Oneman

.

Using a USB stick to transfer software is a fine idea.

I do exactly that when need to move files between friend's PC and my Mac .

But another method may be more convenient: use a download accelerator program.

Even with a slow or unreliable connection, the downloader will make maximum use of the bandwidth you do have.

And if your connection drops, the downloader will pick up again where it was dropped, without having to go back to the start.

The downloader I use is "DownThemAll", an add-on to Firefox.

It's free.

Very handy for anyone with a slow, Internet connection.

https://addons.mozilla.org/en-US/firefox/addon/201

- Oneman

Chiangmai

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I went to Salsa Kitchen's new restaurant tonight.

My first time at that restaurant -- I'd never eaten at the previous location.

I love Mexican food, so I really wish I could recommend it.

But I can't.

I won't be going back.

For the record, I've been a Mexican food aficionado for over 40 years.

I've eaten countless Mexican meals in Texas, Arizona, California, and New Mexico -- and from Mexican truck-kitchens everywhere in between.

Salsa Kitchen is not like any Mexican food I've ever tasted.

I'd describe it as hip-and-trendy food, not Mexican food.

Here's a report:

The air-con was set at a comfortable level.

The music was un-remarkable.

But the room is "bright," with nothing to soften the harsh sound environment.

You over-hear conversations at all the other tables nearby, whether you want to or not.

That doesn't make for a relaxing meal, but it is the hip-and-trendy style in restaurant design.

Slow service, even really slow service, doesn't bother me.

When I go out to eat in Thailand, I usually bring along reading material.

At Salsa Kitchen this evening, I got a lot of reading done.

During the wait for food, NO chips, NO salsa!

And it wasn't just me: I didn't see any baskets of chips anywhere.

I ordered the fish tacos platter.

On arrival, first thing to notice: NO beans, NO rice!

Mexican food without beans and rice: Is that legal?

Instead, the plate had a random pile of sliced cabbage, carrots, and tomatoes.

Veggies are much more hip-and-trendy than beans and rice.

My first taste test was the salsa.

It was spicy, but that was the only flavor I could pick out.

If the peppers were roasted, I could not tell.

If there was any cliantro or minced garlic or lime juice, I could not tell.

There simply wasn't much flavor to the salsa at Salsa Kitchen.

Next taste test was the taco sauce.

Or maybe that was supposed to be the salad dressing.

I'm not sure.

It was white and based on yogurt.

Does Mexico even have yogurt?

Sour cream I know, but yogurt I've never seen before with Mexican food.

However, yogurt certainly is more hip-and-trendy than sour cream.

I liked that yogurt sauce, though: a little sour, a little sweet, and smooth and creamy.

But it wasn't Mexican food.

The two tacos were made with soft, flour, tortillas.

The tortillas were fresh, most likely home-made, and lightly grilled, just right.

Those tortillas were the best element of the meal.

Except they were almost cold.

Not quite; on the verge of lukewarm would be more accurate.

But, even then, very nice tortillas.

A serving of those tortillas, thoroughly warm, with rice and beans, could be a tasty snack.

How to explain the fish tacos?

The Thais have three ways of describing food --

1. Delicious -- "ah-roy"

2. Not delicious -- "my-ah-roy"

3. Can eat -- "gin-die"

These fish tacos were, "can eat".

The fish was fine -- seemed fresh, but with little flavor, and the amount of fish was small.

The sauce was similar to the yogurt mentioned above.

The platter was big and very heavy, but the food portion was modest.

There's another indicator of hip-and-trendy: heavy plate, light on the food.

I can't complain about the bill: 154 baht for the food and a soft drink.

The service did not inspire me to leave any tip.

.

Here is another recommendation for Dr. Sudhee Sudasna.

I went to see him two weeks ago (first time) for a knee problem.

He said it can be sorted it out with physical therapy, not surgery.

I'm very pleased.

Doctor's visit: 500 baht.

Appointment with physical therapist: 100 baht.

No appointment needed -- just walk in.

Be aware that the clinic is only open a few hours each day, mostly evenings.

So call ahead to find what hours, on what days.

The receptionist speaks good English, and the staff is used to dealing with farangs, so no problem there.

The office is difficult to find, so here are some details.

Two main landmarks to get you in the neighborhood.

First, it is on the inner ring road, but the Thais call that, "suu-per," for super highway.

