6 minutes ago, Sydebolle said:

Call it the Chinese virus, it will embarrass those rice pickers and human rights benders; and maybe they think differently if there is a next time! 

"rice pickers'?

Nah, you're not bigoted in the least.

6 minutes ago, Tug said:

Bottom line everyone would be delighted if it works the key here is (if) it works it’s under trials now it is ill responsible to speak of it this early untle it’s proven effective potus of all people should have the discipline to wait till at least early evidence is known 

Come on now Just because people suffering from lupus, a terrible disease, can't get their medication because of Trump touting hydrochloroquine prematurely, is no reason to...oh wait a minute...

3 hours ago, Logosone said:

I'd say, whilst regrettable, a number of 25 million dead would be in line with previous pandemics such as the Spanish flu.

 

Whether we want to accept it or not is irrelevant, we will have to.

It's a pity that no progress has been made in medical science since 1918. Otherwise we might expect better results.

2 hours ago, Nyezhov said:

guess folks in the US dont necessarily agree with you. 

https://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/other/public_approval_of_president_trumps_handling_of_the_coronavirus-7088.html

 

That was before his huge Town Hall on Fox yesterday. 

So now you believe the polls?

4 hours ago, bkk6060 said:

I actually believe he will open it up, but let governors do their own thing.

The markets are heading up again with the stimulus.

US markets usually are indicators of what things will be in 6 months.

By then, the virus will be gone (yes people will die), markets way up probably close to where they were, and Trump well on his way to getting re-elected. 

I am not saying I agree with it.  Just sayin though, I think the above will be the results.

It's funny. One thing we can be sure quite sure about is that the coronavirus situation will increase the importance to Americans of having access to adequate health care. Particularly for those who are vulnerable. The Trump administration is supporting a lawsuit by several Republican states that if successful will eliminate affordable health care for people with pre-existing conditions. Whenever Trump is questioned about this he obfuscates in his own inimitable style. Health care was a huge issue that favored the Democrats in the 2018 midterms. Why do you think it won't be even huger in the 2020 elections? 

As far as I recall, no Trump supporter on thaivisa.com has even acknowledged this as an issue. 

Trump Abruptly Stops Calling Coronavirus ‘Chinese Virus’ At Daily Press Briefing

After days of calling coronavirus the “Chinese virus” despite advice from his own public health aides and the World Health Organization, President Donald Trump abruptly stopped using the term for the first time during a White House press conference on Monday.

• For days, Trump has referred to the coronavirus as the “Chinese virus” even though public health experts and the WHO have said naming viruses after geographic locations or groups of people is inaccurate, inappropriate and could unnecessarily stigmatize Asian-Americans and people from China.
• In the face of such criticism, Trump doubled down on using the label and insisted it isn’t racist because “it comes from China.”

https://www.forbes.com/sites/rachelsandler/2020/03/23/trump-abruptly-stops-calling-coronavirus-chinese-virus-at-daily-press-briefing/#3d1cd02847ad

3 minutes ago, rabas said:

Most often? It just came out, Chloroquine has been studied since the SARS days.

Most often cited as encouraging for use against COVID-19. That is what this thread is about, isin't it?

1 minute ago, rabas said:

Sorry I don't see the reference unless you mean bloomburg.  But you have to take all evidence into consideration, not just an article (I try to avoid anything in the political spectrum at this time).

 

 

from what i posted above:

Here's one analysis of the study itself. Skip down to where the study itself is exhaustively looked at:

The study: Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin as a treatment of COVID-19

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/are-hydroxychloroquine-and-azithromycin-an-effective-treatment-for-covid-19/

18 minutes ago, rabas said:

I've been tracking several drugs for a month (stocked up long before Trump) and the evidence is quite good for Chloroquine. They even know why it works, more later. What's missing are time consuming broad double blind studies usually used at the peer review level of science. This is correct for proof, legal reasons, for business, and routine doctors care.  The lack of a year long peer reviewed work does not negate all that is know already.  Including its safety because doses for COVID-19 are smaller than for those billions of patients who took it for malaria. Slim at best = fat!

