KhaoYai

Prior to the suspension, there had also been some discussion about doing away with them permanently - apparently they don't see the point in them (neither do we) and storage was becoming a problem.

I would love to bring my E36 325TDS Estate - always planned to and CKD it but even that looked like a deliberately difficult path - import tax and general hassle. Now the've completely banned the importation of secondhand cars - sadly there will be no further imports of classics. It would be nice (and good for business) if they made a tax free exception for vehicles over say 25 years old - especially those in need of restoration. I doubt everyone would suddenly decide to import 25 year old motors so I don't see the harm. I do see the good.

Agreed, I would always take all of those documents and a fresh KR2 + copies. You never know what an I.O. will want on the day. I have never been asked for an updated KR2 - not that I can get one now anyway but I believe they are available from any Amphur - you no longer have to go to the one you registered your marriage at???

With that kind of comment, I'm surprised you didn't say "every American speaking country". Maybe in your dreams. America meddles in just about every country on earth and usually makes a hash of it. I'm thinking..........Iran, Afghanistan, Vietnam....................... If you like to think it owns every English speaking country we'll let you think so but its typical US misguided arrogance.

Please have a think about what you are saying. I understand why you might think that way but there are a number of things to consider. I'm not critcising you per se, just asking that you consider that a girl doesn't have to be chained to be trafficked. There is a strange phenomena in some Thai families, something I've been a victim of and still don't understand it but its very real. That is the power that familes have over the younger female members of their clan. With these families, they can ask the girls to do anything and the girl can't refuse. Its usually the youngest female child that is subject to such power and the requests upon them can be various. Before we were married my ex wife's family forced her to go to work as a cleaner in Brunei for 2 years to pay off her mother's gambling debt. After we were married they continually asked her to get money from me - exerting severe pressure. The only way she could get out of that was to divorce me. Her family, she said, would never give up making demands. Its a long story and I don't want to do my dirty washing in public so you'll just have to trust me - the phenomena is very very real. Its not a factor of all Thai families but I have seen this in action before and the girls just cannot say no. They are conditioned from birth that they must do what the family asks of them. The requests are not always severe - sometimes they just get saddled with all the housework and treated like a servant but whatever the request, they must and normally do, give in. I've never got my head around it - why don't they just leave? However, I accept it exists because I've seen it in action. I've also been aware of it from conversations with Thai friends. Some families send their daughters to work as prostitutes. Some are up front about it, some just tell them to go find work in Pattaya etc. and tell them how much they need to send home - amounts they are never going to make in a 'normal' job so prostitution is implied. Then there are the young girls that see older 'working girls' return home on visits with their new clothes, iphones etc. and want it for themselves. Others may be very young single mothers who need to provide for their family etc. etc. etc. Whatever the reason, their is well documented evidence that any females, getting involved in prostitution and the abuse if often involves, often end up with physiciatric problems later in life - sometimes severe problems. The younger the victim, the more serious these problems can be. Some get involved with drugs, theft and all sorts of low end activities. They often have a 'boyfriend' who is more akin to a pimp and takes most of their money off them. I am not saying that the above applies to all 'working girls' - there are a few that make it though and make a lot of money from 'the business' but I'd wager that many, if not most, finish up with nothing to show for themselves after spending years with sweaty old men bouncing up and down on top of them. I have nothing against prostitution but given the risk that it could completely wreck their lives, I do think that the involvement of very young girls in prostitution is totally abhorrent. Also think about this, prostitution if rife all over asia. Visitors often think its all about Pattaya, Sukhumvit, Phuket all the areas where many foreign tourists come to for sex. But I've seen it said that the sex service industry for foreigners is only about 10% of the total market and I believe it. There are private clubs, Thai Cafes, massage parlours, hostess bars and karaoke bars etc. all over Thailand and the vast majority are aimed at the domestic market. Many have young girls working for them but they are hidden from view That equals a hell of a lot of young girls that are potentially at risk of abuse and serious psychiatric problems at some point in the future.

