Pi Sek

^^

BANGKOK: -- A vocational student was arrested early Tuesday morning on charges of murder and illegal possession of firearms for allegedly shooting to death a rival student following a brawl near Rama IX road intersection over the weekend.

The list should include pregnancy and menstruation.

There is not the slightest contraindication to massage during menstruation. why on earth would there be?

Massage is also OK during pregnancy as long as it does not involve abdominal massage.

That's very dangerous advice. Are you qualified to give it?

(Someone who I know is qualified would say that you are giving potentially fatal advice. That person would say that massaging the lower leg areas during pregnancy can invoke labour.)

If the government made corn, bad grammar or flip flops illegal the crime stats would go up. Decriminalizing kratom or cannabis results in less crime not only because people are no longer being arrested for things that shouldn't have been illegal anyway.

Violent crime in Colorado has decreased , so have OD deaths from legal prescription narcotics.

There are good reasons murder, theft, rape and assault are illegal. There are no good reasons cannabis is illegal and Colorado and Washington state are the proof.

Cannabis was prohibited in the U.S. In the 30's for racist reasons and bribes and pressure from companies who profited big by its prohibition.

And Thailand has to content with not only drunk driving, but driving while high on drugs?

Erm... they already are. Often on meth, too, which is one of those drugs they're saying should stay classified as is.

Wife just told me that the Co-op that was targeted in Suratthani was owned by Suthep so I can see the link there...but why Central?

A lot of Thais on social media are blaming this one on Red Shirts/Thaksin.

By their logic:

- car was falsely registered in Chonburi, parts of which are a UDD stronghold.

- car originated in Yala. Bomb part suppliers to the Nonthaburi UDD bomber who blew himself up were from Yala.

- April 10, 5 years ago... the day that the RTA responded to a UDD attack on their 1st Army Barracks with the clearance operation at Khok Wua intersection, where the Black Shirts first showed up and 25+ got killed.

- The warehouse in Surat belonged to Suthep.

- Central Festival represents the elite.

- As the bomb was planted underground in the parking lot, it was not meant to cause death as much as to send a message of discontent. This supports the argument that the bomb was not planted by Islamist insurgents.

In a way I hope they are right... we don't want the Islamist insurgency involved in tourist areas. Red Shirts on the other hand, well, their record of blowing up things where they don't live is well documented.

Still, though, could be anything, including a false flag operation.

Why would the red shirts go all the way to Samui? They could put such a device in any city car park they could, why not Patong/Pattaya, Hua Hin, Chiang Mai or any other major tourist location ?

Makes no sense to detonate/plant this in Samui. This is another convenient way to justify article 44, the same thing happened after thenBangkok incident incident after trying to justify Martial Law remaining.

There is a strong resentment towards the Junta after the army admitted error in killing the 4 guys in the south, tensions and resentment are running high.

Keep an open mind, people sometimes they only see what they want to see, and literally the red mist descends and clouds their thoughts!!

Samui seems quite a natural target for the Red Shirts to me. Suthep said he'd retire there, his son is supposedly investing in large swathes of coconut land in the middle of the island, and in PAD's heyday there were large rallies there with speakers asking gas station attendants not to sell fuel to vehicles with Udon Thani number plates. And besides, Phuket had the highest concentration of Peua Thai voters in the South (30%, significantly higher than any other province), Chiang Mai and Pattaya are full of Red Shirts and businesses that support them, Hua Hin could be seen as an attack on the monarchy (there is only a small minority of UDD members who are anti-monarchy).

Still, you're right - we should keep an open mind. It could be the UDD (as I will openly say I suspect), it could be the army justifying martial Law/article 44, it could even be the PDRC. But I think blaming on the Deep South insurgency before any facts come out (as the BBC did) is premature and irresponsible, especially given that this bomb wasn't intended to cause loss of life (as is the insurgents' MO).

Simple to fix problem If they own the land with legal title offer two choices on live in peace in Thailand or sell your land back to Thai government at fair market value and go to Malaysia who will welcome you with open arms. But if you choose the sell and leave option you can't return to Thailand for 20 years, if you return automatic 20 years in club Thailand hard labor. The others who don't own land offer stay in peace or 10,000 baht to start new life in Maylaysia with same terms for return as land sellers. Cause trouble and locked up for natural life. If they can't be civilized then breed it out of them.

