Arun Mai

I do not have the original Thai language text, so I am unable to oblige you in that regard.  The cynic in me can't help but suspect that whatever it does say in Thai it is likely to be ambiguous leaving much to interpretation.  I may be pleasantly surprised on this occasion, but I will reserve judgement.

On 5/20/2024 at 7:28 AM, onthemoon said:

I am surprised, as I was told at the time that I have to hold PR for 5 years before applying for citizenship. Since they have accepted your application after less than a year, this must have been wrong. Thanks for info.

I was given the same information and also waited more than five years after obtaining PR.  The extra time was due to covid, which delayed my application for citizenship.

On 4/26/2024 at 8:37 PM, saakura said:

@Marcati Congratulations, and hope all goes well with the final process. I had my NIA interview and all documents were sent to MOI in 2020, so hopefully in 2rys time I will get lucky. I am planning to retire in 2026, so it is really worrying.

I don't plan on retiring just yet, but I agree that it is frustrating.  Essentially I can't retire as long as this process is ongoing.  My file was sent to the MOI in July 2022 and I am still waiting for THE interview.  Still, I tend to put it out of my mind and every now and again I come back to check to see if there have been any developments.  Happy for @Marcati.  Congratulations.

25 minutes ago, DrJoy said:

@Arun Mai  Any update on your application ?

Nothing new, alas.

My application was submitted (paid the 5,000 baht fee) in October 2021.  I had my NIA interview in March 2022 and my file was sent to MOI in July 2022.  Since then nothing.  I am prepared for the long-haul.  As I have PR already it doesn't make a lot of difference to me at this point in time so I'll just wait.  One day I expect to receive notification out of the blue, just as with PR.

On 2/25/2023 at 12:19 PM, rsskga said:

Hello Arun Mai, please see above for where you referenced being asked for additional docs.

 

Thanks to all for relaying your experiences and helpful tips!

 

I have an appointment at the US Embassy March 7. I'll report back after as to what they will/won't sign.

rsska.....   I think this post from Arkady resolves the mystery.  I think you only submit what you have from the list.  In my case I have a Thai driving licence whereas I don't have a pink ID card.

12 hours ago, DrJoy said:

Documents are sent in a batch of 20 -30 people.

They are not sent one by one, so you both must be in the same batch.

Yes, I think that is very likely also.

On 3/1/2023 at 1:16 PM, ecline said:

This is really discouraging ???? My docs went to the MOI 8 months ago. I had hoped I would get my interview this year, but I guess that ain't gonna happen. Does anyone know how many times per year they conduct interviews normally?

My docs went to MOI on 1st July 2022.  Maybe we're on the same list?

15 hours ago, rsskga said:

Hello Arun Mai, please see above for where you referenced being asked for additional docs.

 

Thanks to all for relaying your experiences and helpful tips!

 

I have an appointment at the US Embassy March 7. I'll report back after as to what they will/won't sign.

It seems the link doesn't work well.  When I click it it takes me to the post shown in the image file.   With respect to the driving licence, I don't recall the specifics, but what I can say is that it certainly wasn't one of the essential documents for my application.

Good luck at the Embassy with your documents.

On 2/23/2023 at 3:52 AM, rsskga said:

Based on the prior cautionary posts regarding how missing/delayed documents can set approval back by months or years, I'm hoping to provide as many documents up front with my initial application as I can.

 

Of course, we've covered everything on the published list for wives applying through their Thai husbands. In addition, I'm planning on providing:

• my American divorce decree, with a related Embassy notarized affidavit and translation
• an Embassy notarized affidavit of my intent to renounce US citizenship upon receipt of Thai

I'm wondering about providing the following since I've seen others here indicate they were eventually asked for them (all Embassy notarized and translated):

• birth certificate
• driver's license (Arun Mai reports being asked for this here - I only have an American license)
• Thai work permit (once issued by the company we're planning to create)
• Thai company registration docs (once we've created the company)
• certificate of residence (I don't currently have)
• alien book (I don't currently have)

In regards to the intent to renounce US citizenship, is there any risk in completing this affidavit so early in the process?

 

General thoughts on providing any/all of these documents?

You say 'driver's license (Arun Mai reports being asked for this here - I only have an American license)'.  I must confess, I don't recall remarking about being required to present my driving licence, which isn't to say that I didn't or that I wasn't.  Unfortunately the link doesn't pinpoint the post to which you are referring.  If you can pinpoint the post, I'd be happy to comment.