Second, it is across from Wat Jet Yawt, a well-known temple, located in the Northwest area of Chiagmai.

Across from Wat Jet Yawt is an Esso petrol station.

You want to get to that Esso station.

At the South side of the Esso station begins a long row of concrete shop houses.

Dr. Sudhee's clinic is approximately in the middle of that row.

However, his clinic -- and the sign -- is hidden behind a small, clump of trees.

So as you drive slowly South from the Esso station, look for the small clump of trees on the left side of the road; and you're there.

(If you reach the Hotel Grandview, you've gone too far.)

The other alternative, of course, is to call the clinic on your mobile phone, then hand your phone to your driver, and let the Thais figure out how to get you there.

Google Earth coordinates are shown below.

(On Google Earth you can just make out that clump of trees in front of the clinic.)

. . . 18°48'29.39"N - - - 98°58'24.14"E

because the silver market is so small here you will face a pretty big spread when buying and selling.

From my personal observations in Bangkok in recent years, the spread has been tiny: 300-400 baht per kilo.

However, as the silver market becomes more volatile, yes, we can expect the spread to grow.

.

Why not just take a bullion account with someone like the Perth mint ?? Kitco etc offer these products and theres less theft risk and strorage hassles..

There is recent discussion about whether or not Perth Mint and Kitco really have the silver behind their paper certificates and pool accounts.

To learn more about this delicate matter, I suggest a Google search for "Perth Mint" AND Kitco AND "Jason Hommel"

.

I'm interested in purchasing some silver bars or bullion here in Thailand as an investment.

I'm looking for similar "ngerntang", but nobody seems to have it. I walked all throughout Bangrak, from Silom all the way down to Si Phraya along Charoen Krung, and everyone I asked simply said "Mai mee", with no helpful suggestions on where I could buy it.

"No helpful suggestions" sounds exactly right from shop keepers in that area.

Silver bullion is available here.

I've bought with no problem.

But it is a wholesale item -- for jewelry manufacturers -- so unikely you will find it in a retail shop.

Especially not a retail shop in a tourist area.

I bought from a jewelry company near Bangkok.

Minimum: one kilo.

Roughly 15,000 at today's prices.

Had it assayed: results showed proper purity.

So I intend to buy more when I'm able to do so.

Some vendors charge sales tax, if you don't have a proper business license.

Some vendors quietly do not.

I can't explain why some do, some don't.

Foreign bars from known refiners, I've never found here.

But I have seen bars marked with names of local refineries.

That's helpful in Thailand, but if you tried to sell outside of the Kingdom, would a Thai bar be trusted and accepted?

I doubt it.

Likewise, silver bullion coins are very rare here.

Silver coins I've found at coin shops are sold for numismatic value, not bullion value.

That means high mark-ups.

Nevertheless, I did find a stack of Maple Leafs recently and bought all of them.

That means silver bullion coins do exist here, and, hopefully, you can find more.

Bottom line for silver bullion:

Difficult to find in Thailand, but possible.

If you are interested in discussing, contact me by PM or email.

We can trade information about silver in Thailand, and learn from each others' experiences.

But, in my opinion, best to be cautious when discussing this topic in public forums.

.

Update on safety boxes at The Montri Hotel.

I went in there today.

When asked about safety box rental, response from reception clerk was very UN-interested.

She did that head-turn-away motion that Chinese do when they don't want to bother with you.

But, yes, when I asked again, she admitted that, if available, can rent by the day at 50/70 baht per day.

When I asked about monthly rate, the reaction was even more negative.

Duty manager (I assume), who was listening nearby, came over, sternly said, "Rent by day only. No monthly rate."

Then he turned and walked away.

And that was the end of that.

For the tourist passing through, Montri offers secure storage for a few days.

But due to price and "attitude", it's not attractive for the long-term expat.

At least, not this expat.

Well, looks like this is a problem for which Chiangmai has no clear solution.

However, for a practical example in a nearby country, one need only look to Penang, Malaysia.

In a one shopping center, there is a shop offering rental space for personal safes.

(Shopping center: "Bukit Jambul Complex")

You buy your own safe, whatever size you wish.

Can buy one of theirs for sale, or buy elsewhere and bring in to their shop.

They have a security room -- not a vault, but a room surrounded by welded steel bars.

Looks somewhat like an old-style prison cell.

