drbeach

18 minutes ago, digibum said:

And suddenly Thailand is a land of pure minds? 

 

I could see this written from a completely opposite perspective where some farang kidnaps a Thai child and takes the child out of the country and people would be like, "Wasn't it totally obvious?  It's a farang man with an minor!  No mom with the child?  OMG, how blind is Thai immigration?" 

 

With all of the messaging about human trafficking and stuff, I think it would be on the safe side to assume that some people are going to look at you funny. 

Three things. Thai immigration permits a Thai mother to take out her Thai child(ren) using a border pass to neighboring countries without the need for a permission letter from the non-accompanying parent. I've verified this myself. However, a foreign parent of a Thai child can't do this (i.e. can't apply for the border pass on behalf of his/her child) - the Thai parent has to accompany the child, except if it is old enough to apply for a border pass on his/her own, which is at age 15. In this case, there is no longer a need to travel with a parent but up until the age of 12 a Thai citizen parent needs to apply for and travel with the child, while between 12 and 15 the request can be made by the child themselves but must still travel with a parent.

A lone foreign parent accompanying a non-Thai child is unlikely to be questioned by Thai immigration because they don't really care about foreigners or what we do. Also, they probably assume permission was granted by the authorities in the originating country so they're not going to do the work of that country to double check again. I think their duty is mainly to prevent Thai citizen children being taken out without the permission of the other parent.

I think immigration is more likely to think it's strange that a man (such as the OP) is taking a strange child that is not related to him by blood out of the country than his own children. No ordinary person thinks it's strange for a single parent to travel abroad with their child(ren) but without the other parent. I've lost count of the number of times I've seen Thai and Burmese women clearly traveling without their husbands, cross the border with a child in their arms. I think I've also occasionally seen local fathers traveling with their children but without their wives too. I've never seen anyone question this or think it's strange.

Just one final comment I wanted to make. This story is still very new. I recently started noticing Chevrolet showrooms disappearing with one near my place having closed up shop though that may have been a while ago now. Was also kinda surprised when I went to the Chevy website about how few dealerships they have, in comparison to the competition (like Mazda, Toyota, Isuzu). Clearly Chevy hasn't been doing all that well here in recent years, though not necessarily that terribly either if judging by the still sizeable number of Chevy vehicles on the roads (my neighbor owns one too). Anyway, if you do the research and look at their Wikipedia pages and news releases over the years, GM's strategy has changed greatly under their General Manager, Barra.

Great Wall's decision to purchase the GM plant has also just been announced. This follows a 2013 announcement about their plans to use Thailand as a base for their expansion into SE Asia, which was reversed in 2014 because they weren't ready back then. However, it now looks like they are definitely ready to follow a strategy to internationalize their operations. It has been mentioned that GW's takeover of GM's plant will be finalized by the end of this year. I'm sure they'll announce their plans for the Thai market in due course. However, right now it's too early to announce whether they plan to open say 100 or 200 dealerships nationwide and by when. We don't know when actually they agreed to purchase GM's plant. We only know it has just been announced, therefore it's impossible for them to know exactly what they want to do now, when it may take them until the end of the year to finalize the plant takeover plans. Therefore, without knowing more, it's all speculation but reading the press releases already made, and the plans for their operations and using a bit of logic and common sense, it's quite obvious they have big plans for both the Thai market and the rest of the region.

1 minute ago, DavisH said:

Now, you can buy the new capriva form 499K baht. A 500K discount. Any takers????? Big discounts on their trucks too. 

 

Hasn't been mentioned on their website yet though.

2 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

The article mentions nothing about establishing retail dealerships.

 

Are your eyes painted on ?

I don't have time to do the research for you. Pretty obvious that Great Wall is going to be using Thailand as a base for it's expansion into SE Asia/Australia/NZ. I don't know what else to tell you. This topic is done now.

I would also recommend being patient and waiting - over the coming months we'll probably be hearing lots of news, mentioning in detail what Great Wall plans to do. As far as most people are concerned, it's pretty obvious what the outcome will be. GM is leaving, with only a few niche vehicles to be sold here in the future. Servicing and spare parts will be offered for some years, but not sure yet through whom. In South Africa, Isuzu is taking care of that. Perhaps in Thailand's case, it will be the same.

As for Great Wall, they want to enter the market and will basically pick up where GM left off. Their strategy is different - they are expanding their operations, while GM is contracting. Pretty easy to fill in the gaps.

6 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

Yeah no <deleted> they have confirmed they are buying  the assembly and engine plants...

