DamianMavis

how about:

2 foreigners, strangers, a face tattoo woman, with a criminal record and arrested for attacking police officers in the younger past (facts we know from herself) and a questional status as 'tourist' (not the typical 7 day tourist but long time here and different "boyfriends", no WP, an illegal profession anyway.) and her ex-boyfriend, a drug taking and to much alcohol drinking fan of aggressive music with dreadlooks and tattoos all over his body (facts we know when we see at the pictures) and a questional status as 'tourist' (brother in law said: he works in a tattoo shop. WP?) have a night out together, be very drunk. it's the days of nationwide mourning because kings sister died and she even painted here face red. we can take it as a fact that they disrespect the local culture deeply and not obey the unwritten law of social behavior. they are in company of the new 'boyfriend' of the woman, a local. all we seems to know about him is that he is an "artist". (who knows what that means, maybe just that he have no proper job and is not a pillar of the society) and he also had a problem with the police before.

the three met a local law enforcement officer (we know not much about him, local eyewitness can not be trusted, what his colleagues have done bad is no evidence against him).

now its unclear what happen, we know the results, but not how it come to that. for sure, there was a fight between them, both side talking about it. both side talking also that they were wrestling about the gun from the police officer.

so we don't know why and how the fight about the gun starts, there a lot of speculations. cut that speculations out and following the basic facts:

a local law enforcement officer met 3 civilian people,

two foreigners and one residents. one is a drug user and drunkard (was before seen walking and yelling with beer bottles in the hand on bright daylight on a public street), the other one is know for starting pub brawls with cops the third a local. somehow they start fighting about the cops gun. 3 shots where fired. 1 foreigner dead, the other wounded. having his weapon secure in his hand, the police man run away and seeking custody from his other law enforcement officers.

if the shots were accidently given or targeted with the intention to kill is just speculation. but the facts is only one person is dead, the otherone still alive and talkative and the third didn't catch a bullet at all. so if the police man is a 'killer', why he run away instead of finishing his job? only 3 bullets in his gun or had he just done what he should have done if he is out numbered and the situation gets or is out of control. move away and seek support?

it's all speculation.

pathetic little armchair detectives/judges we are.

pictures below can be viewed by everyone in the facebook profil of mr. del pinto. they are for public viewing

http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=564505599

you can have a view on his life, he listen to music by bands called 'suicidal tendencies' and 'death by stereo'. he draw a graffitti "clap your hand & say die" and posted this small gif on his profil. he is also interessted in buddhism and have some kind of daily Buddha Quotes and Teachings application. yesterdays quote have been "I spit on my life. "

there a lot more pictures, taken by his friends, and a lot of them involving drinking alcohol. taken by different persons on different occasions, so we have a continuance.

i think this pictures proves nothing but only that you can not draw black and white pictures.

and you can continue to write stories about how corrupt the thai police is, damian can tell us once more, that all local eye wittnesses are bribable and will lie like isaan hookers and in how much danger we face here in thailand and that the others must be blind if they don't hear or see all the bullets surround them. and that mr. drummond the only quality journalist. and you can call everybody who have second thoughts on your stories: the rose-coloured glasses thai apologist brigade.

and so on. but i will not really help to find out what happend in pai that night.

Ahhh I dont even know where to begin, holy crap! You judge him based on THE NAMES OF HIS FAVORITE ROCK BANDS?! Complete unintelligent judgemental foolishness! A picture of him smiling on the street with a beer is "seen walking and yelling with beer bottles in the hand on bright daylight on a public street" like he was doing something wrong?! Oh and the cop tried to kill 2 people, one was unconcsious on the ground and LOOKED dead, so he left her but she survived, I highly doubt Fuen stuck around to catch a bullet too.

Damian

Nice, some goodies here. Check out Blackcats too though, sometimes they are handing out memberships, they get games alot before they even hit the stores! Its also very fast assuming you arent on dial up.

Damian

But... that wont export and convert all video types, only certain ones....

Damian

Ya its kind of silly comparing the 3 cases and wondering why one is discussed more than others. If the JAPANESE girl case was dealing with an english speaking victim I bet there would be alot more posts from for example... THE JAPANESE haha, but this is an english forum. Im sure on a Japanese forum all in Japanese the debate reached a higher post count.

The police killings is pretty straight forward, 3 cops killed, 3 culprits executed although unproven but obvious, also Thai people wont post here either.

The Canadian case is full of opposing witness accounts, great stuff for a debate and it is about Western victims so attracts alot of english speaking posters to an english site.

Damian

A police officer friend of mine, just a couple of nights ago, mentioned exactly the same thing that BarryMan said - i'm sorry Damian, but it is true. It's another one of them Catch 22 situations. Yes, in theory, Thai police ARE on duty 24 hours a day.