To call these people 'refugees' seems odd. Prayuth has been cosying up to Putin for a while so whilst 'Thailand Welcomes Russian Refugess' - if his buddy Putin told him to send his citizens back, they'd all be heading home. Can't take a chance on losing access to cheap oil can we>

Given that Putin began controlling the news, imprisoning any opposition that starts to become even remotely popular, banning anti government protests and generally 'conditioning' the Russian population since around 1999, I think the word is Brainwashing. Propaganda doesn't seem strong enough somehow.

You have absolutely no idea how much I have driven - many thousands of kilometers actually and in just about every part of the country but this is not a competition.. It is very possible to driven millions of miles on Thai roads and still not know what's going on - you seem to be a good example of that. There is nothing complicated about what goes on on Thai roads. The laws exist, they are not enforced and therefore we have the Wild West mayhem that some of us will see everyday. And who is ultimately responsible for that? Unless laws are enforced, there will always be those that break them. Thailand's roads and the thousands of deaths and injuries that occur on them every year are a perfect example of what happens when you don't enforce laws. Its not a complex issue at all - its quite simple. Enforce the law and make the fines and punishments a proper deterrent. If people can't afford to pay high fines or lose their licence, well they have a choice don't they. Seeing what happens on Thai roads and knowing what needs to be done to make them safer are not a factors that are determined by how long you've lived there or how many miles you've driven. Just about every time I drive far in Thailand I see examples of extremely bad driving, poorly maintained vehicles etc. etc. Sometimes I don't have to drive far at all to see people riding motorcycles without a crash helmet. You accuse me of picking a single issue - OK then, seeing as we're talking about road safety how about all the other things that can be seen every day on Thai roads - absolutely crazy driving, people coming down the hard shoulder inside of you on the expressway as your about to exit left, running red lights well after the light changed, motobikes and sometimes cars out on unlit roads at night with no lights working at all, bikes and cars driving the wrong way down the side of a main road, etc. ect. etc? Complex? How much does a bike back light bulb cost for christ's sake? I've lost count of the number of bikes with no lights I've almost cleaned up at night around my Thai home and I'm convinced that one day I will kill one of them. Why do these things happen? Because the laws are not enforced and the punishments are not severe enough to act as a deterrent - especially when roadside 'fines' end up in someone's back pocket. The fact that people are poor is no excuse for not having punishments that act as a deterrent. We all have a choice and if we can't afford the penalty, we shouldn't be so ready to break the law. The state's role? To create laws and ensure that they are properly enforced - ultimate responsibility. Around 4 weeks from now (Songkran) we will see reports of hundreds of deaths and injuries on Thailand's roads. Shortly afterwards we will see the annual round of announcements by the government that this or that will be done and within a few months it will all be forgotten. The same thing happens year after year and nothing changes - except the body count rises. The Earth is not flat? Well, you learn something new every day

Good idea, maybe they'd learn eh?

