ThailandLOS

Just now, bazza73 said:

So there are some that act like shares rather than as a store of value. Can you give one example, please?

Sure, all of the mentioned above (edited while you were posting) already pay or will pay dividend. There are also other much less complex coins e.g. TenX and OmiseGo (both target the payment transaction market in SEA) that will launch dividend payments within the next few months. I am vested in most of them.

A practical easy example for NEO - which is basically Chinas substitute for Ethereum. When holding NEO, one is paid in GAS on their blockchain abt every 20 seconds when a block is completed, no work or mining required. The GAS goes straight into my personal wallet and can be sold on exchange, or kept for value increase if one prefers. The amount of GAS received is proportional to the number NEO held in the wallet - e.g. share of ownership (or Proof of Stake as it's commonly called in the crypto space).

This is a calculator that shows the amount of GAS earned depending on the NEO holding, and can give you fair idea about the dividend size:

https://neotogas.com/

55 minutes ago, bazza73 said:

Having done some research, as far as I can make out there is a finite supply of bitcoins. That supply is fixed by the originators, six completely anonymous people.

So it's a matter of supply and demand - people buy crypto currencies because they think they will go up in value. Just like the Dutch did buying tulip bulbs in the 16th century.

Who is to say the originators won't debase the cryptocurrency by issuing more, just like governments do?

Some people will make a lot of money, some will lose their shirts. I think I'll stick to the Aussie dollar.

For bitcoin (not applying to all other crypto currencies) there is indeed a finite supply of 21 million coins - which can not be altered. Even if it would be possible, chances that this would happen are less than microscopic as very few of coin holders are interested in diluting their possessions.

People buy crypto for all kind of reasons - but if there were no strong use cases in the first place, they would never exist.

Personally I don't like to speculate on price, e..g. buy the lows and sell the highs - but rather identify the coins that provide a steady growing dividend income without any need to ever sell. There are quite a few of those around.

A lot of the large complex projects really stretching the imagination of what can be done on blockchain technology are still in their infancy - e.g. Ethereum, NEO, Lisk, QTUM, MaidSafe. Most of them are still relatively cheap to buy into today - just like Microsoft was before the personal computer catched on.

1 hour ago, bazza73 said:

I don't consider I am trolling, but I am concerned over the security aspect. And the old saw about not investing in what I don't understand.

Each paper currency is backed by its respective government. Sure, it's manipulated. Who stands behind bitcoins in their various forms? I've noted that some bitcoins have increased in value, and some have crashed. So is this like picking winners in the sharemarket?

There is a whole variety of crypto - mainly divided into currencies and assets.

Bitcoin is a currency - which main advantage is its liquidity, i.e. people can hold or transfer very large amount of currency. In this case the value is backed by the need of people wanting to transfer funds fast and cheap (and in some cases keep them away from the banks). As long as BTC is convertible into goods, service and other currencies, the demand will grow (remember that only 16 million BTC will ever be minted).

Since there is now saturation of pure currency in the crypto space and blockchains can be used for basically anything that can be done over the internet, new ideas are coming up around holding crypto as assets.

An example is OmiseGo (developed mainly in Thailand) which gives you are share of the payment network to connect merchants, users and partners. Dividends will paid be paid out to the OMG holder when the network goes live - and obviously the value of the OMG asset will increase.

Some of these ideas are great to implement on blockchain and finance by issuing a coin - some are just bad business models dressed up as crypto. Proper homework should be able to tell the difference. For every coin I invest in, I reject about 20.

No other Thai xchange than Bx.in.th trades Ripple - you need to get a hold of some BTC or ETH and open an account with e.g. Bittrex (not aware if they accept US citizens though)

1 hour ago, ColinChapman said:

A friend suggests you try coins.co.th. Neither of us has ever used it but he thinks it accepts Americans

They don't, as they are probably looking to expand with other currencies than BTC. The issue is that these might be deemed as securities by SEC and the exchange might face liability. That's what excludes US citizens from most exchanges.

