Parker2100

How does raising financial requirements help? The two stories they mentioned were a businessman & a bike gang. Businesses and gangs don't have money? Sounds like an excuse to me. Nothing to do with screening out criminals. Like when he instituted "Good guys in, Bad guys out." Sure, he got many bad guys out but a lot of good guys moved to Philippines or Vietnam. I currently have a retirement Visa in Cambodia. Retirees saved Thailand's Bacon during Covid. They keep chipping away at Long-term tourism and Thais will continue to suffer and Thailand's neighbors will benefit.

They do already, don't they. I believe it is on the list of things needed. Not sure they enforce it though.

Yeah, he needs to wait until the Government changes. It is taking longer than expected.

The Thai Philosophy seems to be that Thailand is Governed by people, not words, and the Law is fluid. So, this being true, it is better to carry the 20,000. 10,000 may not work and it is harmful to tell people that is always the rule.

The Thai Embassy website in the USA.

When I first came to Thailand in 2016, the website said the official amount was 20,000. But when I have been ask to show it (and I have been asked to show it) they ask to see 10,000. But if they wanted to be strict, they could ask to see 20,000. Especially for longer trips.

It didn't change. It is still 20,000 BUT they will often only "ask" to see 10,000 cash. Better to bring the official amount. Not what people think the will ask for.

No argument but I don't like to play Russian Roulette.

Yes, but I knew what he meant. He just means getting stamped in. I didn't want my answers to be overly/unnecessarily complicated.

If only week long visits, it shouldn't (especially from last year). But I can never predict what Thai Immigration will do, exactly. It may slow the que a little because they need to examine the dates. Unless you are lucky enough to get an IO who just does not care about petty things. The number of VOEs -should- not matter unless you are coming in from a Land Border. But sometimes you get an IO who thinks it is a trick so they need to examine the dates and if you have any Visas + VOEs. But the computer should just give them the info (assuming it was entered correctly). On its face, it shouldn't be a problem.

You didn't say anything that disagrees with what I said. But the "180-Rule" is the reason I am not in Thailand right at this moment, or rather, why I have not been back to Thailand since before COVID. So, it is still taken very seriously. They kept waving a paper in front of my face that said I was in Thailand 191 days in 2018 and 2019 (Which is 2 years, but I digress). Then stamped me in for 30 more days but scribbled a note in my passport, that I was trying to live in Thailand. An attempt to bias future attempts to enter legally. The IO said she is only letting me in because I just came from 60 days in Malaysia & Indonesia. Which totally blows their reasoning out of the water. So, in 30 days, I went to Cambodia. Then COVID happened and I have been spending my money here since. So, Thai Immigration can and will, use there "discretion" to pull reasons out of there behind to boot you without a reason other than suspicion. Or saving face if you prove their assertions wrong. That is what the scribbling in my passport was. Saving face. So I do know what I am talking about.

The memos to the Oil & Gas workers was not in the OP. But it would make sense for the reasons I have been explaining. Your post does not disagree with anything I have been saying and it is important for everyone to know. Not just oil/gas workers. Telling people there is no 180 day rule does not help. If people believe you, you are setting them up for trouble. There shouldn't be such a rule. But Immigration uses it, none-the-less? I have actually seen it written on the Websites of some Consulates. They don't post that because it is a written rule (in that case it is written) but they are warning travelers. They know what triggers Immigration. It should be written on all the Consolate Websites But it isn't, be like you and I, they know it isn't a rule Immigration should be imposing. The mistake many repeat visitors make is that they believe IO discretion works in their favor when many times (most?) it is the opposite.

No, there is no 180 -writen- rule but it is a metric Immigration uses to decide if you are living in Thailand in tourist status. It is real tool that Immigration uses. Ignore it, and you will be hear whining in a few months. They didn't enforce it in the COVID years, but I have read many accounts where they are now. That was kinda my point, Immigration does not need written rules to boot you. You could be following all the rules you know about and still get in trouble. As you said, the OP had what he needed and he still had problems. I suspect you will see many more of post like this in the coming months or maybe even years.

Since IOs have discretion, someone could have a Retirement Visa or even an Elite Visa and Immigration could subjectively decide they are working. In your case, you had two suspicious IOs because you had an expiring work permit. You wanted to enter on your Elite Visa. Presumably, the first two IOs thought you would continue to work without a valid permit on the Elite Visa. They had no evidence to think this but they don't need any. The senior IO could have easily sided with the first two subordinates based on suspicion alone. I know, from experience, you can be following all the rules and still get turned away on suspicion alone. You were just lucky. Probably, your "Elite Visa" status meant to the superior officer that you have resources and they want people like that in Thailand. Even with that, you almost got booted. What does that say about how the average Joe (who visits less than 180 days a year) is treated by immigration when coming in on a Visa or just a stamp? Your case is NOT a good example for the original post. If anything, it serves to show how arbitrary Immigration is with repeat visitors.