Going on from what BarryMan has written in his latest comment. (nothing to do with Damian). I too have read that crazy Bar Stool rumour about the Kanchanaburi murder and an impersonator doing time on his behalf. Spreading rumours like that is not just plain malice, but also illegal.

Please Damian, i respect your viewpoints, but i'd like to explain one thing in regards to an earlier comment of yours. One of my jobs is to take original stories from the Thai Press and translate them into English. Meaning therefore, i spend as much time reading the Thai language newspapers as i do English. Much is posted in Thai that is never told in English. I can confirm therefore, that Thailand gets more than its fair share of former police officers sentenced to lengthy jail sentences behind bars. In stark contrast to the general Farang belief, Thai police criminals are not let off the hook as easily as what is believed. Times have changed, this is not the 1950s era of Pol. Gen Sarit.

Going back to the case. Again, i can also quote a Thai police officer in saying that "Thai police are trained, that in the event of self-defense, thay are to shoot only once"

Thanks! That was what I was asking about a while back, Im glad police are being held accountable for some crimes they commit. I also know that accountability is much more common now than 10, 20, 30 years ago. Before it was much worse.

Damian

Wow, not a flame! Thanks! Yes, that is verifiable truth.... When you see cops out and about around town wearing white t-shirts for example with their uniform pants on and guns in holsters, they are often off-duty, but they're not breaking the law. It's permitted for them to carry their weapons at all times -- which in the case of cops with drinking problems would seem to pose a risk to public safety. It has to do with the idea of them having to be police all the time. They are sworn to that. Thus Uthai being called in to break up a domestic quarrel would not have been unusual, though of course his use of excessive force is an entirely different story.

I have heard from a reliable local source that Thai police are not permitted to fire more than one shot in self defence. Obviously, unless Uthai's claims that the shots were accidental (which seems incredible) is true, he is clearly guilty of excessive force.

Well now I am upset that more than one poster has claimed it was illegal..... hard to get facts when people do things like that.

Damian

You're prejudiced because you fail to listen to consider all sides to this story. I have seen no balance in your posts whatsoever, or willingness to consider all sides to the story.

If it's all the same to you, I'm going to close the door on our little back and forth. I have no interest in engaging in any further discussion with you because in my opinion you have nothing of merit to contribute. I'd rather continue reading the interesting posts of people on the ground in Pai than filling this space with a useless attempt to try to get you to think beyond your paranoid imaginings.

PS -- One more unrelated point, I hope nobody gives any credulity to the nonsensical rumor that the policeman in the Kanchanaburi murder case is anywhere other than in jail serving his sentence. He has a double doing the time for him while he whoops it up in Kanchanaburi? What bosh. I hope the concerned families aren't reading crap like that.

Actually I have changed my attitude about this case alot after following the thread. If you remember, the beginning had the cop putting his pistol in Leos mouth and pulling the trigger. Things have changed. I'll stop arguing with you over unrelated stupid stuff, but please just try not to misquote and say things that look like you are stating opinion as fact, just try ok?

In reference to the police officer that may or may not be serving his sentence. Im not saying he isn't, I dont know. But Barry you may be surprised to know crazier things have happened here. I cannot talk about a perfect example, I do use my own name after all, but I'd love to tell you about a horrible/funny example of murderers not doing time they are supposed to be doing. It is just one case I know of so no Im not saying this is normal. But in the case above you mentioned, it wouldnt be as crazy as having a double do his time, he simply wouldnt be in jail like it said he was "on the books". Did the person who talked about this mean it was actually reported in the news? If so then its not "bosh" is it? I dont know, but instead of discounting it immediately I would ask" was this in fact reported and confirmed before being swept under the rug or was it all just rumour?"

Damian

I like it when reasonable posts appear on this thread. Gives me hope. My only point of contention with what Gaz has written here is the bit about officers carrying weapons off duty being against procedure in Thailand. It's not. They are not required to turn in their weapons after a shift or anything of the sort -- they keep them on themselves because, in theory, they are policemen 24 hours a day and are always required to be available for service.

Really? A few people already stated this was against the law, if you are correct I'm very surprised, what made people think it was illegal for cops to carry guns while off duty in Thailand?

Damian

Personally I could care less about whether you had 20 incidents with police, tuk-tuk drivers or the woman who cooks your fried noodles. I paraphrased the quote you mentioned, but the intent of it was the same, you were accusing me of making stuff up, as you are again, while not citing a specific fact I mentioned.

If there is any reading deficiency, it is your own. You are probably the most heavily biased poster on this thread and if I were to learn anything new at the case, it would certainly not be from someone like you, a bitter expat who seems like he has an axe to grind.

I have stated throughout that the version of events I was suggesting was my own theory based on what seemed like the most logical course of action. I undoubtedly have a better grasp on what happened than you do, that is proven time and again by your unreasonable and prejudiced posts.

