goreme

There's a lot of 'new money' in China, apparently almost 500M of them in the middle class alone which is more than entire population of US - the biggest consumers in the world.

Their behavior is no different or worse than the hordes of Americans who traveled to Europe in 70s-80s and were often disliked and frowned upon for their rude, loud mouth behavior. Same can be said for the increasing number of Russians traveling to Thailand who, not only are openly disrespectful but drink way too much and often become belligerent and even violent.

The main difference we have here is that the Chinese are far more numerous, aren't caucasian and speak an impenetrable tonal language, which to the uninitiated sounds like high pitched squabbling. This exacerbates their negative perception often encouraging veiled racism if not outright hostility.

Folks should keep in mind that this is a country with almost 1.5B people which has changed dramatically, economically in just the last 20 years and without them, the global economy would have collapsed during 2008 banking meltdown.

Why is it the it's often Anglos from either US/UK that are involved in the most heinous, perverted and violent crimes of any developed country? Whether it be mass murders or violent thugs at sporting events to pedophile scum - all mostly Anglo.

Some might call this gross generalization but then why don't we hear about these kinds of things in Germany,France or other developed countries wth such frequency?

My biggest mistake was not coming to Thailand sooner...

I'm in heaven....

YES!!! I can't agree more!

I wasted 20 years in Vietnam, first. Although, 'wasted' probably isn't the best term. Learnt a lot over there that prepared me for Thailand.

Thailand is easy after doing the 'hard yards' in Vietnam.

Interesting...care to share some of those lessons learned in Vietnam that helped prepare you for Thailand?

It sounds as if "traffic safety" is your primary gripe, and not personal safety in general, i.e., from petty crime, terrorists, thugs, etc. On that note, I can see your point but honestly, it's hard for me to believe that you're dealing with this on a daily basis. I can't recall ever being threatened by a motorbike on the sidewalk (does this happen a lot where you live?). But I'm sure you're not suggesting that bikers/motorist are out to run you over intentionally. So it must be mostly negligence...but then is it really that egregious and common? I drive on Thailand roads every single day and I can say that "most" Thai drivers are courteous and are just fine. Even the bikers mostly want to stay out of your way (I drive a car). What irks me more than anything are the slow and meek drivers, so we're all looking at things from different perspectives.

Anyways, it's obvious to me that the Thais want to be safe just as much as any farang. Everybody just wants to get to their destination without getting in an accident. Can't do much about the 5% that are careless, but it's like that in most places.

Your last para...You must be joking........Thai folk haven't the first idea about safety......Thats why they give children keys to their motor bikes.....Thats why they overtake on bends......Thats why they open car doors without looking........Thats why they pull out of side roads without looking...Thats why they overtake rides indicating to turn right........Thats why my list could go on......

It sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder. Your complaints go beyond simple criticism but rather show contempt for Thai culture and their parental values.

For all your criticisms, I can name numerous other developing countries, not to mention eastern Europe and even US/UK/AUS where similar things happen all too often. Open doors without looking...happens all the time in aforementioned countries, pull out of side of roads without looking...happens often in eastern Europe, overtaking on windy roads...happens quite often on coastal roads in California.

Yes, according to western sensibilities minors should not be driving motorbikes. However, it seems those same 'western sensibilities' dont apply to the hoards of middle aged farang who come to Thailand explicitly looking for sex with minors.

Maybe your criticism of Thais is misplaced and you should redirect your outrage elsewhere.

Are you a bit pervvy...? Why bring child sex into a discussion about safety..

Seems you know feeeeeerk all about Thai safety because you don't live here. You know nothing about road stuff, you know nothing about basic electricity that kills zillions in LOS every year........Simple stuff that the years here taught me....

.............

PS...OK bright boy, Why do parents give underage kids keys to their m/cycle...ONE QUESTION.......ANSWER IT.........?