 

Please link the  news and press releases where GW has confirm they will open and operate retail dealerships in Thailand.

Gosh. You take everything too literally and have no ability to research or even use your imagination or common sense. Show me one car manufacturer that ONLY agrees to buy a manufacturing plant but not sell their vehicles. I think even if not mentioned directly, it's implied they will open showrooms. And since I've read that GM has a major strategy to use Thailand as their base for expanding into SE Asia and Australia, it's quite clear they will open dealerships too, it's just obvious.

http://www.xinhuanet.com/english/2020-02/17/c_138791453.htm

This article clearly mentions their strategy.

50 minutes ago, scorecard said:

Well that's easy to say but it's always possible ignorant people (ignorant of the actual relationship) will say things.

 

I know from 2 real experiences:

 

1. My own Thai son (I am his legal father, his biological mother is 100% Thai), his facial appearance is quite Thai and several times over many years people made ignorant even insulting comments about me being a pedophile. 

 

When this happened, I spoke to them in Thai (where the comment had come from a Thai person) and showed my passport pic on my phone and his passport pic on my phone, highlighting that we have the same family name. 

 

On most occasions we quickly got lots of apologies, then the loudmouth quickly disappeared.

 

2. Today I often take 1 or all of my 3 Thai granddaughters to school, many times comments same as above, but often with a further comment about my wife being a prostitute. Show the passport pics, highlight the same family name, and again a quick apology and they flee.

 

 

 

That's disgusting. Who are these ignorant and horrible people?

I'm fluent in Thai and this has never happened to me. Most Thais just comment on how cute my children are (they're still very small).

I am not in denial about some of the realities of this country, but I think the prostitute stereotype has started to disappear over the years - though with that being said - it might depend on the "look" of the woman. My wife is Chinese-Thai. If yours is short and dark-skinned, Thais may be more likely to judge. I'm not sure, but this is my hunch. Thais don't generally stereotype Chinese-Thais as prostitutes - it's always the dark-skinned Isarn types.

1 hour ago, couchpotato said:

Not really much help for the OP who is inquiring about flying to Europe, not crossing into Myanmar!!

I'm asking for someone I know. Not everyone is interested in the procedures for flying - what about if you're crossing a land border? I ask because this is something that is almost never talked about.

7 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

They may build or they may not build.... I base by replies on fact not speculation.

They WILL build. GW have confirmed they are purchasing the plant. You are speculating now. I'm basing my replies here on what I've read in the news and press releases.

14 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

But it is the <deleted> excuse they fed to the media.

I've read about 10 different articles on this story - from media in the USA, Thailand, Australia, New Zealand and Singapore. All of them take different angles on the story but it becomes clear if you do a bit of background research, it's about consolidating their operations to a few select markets. They have decided to get out of mass RHD production, but have previously exited most LHD markets outside of North America, China and South Korea too.

The last remaining sizeable RHD markets are Australia, New Zealand and Thailand, of which Thailand is the only one with manufacturing facilities serving all three markets. That's what the story is - very easy to understand.

In short - GM is becoming a smaller, more regionally focused company as opposed to a global one like say Toyota or Mitsubishi. And BTW plant closures and openings, streamlining of operations happen all the time. A couple of years ago, Mitsubishi decided to close it's American manufacturing plants, but thanks to low import tariffs they haven't stopped selling their vehicles there, just that they are now all fully imported. I am not sure what the market share of Mitsubishi is in the North American market, but it's possible that if it were to go down to a small enough level, they may decide to exit that market altogether. Personally I doubt it though, because the market there is so big, even if they only make up a relatively small percentage of sales, it can still be profitable for them.

3 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

Why would an assembly plant have sales, Marketing and service staff ?

Gosh do you have comprehension problems? Don't you think that Great Wall will also build showrooms and dealerships as well? They aren't just coming to build cars at an assembly plant. They're also going to be selling and servicing their cars here as well as abroad. For that they need a full range of different employees according to the tasks they are assigned to do. I am quite certain many, probably most of the existing Thai workforce at GM will be re-employed by GW, if they wish to do so (almost certainly if given the opportunity, they will say yes).

1 minute ago, Don Mega said:

Which is a point that GM are not answering.... They claim to have axed all RHD vehicles and Development.... does that include the RHD corvette ?

I read they will be producing the RHD Corvette in small volumes directly from the plant in Kentucky. I am not aware of them already doing so - I think the plan is to start soon.