Plus, has alarm systems and security cameras.

For a modest monthly fee, you can keep whatever you wish in your safe.

The fee depends on the size of your safe.

The shop has neither key, nor combination, so only the customer has access.

What they are offering is protection against theft.

Protection against fire depends on customer's selection of safe.

Open during normal shopping hours at the mall.

Very convenient.

I talked with the owner.

He said mostly used by small jewelry shops and manufacturers -- whose premises are not very secure.

Said he would welcome any expats as customers.

But that was in Penang.

The Montri has small safety boxes that are available to the public for 50 baht per day and big ones for 70. I checked last night. You must leave a deposit of around 1,000 baht in case you lose the key, but they will give it back for sure for the key.

Thank you for getting up-to-date facts -- very helpful.

Similar to "left luggage" service at airport or train station, except much more secure.

Valuable service for tourists needing safe place to keep passport for a few days.

50 baht per day comes up to 18,250 per year.

70 baht per day works out to 25,550 per year.

Obviously aimed at the tourist just passing through, not long-term expats.

I'll need to stop by and ask if monthly or yearly rates available.

If so, would be a good solution to this problem.

And if The Montri offers this, does anyone know of any other hotels?

I used to rent a safety box there when I wasn't a guest and never had a problem. The Montri has CCTV all over the hotel and TV monitors in the lobby. Best of all, they have such a good staff, that I wouldn't worry about anyone there stealing. That is the most important point in my opinion.

Excellent points.

Thank you, Ulysses.

So, seems worthwhile going over to the Montri and asking.

I wonder if they have a safety box big enough for the laptop.

With so many expats in Chiangmai, I'm surprised there aren't several ways to solve this problem.

But discussing it here has provided some possibilities.

McGriffith's post above alerted me to importance of storing laptop computer when out of town.

And I'm willing to buy a safe big enough for the laptop.

Buying a safe is no problem in CM, but where to put it, off-site?

Is there any business in CM that would rent about one square metre of floor space?

And that is secure and trustworthy for this purpose.

I'd rent a small "storage locker," but I don't know of any in CM.

Are there storage lockers here?

What are other expats doing?

Or, maybe it's a problem which has no solution in Chiangmai.

The Montri Hotel used to rent out safe deposit boxes and may still do it, but it is less than 2,000 baht per year in a bank and much more in other places including the private safe deposit boxes in Bangkok. It sounds like the OP doesn't want to pay that much.

Finding secure storage is the problem, not the price.

One place I looked at in Bangkok wanted 6,000/year -- fine with me.

Big enough for computer backup drives, too.

But, so far, can't find anything like that in CM.

Hotel, such as the Montri?

Interesting idea.

I would have thought only for registered guests, but this idea is worth some research.

However, the Montri doesn't strike me as very diligent about security.

Do any other hotels in CM rent boxes to non-guests?

There must be many expats here looking for something like this.

Don't want to buy a big safe, or not acceptable to drill into walls or floors for a small one.

Yet want somewhere to store important items -- such as computer backups -- away from home.

Which brings up another point about this -- the importance of keeping computer backups OFF-site.

McGriffith's suggestion above got me thinking about buying a safe.

If I rolled a safe into this apartment, the maid (serviced apartment) would immediately notice the next morning when she came in to clean.

Within hours, every employee in the building would know about the new safe in 810.

Before the weekend, half the Thais working on this street would know about the rich farang with the new safe, exactly where he lived, and exactly what he looked like.

By the end of the month, the word would have spread to the whole neighborhood.

I don't want to come home some night to meet various young men waiting in the shadows, carrying coconut chopping knives, saying something like, "Excuse us, Krap, but we want to see the inside of your new safe."

That's why I'm looking for someplace off the premises; not where I live.

Hoping to find some useful options, and, I expect, other expats are, too.

One option occured to me: ask my lawyer about moving a safe into his storage room.

He's already got a safe in the office, so one more wouldn't be remarkable at all.

Of course, would expect to pay a fee for that.

It's the best I've been able to think of, so far.

What are other expats doing for secure storage?

-

... firesafe, 53 kg. ... will fit my laptop for when I travel out of town.

McGriffith mentioned two, important points which I hadn't considered: fire protection, and big enough for laptop.

Thank you.

I prefer to rent, rather than buy, but if no secure storage in CM, then buying a safe is the next option.

