bangon04

When the Thai immigration dept introduced the 90 day visa exempt limit (1^st Oct 2006), they gave an example of how it was to be calculated. They gave the dates of 7 separate visits by a tourist, along with the accrued 6-month total. These figures , except for one anomaly (which I put down to a typo), fitted exactly to a rolling 6-month model. The figures would certainly not fit the model(s) quoted on this thread. Does this mean that they now calculate the total in a different way – if so has this been documented? Does anyone have a copy of the original example? It does not really make sense to work on anything other than a rolling 6-month model. My two full passports are dotted with many Thai visa exempt stamps (in no chronological order). It would be impossible for an immigration officer manually to work out my stays on the model quoted on this thread. Difficult enough on a rolling 6-month system. Lopburi, you usually give the definitive answer, please help me make sense of all this. Whilst on the subject let me give my sincere thanks for all the useful information you have given and are still giving. It has proved invaluable in allowing me to be properly prepared for my visits to the authorities. You deserve a lite-beer, cheers.

In my experience April 2007, i was stopped at BKK immigration and referred to a senior immigration officer because the desk official had counted more than 90 days using all her fingers and toes (very slowly with 2 recounts). The senior guy sat me down and explained the system to me as the above mentioned Rolling 6 month period. ie counting 6 month period from the first entry 6 months prior to that day eg I was stopped on the 10th April, so he went back and counted days from my entry on 14th October. In the end we did discover that the desk officer was a few toes short, so he gave me a stamp for a few days and advised me to do a border run. (He was sympathetic - nay almost apologetic - because I always enter/exit through BKK and I never stay for than 15-20 days at a time. He as good as said that this is not what they are looking for.

This year I was faced with the similar scenario - my solution was to renew my passport. No questions asked at all. Clearly they do not have computer access to previous stays. Either that or they are not worried about airport entry tourists.

Does anyone know of a situation where the computer records have indeed been used?

There computer is indexed on name, country, and birthdate from what I hear. So if it is just two passports from the same country, they would probably pick it up. If it is from two different countries, maybe not.

What do you think happens if you simply renew your passport (because it is full of oversized Thai border stamps) and present them with a clean new passport?

There computer is indexed on name, country, and birthdate from what I hear. So if it is just two passports from the same country, they would probably pick it up. If it is from two different countries, maybe not.

So can the computer tell them the dates and duration of previous stays? Why the embarassing finger counting?

Yes, but it is 90 days in 6 months for the visa exempt entries. If you do 3 back to back leaving and coming back in the same day, you will really only get 88 days because the day you make the border run will count as the last day on one entry, and the first day on the new entry, counting twice.

So you have the 88 days, and 90 days of your visa, again losing days if you go out on your visa and come right back in, because it will count as the last day of your visa and the first day of your visa exempt stay.

Then there are about 182.5 days in 6 months, so overall you would probably wind up about a week short of being able to alternate back and forth. So if you just want to alternate, you will be short. That does not mean that you cant get two visas in a row, then get the visa exempt stamps, then the visas again.

Double entry visas are doable in Vientiane, so that would help a lot.

Also, it is probably best to not use up all 90 days of your visa exempt entries and then go for a visa. This could leave you locked out of the country if for some reason your visa was denied. Best to keep at least one 30 entry in reserve so that if you get denied, you can still re-enter Thailand and either make plans to leave, or plan another visa run to another consulate.

Thanks for doing the maths. I understand that the tourist visa usually takes 2 working days to process anyway, so this would take up some of the slack??

terminology:

Visa exempt entry - Entry into Thailand without a consulate issued visa. Just show up at the border with your passport, and they give you a stamp that says you can stay for 30 days. Most western countries are allowed 30 days on each entry for a maximum of 90 days in a 6 month period.

Visa - something you apply for at a consulate or embassy. Many different kinds, but for a tourist visa, you can get a single entry, double entry or triple entry depending on where you apply and what the consulate feels. For most western countries, this allows you to remain for 60 days after entering Thailand, and then before the 60 days is finished, you can go to immigration within Thailand and extend your stay for 7 or 30 days (usually 30 days, but sometimes they will only give 7 days if you do not have a plane ticket). Entries using a consulate/embassy issued visa do not count towards the 90 days in 6 month limit for visa exempt entries.

Visa on Arrival - A visa that is applied for at the airport or border in Thailand. Mostly for developing countries that are not allowed visa exempt entries, usually only good for 15 days. Western countries usually cannot get these, and would instead use a visa exempt entry.

So to answer your question, you are only allowed to remain in Thailand for 90 days in a six month period using visa exempt entries. if you want to be here longer than that, then you need to get a visa from a consulate for the remaining days of the six month period. Best to not use all 90 days of your visa exempt entries before getting a visa, because if you are denied the visa, you would not be able to re-enter Thailand because you would be at the limit of the days on a visa exempt entry.

I have lots of stamps in my passport for 2 or 3 days exempt visa stays. I always travel through Cobra Swamp airport, never the land crossings. I have to endure the sight of fully qualified immigration officers counting (slowly) on their fingers to add up the total days I have stayed in Thailand. Sometimes I feel that they are ready to count their toes too.

The obvious thought occurs that they only need to do this because they do not have the information on their computer screens. They rely on the stamps to tell them about previous stays.

Logically, if you present them with a clean / new passport, they cannot apply the 180 day rule so must start again..... So if you have 2 passports you can rest one and switch to the other. Then you will be able to comply with the 90 days in 180 rule indefinitely....

Can you see a flaw in my logic?

1) Yes, 60 days for a tourist visa for most western countries. Can usually be extended for 30 additional days at immigration in Thailand.

2) I have heard of people getting 2 or 3 double entry visas in a row. Possible until they decide not to give you one. Things change all the time, so it is really hard to say.

3) 30 days extension. Some people have been asked to show a ticket leaving at the end of the 30 days and did not have one, so they only got 7 days. But 30 days is the norm.

The way it was explained to me - if you pay for a 60 day Tourist Visa, with a single entry, you can add on / buy an extension of 30 days at the immigration office in BKK, THEN at the end of the extension you leave Thailand for a day and then start a FRESH 180 day period where you can use the 30 day visa waiver rule (ie 90 days - 3 visa runs). Then you buy another tourist visa. In this way you can stay indefinitely as long as you submit for the Tourist Visa on a regular basis. Does anyone have experience of this?