The point is that they have never exported large volumes of North American made vehicles to countries outside of the region - by exiting RHD markets, they are exiting mass RHD production because the strategy was to sell vehicles built locally (such as Thai manufactured trucks and SUVs that were sold in Thailand, SE Asia and Australia/NZ but not North America). The "niche" market of RHD Corvettes may amount to like a couple of thousand units per year out of a total of many millions manufactured across the board in China, North America and South Korea. Such a small volume, hence why it's called "niche".

2 minutes ago, Don Mega said:

I doubt there would be too many Salesman or Mechanics working at the assembly plant Thai or Chinese.

I also doubt there will be many (or even any) Chinese assembly workers at the manufacturing plant either aside from managers. You have to look at the entire operations here - from manufacturing to sales, marketing and servicing. GW will simply be changing the guard from American managers to Chinese managers, but the majority of the rest of the workforce will continue to be Thai.

4 hours ago, Don Mega said:

 Izuzu and GM split a few years ago, the Colorado is not a D-Max.

 

GM have killed RHD production not LHD, Colorado is built in 2 US plants (Missouri and Louisiana).

GM have decided to stop mass production of RHD vehicles by pulling their manufacturing out of all remaining RHD markets (such as India, South Africa and now Thailand), but according to what I've read, small volumes of factory produced RHD "niche" vehicles will still be produced for markets such as Australia, New Zealand and probably Thailand. I believe this will only apply to the Corvette though - all other models will only be produced in LHD format, with Australia's HSV converting them to RHD locally. Japan allows LHD vehicles so Chevy are currently selling two LHD models there without conversion, but I suspect that once they start producing RHD Corvettes, that model will also be imported into Japan in RHD format.

I remember a few years ago before the Ford Mustang was offered in RHD, only select car importers offered them here in Thailand and they were all LHD. Now they are offered through Ford dealerships and are in RHD. Even so, they are somewhat of a "niche" vehicle with relatively low sales volumes. Ford decided to pull out of most car manufacturing worldwide a couple of years ago, leaving just 2 models in North America plus the Mustang, the rest being SUVs and pickup trucks.

By the way, GM has also exited many LHD markets since 2013 too - including Vietnam, Russia and most of Europe. Due to strict emissions standards, certain models can't be sold in Europe anymore. So it's not so much about ending RHD production as it is about consolidating their operations to become more streamlined, focusing on only a couple of main markets where they can make the highest returns. These are 1) North America 2) China and 3) South Korea.

17 hours ago, Don Mega said:

They are converted in AUS by HSV, along with the Camaro and Dodge Ram.....

 

Will  HSV convert the Vette... only time will tell but if they do it will make it a $200k+ vehicle and GM will sell very few.

I know. What I meant was - they will be built in LHD format at the factory in America and then converted to RHD in Australia by HSV. I didn't get into the details like you just did, but that's exactly what they have been doing so far and will continue to do once Holden disappears from Australian shores. A Malaysian firm is doing the same in Malaysia - importing LHD full-size pickups and converting them to RHD locally to meet local requirements.

By contrast, Thailand has no requirement to convert a LHD to a RHD, but I suspect the only Chevy we're going to be seeing here in the future will be the factory built RHD Corvette, which will compete alongside Ford's Mustang. I understand (according to the Aus media) Corvettes will also be imported into Australia in factory built RHD format. Only the other models (Silverado, Camaro, Dodge Ram etc.) will be converted locally.

2 hours ago, Don Mega said:

Existing experienced staff will need to be trained to the new processes.

 

By law GM will have to lat them off and pay redundancies... it will be up to GW if they decide to re-employ.... Maybe they will do a deal with the Thai gumbyment and fill the place with Chinese workers.

LOL. Chinese managers will come in (that's to be expected), but we certainly won't be seeing Chinese salesmen or mechanics. We're talking Thailand here, not Cambodia or Laos where that could actually happen.

18 hours ago, djayz said:

Maybe the Chinese know that most (all?) companies in Thailand have way too many employees on the payrole. 

I'm pretty sure the staff who are not chucked out will learn what it means to really "work" under the watchful eye of their omnipresent Sino-cousins.

 

Yes but I'm pretty sure it's the same thing in China. They certainly tend to employ more people than is necessary. Now depending on what GW's strategy is, they may end up axing a few positions. Keep in mind that GM being an American company probably didn't employ "too many" people either - if it had been a Thai manufacturer/employer, there would probably have been like 5000 employees rather than just 1500.

11 hours ago, tropo said:

They do complain about noise if the noise source is a foreigner. They only don't complain about noise if there's nothing they can do about it, but that doesn't mean they like it. If you want to test my theory, go and live in a quiet village and start making noise.  