 

 

The study most often cited, the one undertaken in France was very sketchy indeed. People who got ill on the regimen weren't even counted in the final results. And the latest one isn't encouraging at all. At least for hydrochlorquinone. 

But what's worse, sufferers from lupus are now having serious problems getting hold of the medication because of Trump's megaphone.

6 minutes ago, sandrabbit said:

I took chloroquin for seven months the first time I worked in India but didn't realise the side effects till the second time I worked there when I thought the risk of having malaria was lower than taking it. The other thing is so many people are taking it and have been taking it that it's effectiveness in Asia is being reduced as malaria is becoming more resistant to it, people are taking stronger drugs like malerone. The same thing has happened in Thailand with using deet (a poison) in mosquito sprays as apparently mosquitos in parts of NW Thailand have become resistant to it.

Deet? Deet is a mosquito repellant. Definitely not a poison. Maybe you're thinking of DDT?

59 minutes ago, riclag said:

Got somethin better, suggestions! In the mean time!!!!!

"A recent controlled clinical study conducted by Didier Raoult M.D/Ph.D, et. al in France has shown that 100% patients that received a combination of HCQ and Azithromycin tested negative and were virologically cured within 6 days of treatment".

https://www.covidtrial.io/

Malaria Drug Chloroquine No Better Than Regular Coronavirus Care, Study Finds

Hydroxychloroquine, a medicine for malaria that President Donald Trump has touted as a treatment for coronavirus, was no more effective than conventional care, a small study found.

The report published by the Journal of Zhejiang University in China showed that patients who got the medicine didn’t fight off the new coronavirus more often than those who did not get the medicine.

The study involved just 30 patients. Of the 15 patients given the malaria drug, 13 tested negative for the coronavirus after a week of treatment.

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-03-25/hydroxychloroquine-no-better-than-regular-covid-19-care-in-study

Now in this study the hydrochlorquinone wasn't given in conjunction with azithromycin. But still, the original French study which has given so much hope to some, was actually very sketchy.

Here's one analysis of the study itself. Skip down to where the study itself is exhaustively looked at:

The study: Hydroxychloroquine and azithromycin as a treatment of COVID-19

https://sciencebasedmedicine.org/are-hydroxychloroquine-and-azithromycin-an-effective-treatment-for-covid-19/

Also, in the nydailynews.com there was an article with about an existing drug, Tocilizumab, that may be effective. The article included info about a physician who was being treated with azithromycin and hydrochloroquinone. He said he kept on getting worse. Then he was switched this drug and said he felt like it put him on the path to recovery. Not a scientific evaluation, of course.

https://www.nydailynews.com/coronavirus/ny-coronavirus-fda-approves-trial-for-drug-to-treat-coronavirus-20200323-cuwac5zw7vguddbj6nhoexuw3a-story.html

1 minute ago, rabas said:

It doesn't work out that way because it's the younger people who spread the virus. Think of every one travelling to work everyday and bringing it back to the older folks. Not only that but fully infecting everyone would collapse the medical system. Try reading how younger people describe the illness, 50X harder than flu, razor blades in my lungs for 2 weeks, each breath a major effort.

 

Also, some report sustaining prolonged and possibility permanent damage to their lungs.

21 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

I think that's exactly what they were looking for. I assume the Democrats loaded up their own wish list with so much junk so they could sacrifice it later in order to get the Republicans to temper their no oversight corporate welfare. That's what Congress used to do. Throw stuff out till you hammer out something neither side is completely happy with but each could sign.  I think it was about Clinton's presidency where they found consensus by agreeing to accept the other side's <deleted> if they'll accept yours.

REally? You think this tactic began in the Clinton era? Because before that negotiators were too clueless?

And the junk the democrats loaded up their bill with was far less costly than the republican junk. And far less nasty too. Apparently, the Republicans wanted to deny funds to any business that depended on Medicaid. And this during a pandemic!

Just now, UbonThani said:

The US is too big for lockdowns now. Its spread too far. Just protect older people and give retirement homes and hospitals more medical stuff.

 

Others go back to work and spend $.

 

 

You can't protect older people if others are circulating freely. Unless they have no contact at all with the rest of society. Which is impossible.

