LanceGringo

Who is abigail89??

I've heard some rumours/ gossip from a Thai friend who works on Samui so take it as you should with a pinch of salt...

This is my own interpretation of what she has said

That night a large group, a mix of Thai and farrang including David Hannah and Sean went to the beach after the bars closed to drink, smoke weed, play guitars and just the typical backpacker utopia, we've all seen the cliche a million times...

One of the Thai guys was trying to hit on Hannah but she wasn't having any of it and he started getting nasty. Thats when David stepped in to defend her and the guy having lost face attacked David, other Thais joined in and he got stabbed and killed.

Sean probably tried to break it up and thats how he got the cuts, self preservation kicked in and he ran away.

Hannah watched all this was then raped and killed.

David was stripped of clothes because they wanted it to look like he had raped Hannah and maybe someone killed him for doing it.

A lot of people thai/farang were there and witnessed this happen and the clean up and getting stories straight before the police were 'officially' called out in the morning so know who did it.

But as we can see the wall of silence tells us its people of importance on that island involved, there's a lot of intimidation going on there now and people are genuinely scared.

But same as anywhere in the world people will eventually bit by bit start to gossip and just tell there best friend and so on...

Eventually someone will leave and then talk.

This doesn't make any sense, how could it ever look like David raped Hannah when two other guys semen was found on her body - and none of David's DNA was found on her.

I think your friend is full of BS and is yanking your chain.

I know Thai minds and western minds think very differently ...

Hmmm

I've heard some rumours/ gossip from a Thai friend who works on Samui so take it as you should with a pinch of salt...

This is my own interpretation of what she has said

That night a large group, a mix of Thai and farrang including David Hannah and Sean went to the beach after the bars closed to drink, smoke weed, play guitars and just the typical backpacker utopia, we've all seen the cliche a million times...

One of the Thai guys was trying to hit on Hannah but she wasn't having any of it and he started getting nasty. Thats when David stepped in to defend her and the guy having lost face attacked David, other Thais joined in and he got stabbed and killed.

Sean probably tried to break it up and thats how he got the cuts, self preservation kicked in and he ran away.

Hannah watched all this was then raped and killed.

David was stripped of clothes because they wanted it to look like he had raped Hannah and maybe someone killed him for doing it.

A lot of people thai/farang were there and witnessed this happen and the clean up and getting stories straight before the police were 'officially' called out in the morning so know who did it.

But as we can see the wall of silence tells us its people of importance on that island involved, there's a lot of intimidation going on there now and people are genuinely scared.

But same as anywhere in the world people will eventually bit by bit start to gossip and just tell there best friend and so on...

Eventually someone will leave and then talk.

This doesn't make any sense, how could it ever look like David raped Hannah when two other guys semen was found on her body - and none of David's DNA was found on her.

I think your friend is full of BS and is yanking your chain.

I was very surprised to see how little Sean McAnna said in the days after he posted what he did on Facebook. From 'risking his life' hiding in a shop on the island one moment, to telling journalists that he didn't know who the killers were etc as he was departing, it seemed a bit odd that he suddenly went very quiet and didn't have too much to say on any of it after that.

I just want to un see the photos.

And pray to whichever god there is (if there is one) - to find the animal or animals who did that and make them suffer.

Agreed. I can't believe a poster posted the pics on this forum. Madness.

Sean McAnna claims that he was meant to meet David the night of the murders, but didn't as he was too hungover from the previous evening. Has this been confirmed that he remained in all evening/night/early hours of the morning? can anyone back his claims up I wonder?

Also, the police said that they were looking for a group of men, westerners, that were singing songs and one of the men was playing a guitar - Sean McAnna plays a guitar . . . and by the looks of it, he plays a blood stained one at that . . .

Koh Tao should market the island as the place to come for a gripping, realistic 'murder mystery' experience.

The trip is based on an actual murder being committed by some Thai men, and you have to try and solve it whilst you're there - as the police are completely stupid, and just spend the entire time holding press conferences and posing for photographs.