I don't think that's necessarily true. Some years ago I had a party at an apartment I lived in towards the outskirts of Bangkok. I had some Thai friends over who made lots of noise. The neighbors (who I had never met or even seen before and couldn't have known I was a foreigner) complained twice. Granted it wasn't me making the noise, but as the host I would be held accountable. Now you have to put things into perspective - I can't imagine a Thai would tolerate lots of loud shouting and music at 3am going on from the house or apartment next door, especially if it's not something that normally happens.

In very poor rural areas, usually small villages, particularly those located near the borders with neighboring countries, it's common to have loudspeakers blurting out propaganda (although it's not nearly as bad as in countries like Vietnam and Laos), Maw-lam music etc. during the day, but it's extremely quiet at night. However, the loudspeakers often come on quite early, like 6am, so sleeping in becomes difficult.

By contrast, upper middle class moo baans in larger cities around the country, as well as people who live on large tracts of land in upcountry areas usually live in quiet surroundings and face relatively little noise pollution. Except occasionally when someone pulls out the old angle grinder, but from my own experience living in a moo baan for many years now, most of the time it's quiet, especially at night. We only have one set of neighbors who like to spend time sitting around with their buddies outdoors, mostly on weekends and public holidays. They put on some music, or some radio or TV program (never know what it is) it sounds like a documentary, then sit around and chat all day from morning till early evening. The music level is not too loud and can only be heard if you're outside and they always turn it off by 8 or 9pm at the latest (and it's only on occasionally anyway). In very rare cases, it might last until 10 but again, it's not audible when we're indoors. A few years ago these same neighbors had a rooster, which was annoying but I think a number of complaints led to that rooster "disappearing".

Another set of neighbors on the other side of our property had 5 dogs who were making a lot of noise at times. Was definitely  annoying, especially at the beginning because they were always outside. They started settling down after a few weeks though and then just became a minor nuisance. One of their dogs started going into everyone's garden to steal shoes - to this day one of my shoes can't be found. We told the neighbor about this who said he would try and find said missing shoe (we weren't the only ones who encountered this) but he never did (or maybe he tried but the shoe never turned up). 2 weeks later this family, who was very messy moved out, without paying their rent. We suspected from the outset that they wouldn't last more than 2 years living there. We were right - they were our neighbors for maybe 1.5 years. Even though I was a bit suspicious about all the upgrades they made to the house (probably without the permission of the owner) including concreting part of the backyard and erecting a fence to keep in the dogs, and painting the front wall, it turns out they were simply renters who acted as though they owned the place.

From the outset I knew I wouldn't really like those neighbors (just from their appearance I guess) and the only time we ever spoke was after 1.5 years, 2 weeks before they would leave for good, because of the missing shoe incident.

That being said, I've had much worse and more selfish neighbors than these people, when living back home in the west. While I can't stand noisy, barking dogs, I tend not to blame the owners too much because it's not like dogs can control their behavior like we humans can. I have much less tolerance for inconsiderate people who ride around on modified scooters and motorcycles with noisy exhausts, like to have parties late at night and turn on music at full volume.

On 2/17/2020 at 3:12 PM, tropo said:

If I'd had a reliable crystal ball, many years ago before I "expated" away from Australia, I wouldn't have come to Thailand, but life is not like that. We learn as we go... Australia is one of the few counties, if not the only country, where you can dial in your climate, from temperate regions that have snow to full tropical climates like Thailand, and every climate in between. You could literally ski and scuba dive in 30C waters on the same day. The best areas are around 25 - 30 degrees south IMO.

Australia is a fine country but it's not what it used to be. The reasons for becoming an expat and moving to countries like Thailand are complex, it's difficult to sum up in a few words. I think if globalization didn't cause much of Australia's manufacturing capacity to be lost to developing nations and if the standard of living were still like back in the 60s and 70s when everyone could afford a house and university education was free, the cost of living was relatively low and with plenty of jobs to go around, there would have been no reason to leave the country.

Thailand, despite being a developing country all along has also "grown up" becoming more expensive, more polluted and somewhat more crime ridden than in the past. That being said, it's important to put things into perspective. Australia has become an expensive nanny state, finding work isn't as easy as it used to be and even if you get a good job, affording the mortgage, car payments and everything else means you have relatively little left over to put aside. Eating out is considered a luxury that relatively few Aussies can afford to do on a regular basis.