I don't need to support anything. People who read this and know Thailand know exactly what I am talking about. And they know you are deluded or a shill. You cannot argue against peoples personal experiences.

You think Thailand is governed by logic and written rules? Ahahahaha! Who do you complain to that speaks English? Or french, as you like to spice your posts with? And you were satisfied that you had to go to all that trouble and were lucky enough to get IOs that speak English? And you were one unreasonable officer away from a lot of trouble. I think you were just really lucky.

Wish immigration thought of it like that. If they have proof positive someone does not work in Thailand, it does not change their behavior one bit.

I was thinking the same thing.

Yes, in the que I was in last time, it was a female IO and almost everyone who came to her counter was sent to secondary screening. I was so sure that I was doing everything correctly, that I stayed in that que even though it was going very slowly. Oddly, a husband and wife were just before me. She let the wife in but was having problems with the Husband. She did eventually let him in though. I thought about changing ques just because it was so slow, but I thought that would make me look suspicious. Sure enough, I was sent to a 2nd and 3rd screening and -almost- got denied entry. Only thing that saved me was rapid firing documents (financial, travel, etc.) at them. It was very hard to get them to reverse course on what they already decided to do.

All my problems (3) have been at Don Muang. I have not experienced them being abusive but I have had them get hard-headed and jump to conclusions even though they cannot speak English enough for me explain something. Then, if you get through to them, they want to stick to their original opinion and they get angry the closer they get to having to reverse course. Basically, there are 3 levels. You have the counter IO who sometimes sends you to the second IO who speaks a little English and that is your best chance to talk your way out of it. Then, he sends you to the office of 2-3 IOs. Their job is to dot the I's and cross the T's because at that point they have already decided they are turning you back. BUT not all hope is lost! Because, even though they don't speak English, they are trying to work on their official reason. Which is usually lack of funds if you don't show them cash. The law does not say you have to show cash so if you keep shoveling documents at them, like Bank Statements, showing them credit cards, or anything, it throws them off their game. They may have to concoct a different reason and they have to try to translate and understand what you are showing them. They will try to play dumb for as long as they can. But if you just keep shoveling documents at them, they may just decide you are to much work and let you in (but scribble something in your passport to bias any future IO who looks at it. As happened with me) If you get to the 3rd level and are quiet, or worse angry, you are going back to wherever you came from. You need to push back, but respectfully.

That establishes TAT but it does not give them effective control of Thai Immigration. Countless times, in my experience, TAT says one thing and Thai Immigration ignores them.

Whenever TAT says something you can usually believe the opposite

Sounds like the same lady I dealt with.

Yes, I did the same as you, as a tourist. I would sometimes spend 2 months out. And I was told by an Attorney in Thailand that I was ok as long as in Thailand less than 180 days in a -Calandar Year-. But Immigration twisted the rules to say that I was 11 days over (191 days) in the last 365 days. Over 2 -Calandar- years! Technically, there isn't even a Law or writen policy limiting a tourist to 6 months a year but it is a metric that Immigration uses to determine if you are a real tourist. Being even close to 6 months will trigger further screening by Immigration. Or least it did before COVID and, apparently, they are going back to doing that. In my cases, I was let in but the Immigration Officer entered, by hand, that I was trying to live in Thailand. They didn't speak much English so I couldn't explain the situation to them very well. Apparently, I got through to them because they let me in. But they could not admit they were wrong so they had to scribble in my passport a prejudicial comment. But they did try to make hard for me to come back for an undisclosed period of time. That was the last time I was in Thailand and I had to close my PO Box, my Storage Unit, and break the shared lease of the seasonal apartment I rented. I also, had to abandon many of the larger things I stored in Thailand. Because I had to break the seasonal lease. The Thai person I shared the lease with (Roommate but was elsewhere most of the time) could not afford to keep the Apartmentand was Homeless just going into the COVID situation. He was homeless for about 6 months.

It is my understanding that iTV ceased operations in 2007 (March 7 to be more precise). So even if it does have some operations, currently, it is not media related. Even if it was founded as a media company. Trying to get it back in operation is business related but it it is still not an operational source of media. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/ITV_(Thailand)