There's absolutely no way this case is going to get solved now, I have given up on these jokers in charge of the investigation. I feel sorry for the families and loved ones of the victims, because basically the ENTIRE Thai police set-up has done everything in it's power to make sure that the truth and the killers are never revealed.

And the owner of AC Bar should be chained up and beaten mercifully until he is prepared to confess everything he knows, because I believe he knows a great deal about what happened that night.

"British backpackers Hannah Witheridge and David Miller may have been arguing with a local gangster when they were brutally murdered in Thailand last week, it has been suggested. The pair, who met on the island of Koh Tao where they were both staying with friends, may have fallen victim to a criminal 'underbelly' which, locals say, no one is speaking out about for fear of their own lives."

Read more: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-2764038/Did-Thai-murder-victims-argue-island-gangster-hour-brutally-killed-Locals-claim-no-one-speak-scared.html

These are still the most believable and important bits available this far, as far as I'm concerned. Probably lots of witnesses, since there were rumors that the quoted events took place in bar (AC Bar, right?), but none's talking.

How long walk is it from AC Bar the the scene of murder, anyway? Short, I assume?

I mean, how likely is it that this murder would be totally random, without murderer(s) priorly having met Hannah (or David) at all?

How likely - especially - when considering the trip between AC bar and scene of the murder is short (correct me if I'm wrong), and the events took place almost next to some party, anyway?

How likely is it, that it was some totally random person, who hadn't been in the party/the bar, and just happened to wander with few pals within Hannah's and David's short walking trip towards bungaloes?

I think, it's rather very unlikely.

I'm almost certain that murderer(s) have met Hannah before, assumedly the same night. Thus, they must have been following her from the bar. Usually things like this don't happen without previous argument of some sort either, so probably the argument has taken place just previously, assumedly in the bar. It doesn't need to be very big argument on places like this, especially if it's about gangsters. I mean, just find some videos of drunk farangs getting sht beaten out of them for little things. Now, the reports say that there probably has been argument, and there must have been witnesses to this, so this is more than likely the argument that has fired up things prior to the murders (yet locals aren't "speaking out about for fear of their own lives").

1. How long walk is it from AC Bar the the scene of murder, anyway? Short, I assume?

Very short, 2 minutes strolling.

2. I mean, how likely is it that this murder would be totally random, without murderer(s) priorly having met Hannah (or David) at all?

Police ask themselves this question every day.

3 How likely is it, that it was some totally random person, who hadn't been in the party/the bar, and just happened to wander with few pals within Hannah's and David's short walking trip towards bungaloes?

Very very low. You'd have to be a psychopath to do this. You should note however that Thailand claims that it does not have any psychopaths.

Thanks for the replies.

Since the trip between the bar they left, and the murder scene, is so short.. the murderers (2 murder weapons, so at least two suspects) have had to make the decision and act quickly. They were savage and brutal, quick, and acted as a pack. I don't think anyone other than a total psychopath would be able to act so quickly and cold-blooded, having just seen Hannah and David for the first time ever. But two (or more), as a pack? Doubt it. The decision wasn't made at the murder scene within a second, by more than one man, without any prior argument of any kind. It had to start up earlier, and they had to be followed.

Ever wonder why David was holding Hannah's hand (caught on the video shortly before the murders)? Just another dumb speculation, but Hannah could had been scared after the assumed argument (or some other reason), thus David holding her hand for sign of protection?

That wasn't them holding hands in the CCTV footage, it was two other people

Sypnosis script for conspiracy lovers.....

A young and open minded farang couple went to a beach spot for fun....

They danced and flirted in typical young foreigners way, perhaps after few drinks...

One or some of the boss's family or spot's staff on the dance floor, said something offensive or touched the girl, and her boyfriend reacted loud...

They got upset....and shared the feelings with the spot bouncers....

3 of them were told, or decided, to "take care" of the farangs outside the spot...

They follow the couple to the beach and waited for the opportunity to confront them....perhaps just for a beating...

They found them..naked..having sex...

The girl's boyfriend reacted, and they killed them ...raping the girl ...and run.

They informed the "boss" about what happens...

They got out of the island the same morning...and probably out of the country the same day...