Following McG's recommendation, I've sent a PM to "tigerbeer".

I know nothing about safes.

Can anyone recommend other places in CM to buy a safe that offers fire protection and is big enough for a laptop?

Are the safes offered at Lotus and Carrefour sufficient?

Or is it prudent to spend more and buy from a specialized dealer?

What about buying a used safe?

And the original topic question is still open: Where to find secure storage, outside of a bank?

.

-

Any private safe deposit box rentals in CM?

Where to store valuable items, safe and secure, but not a bank safe deposit box?

Or, might there be some "creative" alternatives to accomplish the same objective?

Bangkok has several private (i.e. non-bank) safety deposit boxes for rent -- sometimes mentioned on this forum -- so the idea is not unknown in Thailand.

But what about in Chiangmai?

There are several reasons for _not_ considering a bank.

I won't go into them here -- too easy to get off topic.

As with most apartment buildings, mine offers a cheap and small safety box.

It is bolted to a flimsy wooden shelf in the clothes closet.

And, one day, when mine malfunctioned, I watched the front-desk errand-boy open the box with the master key which is normally left hanging in the office.

And the office is often un-attended.

So I don't trust that little box at all.

The manager will not allow any personal safety box to be bolted to wall or floor: It's an apartment, not a condo.

(In all other respects, a fine apartment, so no reason to move just for that.)

What goes in is passport, insurance papers, a small handful of baht in case of serious emergency, my one really good watch , and the baht-gold ring I bought many years ago, but never, ever, wear.

Not a big amount, and not a huge value, but important enough to keep safe and secure.

Worth paying an annual rental for peace-of-mind.

Any place in CM offering that?

Or any "creative" alternatives that might be effective?

I've considered buying a decent safety box at Carrefour.

Then putting that inside a non-descript wooden crate.

Then paying for long-term storage in one of the many bonded warehouses companies near the CM airport.

I inquired at one such company, Boonma, on Mahidol Road -- about storing "critical spare parts for my company's computers".

Yes, they can do, but minimum charge for long-term storage is 1,000 baht per month, even just one box.

12,000/year is a bit on the high side for what's inside.

And it's just an open warehouse, nothing secure.

Are there any better options?

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I first read about Meals on Wheels on this forum.

Tonight I ordered for the second time this month.

First was from Duke's.

Tonight from Chiangmai Saloon.

Both times, food delivered quickly and properly:

At my doorstep in about 45 minutes; Hot food hot, and salads still chilled.

One nice thing, the salads have been huge: two different restaurants, two different orders, both delivered very large salads.

The large box seems to get a larger-than-normal serving, more than I would expect on a plate.

As someone who likes salads, that is an unexpected benefit.

I can't find anything serious to complain about.

Well, crispy foods -- like toasted bread or french fries -- don't arrive crispy.

A few minutes inside a styrofoam box is enough to deplete the crunch.

I don't mind, but, if you're the fussy type, you might.

I like the idea of looking at menus on the web, preparing my order by clicking, then calling on the phone to place the order.

It's a quick, convenient, method.

On the web they use the name, "mealsonwheels4u", so that would be your search term.

When I lived in Bangkok, I used various food delivery services there, especially, "Food By Phone".

Very handy for rainy nights when going out for supper was not tempting.

A life-saver during annual Songkran, and, also, during the occasional "coup".

Although life in CM is not quite so exciting, a meal delivery service here offers a lot of convenience.

(deleted by poster)

(duplicate deleted)

There are a thousand ways to tell someone the truth. To find out That way Not to insult the other party is a gift.

Exactly!

Especially here in Thailand where personal relationships are an essential value.

Following the laws of government and religion is a Western cultural value, but not much of that here.

Easy to see that behavior in Thai culture is not based on laws.

Thais do what they think they can get away with.

The question is, get away with from whom?

And that's a missing piece to the puzzle on this topc.

Thai social world is split into two parts: one part is family, extended family, known friends, and neighbors.

The other side of the split is everyone else.

Within the family-kin group, people are usually careful, honorable, and considerate of others.

Outside the family group, anything goes, if they can get away with it.

(Exceptions, of course.)

In the OPs situation with the maid, I would have tried to associate myself with her family-kin group.

Apparently the OP did a lot of that, too.