And you call yourself civilized with half-baked uninformed comments like this?

These people feel that their country was unfairly taken away from them by Britain and Siam as part of a land deal over 100 years ago. Why should they have to sell or move? Treat them as human beings, respect and encourage their cultural identity, give them the same consideration as people elsewhere in Thailand, and most of all get rid of the thugs in the Thai army who think know that they are above the law and you have a chance of solving the problem.

Do you mean the thugs who are shooting teachers and many others dead in cold blood ?. How is that the fault of the Army ?. How many do you think would be dead if the Army was not there ?. Buddhists would have been driven out in fear of their lives long ago.

One thing I have learned is that you cannot trust much that the Muslim's say. One set justify murder by quoting the Karan, another set say the first ones interpreted it too literally and yet another say it doesn't matter what the Karan says : Allah knows the intention in his heart. This pick-and-choose hypocrisy basically allows them to do anything and claim some justification.

Maybe you think the Thai authorities should pull out and let them rule themselves ?. Then maybe we can get a few women stoned to death and people given 100 lashes by their sharia laws.

This religion needs to get out of the 15th century. At the end of the day, this is Thailand. Maybe 100 years ago it wasn't and maybe 1,000 years ago it was something else again. It doesn't matter. Every one of them now was born in Thailand and didn't have anything taken from them. If they want to go back to Malaysia and live is a Muslim country, Thailand should help them do it. At the end of a barrel for some.

"Shooting teachers and many others dead in cold blood", as you put it, is deplorable regardless of the situation, but you must understand that they have been doing this in response to atrocities committed against them; atrocities which, as this article rightly points out, have gone un-investigated or simply ignored. I can see that you consider Islam to be evil, but actually this isn't an issue of religion - it's an issue of the local population, who feel no affinity with their official nation but have historically reluctantly submitted to their governance, being consistently harshly treated by their government - in that, there are perhaps stronger ties to medieval times with Scotland. It's not quite historically correct, but the movie Braveheart probably strikes a cord with the Thai-Malays in the Deep South. They know they can't kill their way to independence or whatever, but they see an ongoing fight for recognition to be more equal human beings than they are currently being afforded... and over time, they might even be able to trade their violence against the State for negotiations for more autonomy. It seems fair enough in principal to me... if they weren't cutting people's heads off.

The separatist movement has been around a long time - the violent insurgency has only been around for the last decade or so, and its levels of severity have been directly correlated to the spikes in military & paramilitary "enforced pacification" operations. So, you see, "at the end of a barrel for some" is a proven way to increase the violence problem, not resolve it.

and the fact that her other daughter is a red shirt terrorist that has been caught out trying to plant bombs means nothing hey. The only ones trying to stir the pot are the ones that dont want the real truth to emerge, last thing they want is for the red terrorists to be shown to have been a major cause and possibly the ones doing much of the shooting. Easier to blame everyone else, seems they were quite happy when the ptp were running the investigation as they were trying to pin all the blame on the pm and let all the reds off but now the truth is going to come out they are all sh*tting themselves

I wasn't aware that the bomber was Phayao Akhahad's daughter?

I was under the impression that the bomber was merely one of two key witnesses in Kamolkade Akhahad's murder... not a relative. I may be mistaken, but don't think so... you have a link?

Hang on a minute... when Methee was arrested driving around in his car in Bangkok with Tavors and M16s which he had "confiscated" from troops on 10 April, he folded and gave a statement that it was Natthawut who had given the orders to instigate violence.

Of course Natthawut denied this, and Jatuporn denied Methee's claims that Jatuporn had him threatened in attempt to get him to change his story... but how can anyone with as much incriminating evidence against them as Natthawut (above is one piece of many, and this one didn't even come from his own mouth) POSSIBLY demand any role into investigations in which they are the accused? Madness!

But, I suppose, in a world where those who question the "official 9/11 story" (which, as it happens, is physically impossible) are labelled by the US government as "terror risks", and GW Bush was allowed to give a statement in the "investigation" in secret, not under oath and behind closed doors... madness is the direction in which the world seems to be going.

So on every occasion a protester was killed it was due to the "Men in Black" firing at the army.? Even if that was the case and it isn't why were innocent protesters shot and killed?