On 10/14/2022 at 10:49 AM, 2009 said:

Aside from that, it is so easy to qualify for the retirement visa in Thailand. It seems like a no-brainer for me to do that indefinitely when I retire.

But will that always be the case?  During covid, restrictions were imposed on retirees such that many effectively couldn't leave Thailand without jeopardising their rights in Thailand principally because many were unable to obtain health insurance coverage of sufficient value.

On 7/14/2022 at 5:58 PM, qualtrough said:

Just curious. Has anyone here who obtained their Thai citizenship run into a government or private organization that failed to recognize your new citizenship? So far things have been smooth for me. Knock on wood.

I have read with interest the various comments made by naturalised Thais of the injustices they have faced notwithstanding their changed legal status as Thai nationals.  My application is still winding its way through the system and it is unlikely to reach a conclusions for at least a year or more.  I have been a permanent resident for over 6 years.

One of the frustrations of being a permanent resident is that the status seems to be viewed more as a favour than an entitlement; one is accorded no special rights as a permanent resident other than the 'right of abode'.  Owning land is still restricted as is the right to work, etc., etc.  More to the point, Thais in general have been led to expect that all foreigners in Thailand need to have some sort of a visa.  During the pandemic when the country was essentially closed to international travel, I did not renew my Non-Quota Immigrant Visa, of course - why would I, unless I wanted to travel?  One time when I checked into a hotel in the south the staff took a long time to search every blank page of my previously unused passport looking for a visa, to no avail needless to say.

The major benefit that comes of being a permanent resident is that it deprives the immigration department of discretionary powers as to whether or not to renew your visa annually, as far as I can see.  It is also preparatory for applying for citizenship unless one is married to a Thai.

I think when one is going to contemplate the injustices that naturalised Thais face living in Thailand it is important to also consider the manifold benefits that come of being granted Thai nationality.  It may, therefore, be of value for me to recount one of my most recent frustrations as a Thai PR.  I have been looking at interest rates on bank deposits.  Most commercial banks in Thailand have 'high' interest accounts to attract and retain customers.  As far as I can see, almost all banks have some such offering.  Siam Commerical Bank's offering is available to foreigners also, although the high interest rate is only available on the first one million baht.  I have enquired of about three or four other banks that similarly offer higher interest rate accounts.  They all restrict such accounts only to Thais and upon enquiry they explicitly exclude PRs too, although not naturalised Thais.

We can all probably think of occasions when 'foreigners' have been discriminated against in the various countries of our formative years and it would be naive to imagine that discrimination doesn't show up everywhere in some form.  It is a very human condition after all.  So, in summary, it seems to me that the benefits of naturalising as Thai far out way any 'minor' frustrations that may come along with it.

15 hours ago, Neeranam said:

You don't need to translate it, it is from the Embassy but written in Thai. 

Actually, my renounciation letter dated 2-Nov-21 issued by the British Embassy was written in English.  The SB case officer asked us to provide a Thai translation, which we prepared internally (at our office), which was perfectly acceptable to SB - no special treatment with notaries or anything else.  The same is true of the certified true copy of my passport.

3 hours ago, moochai87 said:

I am being asked to take a letter addressed to the Ambassador of the UK, in order for him to confirm that I truly exist and that this is my passport. I have a feeling that if I show up to the embassy with it, they will just look at me and ask me to leave ???? . They of course have a 'validate a copy of passport' service which I can request (I actually thought I already did that, but I have handed over so many documents already I honestly can't remember). Once I get this, and then translate it to Thai, do you think this should be enough? Or do I somehow need to get the embassy to reply directly to the police that issues the letter?

Do bother trying to deliver the letters to the British Embassy, they're not interested in them.  Just apply for: https://www.gov.uk/guidance/notarial-and-documentary-services-guide-for-thailand#supporting-letter-for-thai-nationality-application

And also apply for a certified true copy of your passport from the embassy too.

22 hours ago, THAIJAMES said:

Are you sure the lady wasn't from the national intelligence agency? if so it was probably normal for her to request all the documents again as they may be working from home.

She is indeed at the NIA.  So I am now just awaiting the interview appointment.  Presumably there is a second interview at MOI much later in the process, is that so?

26 minutes ago, THAIJAMES said:

Are you sure the lady wasn't from the national intelligence agency? if so it was probably normal for her to request all the documents again as they may be working from home.