But even that was not enough to avoid the "get away with" stealing.

Could he have done more?

From reading his posts, I don't think so.

I think there is another factor which has been overlooked in this discussion so far.

That is a factor which most Westerners never consider in such situations.

We Westerners look to laws, including laws of our religious heritage as, "Thou shalt not steal".

But Thais regulate their behavior by looking to retribution from others in their family-kin group.

With the OP, the maid was just an employee -- with no family-kin connection.

At least, none was mentioned.

That's why, when hiring staff here, or looking for anybody to do anything for me, I always try to find a "counter-party" in the staff's family-kin group.

If something goes wrong, who is the counter-party who will make things right?

Is it the father, the older brother, the uncle who is a monk, or my neighbor, the police colonel, who is the older brother of the wife of the staff's cousin.

Someone like that.

With a counter-party in the background -- known to both me and the staff -- there is far less chance of any problems in the first place.

The Thai staff may want to steal from you, but, far more, she won't risk offending someone in her family-kin group.

Now the OP is trying to replace his maid.

If I were wanting to do that, I would not place an ad, nor ask for referals from Westerners.

Instead, I would make inquiries of senior members of the Thai family groups I already know.

(Inquiries in a very round-about, polite, face-saving manner.)

I would let them select who would apply for the job.

Then I would pick one from among those who came forward.

The essential, counter-party network would already be in place.

Still some chance of problems -- always a chance, anywhere -- but far less if we understand Thai culture, and work within it.

Far easier that, than trying to impose Western ways, to "teach them a lesson".

And far safer, than to risk retribution from an angry Thai and his family group.

---

(I am always striving to understand the Thai culture that surrounds us here.

If others have topics to discuss -- but off-topic of this particular thread -- I am always happy to get PM or email.)

Not say anything. Just dismiss. After being sure you have your keys etc. And be a gentleman, pay for 2 or three weeks extra.

Why would I do that?

Pay them the legal 3 months salary for stealing my things? Interesting logic.

...as soon as you discover they steal from you, don't say anything, dismiss and pay. Give some excuse like, "we can do it ourselves from here".

For them no loss of face ?!

Valuable logic from "Fiscalist".

Especially his comment about saving face.

In Thailand, everything is about face, in some way or other.

Worthwhile to consider it carefully.

Why would you offer severence pay?

To protect yourself from ill-will among the locals, and to burnish your reputation as a man with good heart ("jai-dee").

Here in Thailand, far better to have many friends than one enemy.

To suddenly fire your staff, without pay, puts severe strain on them.

All their social network will come to their aid with food and loans of money, until they find new jobs.

Everyone will know the reason for the problem -- and that reason is you.

Plus, the next staff you hire will certainly know everything about you from the gossip.

Any comments from us Westerners about "theft is theft" ignore the strong, cultural trait, of sharing among Thais.

In addition, in Thai society, the rich person "takes care" of the poor within his extended family.

If you employ someone, they come within your extended family.

We have little concept of that in the West, but the Thais put high value on it.

When they take something -- as "DLock" described -- it is not a sin, just their way of letting you be generous to them, without bothering you by asking for every little thing.

Among my staff, I expect these sorts of things to happen, and I try to understand them, as they try to understand me.

They look to see what I value highly, and never touch those items.

For example, they would never, ever, take my computer, my mobile phone, or any CDs.

But they would, and have, remove something small from the kitchen, like taking home plastic food trays.

And, of course, they help themselves to any food within reach, and take plenty home for their own family and neighbors.

They will also take minor items of low value, if I have many, like socks.

Most times they return change from small purchases, but sometimes they don't.

It's all part of the package of living here.

I was recently in Bangkok, and tried the fish and chips in Ship Inn, on soi twenty three off Suk. It is just past the Offshore Bar.

I was happy with it, good tasting and well served. Not a big fancy place, but very clean and well run. Gets two thumbs up from me!

I'll second KhunDennis' recommendation for Ship Inn. Certainly works as a servicable, neighborhood, chippie. I wouldn't say to go out of your way for it, but if you are nearby, then, certainly, yes.

A very large slab of tasty fish, so I didn't go away hungry. However, I would have liked several, smaller, pieces instead of the one huge one, because the crispy coating all around adds to the flavour.