A way to get around this as someone mentioned is to use Localbitcoins - which is not really an exchange but still useful for buying BTC if you don't expect to do frequent trades. But that will still not solve the problem if u want to exchange for other currencies.

Good news for the US (and Chinese) citizens of the world is that new exchanges are on the way which don't require sign ups and will do the trading directly on blockchain. Kyber.network and Ox are examples of such high profile projects - but still some time before they go live.

12 hours ago, InMyShadow said:

Its interesting the developers have chosen Nana to build the most expensive condo project in Thailand. That speaks volumes about where that area is heading. There is a major overhaul happening in that area with partial sois being demolished along with their sleazy bar scene.

Nana plaza is next . It reminds me of redfern and  kings cross in Sydney Australia , dumps that were  quickly transformed into  prime property .

This is by no means the most expensive one - and the land around Nana is not even considered prime location. Atm there are projects being built with with duplex units priced up to 500 MB.

51 minutes ago, Pdaz said:

Been looking at the bx.in.th site ( I've used coinbase and coins previously) and registered an account. I can't see where to transfer directly to my hardware wallet only their bx mobile wallet. Will the destination wallet address show when I purchase bitcoin/other currency on their site first ? Not keen to leave coins on the exchange.

You can withdraw to any blockchain address you like - as long as it supports the currency you are withdrawing. Under 'My funds'/'Withdraw' you select the currency and just enter the destination address. Then you can access the funds thru your preferred wallet.

The destination address will show up in the blockchain (unless you use Dash, Monero or some other coin obfuscating this), but you can always generate a new address on the wallet side, if you want to prevent tracking.

Hope that helps.

4 hours ago, champers said:

Why is it assumed the thief is a tourist? 

You mean he would need to enter on a non-B and get a work permit?

2 hours ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

I am not a liberal and I'm only part Canadian. 

 

I don't watch CNN.

 

you didn't answer the question what do you think about Fck coin?

Only part Canadian huh? In that case I retract my comment above.

Tell you what - to show there is no bad blood I will try out the FCK free of charge. Send a hundred of them to the ETH address below and I will give you my professional opinion within 48h before I return them. Deal?

0xc7c0eefcabb11214e446bb9df692ad7ef91200ed

1 hour ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

Of course there is a switch. They can start by shutting down wallets and exchanges....and there is a real threat of bitcoin hack using quantum computers.

Nope, you still don't get it. You can't "shut down wallets" that are local - and you can't shut down exchanges that are running on blockchain. 

And there is no "real threat of bitcoin hack using quantum computers" - as they are nowhere to be seen and will not for quite some time. I would imagine that cryptography has taken few steps by then, so no threat there.

1 hour ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

btw, if ponzi fiat currency is so bad, why is it the only accepted method of exchange

It is not and you would have known it if you would try to educate yourself a bit instead of getting your information from CNN or whatever you watch in neo-lib Canada.

47 minutes ago, theguyfromanotherforum said:

 

No more, no more..... until someone at the government decides to shut the all operation down. Remember the safety of Swiss bank accounts? Bitcoin like the fed is based on a belief system, just like MySpace and Facebook. Saying no more comes out as being pretty arrogant.

 

btw, what do you think of <deleted> coin?

 

 

Which government is that - all of them jointly confiscating millions of computers? And what does it have to do with Swiss bank accounts, that are tied to physical locations and individuals?

You need to understand that blockchain systems are distributed - there is no single point of failure, no 'button' for any government to 'switch off' - there is no office to raid and close down, no one to arrest, nothing, unless someone would decide to kill off the entire internet. (As a matter of fact there are blockchain projects being worked on even to mitigate that)

Facebook a belief system?? They are selling out your entire life to anyone willing to pay right this moment - in case you have an account with them. This is exactly the types of centralized arrogant monopolies that blockchain applications will take down in the coming years. I hope you see this as a good thing.

1 minute ago, tryasimight said:

All are miniaturised transistorised memory.

No they are not - try again

I have no intentions of spending my Saturday evening exchanging insults with you - however, you might want to google how cold storage of data is done nowadays.

17 minutes ago, tryasimight said:

Oh dear ....you really are a  tech head......but not an electrical engineer are you?