Profound lack of knowledge of road safety (typos corrected) ???????????? - possibly the most arrogant, self important post, pompous post I've ever read. If you don't like my comments, that's fair enough but don't fill this thread with your own self importance. I fully understand that Thailand's traffic laws and their enforcement are not the whole issue. As anyone with a modicum of intelligence would understand, it is implicit in my statement that the state has a role to play. I know that is not the whole issue. But as you don't seem to have that requirement, I'll say it a different way: Anyone stating that a particular facet of a narrative has a role to play, is implicitly stating that their subject is only part of the story. If I was trying to say that the state was totally to blame, I would simply say that, not that the state has a role to play. If you read all of my posts on this subject, you should also understand that I am fully aware that there are other factors that may have lead to the situation this man finds himself in. I selected the state and their lack of enforcement of the traffic laws - especially relating to the wearing of crash helmets - you surely cannot deny that that is a factor in many deaths and serious injuries sustained in accidents involving motorcycles? I may not have your implicitly claimed knowledge of road safety issues and if what you write is an example of that knowledge, I don't want it but I do have experience. I have driven many different types of vehicle in quite a few countries for over 40 years. Most of those countries have been well developed in terms of their road networks and traffic laws so it came as something of a shock when I arrived in Thailand 21 years ago and started to learn how things work there and how dangerous Thai roads can be. I have stated facts and if you deny those facts, supply proof. I'll list a few: Thailand's road traffic laws state that a crash helmet must be worn when riding on public roads. A large percentage of riders choose not to wear them. The police rarely prosecute people for not wearing a helmet (when taken against the number od journeys made). When the police do stop people for ANY traffice offence, the fines issued are not of a size that would deter the offender from repeating their offence. The fines also are often negotiated down to a price that the offender says they can afford. It is very well known that the destination for a very large percentage of those fines is not the public's coffers. Thai drivers and riders often have a high disregard for traffic laws in general. Part of that is down to the lack of enforcement, part is because the deterent is not enough and part is down to a mistrust of the police which creates some of the disregard for the laws in the first place. Some of those traits also transfer to foreigners visiting the country. In 2011 I was on the back of a motorcycle taxi when a car taxi pulled out of a side road and we collided with it. Both myself and the taxi rider were quite severely injured and yes, I was not wearing a crash helmet. Why? Because Thailand is a very hot country and I knew that I was unlikely to be stopped by the police for not wearing a helmet. In other words, I had obtained the same lack of respect for the law that native riders have. That law is there for a very good reason. I sustained a head injury, not too serious but enough to make me realise just how different things could have been. I can tell you that an unprotected human head, launched into a collision with metal box, even at a relatively slow speed will spill its contents all over the tarmac very easily. Do I ride without a helmet in my own country? Never, partly because I don't want to sustain serious injury in the event of a collision and partly because I know that if I do and I'm caught, I will receive a reasonably heavy fine and 3 points on my licence. My insurance will also probably increase at the next renewal because of such a prosecution. I am focusing on a single issue here because: a). I rattle on far too much in any case and it would take me chapters to discuss other factors. and b). Because there is a strong possibility that if the subject of the OP had been wearing a helmet, he may well not be in hospital in a coma right now. I repeat, the Thai state DOES have a role to play in the dire state of safety on its roads. It does not ensure that its laws are enforced or provide a situation where its riders and drivers respect the law. It is very easy to bribe yourself out of a traffic offence in Thailand - even serious offences. Readers here will know that for sure. It is also quite easy to buy your Thai licence if you so wish - I know that to be a fact because an ex girlfriend was offered a licence for 2000 baht when she persistently failed her driving test. Imagine that, a person who barely knows how to turn a steering wheel, obtaining a licence without passing a test or having any formal training whatsoever. A disaster waiting to happen. Maybe even worse, thousands of Thai's ride and drive every day without a licence. Next time you're out on Thailand's roads, take a look at the chaos that is a roundabout. Many drivers have no idea who has right of way and simply practice a rotating me me me/I don't give a damnn/scared attitude. Last time I looked, there was no roundabout involved in the Thai driving test. I stand by everything I have said and I will not discuss the matter further with you.

Interesting but not necessarily worrying. The RTE London used to disregard the need to provide financials if you were applying for a MENO to visit your wife (despite their website stating they were needed). I wasn't arguing with them but I found it a strange stance. Nevertheless, it seems things are changing and I doubt they will change for the better.

Seriously - given the location, is this survey likely to produce anything other than a large majority stating that they prefer a Thai?