Like most deep fried foods in Thailand, the oil was not hot enough, so it soaked into the fish a bit. Unless in the large hotels, most deep-fried foods in Thailand turn out like that. Not bad, though, and that won't stop me from going back again.

The only problem is that Ship Inn is directly across Suk 23 from the DownUnder bar, with their home-made, Aussie-style pies. It's a difficult call: fish or pie, fish or pie? Last time there, I got take-away from both. _

There's also Elite Bookstores which I thought was better than Dasa. It's between Villa and Phrom Phong station on Sukhumvit, near Soi 33.

But honestly, still pricey. I end up just going to Kinokuniya.

I'll second that recommendation for Elite near Villa and Phrom Phong. I was in there just today. A huge selection, mostly popular fiction and some travel books, but a small assortment of everything else, too. Be warned, though, Elite is not for fat people -- the shelves are spaced for Asian body size.

Both Elite and DASA will trade books: bring in your old ones and pick out new ones. Depending on if they want your old books, the going rate at Elite is 3:1. Elite accepts in trade almost anything I bring in. DASA is far more limited in the books they will accept in trade.

But for the most common problems people face with meter taxis, i.e. refusal to turn on the meter and refused destinations, there's no reason to leave the driver any money whatsoever. And you'd be crazy to advise people that this is a sensible thing to do.

I hope other readers understand I'm not taking my time writing here this afternoon, in order to convince Dantilley. And if he merely asserts that something is "crazy", that does not make it crazy. However, I do gather from Dantilley's writing on this thread that he would engage in a test of wills with a taxi driver rather than part with 40 or 100 baht. That is quite the opposite of my advice to friends coming to visit Bangkok.

Avoiding conflict (whilst saving face for the other party) is an important survival skill for foreigners in Thailand. Offering money is one easy way for any foreigners to avoid conflicts with Bangkok taxi drivers who refuse to turn on the meter. They want money, so just give them a little and get away from them.

Perhaps Dantilley has discovered some other ways to avoid conflict with Thai taxi drivers, of which I am unaware. In a spirit of working together to understand as much as we can about Thailand, I hope he will share those discoveries on this thread. However, just writing that something is "crazy" doesn't help with that.

I am not a novice (having traveled to Thailand on business over 15 times and lived there for the equivalent of three years).

It is appropriate to insist that you be taken to your destination and that the meter be utilized, once the cab driver has taken you away from the pick up spot. If he decides not to do so, then insist on being returned, and if not insist on being let out.

I'm sure that Hastings has far more experience with Thai ways than I may ever have. So I'm quite willing to read carefully and think about what he writes. Yet it seems strange to me that Hasting's behavior (as he himself described) and his comments (as quoted above) seem so far out of line with everything I have observed and learned about Thai culture.

In a previous post, Hastings described punching a Thai three times. Yes, Hastings admitted he is not proud of doing that, but still, by his own admission he did that, and that causes me to have serious doubts about his understanding of Thai culture after 15 visits and three years of stay here.

In that quote above, Hastings says, "insist ... insist ... and if not insist". I wish I would watch Hastings in operation -- from a distance, of course -- because from everything I have observed about Thailand, insisting usually gets the opposite result from that which is insisted upon. That's the Thai way. Most long-stay expats here know that and behave accordingly with the Thais. And, I must add, especially with the Thai taxi drivers. And those Thai taxi drivers who are operating meter scams are especially volitile and are best handled very carefully. I very much doubt that insisting is the way to get where you want to go with them. But then, again, I have not yet had the opportunity to observe Hastings in action. Perhaps it is I who still have much to learn about dealing with the Thais.

My purpose in writing this is not to castigate Mr. Hastings. I'm sure he means well and I, for one, appreciate the vivid detail he puts into his writing, which is very helpful for clearly understanding the situation. Instead, my purpose is for the benefit of those readers who have little or no experience with Bangkok taxis. In my years here, I have observed that insisting on anything with Thai people simply doesn't work. I draw some support for this view from Rudyard Kipling. I'll copy-paste from one of his works below. It may provide useful advice for other readers of this thread who are seeking useful information about dealing with Thai behavior in general, and Thai taxi drivers in particular.

"The Naulahka"

Rudyard Kipling (1865-1936)

(excerpt)

Now it is not good for the Christian's health to hustle the Aryan brown.