13 minutes ago, cmarshall said:

If you have been watching Rachel Maddow this week, she has had several reports on a company, Kinsa, that has been selling web-enabled thermometers for eight years.  When you take your temperature the reading gets uploaded automatically and instantaneously to the company, Kinsa.  With sales of over a million units and eight years of data, they are in a position to determine the aggregate excess high temperature readings in an area which suggests the spread of some fever-inducing illness, but, of course, cannot diagnose it.  The graph below of the US shows the excess fever readings over the seasonally-expected rates throughout the areas where units are in use.  Notice the two hotspots: the NY metropolitan area and the state of Florida.  Covid is certainly the culprit in NYC, which already has 30% of the total US cases of infection.  Unless there is some other, unknown source of illness in Florida, the Sunshine State is about to explode with corona.  Good work Gov. DeSantis, who has failed to issue a shelter-at-home order, failed to close the beaches, etc.  

 

 

https://healthweather.us/

 

fascinating. Also a lot in Texas where the governor has refused to issue a stay in place order. Notice that in the Bible belt states there's a lot of fever too. Possibly attributable to the fact that Trump loving fundamentalists have continued to attend Sunday church services?

To be fair to Florida, some of that is probably due to the fact that it's a major tourist and snowbird destination. Which doesn't excuse the foolishness of its governor.

And of course, the high number of seniors.

2 hours ago, lannarebirth said:

 

I didn't say that. In fact once you get some immediate relief outin a smaller, clean Bill  the Democrats could have taken a much harder line IMO. It was the linkage and lack of breathing room that allowed for the corporate largesse. They had a gun to their heads. Not that there aren't plenty of Democrats that aren't sympathetic to Wall Street too.

A much harder line? And what leverage would the democrata have had to get that clean bill? You don't think that Republicans were determined to bail out big corporations and such? That it wasn't their top priority?

8 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

I think too may items were under consideration by both sides. I think both sides had enough data and there was enough urgency to send a clean Bill to the president to send out $1,000 to every adult and $500 to every child. They could then have spent more time attacking the pork each side presented and decide the proper amount of assistance the business sector might require in a seperate Bill.

And if the incredibly generous corporate bailout arrives a week late, that's okay too?

Just now, lannarebirth said:

I think too may items were under consideration by both sides. I think both sides had enough data and there was enough urgency to send a clean Bill to the president to send out $1,000 to every adult and $500 to every child. They could then have spent more time attacking the pork each side presented and decide the proper amount of assistance the business sector might require in a seperate Bill.

 And the Democrats hugely increasing the amount that the unemployed will be getting is not a matter of great urgency? Seems a lot more urgent than giving money to those who still have jobs.

3 minutes ago, Logosone said:

The most recent study by Oxford university shows that half the population of the UK may already be infected.

 

Herd immunity means so many people are infected and immune that the virus can not spread.

 

In the absence of governments taking the fight to the virus, as they are unable to test, identify and isolate the infected in sufficient numbers, it would seem that herd immunity will be the most likely way the virus is stopped.

 

Social distancing means delaying the desirable goal of herd immunity. It means the virus will spread for longer.

 

Opening up a country for business will achieve herd immunity sooner.

 

It will also make testing and isolating easier.

 

 

If true, Trump will claim that he knew all along that it wasn't really a pandemic.

10 minutes ago, lannarebirth said:

 

Sorry, the government. Our leadership.

Funny, because the Democrats had to compromise to get more support for the unemployed and lower income people. Imagine what they could have gotten if the Republicans weren't in the way.

10 minutes ago, Logosone said:

We can be pretty sure the medical systems of the world, including the US, will be overwhelmed whatever happens. The only possible exceptions are the German, SKorean and Japanese health systems. The rest will have to go through panic mode like Italy, Spain and the UK soon

 

The number of deaths, of course, will be finite, there is only so much population. The same number of people will die either way, as our governments seem to be unable to test, identify and isolate the nececssary numbers.

 

Basically what you're saying is that we should all self-isolate to do the health services a favour. 

 

The problem is that self-isolation will mean herd immunity comes slower, so this is all dragged out.

The question is how overwhelmed? It will be less overwhelmed if the spread of the virus is slower.