Wrong on all counts. I don't understand the traffic laws? Complex? It is against the law to ride a motorcycle without a helmet. That law is not fully enforced, hence the amount of people riding around without them. When roadside checks are made and small fines issued, it is well known that those fines do not reach the destination that they should. Nothing complex about that. For further answers to your complex public health issues - ask Thai people why they disregard the traffic laws. I know far more Thai people in Thailand than foreigners, most of my friends are Thai - we talk about these issues. If you have an accident on a motorcycle, you are likely to injure your head. That situation is greatly reduced if you are wearing a decent quality crash helmet - full stop. Nothing to do with complex social situations, plain and simple blood and guts - literally. I am not fixating on one individual at all. These accidents happen every day but they happen in the main, amongst the native population. The entire road safety issue in Thailand is dire. Your assertion that the situation is complex is, in my opinion, total rubbish and a typical left wing viewpoint. Its quite simple - there are roads, roads can be dangerous, therefore to reduce that danger, rules need to be put in place to protect people. In order for those rules to work, they have to be enforced. Thailand fails - mainly in enforcement. The laws exist but they are rarely followed. The governement comes out with a load of blustre about changing the laws to make things safer each time a serious accident occurrs, then does nothing. Your over-complication not my simplification. What is complex about a policeman fining someone for not wearing a helmet (or any other traffic law) and putting that fine in his pocket? Do you know how Thai people feel about their police force as a result of such corruption? Leave Social Science out of this please. Complex social issues or public health issues have no place in road safety. Roads/Accidents/Rules/Enforcement they are there for the same reasons and are just as necessary wherever they are.

I have lived in Thailand on and off but have been a regular visitor (over 150 trips) for 21 years and have a home near Khao Yai. I am not however, in Thailand full time at the moment. But we are not talking about the overall crime rate - we are talking about traffic laws. Western ideas? They are not Western ideas, they are laws which are comensurate with the traffic situation. They are laws designed to protect people. The reasons for having a speed limit in Thailand or wearing a helmet are just the same as they are in the West. Thailand's roads have improved greatly since I first visited and in many cases they equal those of many Western countries. One of the main differences is that they are frequented by an awful lot of people that have had little of no formal driver training, many don't hold a licence and a lot of others have paid for theirs. Those that do pass their test do so very easily as the standard of the test is woefully inadequate. If enforcement is a 'Western' idea, as you seem to be suggesting - so be it. We are almost at the pinnacle of the road deaths period in Thailand - Songkran. Expect another 800 or so motorcyclists to die. Many of those that will die will be drunk and many will not be wearing a helmet.

But they don't have the time of their life, many die. Also, the example I cited in Korat where they do that in front of traffic police is not on a quiet country lane - its on the main road through the city! If you think its OK for 3 or 4 12 year old children to ride a bike without a helmet in a busy city, then shame on you.

Never, I have never 'done' a teenager, honest guv ????.

All 4 put together? Jeez, how old is she? Is it legal?

You know, its not that long ago that I would have said you are a tw&t for making such a comment. How things change, now I wish I'd had that attitude years ago.

Yes but I'm not saying there isn't a price to pay. It would have been nice if one of my past relationships had worked but there comes a time when you have to say enough is enough and find a different way. It took me far to long to learn that. At the moment I'm enjoying it but who knows what will happen next week, next month or next year? I doubt it though ????.