I'm sure there is huge conspiracies and many people were used and mislead , but at the end of the day the Army killed 90 people

Whilst Abhisit's defence will likely acquit him personally of any wrongdoing, it might incriminate some members of the army as I don't think all protesters who were shot were armed.

But to say that "the army killed 90 people" is a lie. Stop it.

Lee Kuan Yew and the Singapore model was indeed Thaksin's role model for nation building when the ex-PM was in office before the 2006 coup. Lee criticised leaders around the world, including many Thai elite, for mishandling their countries, but he praised Thaksin for visionary leadership and economic management. Lee has run Singapore like his company and hence the world knows the country as 'Singapore Inc", so did Thaksin who tried to make the Kingdom "Thailand Inc".

Nah...

Lee Kuan Yew had the vision and leadership to build a country/nation

Thaksin's vision was to fill his pockets and those of his cohorts with a nations wealth.

Lee Kuan Yew and the Singapore model was indeed Thaksin's role model

an ever bigger Nah....

Ferdinand Marcos and the Philippine model was INDEED Thaksin's role model

The problem you have with is that under Thaksin Thailand had its most sustained period of economic growth ever. You can repeat the cliches but Thaksin more than anybody took this country from a pretty broken place post 1997/98 to a nation where, in 2006 the north had seen average incomes grow 250%. He was flawed for sure, but he was no more corrupt than any previous administration and far less than most, and arguably the best premier since 1932 (the bar is very low of course). Thailand in 2000 and Thailand in 2013 were radically different - and for much of the population, much, much better - places. You can thank Thaksin for much of that.

I know that goes against the right wing memes you're reciting, but it's hard to sidestep the reality of what he did for Thailand.

Oh really. Do you have any idea of Thaksin's activities around said 1997 financial crisis?

Here's a few hints... Deputy Prime Minister... Carlyle Group... "international currency speculation"...

But it's OK, the IMF came and bailed out Thailand and Thaksin paid back the loan from his own pocket.

And after Thaksin resigned as Palang Dharma's party leader (not because he lost an election, because Thaksin never loses elections), he stated the reason that the party didn't succeed was basically because they wer enot dirty enough. That would explain why he's kind-of gone the other direction since then.

Anyone who believes that only the red shirts have/had/have access to Tavors need to be reminded that the popcorn gunman from last year was using one, last time I checked, he was NOT a member of any red shirt group.

what's the update on his trial by the way? last I read it was postponed?

But the Red Shirts did have access tgo tavors... some were confiscated on April 10/. Methee was caught with one the next week.

Yes I know they had access to them, but so did the PDRC security last year which kind of makes it irrelevant by associating the Tavors to just the red shirts.

Yes, OK, didn't read "only"... was pretty drunk last night. I'm allowed on Sundays.

Anyone who believes that only the red shirts have/had/have access to Tavors need to be reminded that the popcorn gunman from last year was using one, last time I checked, he was NOT a member of any red shirt group.

what's the update on his trial by the way? last I read it was postponed?

But the Red Shirts did have access tgo tavors... some were confiscated on April 10/. Methee was caught with one the next week.

Abhisit did agree to go to the polls and that offer was accepted only to be rejected in a reversal the next day, tell us who may have been responsible for that change of mind.

Suthep, he made it very clear that he would rather see the reds bloodied and punished and compromise would never have been accepted.

Abhisit may have been Prime Minister but Suthep was still the real power.

Are you seriously suggesting that the Jatuporn, Veera & Natthawut changed their minds on Abhisit's offer because Suthep told them to, or are you suggesting they didn't accept the PM's offer because the Deputy PM held more power than him?

No the argument between the "reds" and the government was they wanted the government to resign immediately, the government was giving a date in the future (still room to negotiate). The government could have resigned immediately (caretaker government situation) - which would require the EC to set an election date. The offer to resign was withdrawn -- after Suthep made it very clear he was against any such compromise.

That's not quite accurate though is it. They were offered an early election, they accepted it, then they rejected it after someone got an "important call". Robby NZ's question was: who made that call? I don't think it was Suthep.