Give you an example? I GAVE YOU 2! But they dont count? They were perfect examples of how you twist and remake or just dont remember what you read. And the bonus is they WERE ACTUALLY REAL, unlike many things you have said.

You undoubtedly have a better grasp on what happened than I? If you say so.

Im unreasonable and prejudiced but you are not? heh

Damian

There's a HUGE difference between using a taser (which is SUPPOSED to be non-lethal) to subdue a drunk and shooting a near x-ring shot into the body of an unarmed drunk female. I think most posters get that.

It's amazing how posters with weak arguments will twist what is said to try to prove their point. NOWHERE did I say that cops in 'farangland' don't use force in dealing with drunks. Of course they do; they just don't kill unarmed folks with the alarming regularity that happens here. I think most posters get that too.

Yes it is amazing.

Damian

...I think it speaks volumes that a hardened news professional sees the victim of an attempted murder being treated so unfairly by the authorities (and others) that he expresses remorse over having published the full balanced results of his investigations.

Arkady - good post. I'm sure Andrew Drummond's letter in the Nation today raised more than a few eyebrows amongst seasoned expats here. It certainly did with me!

I truly and sincerely hope he follows up - and duly continues to report comprehensively and honestly on this shocking case.

So what would it take for Andrew Drummond's boosters on this forum to think him a bad journalist? Prejudicing the case from jump? He's done that in his first story when he said, without referencing a single source and only relying on his own authority (the kind of authority you get from staying in Bangkok while you write your expert analyses on Thailand events occurring miles away) to say that this case was a mirror of the "face-saving" killings in Kanchanaburi.

Does Mr. Drummond investigate these pieces on his own or does he call up Damien on Thaivisa.com and between the two of them they figure what's what with the world?

I would like to have been proven wrong on here, but I've only received idiotic counters to my posts, such as those that come from Damien (And I paraphrase his initial rant "YOU'RE LYING!! YOU MAKE UP EVERYTHING",.... Right.... Let me know when your 21st time being involved with Thai cops comes about and I'll call the Guinness Book and tell them they have a contender for most annoying farang of the year, and also I want to know when you and the other farang are going to get together to sing "Redemption Song" by Bob Marley.I want to be there to witness one of the great civil-rights movements in history.)...

Those who assume Drummond "knows something" should think twice. He's saving his own reputation after he published an initial accounting of things that could not have been more irresponsible journalistically.

Thanks to a poster, I believe by the name of 'sabaijai', who is actually on the scene. Don't worry about running into Andrew Drummond there, because you won't. He is a lazy telephone journalist.

I look forward to hearing more of the REAL version of things going on there from people like Sabaijai, and I hope the rest of you are able to put a grip on your paranoia as farangs for long enough to get a good dose of the truth.

This poor Canadian fellow did not deserve to die, but that is not reason for us as Westerners to bury the entire story in a bunch of xenophobic, lying s*it.. It would be a better tribute to his memory to speak truthfully of this incident and to acknowledge that from all we know it was his a**hole drunken female friend who sparked it, and another irresponsible a**hole drunk cop who did the killing. Let's not lie, and let's not let the stupid paranoia and idiocy of the day carry us away.

I realise now what your problem is, you have a reading deficiency. I dont mean that as a random personal attack, I'm stating a fact. When I say you make most of your post up I truly mean it because you misquote and throw in statements that are completely wrong. I now understand why you have such a strange viewpoint, its because half of what you read is remembered incorrectly or it never gets through in the first place. FOR EXAMPLE: "Let me know when your 21st time being involved with Thai cops comes about" I didnt say that, nobody said that, you made it up. I said quite clearly in several posts that I have been involved in about 20 possible bad/violent situations (nothing to do with police) and that being sober probably kept me from escalating the situation, I even gave examples that also showed I was not referring to police. I then stated very clearly that I have actually only been in ONE negative interaction with police.

Another example: your quote of me doesnt exist - "YOU'RE LYING!! YOU MAKE UP EVERYTHING" The real quote was "BARRYMAN, you made your whole post up! No where do all the FACTS you listed actually exist! It is JUST YOUR OPINION." You have just proven this point AGAIN, you continuously make up facts based on your opinion, you even misquote.

You have done this kind of thing many times throughout your posts, mostly about the details of this case, only remembering bits and pieces of what you read and than coming to a conclusion based on a partial story and then posting about it like its fact. I think this is causing you to see this whole situation differently than if you were reading this thread throroughly.

Damian

Fellas:

Never played the PSP so my opinion is biased. As a fanboy of Nintendo it was a no brainer decision on which console to buy.

Anyways, the R4 is a great piece of hard/ software. Can anybody recommend a website that has the DS games for download? I have a few but the are not so comprehensive. Thanks in advance for your suggestion.