That's a good question, thank you for asking it.  No, I am not sure that she isn't from the NIA.  I shall ask my PA to call her in a day or two to check that the documents already submitted are all in order and to ask her which office she's from.

17 minutes ago, yankee99 said:

I think the main milestones are 

 

1. application and SB interview 

 

2. passing NIA interview 

 

3. documents forwarded to the moi

 

after those its really just waiting 

 

 

????

23 minutes ago, khongaeng said:

It sounds like the process has changed a bit since I went through this part of the process 5 years ago.  At that time interviewing with NIA was within 3 months after SB interview and fingerprinting.  The NIA interview was only 30 minutes, and that was after a very detailed inspection of all of our vital documents.  The NIA officer even found some errors that the Thai Ministry of Foreign Affairs made with our documents.  I thought that was funny, and fortunately, the officer just moved on without making a big deal.  

 

The big wait will be after you finish your NIA interview.  After NIA your application gets sent all around Bangkok for every department in the kingdom to affix their rubber stamp before it is finally forwarded onto MOI.  You will not receive any automatic status updates from the time your NIA interview is finished until your MOI interview is scheduled.  Many have reported that their SB officer did the decent thing and told them when their application was finally forwarded to MOI.  In my case this was 5 or 6 months after my NIA interview that my documents were finally sent to the long queue at MOI (I had to ask my officer when it was finally sent).  Right before my documents were sent to MOI, I did get a call back from my SB officer that I needed to bring some additional documents that the officer rejected the year prior saying that they weren't needed.  I found out later that this mistake from my office ended up costing 8 months of processing time on my application.  This is a lesson from the experience, that I think everyone here will echo, you just have to be patient with the process and give them whatever documents they ask for... at least in my case, they never asked for anything more than documents, and I never got the feeling that that would be required from my application to ultimately be successfully processed. There is no firm timeline but it seems that all applications within the past 7 years are completed between 2 years and 4 years after you apply.  If you are famous, then you can possibly get everything finished within 1 year.

Thank you for your input too.  Alas, I'm not famous, hopefully not infamous either, but certainly not famous, so I guess I'll just have to wait.

I think my NIA interview should be more or less within 3 months of submitting the remaining outstanding documents which was some weeks after my interview and finger printing (which was done twice).  Thanks for the insights regarding the delays between the NIA interview and the file going to the MOI.

11 hours ago, Marcati said:

Yes, you need to complete an interview with the NIA before they send your documents to the MOI for the final interview.

 

Ours lasted 1.5 hours, but that could be because I speak Thai fairly well and we had an in-depth conversation about all aspects of life in Thailand.  The people were very pleasant to deal with.

Thanks for your input.

Thank you for your input yankee99.  Yes, I shall certainly provide her with the documents she's requesting, to do otherwise would be churlish, but I just thought it was a bit odd when I've already provided almost all documents already.  I was curious to know how common my experience was.  My original contact is still at SB.  We called him to check that it was appropriate to be dealing with this new individual who contacted me out of the blue, although I was expecting to hear something around about now as it's been 3 months since I submitted the last document requested at the outset.  Is the process of sending documents to the NIA a milestone along the way to approval?

Is this a common experience?

I submitted my application to SB on the basis of PR and paid the fee towards the end of last year.  I submitted the remaining documents requested (name reservation +++) in December last year.  I was contacted by a new officer on Saturday, a lady with whom I had not previously been in communication, requesting more documents ahead of fixing an interview (with whom I don't know).  She said the interview would last no more than 1 hour by video call.  Anyhow, the list of documents she is requesting is broadly the same ones that I already submitted at the point of making my original application (there were one or two additional documents asked for - drivers licence and birth certificate).  I pointed out to her that I had already submitted all of these documents last year to SB.  She said the document had been sent to the National Intelligence Agency.  At first I didn't really understand what she was asking for.  It seems she wants me to submit copies of more or less the same set of documents that I already submitted to SB which may either be submitted by Line app, email, or post.  Upon receipt of the said documents she would then arrange for my interview.

Is this common?  Has this happened to other applicants?

Thank for the input in advance.

18 hours ago, Badger18 said:

I guess this has been asked before - I did try searching but no dice. In the real world do people actually go ahead and renounce their original citizenship, and if so what happens about travel? I mean could the British embassy refuse you a visa if you wanted to visit for a couple of weeks, would you be unable to rush back if you needed to go to a funeral, etc?