I am.

Actually I have a masters degree in electrical engineering and been working in IT industry for quite some years - hope that satisfies your curiosity.

20 minutes ago, tryasimight said:

And one decent sunspot, or a nuke, event wipes out all . I'll keep my cash under the bed thanks

Even when/if the banks mainframes are stuffed I'll still have negotiable currency. I may even be a billionaire in that world. Craptocurrency ....non existent.

Google magnetic pulse..

 

One thing I have learnt on my years on this earth, generally speaking, is that you don't get something for nothing....you have to work for it.

 

Are you saying that the people creating blockchain solutions and ones supporting them by investing haven't worked for their money?

I don't need to Google something that is taught in elementary school - and have yet to see a magnetic pulse that wipes out all the computer records in the world, especially since very few are kept on magnetic media nowadays.

1 hour ago, Shaunduhpostman said:

Its rather tragic that the media gloms on to scam stories and how absurdly over valued  Bitcoin is rather than the news that the average person now has great potential for opportunity that you  can to some degree manage and control yourself, vicissitudes of the crypto-currency markets not withstanding. There is also micro loaning to other crypto investors you can do, you can actually mine and mint various coins yourself using video game graphic cards. It is not something the avergae person has even a remote chance of doing with fiat currencies. Do we hear about any of that, of course not, haha!

Totally agree on that - anything disruptive to the current status quo will inevitably be the target of mainstream media.

Like all great things that empower the people like free energy, free speech, the free internet, crypto currencies and peer-to-peer blockchain-based application will be attacked/undermined/regulated/infiltrated/sabotaged ferociously by the powers that be once they they start making significant inroads into the fabric of society and thus changing the status quo.

But due to its decentralized P2P architecture, blockchain-based software solutions will become and remain a very disruptive, mercurial, creative, game-changing, world-transforming technology platform far ages to come.

Once computers were developed, the internet was bound to be created. Once the internet was established, block-chain based applications couldn’t help but cropping up and overgrowing the whole digital world like a tropical forest.

And the same type of uninformed skeptics are now seen on the sidelines as during the breakthrough of public internet.

1 hour ago, janclaes47 said:

So I presume the electronic wallet is linked to under your mattress.

Have no need for any wallet since I'm not moving the funds around - just a crypto key and the blockchain address. The funds are secured in the blockchain which is replicated by millions of computers.

21 minutes ago, impulse said:

 

Cannot be manipulated?  Any market can be manipulated.   Decentralized and transparent?  Did you realize that well over 90% of Bitcoin transactions are now happening in China?   Where they throw people in jail for reporting how much money they've printed.  If I could print money, not tell anyone how much I have printed, and throw anyone who does tell in jail, I'd be buying Bitcoins at a rate that would drive the price up astronomically (with my newly printed cash) and dump it all when I've had enough fun.  

 

Leaving all the suckers "holding the bag".

 

 

So you would volunteer to cause hyper inflation and social chaos in order to take crypto down?

What one doesn't want to understand one can not understand. Good luck with your fiat currency anyway.

1 hour ago, janclaes47 said:

So you can today receive 120.000 USD in cash for your 10.000 tokens?

Yes I can sell the lot on the exchanges right this moment, but would never trade it to fiat currency unless I need to - and especially not USD, unless it's e.g. for buying physical gold or property at fair value.

1 hour ago, janclaes47 said:

How does a individual who has no bank account have access to electronic payments? I thought online banking and credit cards were linked to bank accounts.

Omise Merchants and others (e.g. McDonald's Thailand signed up a few days ago) will adopt electronic wallets accessing the OMG blockchain (basically an immutable ledger database). Solutions for cash in/out without any need for bank account are coming early next year. This will also be a trading platform for bringing together various type of loyalty program points and redeem into tokens or cash.

The processing rate on the OMG blockchain will be very fast - and thus suitable for micro payments (where for example Bitcoin or common credit cards can not compete).

Primary target markets at the moment are Japan, Thailand and Malaysia. Note that BTC is already legal tender in Japan, so no need to even exchange for cash there.

