disparagingly by jealous folks from other parts of the world with more parochial life styles.

You think it's normal to pay for sex?

Not everyone here shares your lifestyle.

i just think to survive here you need either truck loads of cash or a viable source of income.

If you come across a place where it's possible to survive without a viable source of income, please let us know.

I wasn't referring to the Thais.

I got a free ride over Songkran, too. Gave the guy a few baht anyway.

Bangkok taxi drivers are mostly nice guys, despite the people they have to deal with.

I like Khao San too. You wouldn't want to go there every night, but it's fun now and again.

I think it is good to have a normal critical view on things and also be able to see things that are bad here. If Thai people in general also had this ability, then there would maybe not be so much corruption and e.g. rich people being above the law. They might also do something about the wide spread prostitution and look for better ways to expand tourism. They might even get a better educational system and end up with an international outlook. And I could go on forever...

Believing that everything is just perfect or covering up the truth does not improve anything or help anybody. It is just living in an illusion. Both Thai people and also many farangs here, could learn a lot about facing the reality of the real world, discussing it and learning from the bad things here.

Being critical in a constructive way, is for sure better than being stupid and naive.

Who said Thailand was perfect?

This place tends to go way beyond constructive criticism - more like running down everything about the country then belittling anyone who disagrees.

I get the impression some of them would be living in misery wherever they were.

Never really had much of a problem with this. Now and then one or two drivers will turn me down, but I tend to attribute this to them not being able to understand my bad Thai. Life's too short to get all bothered about it when there are plenty of others driving around and I generally find one within a couple of minutes.

Found this on Stickman's site...

By John Zachary Smith

I have some advice to any westerners out there contemplating moving to Thailand.

If you are rich and are sensible with money, then go ahead. If an international company or similar offers you a high salary job in Thailand then fine. If your are retired or have steady funds from aboard and want to live modestly on those funds, go ahead, but watch yourself. And if you're a young dude travelling around the world, and you want to spend some time in Thailand teaching or whatever for experience, then that's OK too.

If you don't fall into these categories then "don't" consider it for a moment. Many middle aged westerners in particular (including professionals) like the idea of living there, having a business or making some money and "enjoying life" in Thailand. But very few make it. (Forget about western restaurant or bar owners and alike you might meet in Thailand boasting about their good life there. It is common for faltering foreigners to keep up appearances). Mostly they end up broke or crazed, sometimes both, then they leave. Thai business, visa and residency laws get you in the end. The "Thai way" will get you in the end. Have a minor run-in with a wealthy or important Thai and your status and possibly your life will be at risk. Their whole culture is geared around making sure that foreigners pursuing individual efforts are not successful. It's ingrained in them from an early age to believe that they are the never-colonized master race of Asia (yes they really think that) and their mythology runs so deep you'll never budge it. Remember, in Thailand you'll never have any real business, legal or ownership rights. But Thais can go to your country (very possibly) and buy and own anything they can get their hands on (because of the more tolerant business laws). To Thais, this is just further evidence of how clever they are, and how foolish are the foreigners to go to Thailand.

Remember too, that Thailand is dominated by a comparatively small military-industrial elite. They have all the power and most of the wealth in the country. The idea of western foreigners living in the country and achieving wealth and status through individual entrepreneurial efforts is seen as a threat to the hegemony that they have over the Thai underclass - the bulk of the population. For this reason, it is never allowed to happen.

Think of Thailand, for westerners, as being a bit like a casino. A casino is a place with a touch of excitement, the lure of good fortune / the good life, and a place for fun, even with a bit of a risk. Go to a casino every now and then for fun and that's OK. Go there everyday all-day and you will ultimately lose, because the House Advantage will always get you. So it is in Thailand. The Thai "House Advantage" will get you. They make sure of it.

Of course, if going to Thailand with all your money and slowly losing it and ending up teaching English for a pittance (because that's about all you can do), either illegally or working legally but being treated like a serf by Thai institutions, appeals to you then go ahead. And running around the country several times a year getting visas, or always being at the mercy of authorities on visa matters might be your bag. If so, then go ahead, at least you'll be able to spend your nights at cheap restaurants sharing your impoverishment and frustration with other exploited western teachers. If not, think seriously.

In case you are thinking, let me say that I am not a former go-go bar owner gone bust, I have not lost my all doing business with Thais, no I haven't been cheated of everything by a bar-girl, no I haven't been reduced to the indignity of teaching English for a pittance. I have my own money, have spent a lot of time in Thailand, and have done some business there, have observed the experiences of a lot of foreigners, can see what goes on, and have enough concern to want to tell others about it.

If my words can prevent even one westerner of modest means from selling up and going to "enjoy life" in Thailand (and getting shafted in the end) then that will be something. Don't make the mistake of thinking that as a foreigner (even with professional skills) you can "make a contribution" to Thailand, no matter how good your intentions or needed your skills may be. Your contribution will *never* be welcomed, only your money. There is a saying in Thai that captures it well: "farang roo mark my dee" - foreigners who know too much [about Thailand] are no good. Gullible tourists, however, are great.

So, go to Thailand as a tourist if you like, enjoy what you enjoy there, but don't be taken in by the culture or people, as many westerners have, and don't under any circumstances give up anything back home to go and stay there unless you are financially secure for life, or know exactly what you are doing.

There is a tradition of resident foreigners in Thailand not telling you the truth about the country because they don't like to admit to themselves and to others about the mistake they have made in moving there. But especially now, with the financial mess Thailand has got itself into through a mixture of greed, incompetence, arrogance and corruption, and the prospect of difficult times ahead (to say the least) it is time for plain speaking.

A final comment to anyone who strongly disagrees with these comments. Unless you have lived, worked and conducted business in Thailand for many years, I'm not interested. The views of "oh how can you say that, Thailand is really great" 2 week tourists carry no weight with those of us who know Thailand and Thais well.

So don't move here unless you have some way of supporting yourself?

I'd have thought that was pretty obvious.

Fair enough. You have a unique experience.

I have a 'unique experience' because I don't hang around with sexpats?

This is one of the things that's odd about this place. It's full of people who think the only reason to come here is to exploit the women.

Another question could blame the host country: why can't Thailand attract and retain [well adjusted, polite, smart, successful, culturally sensitive, younger, richer, etc.] farangs?

It can - I know plenty of people here that fit that description. They just don't post here, probably because it has a reputation as a den of whinging whoremongers.

Of course we have our own anecdotes suggesting there are some. However, I would have to strongly disagree with the implication that these chaps are the majority. There are places in Asia where these guys gravitate in higher as percentage numbers. Singapore is one, China is another. Japan, Korea ditto.

There's some reason why Thailand cannot attract and retain a high enough number of these kinds of people to change the (earned) perception. I suggest it's the Thai state and culture that should have some considerable blame placed with it.

This question, by the way, is one the apologists have no answer for.

And, I should add, to be clear, some percentage of these falangs would never be the type that Thais are trying to attract. But, I suspect many here might be quite different if they believed that the Thai state truly welcomed them and their families and treated them fairly under the law and had immigration policies that made them feel secure. Why learn a damn hard language, for instance, if you might not be admitted into the country next year?

They're certainly the vast majority amongst the expats I know here. But then, I don't spend my time hanging around in the city's less salubrious bars.