A month away before Super Smash Bros Brawl hits the Wii. This is going to be awesome. Link from Twighlight Princess looks baaaadddd! But, I always cleaned up with Pikachu. Looking forward to this Wii game.

Turok

I like nintendo too and grew up playing its various consoles, I just dont hold any allegiance to any particular product name. What exactly is the r4? A seperate piece of hardware you attach to the ds? Blackcats is the best game download site, but good luck getting a membership....... its free but they dont let people in all the time and once youre in its easy to get booted out if you dont upload enough.

Damian

quik sum up then................they were drunk,cop was drunk.......some sort of altercation,drunk cop tries to kill them both.....succeeds on one count..then comes the cover up with help of his friends(cops).....canadian lady goes home......everything dies down.....cop moved to other station.........end of story.this is thailand!!!

moral of story.....we live in country that is corrupt therefore unless you come from a very rich family then there will be no justice for foreigners or poor unconnected thais, as to get them to do the right thing and punish the drunk cop for taking a young mans life then it will take many bribes to many people which would see him put inside maybe for a couple of months/years then he will be sneakily let out anyway!!!

i dont know if thailand can ever be uncorrupted...........money is god here.........not buddha!!!

Pretty much.... but one thing that bothers me, in the other case where the police officer who was succesfully convicted of murder and then seems to be let out and never actually did the time he was supposed to do (or did a tiny bit of it) what is the big problem here? I mean, why at all costs must a police officer NOT be punished? Was he really connected or rich? Or is there just no way a Thai policeman will ever be punished even for brutal murder? I'm asking the thoughts of people that might have some insight as I have no clue.

Also, does anyone know of any confirmed cases of police going to jail? And for how long and for what crime?

Damian

Yeah, I'm connected to the internet. Can surf the net and such, download stuff off Installer... I can even check my Yahoo! mail from the website, just not through the mail button.

Oh ok, yes you have to do a goolge search for "iphone yahoo email setup" or something close to that to get a walkthrough on how to setup yahoo. Gmail is set up very easy, Im sure yahoo will be similar.

I'm currently using WinSCP for file management, and I love it. I can add/delete/etc. the stuff on the phone through wireless; don't even need to plug the phone in. I can even use the phone as a portable HDD of sorts.

Uhm... THANKS, I'll look into that program! heh

Now the other thing is, for video converios, I tried Videora iPhone converter, but after ~5 minutes of playback, I lose sound, then have to restart the vid. Using Cucusoft, the quality is perfect, but there's a huge 'Free Trial' watermark in the center of the screen. Guess I gotta head down to Pantip and see if I can find anything there.

Yes go to pantip or if you can download torrents or download using emule you can grab a bunch off the net to find the one that you like and works best for you.

As for ringtones... iTunes won't let me sync custom ringtones. I'm currently using SendSong, which allows me to use the songs I have on the phone as ringtones. This doesn't allow me to cut or edit the songs though, gotta use it as is; I also was unable to find a way to change my received SMS tone. Customize has an option for it, but when I click it, the screen just goes black and I've got to press the home key to exit. (Been using ICQ's 'ut oh' sound for years )

I actually have yet to really mess around with ring tones, BUT I use a great program to change all the sounds of my phone... I currently have the phone making all kinds of Star Trek computer sounds for all the different functions, theres a set of BORAT sounds that are too funny to, NIIIICE! I'm such a geek..... The program is "Customise", grab that from installer, then grab all kind of icon sets and sounds sets and themes too if you want.

The Maps program... is quite useless for Thailand. Firstly, the maps are in Thai, and there's no way around this. (Google used the native language of each location for the labels. i.e. Japan is in Japanese.) Also... seems the only searchable location is... Bangkok. That's it. No roads, no buildings, no landmarks, no nothing. There're no kml files for Bangkok either, and using one disables your ability to zoom.

Yes as soon as I realised it was all in Thai I just stopped trying, I am pretty sure that they will release an app or a firmware upgrade that will translate the maps otherwise what is the point? Who needs a freaking map to their own neighbourhood?! Im positive about this, it just makes too much sense. Many customers have probably given feedback about wanting to use the iphone for travelling the world. If Apple doesnt do it I'm sure some programmer will make an app.

CameraPro program always takes pictures in landscape. Meaning, when your phone is upright, the picture's bottom is on the side. When you tilt the phone on it's side, the bottom of the picture goes back to the 'base' of the phone, so you've always got to tilt your head to see the pictures.

Ya I'll mess around with my alternate camera program, I'm pretty sure there is an option for landscape.

And I guess the list of things for which I can find no answer/solution to can go on and on and on...

BUT

I've got to say, I love this phone despite it's downfalls. Most fun phone I've ever had.