With "professional" help, the boss tryed to put the blame in no local people....but DNA was the only link to the murderers..

The criminals never were found...or were found much later... and matching the DNA...but DEAD.

Case close...

DISCLOSE:

This is a fictional work, and not specific country, town, boss, or authority, is named.....

It is sounds familiar, it is because can happen in any place on earth, and to any people....

Too much time on your hands?

so it's a 3 hour boat ride to Koh Samui, then a 1 hour flight to BKK. Yet we got the DNA result back in less than 24 hours so Mon is no longer a suspect. Come on reporters. Press the corrupt cops over this nonsense.

Who has reported that news then?

Will someone please clarify which one of the dead tourists news threads is the latest official one?

There's so many of them I'm not sure which is the one to comment in.

agree . . . seems there's a 'new' thread on this tragedy opening up in the 'news section' all the time.

quite disgusting really . . if you factor that the friends & relatives of those two poor people are probably reading all this speculation on these pages too. TV should close them all, except for the very latest one they are posting/promoting.

If my son/daughter or someone in my family had been the victim of a crime like this, the last thing I think I would be doing is reading forum posts/threads about every detail online in a chat forum. Just my opinion.

Having said that, and anyone related or who knows the victims is reading these posts, I just want to say how desperately heartbroken I am for them, I really hope the murderers are brought to justice. This case has really affected me, and even though I don't know the victims, I want the families and their friends to be able to get some closure from knowing that the guys responsible for this awful crime have been caught and punished.

Well I stepped up a few hours ago but my post was deleted by Thaivisa, you can rest assured that some people don't want to know or allow the truth to be conveyed..

This crime is a lot worse than Murder...there is photograpic proof from the crime scene that has been released by the police in private that shows and proves the female victim was murdered BEFORE she was raped twice...

counting the minutes till this post is deleted, but not to worry, there will be copies of the photos/proof sent to the western news, no more cover ups!!!!!!!!!

How do you know she was raped after being murdered?

I have seen photos from the crime scene..A forensic expert can confirm whether someone is penetrated before or after death...I am no expert but have it on experts advice that these phootos undoubtedly prove these rapes occurred after the murder..

I has been explained to me the difference and makes total sense..there is a huge cover up going on here still..

Can you explain what the differences are, based on photographic evidence alone?

Relax everyone. They don't make arrests until all the DNA, etc are examined. In the meantime, the suspects are being held by the police. So many of you are really uneducated people on this board. The police are doing well. They want the case to be solid. In fact, they probably want confessions from the guys who did this. The confessions are normally easy to get in these cases in Thailand. You think torture forget that.

All they need to do is to explain DNA and other forensic evidence. Most people dont even know about DNA and what it can do and certainly many Thais isolated on a little island working at labor type of jobs probably dont scan the internet for the latest and greatest. They probably dont even know many cameras are around them.

Once the guilty realize they have no chance they confess for a promise of a less sentence maybe.

Cross contamination allegations are the best defense against DNA. Of course the guy's DNA will be at the crime scene - he is seen in video and photos standing next to one of the bodies with the police! The police let him contaminate the crime scene - now any lawyer worth his salt will argue that his DNA is of course at the crime scene, since he's standing there barefoot, and that the cops cross contaminated by touching one thing then another, moving dna about to the extent that no sample is unadulterated.

How can his DNA be at the crime scene just by being stood there?? - what was he doing masturbating/bleeding etc whilst he was stood chatting to the police???

Well I stepped up a few hours ago but my post was deleted by Thaivisa, you can rest assured that some people don't want to know or allow the truth to be conveyed..

This crime is a lot worse than Murder...there is photograpic proof from the crime scene that has been released by the police in private that shows and proves the female victim was murdered BEFORE she was raped twice...

counting the minutes till this post is deleted, but not to worry, there will be copies of the photos/proof sent to the western news, no more cover ups!!!!!!!!!

How do you know she was raped after being murdered?

He refused to the DNA test initially, before the photo of him was published on Sean McAnna's Facebook page.

Maybe to buy time for the other(s) to get away. If he was involved/knows more but is not one of the rapists/killers he might be confident do the test now as it only shows a family tie to the killer(s) - who has a couple of days more head-start now.

