Thaindrew

correct re the Thai Elite Visa, I am considering withdrawing my 15 years "extension" and just staying in Thailand 179 days a year as a result of this new interpretation. It was costing me 500k to extend and I am considering cancelling so you can think what those paying much more may think

but only if you bring those monies to Thailand right, whatever that means, sure they can track bank transfers, but atm withdrawals, credit card payments etc could they get into that much detail?

you could send 20m to yourself tax free before, but not going forward, don't see how that will be different for a Thai spouse, they also have a tax free threshold of 150k and these very changes are to prevent money coming from outside Thailand to Thais also tax free - if it is a loophole that could be proven its potential a lucrative agency type business

it could kill the property market if applied as you state, of course if you transfer a large sum there is already anti money laundering checks but generally thats to show you did earn the money, not exactly that you paid tax on it. When you consider the current buyers of Thai property those may well have not paid tax in their home countries, and if they were taxed at such high rates when funds arrive in Thailand, the property market would collapse in terms of sales volumes or the prices drop 30%.

and its interesting to note all this is based on a re-interpretation of the current law, not something that has to go through parliament, and who has the most funds outside the country that has never had tax paid ...... ?

the big issue is whether if you are here for more than 180 days will they force you to do a tax return, I'd say its likely now, if you declare no funds bought to Thailand they are likely to ask questions about how you can live. If they tie in immigration and you have a "married" or "retirement" visas they are also likely to check that the funds you declare on a tax return match what you have to declare for those visas. You could though bring in with cash, atm / credit card etc funds over and above what you have to declare for your visa and that would probably go unnoticed.

a tax resident is everyone that lives here more than 180 days a year (that is clear), currently we are not "forced" to do a tax return but it sounds like we may well be as a way to assess any tax liability

I'd say at the new costs of the Thai Elite Visa, if you would also be taxed, then those visas will be much less attractive than before - people will chose to stay here less than 6 months a year and chose a different visa option

potentially a lot of work though, especially if bringing in 20MBaht to buy a property also don't forget many people don't have to pay tax, for example the Uk threshold means many pensions are not taxed, but the threshold here is lower so you cannot prove you paid tax as in fact you didn't have to

loads of issues as usual after a Thai Govt proclamation. Pensions could well be an issue though as tax free thresholds in Thailand are lower than most other countries, so people may not be liable for tax in say the UK as its below the threshold but it couldn't be below the Thai threshold which is 150k a year so below what you have to declare as income to get a Thai "retirement visa". its going to come down to interpretation, will they consider "assessed for tax in the UK but not liable" as enough of a justification to not pay in Thailand - it sounds like not but pensioners will rightly be up in arms

I doubt the banks would take the "tax" on receipt of transferred funds, the statement seems to state that the funds are "to be assessed" for tax, which id take as meaning we will be forced to do a tax return stating the funds bought into Thailand and then we'd have to prove tax has been paid at the same or higher rate than the relevant Thai rate - if so no tax

try proving the savings didn't come from previous income, you could before given the "income from previous tax year" transfer rule, but that rule has gone, so now you'd need to prove the transferred funds had been taxed wherever those funds came from

I have asked Thailand elite / privilege to clarify and will advise if they respond

the problem though is the tax threshold is a lot higher in the Uk than in Thailand, so you may fall below the level needed to pay tax in the UK but you cannot be below the tax threshold in Thailand based on what you have to show as income to get a retirement visa. So I will come down to interpretation - you can show you have been assessed for tax in the UK but as you cannot show you have paid any it may well be that you would have to pay in Thailand

thats seems to be the rule they are re-interpreting so yes any income bought into Thailand is taxable, but hey thats what VAT is, so we'd be taxed twice on expenditure in effect.

I suppose the point will be that if you are here over 180 days you will have to register with the tax office .... that can easily be overseen by the "trusted" immigration dept and checked upon visa renewals - this would be very bad for Thailand ultimately.

even the locals cannot really vote them out !

china also taxing global income now if you are there more than 180 days, that why I moved to Thailand.

The Thailand Elite Visa is listed as exempt from Tax on the IRS website

actually I have just seen that currently the Elite Visa, from the IRS site of tax exemptions "individuals who are exempt from paying tax under a special law such as the Thailand Elite program", they could possibly change that for new applications but not for existing members

HSBC have a global debit card that has no transaction or exchange fees and even gives a rebate on spend

possible, but I think it would then be held up as discrimination by individuals who have paid for more expensive visas.

thats based on current tax law and applies to everyone, if the tax law changes its likely to change for everyone

you can only minimise your costs not eradicate them completely I suppose but bank transaction fees probably cost you less than a tax bill. There are banks though that have "global debit cards" so you can hold multiple currencies in your home country account and use a debit card to pay in Thailand in Thai Baht with no transaction fees.

"Could also be that the individual amount of pension received by some folks is under the Thai personl tax threshhold." --- if lower tax limit is 150K baht a year then to qualify for a retirement visa you would have to bring in more than that on an annual basis. But it could get even more complicated, say you transfer 800k for the visa application, which is taxed in HK at 15%, will they want to tax it again at the differential rate? Will they be purely looking at "transfer in" values to determine tax liabilities. What if you transferred in 15m Baht to buy property and those funds were taxed in HK at 15%, will they want to tax you at the differential rate if you are living here over 180 days? Again, Will they be purely looking at "transfer in" values to determine tax liabilities. That could kill the property market. One of the issues in Thailand is that there is never clarity in the law or its application.