It sounds as if "traffic safety" is your primary gripe, and not personal safety in general, i.e., from petty crime, terrorists, thugs, etc. On that note, I can see your point but honestly, it's hard for me to believe that you're dealing with this on a daily basis. I can't recall ever being threatened by a motorbike on the sidewalk (does this happen a lot where you live?). But I'm sure you're not suggesting that bikers/motorist are out to run you over intentionally. So it must be mostly negligence...but then is it really that egregious and common? I drive on Thailand roads every single day and I can say that "most" Thai drivers are courteous and are just fine. Even the bikers mostly want to stay out of your way (I drive a car). What irks me more than anything are the slow and meek drivers, so we're all looking at things from different perspectives.

Anyways, it's obvious to me that the Thais want to be safe just as much as any farang. Everybody just wants to get to their destination without getting in an accident. Can't do much about the 5% that are careless, but it's like that in most places.

Your last para...You must be joking........Thai folk haven't the first idea about safety......Thats why they give children keys to their motor bikes.....Thats why they overtake on bends......Thats why they open car doors without looking........Thats why they pull out of side roads without looking...Thats why they overtake rides indicating to turn right........Thats why my list could go on......

It sounds like you have a chip on your shoulder. Your complaints go beyond simple criticism but rather show contempt for Thai culture and their parental values.

For all your criticisms, I can name numerous other developing countries, not to mention eastern Europe and even US/UK/AUS where similar things happen all too often. Open doors without looking...happens all the time in aforementioned countries, pull out of side of roads without looking...happens often in eastern Europe, overtaking on windy roads...happens quite often on coastal roads in California.

Yes, according to western sensibilities minors should not be driving motorbikes. However, it seems those same 'western sensibilities' dont apply to the hoards of middle aged farang who come to Thailand explicitly looking for sex with minors.

Maybe your criticism of Thais is misplaced and you should redirect your outrage elsewhere.

Am I the only one who thought this guy's post was actually well thought out and showed that he's shown restraint and was simply seeking (wisely) best advice on how to go forward/ what to expect? To me he sounded like someone who gets that he doesn't necessarily get everything about the Thais nor the rural Thais and just wanted advice. OP, I think it's great that you're asking..

As far as using it as a work house - hello? Doesn't anybody have an office or reading nook they like to go to to be productive with book or with laptop? A country house sounds like an ideal place to do that. I'm embarrassed for the locals already trumpeting out visa this and work permit that.... The guy doesn't sound that unaware and.... that "advice" is such an old saw.....

What's going to work ultimately is going to be tightening your relationship with the groundskeeper and also restating your desires probably 100 times for it to begin to stick. Also, there's going to be some compromise or bonding that will involve him benefiting from you - that may be in the form of produce, a little extra cash, something..... but there will need to be a negotiation for him to see it more your way and not as same old same old. Buy in will take some sort of gifting showing you understand you're taking away from him essentially and you want to give back in another way. I've seen some other good advice from a few others too. This situation isn't unworkable and repeats itself in various forms throughout the country, so best to get on board with it.

Good luck.

Anyone asking for advice from strangers on a public forum about whether or not it's ok to get violent with their neighbors on rented property and in a foreign land doesn't sound wise nor restrained. The op comes across as looking for an excuse to start an altercation and came TV to get permission that it was ok.

Your blase response really exemplifies the cultural chasm between the confrontational, conflict-prone behavior of the west vs the more indirect, conflict-avoidance of the east. Perhaps the latter is one of the reasons so many farang choose to live in Thailand yet often forget or refuse to adapt their behavior accordingly.

According to farangs, every type of tourist who is not a farang is bad. Eventhough Russians and Turks look like farangs they're rejected by their fellow anglosphere farangs

Brits/Aussies stir up their fair share of drama after several pints and often don't know when to stop. Problem is this is almost a daily ritual for many of them.

"Why Thailand makes them more welcome than other nationalities is way beyond me!"

"They do not respect Thai Customs or Culture and do not even like Thai people. "

Apparently Russians spend even more than the Chinese which is why theyre tolerated. That being said, many of them are loud, belligerent and drink too much. The do nothing but make fellow Russians and other farang look bad confirming the negative perceptions among Thais.

You know what, you're whining about something that is just not a big deal. It doesn't reflect on any sort of rude or inconsiderate behavior by Thais because they intend nor see it as such.

In a developing country, where scooters are preferred mode of transport and there is limited space to park this is common. Simply move the the scooter(s) blocking you. Thais do it all the time, not a big deal nor a need to get your panties in a bunch.