You very well could be right there actually!

Sources now speculate that the brother of the headsman was tested for DNA and results show negative (no match). The other person (son of headsman) say that he's somewhere in BKK.

If you read the numerous TV posts, so many have condemned this guy. I now understand that the reporting in Thailand is terrible and much to much premature. However, knowing that it's probably best just to reserve judgement until all the dust has settled and all the cards have been shown.

There is just so much speculation and being to quick with conclusions only can get you into trouble. There is too many who speak with Forked-Tongue.

I wouldn't have thought the DNA results will be available as of yet? at least 24 hours, no?

If this guy was so innocent, he would not have declined the DNA test in the first place, long before he was identified on Sean McAnna's Facebook page.

Don't believe everything you read. Things being reported keep changing very quickly. There is a LOT of false information that is being released by the media. Within the next week just look at how much information that gets reported is inaccurate.

Yes, at the start of the investigations maybe, but we're 9-10 days into this case now, the police have recovered a lot of evidence, I don't see there being too many twists and turns left in this one now.

He refused to the DNA test initially, before the photo of him was published on Sean McAnna's Facebook page.

So you think the guy on the cctv is Montriwat Toovichien?

He's already been identified as the guy in the CCTV footage by police, hasn't he? - also, it does seem a bit odd that he was practically first on the scene after the murders when the police were there (the pic of that is floating about online in places)

This guy is guilty as hell, I think he's certainly involved in one way or another.

Sorry but my in my opinion the guy seen running looks a lot younger than 45 [ in every other picture you can see its him .. without a doubt - he may however have been the shirt number 9 guy??? - much earlier in the evening.

How can you tell from a blurry CCTV image/video how old someone is!?

He's definitely NOT the guy that was wearing the number 9 shirt

So you think the guy on the cctv is Montriwat Toovichien?

He's already been identified as the guy in the CCTV footage by police, hasn't he? - also, it does seem a bit odd that he was practically first on the scene after the murders when the police were there (the pic of that is floating about online in places)

This guy is guilty as hell, I think he's certainly involved in one way or another.

My fear is the court case and physical evidence having been made unreliable . . . on purpose.

I think the odds are stacked against this guy now though, they've got too much on him - DNA, witnesses, then things they claim they have also, finger prints, locals information etc

So you think the guy on the cctv is Montriwat Toovichien?

He's already been identified as the guy in the CCTV footage by police, hasn't he? - also, it does seem a bit odd that he was practically first on the scene after the murders when the police were there (the pic of that is floating about online in places)

This guy is guilty as hell, I think he's certainly involved in one way or another.

If this guy they've caught is so innocent, then why was he running by the crime scene, in just shorts/underwear at that time in the morning? - very suspicious I'd say. Also, perhaps he was only wearing shorts because the rest of his clothes were covered in the blood of the victims, and he had to get rid of them?

who was running by the crime scene? - the son? or the brother??? - who in your thoughts?

The jackass that was at the crime scene and in Sean McAnna's photo he posted on Facebook.

ok I get the crime scene / sean mcanna photo's - when was he running? - are you talking about the 4am ish ctv?

Yes, that CCTV footage

If this guy they've caught is so innocent, then why was he running by the crime scene, in just shorts/underwear at that time in the morning? - very suspicious I'd say. Also, perhaps he was only wearing shorts because the rest of his clothes were covered in the blood of the victims, and he had to get rid of them?

who was running by the crime scene? - the son? or the brother??? - who in your thoughts?

The jackass that was at the crime scene and in Sean McAnna's photo he posted on Facebook.

How do any crimes ever get solved in Thailand if suspects are just allowed to casually decline when asked to take a DNA test? - the mind boggles!

Thai Police Officer: "There's been an awful lot of crime on this island of late, and we strongly suspect that you're behind it all. I'm afraid we're going to need a DNA sample from you"

Suspect: "No"

Thai Police Officer: "Oh right, well, thanks for your time. Sorry for any inconvenience caused. Shall I close the door on my way out?"

...

...

...