For the Christian riles, and the Aryan smiles and he weareth the Christian down;

And the end of the fight is a tombstone white with the name of the late deceased,

And the epitaph drear: "A Fool lies here who tried to hustle the East."

1. Never, ever, get into any taxi waiting in front of a hotel in Bangkok. Instead, wave down a moving taxi who is driving past.

2. Always speak softly, politely, even if you are in the right and the taxi driver is in the wrong.

3. Never, ever, hit a Thai.

4. Always carry small change in your shirt pocket where you can get to it quickly: 20s, 50s, and 100 baht notes. Don't depend on the driver being able or willing to make change.

5. Don't bother with the police. In Bangkok, the police are not your friends

1. Pass up the cab that's waiting in the cab rank/queue/etc. Walk down the street a short distance and flag down an unoccupied meter taxi, that cab is more likely to be willing to use the meter.

2. The meter fares are low, the driver may feel that he isn't making a decent fare if you pay the exact meter rate. So if you have a 135 baht fare, slip the cabbie 150 baht and tell him to keep the change. It isn't much, but makes him feel like he got a little extra. Face it, whats 15 baht to you?

3 If you know where your going, be prepared to get off on the opposite side of the street, and cross over using the foot bridges. This is especially true on Sukhumvit Road and other one-way streets. If you insist on having the cabbie drive 4 or 5 blocks so he can drop you off on the side of the street you want, he won't be happy.

4. In times of heavy slow-moving traffic, be prepared to tip him off the meter fare for the time he waits for traffic to move.

5. The final tip, if you're in Bangkok enough, learn the air-conditioned bus routes, where they stop, and use them.

There you have it: The Ten Commandments for surviving taxi meter problems in Bangkok. Thank you to both Mr_Dave and to IMA_FARANG for exellent advice that is especially useful for new visitors who aren't familiar with the many pitfalls of Bangkok taxis.

And I'm glad you picked up on that point about Mr Dave suggesting that it's a good idea to leave 100 Baht on the back seat of the cab when the driver has turned out to be a pain in the ar5e. People really should not be encouraged to do this.

I wish to present a contrary observation about this. There are plenty of problems waiting for us farangs when we come to Thailand for holiday or long-stay. Over the years that I have been living here, I have learned again and again that the easiest way to solve small problems is by offering a bit of money. The taxi meter situation is a small problem than can be easily solved if one is simply willing to leave a bit of money and then change over to a different taxi.

When I have friends visiting Thailand I always advise them to try to solve small problems before they become big problems. In Thailand, the surest and easiest way to solve small problems is with money. Taxi scams and rip offs start out as small problems, but they can quickly escalate into big problems with maybe a fist fight (as was vividly described earlier in this thread), or maybe the police arriving on the scene. So I do encourage my visiting friends to "pay their way out", if at all possible, especially for such an insignificant problem as a taxi meter scam.

So far, sure, some small problems here and there, especially with the Bangkok taxis, but, so far, not any big problems. Thanks be to a few green and red currency notes offered when appropriate.

Where can i find a hotel or place to crash for a half day or 6-8 hours in bkk like sukhumvit or petchburi, siam area ?

Your trip probably has already finished, but this information may be useful to others. Almost any hotel will rent short-time -- for a day rate -- if they have a room available and ready. Even the nicest hotels. Just walk in and ask. Specific language to use when asking at reception is, "day rate".

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Main point is NEVER get in the taxi BEFORE they agree to use a meter. Open the front door - say where you want to go and "use meter". ... Main areas for problems are of course Patpong etc where you usually have to walk along the waiting taxis - after a couple of "500 Baht" idiots the next taxi knows you are serious. Usually ones that are driving not waiting are ok with meter. Never shout, argue etc. Just give them the smile that says "you lying lizard" and walk off. ... i am normally dressed well in a shirt, trosers and proper shoes. Shorts/flip flops/backpack/camera shouts "I am a tourist with more money than sense". Thais at all levels give more respect to well dressed people

That's sound advice from Nemo. I use taxis almost every day in Bangkok, and I follow similar procedures to those suggested above, especially wearing respectable clothing instead of anything that looks like the tourist uniform. In three years of using taxis in Bangkok, rarely any problems.

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This is a just a topic bump -- not a meeting announcement.

Is there an active expats' club in BKK? The last post on this topic was over three years ago. I know two clubs are active in Pattaya, but wondering if any in Bangkok.

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