Serously... I dont use my psp or laptop anymore, Im too busy playing with my phone and not even playing games on it!

I guess it's just gonna take some time to work out all the kinks.

I even had some problem with the sound (the sound on max volume was inaudible), and SMS (could receive but not send)... that somehow fixed themselves.

The external speaker sound was inaudible? At home or on a busy noisy bangkok street? heh, mine is very loud..... let me know if that continues.

These are the most needed apps:

SMSD or ISMS (allows multiple recipients and forwarding sms, also allows erasure of individual sms and not the whole sms thread

Services (to turn wifi, edge and bluetooth on and off anytime)

Swirly mms (allows you to send mms and soon to recieve it to)

Customise and rSBT (allows you to move icons around the desktop and change certain icons and sounds)

Vnotes (to take voice notes)

Todolist (to do list heh)

Summerboard (to make an extended desktop that scrolls up and down so you can add as many apps as you want)

Websearch (opens a page that has a list of search engines, click on the engine like EBAY and type in the keyword and it takes you directly to the results for that search on ebay)

Wallpaper (I love this but all it does is scan all the iphones connected to the wallpaper program at that moment and shows you their wallpapers which you can copy to your own phone.... theres been a few REALLY private ones I picked up woops! But some are very nice and cool)

Books, PDF Viewer, Preview and Text Edit ( all used to look at various read formats and ebooks)

Damian

Boy or girl?

It's for a boy.

Im pretty sure there are alot more psp games than ds, I have over 200 psp games and I dont have them all. Also its very easy to get psp games and the psp you buy at mbk will already be able to play copied games

How much would the PSP games cost at MBK?

Also can anyone comment first hand about battery life and charging time? I've heard conflicting comments.

Thanks all for your replies!

PSP games are about 70 baht each if you find the right place (some might charge more especially if they think youre a tourist), keep in mind we are all talking about copy games. Battery life.... good question, I never paid attention .....

Someone mentioned the games are smaller on the ds, thats because they are simpler but that doesnt mean they arent fun. The high graphic quality and intricacy of psp games is what makes it popular with a more serious gamer. If you add in all the playstation 1 games, psp games, other console games like Gameboy advance, super nintendo, sega etc that the PSP CAN play you get THOUSANDS of games heh. And who wants to watch movies on a tiny ds screen? Large wide psp screen for me! This is totally not as important but they continue to upgrade the psp firmware to add more functionality to the psp all the time, like higher res videos, ability to choose your own custom theme, adding internet functions.

Damian

I'm pleased to see that some people on here, not the majority of course, but some, felt the same way I did when reading Drummond's letter to the Nation today. To whit:

Carly Reisig has a history of getting drunk and violent with police. HOW IN THE hel_l is that not totally relevant to this case involving an altercation with a cop, while she was drunk.

As for earlier posters who basically said I was making up facts about the case, two points:

Reisig's version of events did change. She started with her initial story about how she was skipping down the road with facepaint and enjoying herself only to be randomly assaulted by a policeman, which was clearly enough stated. Then she went on to say that she didn't really remember what happened, or that her memories were "vague". Both of these accounts were reported by Drummond.

NO they didn't change, she has stuck to her story since the begninning, she did however say that OUTSIDE of what she has described she doesnt remember THE REST too clearly. But she has always stated that he walked up and punched her out of the blue, that never changed. If she doesnt remember other details she is admitting that, but she didnt back peddle and she didnt change her story, YOU decided that all on your own.

If this was a cold-blooded killing, which it may well have been, her changing versions of events does matter. Had she told one consistent story from the start we would a solid place from which to start to find out the truth. By being inconsistent she has harmed the investigation into this case and she owes the family of the deceased an apology.

She DIDN'T change what she said, admitting she doesnt remember other details outside of what she DOES remember (him hitting her by surprise) is not changing, she has always stated the same thing about him walking up and punching her. So she has nothing to apologise for.

I used to respect Drummond for "going where others dared not", now I do not. He has not reported on this story fairly, but rather decided from jump that this was Kanchanaburi all over again, before looking into anything about the case at all. That he would later send in a letter to the editor and apologize publicly for reporting on relevant facts shows the type of journalist we're dealing with here. Drummond, as a professional journalist and self-proclaimed expert, should know better than to dismiss eyewitness accounts (if the people in Pai are in fear of the police, why have people come forward to say that the officer was drunk that night? Doesn't wash, but in Drummond's world, all Thais conspire against foreigners: a sentiment that is lapped up on this forum with relish, though thankfully not by everyone).

Only one person has come forward to say the officer was drunk, the young 22 year old bartender and GOD BLESS HIM for it, he is very brave, I hope he sticks to the truth and doesnt suddenly "remember" it differently due to outside pressure.