....too bad they do not have actual people....

...to keep the tourists from going into the water....

...that is part of the duty of 'life guards'......man the beaches.....

....totally irresponsible....

And where is the money going to come from to pay this army of people to babysit all the farang who blatantly ignore internationally recognized warning signs?

Law enforcement already has their hands full with all the belligerent and drunken farangs that go around starting fights, engaging in theft and creating problems, not to mention offing themselves.

" Red flags " are, clearly, not enough - lifeguards should be patrolling beach,and have proper life-saving equipment, including a boat

to render immediate aid

Why... do farangs need to be coddled and protected like children? Everyone else seems to understand the red flags except farang, which in typical fashion, feel entitled to do whatever they want whenever they want and screw everyone else attitude.

Do you think farangs that blatantly ignore warning signs understood by 2yr olds are going to listen to some 20yr life guard telling them not to swim.

More than likely theyll take offense that some 'little brown person' is trying to tell them what to do, and at the risk of losing face and appearing weak, will go and do it anyway.

1 million because they are RICH!!! They have spent billions on Real Estate in America, and fly the world to see how the expats live.

People are so jealous they can fly to Thailand, and then LEAVE......while most expats here spend 49 baht on soup noodle and wait for change from their 50 baht bill...

yes, this means you!!!!

i'm off to china to study the pandas......

Wrong. The rich Chinese don't deign to visit Thailand. They go to America, Europe, New Zealand.

Thailand is a budget destination for not-so-rich (and usually low class) Chinese.

There's the rich, new rich(nouveau riche), middle class and then everyone else. The new rich number in the millions while the middle class is at 500M and growing fast. It's the latter group that primarily visit Thailand and other Asian countries. They are almost 2x population of entire US - think about that.

You ate all of that between 2 people and in the morning? Incredible how many farang eat so much early in the day and so much at night. It's no wonder many have health issues.

Honestly, eating all that sausage meat, french fries, eggs, greasy noodles that early in the day is repulsive.

A lot of Thais don't understand you as well and shake their head at common farang behavior such as walking in public without a shirt on, walking down the street barefoot, throwing your money on the counter, quick to argue and be confrontational, etc, etc.

I once stayed in a guest house where the Canadian next door would often bang his doormat against the balcony letting the debris fall on the other balconies below. What I saw as incredibly rude and inconsiderate, he saw as perfectly acceptable.

For many Thais, farang often come across as rude, arrogant and confrontational when they don't get their way. You don't sound like that type, but your post hints to a level of entitlement expectation of reciprocity that is not overtly displayed in many Asian cultures.

My experience of Thailand is that favours are met with gratitude...

I have found more overlapping similarity in our cultures than differences. The strongest similarity I have observed is that its quite obvious when someone is being considerate and polite, its quite obvious when they are not - this is true of any culture I have experienced.

If people are being rude, ungrateful, self-centred or careless its not because of their culture, its because they are rude, ungrateful, self-centred and careless.... Its just that simple.

My Brother in Law takes us to the Airport - We (Wife and I) say thanks and pick up a little present.

My Parents in Law take us to dinner, we (Wife and I) say thanks, I take them to dinner next time.

Generosity, care and consideration don't need to be reciprocated, just recognised, particularly by people with whom you share mutual respect.

Culture is often misused to explain poor manners of others... when in reality, its just poor manners.

People are basically the same all over the world. That said, there are cultural norms and expectations that while common in one country are considered offensive in another. Doesn't make one better than the other, but ignoring this will lead to misunderstandings, frustration and isolation.

A lot of Thais don't understand you as well and shake their head at common farang behavior such as walking in public without a shirt on, walking down the street barefoot, throwing your money on the counter, quick to argue and be confrontational, etc, etc.

I once stayed in a guest house where the Canadian next door would often bang his doormat against the balcony letting the debris fall on the other balconies below. What I saw as incredibly rude and inconsiderate, he saw as perfectly acceptable.

For many Thais, farang often come across as rude, arrogant and confrontational when they don't get their way. You don't sound like that type, but your post hints to a level of entitlement expectation of reciprocity that is not overtly displayed in many Asian cultures.