The government at the time said they had until May 5 to accept the early election - a "yes" or "no" answer. Abhisit's critics said at the time he was being too neutral, so I think the ultimatum was justified, particularly in the face of so many deaths at that point. They tried to counter this with a "yes with conditions" which, to be frank, were unreasonable (at least in my opinion).

They were asking Suthep to resign and take responsibility for the 10 April deaths... which were part of an operation to clear the protest site in the wake of Kwanchai's 200-strong Red Shirt force attacking the 1st Army Barracks at Saphan Fah Luang, and we all know how that turned out... someone decided to fire an M79 grenade at the army and all hell broke loose. The only bit that's not clear is who shot all the protesters - personally I don't think they were all down to the army, and that certain terrorist elements in the Red Shirt side decided it would be a good idea to further their cause by creating some martyrs. I've come to this conclusion because I have seen footage of front line Red Shirt aggressors on 10 April panicking and asking each other whose side Seh Daeng's troops were on. What we do know is that a prominent actor-turned-Red Shirt got picked up a week or so later with a load of weapons "confiscated" from the army, and named Natthawut as the principal organiser of violence, although the Red leaders were quick to point out he wasn't a real Red Shirt. (Maybe they should have claimed he was tortured instead.)

Suthep's since been charged and he has his defence ready, just like Abhisit, and he's willing to answer the charges instead of running away like real elites such as Thaksin, the Redbull heir and Chuan's corrupt brother.

If it weren't for all the coups Thailand would already be a proper, modern functioning democracy. Thailand is undergoing a process of change, its democracy has been far from perfect but is slowly improving (when given the chance). Indonesia started the same journey at the same time as Thailand's latest efforts towards freedom - after the Asian financial crises in the late 90's. The difference between the 2 countries now is that in Indonesia the people have managed to keep the military out of politics, in Thailand the military have not been put back in their box and have conducted 2 successful coups since the financial crises - stunting Thai democracy yet again. The choice Thailand faces is to keep moving forward on the path towards democracy, slowly perfecting the system step by step or return to the undemocratic and unjust past. The hurdle Thailand faces and cannot yet get over is for the losers of an election to accept defeat, to accept the will of the people and take their seats on the opposition benches and try to earn more votes next time around through hard work and policy development. Thailand needs to experience the peaceful transition of power after a succession of elections. Thaksin can only come to power via votes which means Thaksin can be removed from power by votes without destroying the system - not so the military, they come in via guns and destroying the system and cannot be removed by the people without bloodshed.

Thanks for the intelligent post, at least until the beligerent bit attempting ridicule (fascist trait, by the way) at the end. Didn't answer my questions directly, but it did confirm that you don't actually know what a democracy is, because a "proper, modern functioning democracy" as you put it is not a democracy. The closest thing we have to democracy in the world is Switzerland, which is officially a police state.

USA hasn't had any coups for a while, and it is absolutely not democratic; same with the UK - it's for this reason we see people like Russell Brand, with no solutions, represent the will of the people more than the government. I suppose you'd like the world to go down that avenue?

I reckon the current Junta is more democratic than any government we have seen since 2001 - that means TRT, the 2006-7 Junta, PPP, the Democrats and PTP, because they are demonstrating less autocratic traits than any of the above. It seems to me you are actually anti-democracy, because you are pro-autocracy. If that's not the case, I'd love to hear your thoughts... but I very much doubt we will agree.

I probably don't understand, because I must be part of the "elite" if I can afford $120k toilet paper. Luckily for me, this toilet paper was funded by the state. Also luckily for me, I have two other expensive pieces of toilet paper, although they're not the arty versions. I suppose you have scientific toilet paper?

Pro Junta = pro torture

Pro Junta = anti democracy

Pro Junta = anti freedom of speech

Pro Junta = anti freedom of association

Pro Junta = pro corruption

Pro Junta = anti fair and just judiciary

On every count, pro Junta is just plain bad

This may be the case in the "real world" or wherever else you're from, but your post to me does not take into consideration that "TiT".

Here pro Junta means...