I'm in no position to answer that question.  What is clear is that part of the process of applying for naturalisation in Thailand is to express an intention to renounce one's existing nationality upon successfully obtaining Thai nationality.  I'm not sure what that means for people with, say, two different nationalities, for example.  I do know of Americans who have renounced their American citizenship when they have had second or even third nationalities, although that was primarily because of the onerous American tax system.

Ultimately, nationality is a legal status conditional on the laws of any given sovereign state.  In my opinion, for very many people their nationality forms an integral part of their identity, wheras in reality nationality is nothing more than a social construct.  Personally, I gave up BEING British long ago, although that doesn't alter my legal status as British.

As for visas, I understand that it was at least once possible to have one's Thai passport endorsed to indicate that the bearer had the right of abode in the UK so that no visa was required to enter the UK on such a  Thais passport.  Whether or not that is still possible, I have no idea.

On 11/6/2021 at 11:49 AM, RJaidee said:

I have also just received these envelopes and as am confused by these responses as I am by my wifes explanation of what to do with them (her being unaware of the British Embassy's unhelpful nature). I haven't opened the letters as I presume  they are in Thai and the wife says you can't  open letters not addressed to you, which is correct.

 

I have provided the letter stating my intention to give up my citizenship already (costing 50 GBP + 2GBP postage + translation + MOFA stamp) so do not want to be doing that again. I provided a Police clearance certificate in my original information folder to but they had no interest and told me to remove it. 

 

My wife LINEd our staff member who says that she requires nothing back from the British Embassy, they are just to be delivered. Therefore, if the British Embassy will not accept the letters, and nothing is expected in return, do I have to give them to the British Embassy?

 

I may be able to provide my own answers as I know the husband of someone who works at the BE, and if I find out then will report. However, as no one seems to know its best to ask in different places.

 

 

 

 

I don't check in to this forum that often so I've only just seen this.  With respect to the five letters I was given, two were for Chaeng Wattana and they have been dealt with.  I have two corresponding letters back from CW.  My understanding is that these are in connection with proving my PR status.  One letter for the Amphur is for a name clearance - I have to choose a Thai name although I'm not required to adopt it.  I shall attend to that this week.  That leaves the two letters for the Embassy.  Having spoken to the British Embassy and considered their reply (not interested, don't bring them to us, we don't want them), I decided to open them.  They were only sealed with a small piece of tape anyway.  One letter was requesting documentation to the effect that I had expressed an intention to renounce my British citizenship upon successfully obtaining Thai citizenship.  The other letter, however, was a request for verification that my passport is genuine.  I have already received the 'intention' letter back from the British Embassy.  For the 'verification' letter I understand that I need to obtain a certified true copy of my British Passport.  That costs GBP25 and if one wants to do it in person it takes several days before one can book an appointment.  I have an appointment later this month to do that.   https://www.gov.uk/guidance/notarial-and-documentary-services-guide-for-thailand#services-we-provide-in-thailand.

Good luck

On 10/29/2021 at 10:05 PM, Neeranam said:

Open the letter to the embassy if you want. 1 is for a criminal background check and to verify your passport is real, the other is to do with the intention to renounce your British citizenship. However, I did mine in 2018, things changed in May that year. Some here have done it more recently. I'd just make an appointment and demand your rights. 

 

I assume that 2 of your letters are for the PR people at Immigration. I only got 3 letters as I wasn't PR. 

 

So, the two letters to the embassy comprise of one which seeks to verify my passport is authentic and the other is in connection with expressing my intention to renounce my British citizenship once I have successfully obtained Thai citizenship.  I understand that both of these points are addressed under the Thai nationality support letter: https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/926913/Application_pack_-_Thai_Nationality_supporting_letter.pdf

15 hours ago, Dogmatix said:

I was given these letters to take to the embassy after I had already submitted all the documentation required from the embassy including the affidavit. So I just put them in the file. Of course the embassy staff have no interest in receiving these letters which are just pointless Thai bureaucracy. You just tell them which consular service you want from them and, if they can do it, they will quote you a price.

Indeed, I'm not unsympathetic towards the embassy.  Receiving letters requires filing systems, archiving and eventually destruction of the documents after a prescribed period of time has elapsed.  The embassy doesn't need nor does it want the overhead associated with such a burdensome process.  Furthermore, as all these costs must get passed on to the users of the various services, I don't want to pay for it either.