I wish the Post had someone reliable on this one. The reports I've read from them have seemed more balanced, but they have been few and far between. Having Drummond as the only local option for this story is worrying.

That's unfortunate and sad that someone had to die over this incident. We'll probably never know exactly what happened. The farang woman in this incident seems to keep shifting stories and doesn't seem all that stable either. I'm guessing the truth is somewhere in the middle. Two parties were drunk..a cop entered into the picture..someone got physical and then it escalated from there.

Where did she shift her story? Saying she doesnt remember what else happened outside what she does remember? thats not shifting the story.

Too bad for the man who got sent off this mortal coil but he should have known better than to get into it with a thai cop. There are just too many people around whether tourists or long term expats who feel that because they are white faced foreigners from wealthy countries the social chaos that passes for "rules" here doesn't apply to them. It's not a hollywood movie..you're not Bruce Willis you will get your a$ beaten to a pulp or killed if you get into too deep with someone Thai. That's the way it is.

He DIDN'T get into it with a Thai cop! Cripes do you people read the same posts and articles I do!? The cop says he was attacked so I guess you believe that then.... but the VICTIMS account and the Thai boyfriends is that Leo simply pushed the attacker (cop) away when his FEMALE friend was punched right in the face! YOU WOULDNT DO THAT?! Id be dead too because theres no way in hel_l I'd watch a man punch a female friend of mine right in front of me without trying to seperate him from her to protect her from further harm. My god.....

This isn't just Thailand but several other 2nd and 3rd world countries. If you've been here long enough you'd realize that there are no real laws here..everything is arbitrarily applied according to who the person is and the situation as it unfolds. Don't expect any justice or "fair" resolution out of any of this as well.

Right I totally agree.

I seem to understand every dang thing you said and I actually agree with more than 90% of what you said.

Just one little thing I am curious about is your mentioning of the great chance of getting into trouble even when one behaves well sounds a little different from my experience in thailand. And I am really not saying this never happens. The only time I have really been very slightly threatened for no reason by a thai(wasn't even sure if it was just misunderstanding too) was in patpong area but this place is a shit hole to me. So I only go there like if I wanted an adventure but I very seldom do.

No I didint say GREAT chance heh, I just said it still could happen to you even if you mind your own business and always act polite. MUCH more rare but it can happen, there have already been several examples of nice people being targetted on this thread. Here's another: Im at a bar, ALL Thais, a very cute girl is looking at me and when she catches my eye she wiggles her butt at me in a cute little dance while looking over her shoulder... I couldnt help laughing a little but didnt make any prolonged eye contact or approach her in any way... but of course she is doing all this right in front of her thai date...... so he gets upset and makes like to come over to me but she holds him back. Whether he is serious or not I dont know, but this is exactly how nice guys land up dead for NOTHING. Starts off with some random dumbass thing and turns into glassing or bullets flying out of pride or ego or face. If he had come over of course I would have been as nice as possible but would that have worked? So far it almost always has.

Of all the times I have been in thai discos and night venues, they have been pleasant and sometimes involves interactions with other thais. I have never recieved that many smiles in other places in the world. They don't even punch you for looking at their girls.(they even smile at you) Try doing that in the UK?

Most of the time Thai people are nice to me too! Much nicer than Ottawa'n meatheads at all the bars I went to when I lived there.

I'd like to remind EVERYONE that it is in fact the POLICE that keep changing THEIR story. And doing it many times! They tried to portray Leo as a huge aggressive weight lifter when he is in fact a lean looking artsy fartsy type, they tried to make up a story about Carly fighting with her boyfriends about the non existent baby in her tummy. There is no pregnancy and therefore no reason for this imaginary fight the cops made up. They have now mentioned retracting that statement. The circumstances around who attacked who changed, at first the Thai boyfriend wasnt involved, then they said he also attacked the officer, 3 on 1! The circumstances around how the officer fired his weapon has also changed..... Im sure there are more examples but the point is, the police have never had a solid story that stayed firm the whole time, not even close!

Damian

What kind of reporter would consider reporting the facts a mistake here in Thailand?

A: An honest one

Perhaps, however some people over the past few days feel that he was sensationalizing the case and now he wants to let everyone know that he is contrite.

Sensasionalised how exactly? Give me examples from his article please. The case IS sensational enough all on its own, I dont think he added to that personally but prove me wrong.

Damian

First you have to dial back on the Red Bull. Your 20 almost confrontations seem plausible now. Some of the 900 plus posters here mentioned sensationalism in some of Andrew Drummond's past body of work. Some questioned his motives and facts in this particular case. I was not one of the posters accusing him of sensationalism I questioned why is he now contrite and regrets imparting the facts through his article in The Nation. He may be eluding to this website in his letter to The Nation today. As for a an example of sensationalism let me refer you to a photo on his website: www.andrew-drummond.com/2008/01/10/canadian-backpacker-admits-she-had-hit-thai-policeman/ that is posted with each article about this case. It is the back of a subject wearing a shirt proclaiming, "Better to Lie Than to Die". Why is it there at all because there is no explanation? Is he somehow telling us he is lying or is he saying we should lie to protect ourselves? Or maybe he says everyone is lying? Perhaps he is joining the growing ranks of shirt vendors?