Sadly, people will take chances, people will also break the law given the chance - especially when that law is not enforced. This is why I brought the role of the state into this discussion. I am not totally blaming the state for this and the other accidents with similar consequences that we hear of all too often. What I am saying is that the state has a role to play. Would this accident have happened at all in a different country - somehow I doubt it would, not in a country that has properly enforced traffic laws. That said, even in such a country, accidents do happen - laws and enforcement will never stop them all. But, and its a very big but, the Thai state knows very well that literally thousands of people are killed on motorcycles on its roads every year. It also knows that its laws are not enforced and that all too often fines are both inadequate and are nothing more than Tea Money. Enforcement would not save all those lives but I think its a safe bet that it would save an awful lot of them. Its not too difficult to understand that the threat of a much higher penalty and the loss of one's licence would take time, but eventually would change things. Yes people are much poorer in Thailand - so what? All the more reason for them to fear a heavy fine or the loss of their licence. But what do we see from the state? A new points system that allows people to be caught for drink driving 3 times before losing their licence! To make things worse, they are now proposing ways that people who have lost points, can get them back within 6 months!!! How do I know that a properly enforced system of punishment will work? I see it in action every day in my home country - the UK. I would bet everthing I own that on my drive into work tomorrow, I see no motorcycle riders not wearing their crash helmet. Yes, there are far less motorcycles on the UK's roads but its not just about that, its about people's attitude towards the law. I'm pretty sure that if people could get away with not wearing a crash helmet in the UK, some would. I'm also pretty sure that if people could pay the police a few pounds to get out of a traffic offence or losing their licence, they would. If people all behaved properly without laws, we wouldn't need them would we? As I said earlier, that's Utopia and it doesn't exist. So, in my opinion, backed up by evidence of how things work in other countries, I believe that the state has a lot to answer for in this and all the other accidents that sadly happen in Thailand on a daily basis. I am not a fan of over-regulation but there are some facets of life where regulations are very necessary. When you ride a bike or drive a car, you are in charge of a weapon. A weapon that can not only kill or mame you, it can kill and mame others - to say nothing of the heartache caused to victim's friends and families. Regulation and its enforcement is sadly lacking on Thailand's roads and that needs putting right. Will it be? The answer to that can be found in what I said about the new points system. Not a hope in hell. Next week, next month and next year, we will still be reading similar stories to the OP.

Jeez.... we've covered this..........Bangkok for christ's sake!

The All Clear Gold policy covers any size of motorcycle - the only exclusions are below - from my policy: 13) a) you driving a motor cycle unless you hold the equivalent and appropriate valid licence in the UK; b) you driving or riding on a motor cycle unless you are wearing a crash helmet; The wording is in 'General Exclusions' and states what is not covered so.......you are not covered when riding a bike (no size limit metioned) if you don't hold a licence in the UK and you are not wearing a crash helmet. Note, the policy does not cover the UK so don't draw any inference from the UK licence bit. It simply means that you must have a UK licence for that bike - that you are riding it abroad is implicit. I should perhaps also state that I have just received a renewal quote and the price has jumped to £193. I still think that's good value for a 12 month multi trip policy.

You are quite clearly being deliberately argumetative and I think most people here will easily see how. If you see most people wearing crash helmets or even the majority of them, you must live in a different country to that which I spend a lot of my time in. The last time I spent much time in the city, Bangkok was no different - if that's changed, that's great news. I think its quite clear why helmets are involved in this discussion and I am not prepared to continue feeding your deliberately argumentative stance.

You're in Bangkok. In Pak Chong and Korat you won't see many Thai's wearing helmets. In Korat city you can see many bikes with clearly underage riders + 2 school kid passengers - all without helmets, every morning. They do that right in front of the police directing traffic on the main road through the city. Maybe people are obeying the law more in the capital nowadays but I see no change out in the provinces.

I'm not sure if you are getting your information from this thread or a completely different one? Firstly, I no longer qualify for a MENO - I'm divorced, I'm trying to get information for a mate. Nowhere did I state that he can't afford 400k but at the moment he can't produce it in the way required and on time. Therefore it seems his best option is to get a visa from either HCMC or Savannakhet. Both of those locations used to offer 12 month MENO's without any financial requirement - I have been trying to establish if that's still the case. Secondly, as far as I know, the cost of a MENO at Savannakhet is 5000 baht not $200 US. The $200 US is the price at HCMC. The total cost of obtaining a visa at either location, including travel etc. is way less than the 400,000 baht required for a 12 month extension. You then talk about using an agent for a retirement extension - nowhere have I stated that my mate wants a retirment extension or that he has used an agent. The visa he wants is a 12 month MENO based on marriage. Are you sure you are replying to the correct thread?