"mostly what I see is a lot of fakeness, opportunism, selfishness, drunkenness, laziness, child / animal abuse and neglect, showing off, jealousy, gossip and an attitude of entitlement."

..and you rarely encounter that behavior in your home country?

Researching Da Nang and although it appears to be growing in popularity, there still seems to be a lot of dioxins on farmland and water sources leftover from US bombing with Agent Orange.

Anyone spend significant amout of time their confirm any of this?

"Prisons for corrupt officials etc. etc." what country is that?

Not Thailand - if you have connections and Money you go free ... Not in a civilized country thats not a banana republic ...

Yes, that rarely happens in developed countries especially the US </sarcasm>

There seems to be far more petty theft and road violence in Spain than Thailand. Feel perfectly comfortable leaving helmet/personal belongings on scooter in Thailand but never in Spain.

Thanks for all the replies, I think Sheryl may have hit the nail on the head, she walks some distance to work, rather slowly perhaps to minimise the sweat, but that exercise and consequent perspiration could be the key. I gather it's not the diet.

Perhaps she should go on a motorbike instead.

For those who say tell her, it's not easy, none of us are close to her, she's somewhat withdrawn and frankly I fear the consequences if we did. We're a small crew of 5, the boss who is a woman, has no idea about this but she may be the final route to go, however we'd rather sort it out ourselves.

Anyway I'm glad in a way because it's the perfect excuse not to turn on the air- con which I personally dislike!

To ignore diet is missing the bigger picture and only treating the symptoms not the cause. Sweat releases protein/fats which depending on one's diet can cause them to smell more than others. This combined with the fact that Farangs typically have more body hair, and as a result, tend to sweat more than Thais/Asians, while producing more bacteria causing odor.

Anyone have experience with this? Theyre supposedly edible when roasted and have mild narcotic effect.

I like Hoi An with 2 great beaches - can drive to Da Nang in 30 min, also very nice Beach - take train to Hue, magnificent beautiful town - Da Lat beautiful green landscape

Cons : constant horns from cars and bikes ...

Pros : Everything else ... ½ l. Saigon Beer in restaurant 17B - Best food in the World (say my TW) and 50% of thai Price - Superior clean beaches, sunbed 30B, not the cesspools we see in Thailand ...

As Baywatch82 say the Hairsalons are not to get a haircut but for pleasure ... less than 50% of thai price and the VN-girls are IMO more sexy than thai-girls

Vietnam will no doubt be "the new Thailand", just a lot better ...

Vietnam is the only country in the world where a scooter honked at me to get out of their way. While I was walking down the sidewalk!

Next trip, I'm going to bring that horn that connects to a can of compressed air so I can honk back! It does drive you crazy. Horrible drivers.

The thing about scooters and other motor vehicles in much of SE Asia is that they are considered to have the right of way. When they honk, it's not out of aggression or to reprimand you but rather to warn that they're approaching.

Note that despite the apparent chaos, the traffic flows and people by and large get where they need to go, with little to zero road rage or drama unlike many western countries (US/UK/AUS). So you need to get rid of the entitlement mentality of 'I have the right of way' so common in your home country.

Nha Trang.

Nice and very long beach.

Snorkeling all day trip with buffet lunch costs you about 300 baht.

You can find beer (beer Saigon) for about 20 baht in bars.

Good nightlife.

Cheap food. Buffet breakfast in some hotels for about 100 baht. Big baguette with meat and veggies for 20 baht on the street stalls.

Accommodation not expensive. I was staying in nice hotel close to the beach for 400 baht night.

And my favorite : hair cut - blow job shops. You can have the work done (not haircut) for 200 baht.

Great amusement park - Vinpearl - you can be there all day and use all rides, water park, shows etc for about 650 baht.

City is full of Russians, some people might not like it.

Do they tend be loud, belligerent types creating a lot of drama?

I admit that I do not like VN, but while there I visited a town called Da Lat. I think it's what the Brits in India days would have called a 'hill station.' It's not on the coast, the area is cool, lush and green outside of town. Seemed quite nice.

What do you dislike about Vietnam?

Aside from HCMC, what are other cities in Vietnam worth considering for potential long-term stay(6mos+)?