1 minute ago, Meljames said:

 

 

You did when you claimed no one would be left holding the bag.

 

Bitcoin and the others  just the latest investment gimmick . It has it's upsides and will have an impact on global economics. The people behind it will learn to manipulate it to protect their wealth, people will get rich, others will go broke trying to get rich with it. Nothing new under the sun here. 

No, your missing my point - it can not be manipulated to any significant extent since the cost would be too high. There are no "people behind it" since it's totally decentralized and transparent, in contrast to the "mainstream economy".

BTC and other will have it's ups & downs - but it's here to stay.

1 minute ago, Meljames said:

Same as illicit drugs or any black market item; working outside the mainstream economy doesn't make it invulnerable to economic factors. Eventually, the new will wear off, other crypto-currencies will emerge etc, and the price will flatten and fall. 

 

 

No one said that crypto is invulnerably to basic economic factors - although a lot of those factors have been manipulated to benefit the top 1% - this can not be done as easily in decentralized crypto economy where you can't simply print money at will.

E.g. the cyclic transfer of wealth that we have seen over and over again: cheap loans -> inflated property and business prices -> manufactured crisis -> banks and governments step in and buy below fair value

Abt other cryptos emerging, well in that case you could say that abt any major corporation in the world in which people are buying stocks.

Time to market, a strong business model and liquidity is everything - those are the basic economic factors.

8 hours ago, janclaes47 said:

 

You're right about that, and one of those that is a benefiter of that new wealth hung himself in a Thai jail a month or so ago, while another is sitting a life sentence in a US jail.

Well - I would say the majority is neither in jail or considering hanging themselves.

I bought Bitcoin in 2015 - then started to get interested in the coins/tokens that have more elaborated business models than just being a vehicle for payments.

E.g. take OmiseGo, which is a Thai subsiduary of the Japanese payment vendor Omise with 50.000+ merchants on their records ready to adopt the OMG token in Q1-2018 - and will cater for the 70%+ unbanked people of SEA that will be able to access electronic payements and cash in/out solutions. This is an example of a very real business model that will be coming to a place close to you very soon.

I bought 10.000 tokens at 0.26 USD when they released a few weeks back. Now they trade at 12 USD - you do the math on that.

For that I get a cut of their network and get paid dividends that no bank in the world is close to matching.

Now tell me how crypto is a bubble and people adopting it are criminals and suicidal.

56 minutes ago, Meljames said:

 

Why?

Because funds are currently shifting from fiat currency to crypto on a massive scale - just have a look at the USD index to get an idea. Less and less major players participating in buying USD & US bonds to keep the recycling game going.

The same people that are telling you that gold is just a pet rock (and simultaneously artificially holding it's price down) - will tell you that crypto is a bubble and you should hold fiat. See how that is working out in e.g. Venezuela currently - where people are surviving thanks to crypto.

1 hour ago, impulse said:

The 2 key words in your post are "bubble" and "bursts".   It may go up to $10,000, but I don't want to be one of those holding the bag when it happens.  Unless I got in at $5.00, but it's way too late for that.

Nobody having major cryptos will be "holding the bag" - there is a major transfer of wealth going on as we speak, one of the largest in history of mankind.

No more asking for permission where to send funds and pay outrageous fees - and then wait a few days for everyone in the transfer chain to take their cut.

No more SEC's to decide what people are allowed to invest in and when.

No more governments inflating the value of peoples work (and pretending that inflation is eradicated)

No more credit score companies selling peoples private lives.

No more Google/Youtube/FB censoring content at will.

These are just a few of the implications from blockchain - and you can be sure there will be more.

10 hours ago, Takeprofit said:

Bitcoin is a global Pyramid Scheme.

Speaking of scams, there’s this altcoin “Dollar” some outfit named “Federal Reserve” released – premised, no coin cap, shady as heck. It’s centrally controlled with zero transparency steer clear. Also every major “upgrade” was disappointing, to say the least. Plus the developers allocated 99.9% of the released coins to themselves and their banking buddies. Ponzi? MLM scam?