It would be awesome to become a farmer living in tropical north Queensland but it's probably a pipe dream for most. Cyclones, droughts, bush fires, floods and land being sold off to greedy foreign corporations has become a reality you have to cope with. Local retailers like Coles and Woolworths prefer to buy cheaper imported produce. Elsewhere in the country, it's becoming almost impossible to live off the land - just look at the recent fires and before that, the endless droughts. Australia could be self-sufficient if it wanted to be but globalization ensures it won't be and that's not even taking into account the harsh climatic conditions in many parts of the country. 

12 hours ago, Nkpjed said:

This is Thailand's future.  Groups of young Thai males, uneducated, worshipped since they could walk giving them the impression they are entitled, jobless, looking for any excuse to gang up on someone innocent or not.  This country in 20 years will be a nightmare.

I'm not as pessimistic as you are, but you're missing a few details here. Apparently as many as 3 million Thais (mostly unemployed or underemployed young men, as well as long-distance truck drivers) are addicted to yaba. It's a national epidemic and that's behind a large part of the violence you sometimes see going on here. Broken homes contribute to this as well, but merely being brought up without a father doesn't cause this kind of violence on it's own. It's usually a combination of factors, especially yaba, which causes extreme aggression. Now these youths could get jobs if they wanted to - but most are too lazy. Otherwise there wouldn't be 3-4 million Cambodian, Burmese and Lao laborers working in a country of only 69 million.

In 20 years time there won't be large groups of youths around anymore since Thailand has a very low fertility rate, which will undoubtedly decline further. It's down to around 1.5 now and in 20 years time the median age of Thais will be like 45.

20 hours ago, Emdog said:

Maybe TAT can use this in a promotion: Thai gangs of cowards don't only beat farangs! Be treated like a Thai. Rejoice!

Granted, the vast, vast majority of such cowardly attacks are Thai on Thai (or may even involve some of the estimated 3-4 million migrant workers from neighboring Laos, Cambodia and Myanmar) and rarely involve farang. While I am appalled at attacks like the one in Hua Hin, given the attention granted to it by the media, I suspect that such attacks are quite rare. Now don't get me wrong, they do happen from time to time, but hardly often enough to make it appear there is an epidemic of Thais lunging at farang going out for drinks at a bar. Usually when something like this happens, it's because the farang started acting like a jerk or started pushing around other patrons when he got drunk. A well-behaved farang who minds his own business is extremely unlikely to get hurt. He's more likely to encounter problems with gangs if he ends up in the wrong neighborhood back home in Australia, the USA or the UK without even antagonizing anyone. Just being there can get you beat up in such places. I remember one time parking my car a couple of streets behind Thaitown in Los Angeles a few years ago. Was about to get out of the car and some unfriendly looking Mexican guys were staring at us. Felt very uncomfortable so decided to park the car elsewhere. No one acts thuggish like that towards strangers in Thailand for no reason.

13 hours ago, hmficc said:

 

Completely untrue 

Actually, that's exactly the way it is in America - I think you're in deep denial or don't know what you're talking about. I felt uncomfortable constantly hearing "black" and "white" being used to label people when I lived in America. In Australia, people tend to use terms more appropriate to where they are from. Someone from Europe might be labeled a "Euro" or "<deleted>" from southern Europe (this is nowadays considered a little discriminatory but only more recently) - the police simply say "we're looking for a suspect of Caucasian or European appearance". In America "we're looking for a white (or black) guy".

In any case, Americans are absolutely obsessed with race. The fact they ask what your race is on every government form absolutely shocked me and made me feel very uncomfortable. In Australia, they generally only ask whether you are "Aboriginal or Torres Strait islander" or your cultural background (they give you a list of countries) on the census form. Never do they ask you to list yourself as "black" or "white" or "Pacific Islander/Asian" like in America.

23 hours ago, baansgr said:

More job loses....oh dear....will Ford be next?

I can imagine most, if not all current Chevy employees will be re-employed by Great Wall. Unlike in Australia's case, where they won't be able to find a new role in the industry.

Ford, no. Ford are doing much better than GM and their Ford Ranger is now Thailand's 3rd most popular pickup. Actually in some recent years I think it was even second. It's pickup based SUV, the Everest, is also quite popular. Both are way more popular than their Chevy counterparts.

3 hours ago, transam said:

Don't think a truck will change Fords status on the world stage any time soon....????

Ford has a good reputation but decided about a year or two ago, to pretty much get out of car production, leaving just 2 car models in North America, with the rest being SUVs and pickup trucks.

The Ford Ranger is certainly a good vehicle and very popular all across the region.