- pro torture you're not happy with the state of human rights under Thailand's false "democracy"

- anti democracy you're not happy with seeing democratic ideals raped by an autocratic government, despite that party being "democratically elected"

- anti freedom of speech you're not happy with the way that freedom of speech has been usurped and warped into a license to spread false rumours under Thailand's false democracy

- pro corruption you're not happy with elected governments seem to try and outdo each others' corruption records

- anti fair and just judiciary you're not happy with the way the judiciary branch is manipulated by the administrative and (to a lesser extent, but Peua Thai were trying to change that) executive branches

At least to me it does, and I doubt I'm alone in that. Democracy here has never existed, everyone in the know on both sides seem to agree on that. I'd rather have a Junta than a demagogic system where right wing fascism is misrepresented as "Democracy". At least there's no pretending.

PTP are right wing fascists?

Wrong and wrong.

If anything PTP are left wing socialists.

I doubt you understand what democracy means, if you did you wouldn't post such nonsense.

Yes, you read it right... Peua Thai are right wing fascists. But then, so is every other group in the Thai political playground to a degree, including those who feel the need to pull out belittling personal comments like you tried to do just then.

...edit to add... I intentionally didn't mention Peua Thai above - that was you. But all of Thailand's elected governments have been corrupt, warped democratic ideals, stifled free speech... including the last Democrat-led coalition after it was democratically elected (more evidence that we're not in a democracy - we're in a constitutional monarchy) - in 2008.

I can give hundreds of examples of Peua Thai's right wing fascism, and I suspect that if you took off your Peua Thai football shirt you may be able to too. I can also give hundreds of examples from the various other recent governments.

I think I understand democracy quite well, at least to the Bachelor of Arts level. In the "Thai" scheme of things, I can be quite concise: an autocracy, democratically elected or otherwise, is not a democracy... do you disagree? Would you disagree that all governments in Thailand's history have been autocratic? Do you think that constitutional monarchies like the UK or Thailand, or constitutional republics like the US (and, I suspect what some see as the future of "Lanna Nation") are democracies? If the answer to either of these is yes, then I'm afraid you may have to look up democracy for yourself.

Well when the so called peaceful protesters are storming hospitals, rigging up oil trucks to explode, making fortified positions, and having their leaders openly say they'll burn the country down if they're challenged it would be incredibly negligent of a PM not to make steps to disperse the protest by any means necessary.

And the army had to battle back with guns only because the red camps had armed militants who had previously fired at soldiers in their camps. Anybody who doesn't get what was happening should check this video for a small overview

No matter who is right and who is wrong the army should never be firing live rounds at their own people. Its not what a nations army is used for.

Sent from my c64

I respectfully disagree. There are numerous eventualities in every country where a nation's army has to act against its own citizens. 2010 was a fine example.

The real question here is: To what extent should suspects willing to injure or kill members of the public be protected by standard-rights normally given to suspects??

If torture was indeed used, it might have saved lives!!

These human rights wasters irritate me - as soon as they appear everyone seems to have been tortured. It must be their stock saying "deny everything and tell the media that you were tortured", it doesn't matter that you committed the crimes and weren't tortured just say it.

Thailand gets accused by the Americans of not being democratic and when they 'SUPPOSEDLY' copy their interrogation methods (I don't believe this torture thing) they get crucified!!! Just cannot win can they.

Pro Junta = pro torture

Pro Junta = anti democracy

Pro Junta = anti freedom of speech

Pro Junta = anti freedom of association

Pro Junta = pro corruption

Pro Junta = anti fair and just judiciary

On every count, pro Junta is just plain bad

This may be the case in the "real world" or wherever else you're from, but your post to me does not take into consideration that "TiT".

Here pro Junta means...

- pro torture you're not happy with the state of human rights under Thailand's false "democracy"

- anti democracy you're not happy with seeing democratic ideals raped by an autocratic government, despite that party being "democratically elected"

- anti freedom of speech you're not happy with the way that freedom of speech has been usurped and warped into a license to spread false rumours under Thailand's false democracy

- pro corruption you're not happy with elected governments seem to try and outdo each others' corruption records

- anti fair and just judiciary you're not happy with the way the judiciary branch is manipulated by the administrative and (to a lesser extent, but Peua Thai were trying to change that) executive branches

At least to me it does, and I doubt I'm alone in that. Democracy here has never existed, everyone in the know on both sides seem to agree on that. I'd rather have a Junta than a demagogic system where right wing fascism is misrepresented as "Democracy". At least there's no pretending.

OK, own up, who was it...