Six years full time, out everyday in Bangkok and zero confrontations with any Thais.

Whoa easy, I was serious about wanting to know what was sensationalised. If Im wrong about something I want someone to explain it to me but from everything Ive seen he was just telling the story, which is quite crazy all on its own. No need to infer I am antagonistic and attacking you. TO BE CLEAR: since people never seem to understand a dang thing Im saying... when I say Ive been in 20 situations where things could have gone bad if I had been drunk, most of them are as simple as this example:

Standing waiting for a taxi near kaosan road with a few friends, one angry young Thai man comes right up to me shouting "YOU BAD MAN, YOU THAT GUY!" (I know full well I am NOT "that guy" as I have had no interaction with anyone outside my group, not even a female, I came to meet friends for dinner and then was leaving) He is getting cloer and closer and looking like he might get physical. So what do I do? I SMILE and I keep smiling. I pretend I dont even know what he is talking about and just keep smiling sweetly at him. I casually look around and sure enough: there is a group of Thai men peeking around the corner 100 meters away, they keep checking to see if I get into it with their friend, so I just keep smiling and he calms down and backs away and I get into my taxi. That's it. I could be wrong but the situation felt like the friends were going to jump in as soon as the instigator started something with ANYONE.

Another example would be the few times a Thai man bumped into ME at a bar and started to get angry, I just smiled them away. If I was drunk perhaps I would have gotten angry and escalated the situation?

Damian

What kind of reporter would consider reporting the facts a mistake here in Thailand?

A: An honest one

Perhaps, however some people over the past few days feel that he was sensationalizing the case and now he wants to let everyone know that he is contrite.

Sensasionalised how exactly? Give me examples from his article please. The case IS sensational enough all on its own, I dont think he added to that personally but prove me wrong.

Damian

Sounds great.

Damian

So I've been playing around with my new iPhone, and came across a few questions I could find the answer to...

How do I access the phone's file system from my PC? I'm thinking something like iFuntastic, but that's only for Intel-based Macs. (I'm on Vista Ultimate.) I also found iBricker, but seems that it doesn't work with 1.1.2

Also... so now apparently I've got the PSX emulator and pdf reader on the phone (can't find the program to read text/word docs)... and no way to transfer the files to the phone to read/use. iTunes only allows syncing of music/vids/podcasts/pictures.

Another thing is, what format videos can be synced in? So far, it seems only my mpeg vids can be synced through iTunes.

Out of the box, the YouTube and Yahoo! mail functions don't work either. There're fixes out there, but I've no idea what they did to unlock the phone over at MBK, so I can't find a solution. (Will probably have to bring it back to the shop for that one.)

Anyone knows what to do?

... Damian?

Thanks heaps guys!

iBricker doesnt work with 1.1.2? You sure? I'll take a look online....

ibricker is what you need to transfer any kind of file other than the sync ones.

Just try installing those apps, go through them, install it, try it and uninstall it if you dont like it. Most important is to install summerboard so you can have room on your screen for all the new programs, the text reader program is in the list of apps in the installer.

Videos should be in mp4 format to sync but itunes will convert mpeg videos for you if you want. Use another program called something like "Apollo video to ipod converter", you can download all kinds of ipod converter programs or you can go to pantip and buy a disc with converter programs on it.

If youtube and yahoo arent working Im thinking you are not connected to the internet, have you figured out connecting to the internet?

Damian

10? Boy or girl? The psp is better due to the many many things it can do (look at pics, browse internet, play music, play video, play games obviously, use homebrew programs to do things like look at text files, emulate a pda, read comics)... but not sure if a 10 year old would appreciate all that. Also the DS has more kiddie games... however a 10 year old BOY might very well be more into the psp with its huge selction of violent games heh, if that doesnt bother you. Im pretty sure there are alot more psp games than ds, I have over 200 psp games and I dont have them all. Also its very easy to get psp games and the psp you buy at mbk will already be able to play copied games.... not too sure about the ds but I know they can play copy games too... I think!

Damian

Well, Damian, nothing has changed. Thailand is still the relatively peaceful country it always has been and many farang have found a way being kind neighbors. There is a way to live peacefully, deferentially, and happily here and there is a way to attract violence here if that is what people choose. We just want to make sure they are making an informed choice. Many travellers feel that Thailand is a place where they can mouth off to Thais and be disrespectful with impunity - decidedly not so! They may get away with it for a while, but it will ultimately catch up to them. Karma's a b*tch! Walk slowly and drink lots of water and smile. Rise with the sun and tuck in early. Most of all, enjoy each day!

Yes something has definately changed oh my god! Thailand 10 years ago is not like Thailand today. It is definately more dangerous for foreigners. Im not saying its not the foreigners fault, perhaps when too many tourists start coming to a place it goes downhill, perhaps western influence too fast is a bad thing, I dont know, but this place has changed ALOT. I do agree with you about how to behave, when I see a farang arguing loudly or being rude to a Thai I wonder if that farang has a death wish or is really that stupid..... but really... should we have to worry about our mortal safety over an argument? No. It is sad that we do.

Journalist I never said someone in power needs to change everything, I truly dont believe anything can be changed. And CERTAINLY nothing is going to be changed by any group of foreigners.... this isnt the civil rights movement in the United States by American citizens you mentioned, this is non citizens with no power or voice at all.... unless there is international pressure for monetary or political reasons.

Damian

I agree to a large extent, and fatalism sometimes seems like the only answer. Foreigners can change things though (and people who gainsay that might as well go and retire to the cemetry right now!) and you do form a natural bloc. And you do have rights. Amnesty International had to start somewhere.

But in your last four words - therein is the solution. How does it pan out?

Brainstorming...

-write letters to key national newspapers aborad

-distribute leaflets at the airport

-Be the spokesmen who journalists look to speak to when killings like this happen.

Make a noise.

You really believe this? Well it is an interesting thought. I personally would think anyone doing this would be deported at the least never to return.

Damian

^ No, not facetious.

Damien is voicing the same complaint again and again, saying that someone at the top needs to do something. Thats not the solution.

An agent for change comes from the underclasses, the ignored. So be that agent for change. There's no more ideal constituency than this one to initiate it.

Get a sub-forum where it can be discussed. There's plenty of reporters here who would give you quotes and publicity.

BARRYMAN, you made your whole post up! No where do all the FACTS you listed actually exist! It is JUST YOUR OPINION.

Journalist I never said someone in power needs to change everything, I truly dont believe anything can be changed. And CERTAINLY nothing is going to be changed by any group of foreigners.... this isnt the civil rights movement in the United States by American citizens you mentioned, this is non citizens with no power or voice at all.... unless there is international pressure for monetary or political reasons. But even then... when the police killed all those people during the drug killings (over 2000?) and the military killed those muslims stacking them in the back of a truck like fire wood ALIVE and they made Thailand look VERY bad did anything get done or change? I dont know.

Lovedablues, I am out and about alot more than you perhaps? I'm younger than your average poster so am hanging out in different crowds? I am always sober and calm and smile even when (especially when) I feel like trouble is starting. If I was drunk I doubt I'd react in the best way to diffuse a situation.... why do you think so many violent crimes here almost always involve alcohol?

Damian

This is the whole problem that we have been trying to get through to the more "resistant" of posters. There is NOTHING that can be done to get any other result other than what the police want, they can block all attempts at every turn. AND THIS IS THE WHOLE REASON WE COMPLAIN! There isnt even a chance that the victims (whether guilty or not of instigation themselves) can get a fair chance. The only way to get anything done with the police is to pressure them from above, if someone with power or sway over them says "do this" they will do it, otherwise they protect themselves by any means necessary.

The major issue is that if YOU or ME was put in a similar situation (and dont say it would never happen to you because YOU KNOW how to behave in Thailand, random acts and unlucky things DO happen to good people!) we would be portrayed as bad people no matter what our personalities and they would find a way to pressure the situation so you could do nothing to protect yourself or seek justice. Look at me as an example, I have never had a drink or drugs in my life, but GARUANTEED the initial police statement would be that I was drunk and ornery and causing trouble. There would be other made up stories to cloud the situation (like I wasnt nice or I was rude or I was "fighting" with my non existent Thai girlfriend etc...) and it would look a little like somehow the end result was not actually the fault of the perpetrator but of myself and that is just plain wrong.

Alot of people posting here so desperately want to believe the victims are at fault for DEATH because it makes you feel a little safer and secure thinking that as long as you always act accordingly nothing bad will happen to you. I've avoided at least 20 bad situations here because I WAS SOBER, I'll fully admit that, but there have been a few situations I couldnt avoid no matter what I did or said. If a bad situation arises with someone that is "Connected" it wont matter how polite Ive always been or how sober, I will be the bad guy no matter what and that sucks.

Damian

The Canadian Embassy is a lot meeker even than the Brits here and it would be a big but pleasant surprise to see them bring in the Mounties.

Actually our fifth Dan blunderbuss seems to want to emulate this fellow Hoser Hero.

Why are you getting personal buddy?

Damian