Phil Clark

Joe,

The procedure you outline above looks to be an ‘under the table’ arrangement and goes against the fundamentals of what I imagine even the most knowledgeable on this forum believe to be the current rules.

The first and most obvious point is how a 30 Day Tourist Visa Exemption can be ‘converted’ to a Non-Immigrant ‘B’ Visa. I believe that visa classifications can be converted in certain circumstances, but that does not seem to apply here.

The Tourist Visa Exemption merely allows you to stay in the Kingdom for 30 days: it is not a visa, so one wonders how it can be converted. It might be a different story if you had a Tourist Visa, but from what you say that is not the case.

It gets worse in as far as your application for a Non-Imm ‘B’ visa would be made under false pretences as the job you have supposedly been offered is de facto fictitious.

I have little doubt that you could get a multiple entry Non-Imm ‘B’ via this route. Anything is possible with corrupt officials, if such beings exist.

The fee required suggests it is hardly above-board, even without the agent's cut.

There is, however, more.

As far as I am aware, on a initial multiple Non-Imm ‘B’ you have to leave the country every 90 days, despite the fact that your visa covers a twelve month period from the date you first arrive in the Kingdom. I thought it was along the lines of a multiple Tourist Visa, albeit for 90 not 60 day periods.

Would I be right in assuming you think you do not have to exit every 90 Days? The slant of your questions suggests you are thinking in terms of a 90 Day reporting requirement but perhaps I am reading too much into it.

I have little experience with multiple Non-Imm ‘B’ visas and am happy to be corrected for the sake of others as they need factual details of latest practices, but my understanding is that to stay in the Kingdom permanently for one year on such a visa requires an application made with a Work Permit, not the promise of a job whether real or not.

I somehow doubt that an automatic Work Permit is part of the deal? If it is, then you are about to skate on even thinner ice.

I know of no-one having never taken such a path as you are contemplating and I doubt have many others. Even if they have, I suspect they would not be prepared to prove it.

We shall of course see.

Just my two satang, but when you leave the country every 90 Days I would not like to be in your shoes at an Immigration Control point if an eager Officer tracked through your Passport and queried the validity of your visa, especially if the issuing Officer had moved on.

The route you are contemplating is one to be avoided in my view, but as the sayings go: “Up to you!” and “Caveat emptor!”

Hi Guys,

            Re the little gifts for Immigration officals, the lady with the long dark hair who fed all your details onto the computer and asked for 500baht for the "computer" was not there when I renewed my visa in Nov. at Pattaya Soi 8. So nothing was asked for and nothing was offered. I suggest everyone does the same, ie. don't offer. I've heard some guys in the past say it would be worth X 000's baht to get their visa, but remember if one person pays, the rest of us are expected to do the same. Just my 2 pence worth!   MonsH.

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Blimey! Who gave 500baht? I gave 100 baht once, and 50 baht for an address certificate - again, just once. But this "over-tipping" is a problem for all expats actually living (retired or working) in Thailand. Tourists flushed with their year's worth of holiday money, throw it around like it's going out of fashion, thinking they are impressing their new "friends" but what they don't realise it that it sets a standard for people who are here 52 weeks a year to live up to. And ex-pats who say to the immigration staff things like "this visa is worth so much to me", deserve shooting!

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I could not agree more about the stupidity of saying such things to Immigration Officers and giving them money when there is no need. All that does is encourage some Officers to try it on as their expectations have been raised. If and when they were to try it on and were refused, their veto in terms of the discretion they are supposedly allowed on a case by case basis could quickly come into play because they have again become accustomed to dropsy.

As for the 500 Baht, that was a different story altogether and it happened to me when I applied for my first extension earlier this year (March). When the woman officer had finished entering my details, she turned to me and said: “500 Baht for use computer.” This was not a ‘tip’ instigated by me, it was a clear demand for payment made in front of two other officers. It was obvious to me that it was a con, but was I going to make a fuss and jeopardize getting the extension? Not likely, I just paid up.

Last week I successfully applied for a second year, but this time no such demand was made and I certainly did not offer. Perhaps the new Chief is playing it by the book?

That said, the more people who bung the officers then the higher the chance it will become the norm. If Immigration play by the rules, why tempt them if you are a legit applicant?

Phil Clark

With respect ..... Astral and Dr Pat are not both wrong.

What they are saying is what the Imm Law/Rules are.

If one office chooses to shortcut the rules, that is their decision and in this case it is a reasonable judgement to not require the Visa be a Non Imm O if the retiree has all the other requirements in place. But it does not follow the Rules.

I think the important question is  .... did you or someone you know actually get this 1yr retirement extension, or is this just something you have heard thru the grapevine ? Do you know or have you seen the Passport with the Retirement Stamp and no Non Imm O ???

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Perhaps this knowall will post the stamp here. Personal details can be removed.

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Mr Pong,

Sorry, but I refuse to address you as ‘Dr.’ because judging from your petulance I do not believe you have that qualification. Moreover, why would you use it on a board such as this? It does little to impress me. Perhaps you are having a chuckle and it is short for: ‘Drongo’?

You refer to me as a ‘knowall’ (sic). I can assure you that I am far away from such a dizzy or lowly status, especially when it comes to matters concerning Thai Immigration flavours. All I do is share what I know to be fact at the time.

You obviously do not recall that we had the same debate a year ago and I did provide the evidence. You actually replied, somewhat reluctantly, and agreed that what I had put forward appeared to be the case. Not one person refuted the ‘evidence’, which was:

Accept it or not, in Pattaya several people I know have availed themselves of the facility since, whether you choose to believe it or otherwise.

“paulfr” at least had the decency to politely question this (as I did a year ago) yet you chose the classic snide one-liner for which you are well known. Why do you do that?

I have left my reply for a day or so as my second annual extension of my Non-Imm. ‘O’ Visa on the grounds of retirement was due. I wanted to ask the officer I know what their policy now is.

Happily having my extension until December 2005 stamped in my Passport, I asked him as to whether it was still possible for a Tourist Visa to be extended in Soi 8, as I showed him copies of the above pics.

Rather than go into too much detail, it would seem that: “each case is now considered on its own merit”. From his demeanour, I somehow do not think that is the ‘company line’ for all now. There has been a shake-up and I found it interesting that the ex-Chief Front Desk ‘Under-the-Table’ Clerk now seems to have been promoted.

Make of the above what you will, but as I said before, if anyone is coming in to Thailand with the intention of applying for a year’s extension on the grounds of retirement, they should come in on a Non-Immigrant ‘O’ Visa. It may well still be possible on a Tourist Visa in Pattaya, but I suspect there may be certain hurdles to negotiate so why bother if you do not have to?

I don't believe there is any provision for extending a Tourist Visa for one year.

The Non Imm O is a different matter and can be extended on the basis of:

Marriage

Work Permit

Education

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I agree Astral.

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Well you are clearly both wrong.

I am going through the retirement 1 yr extension application

process right now.

1/ You cannot get the 1yr ret extension from a Tourist Visa.

    Imm at Suan Plu BKK will make you convert to a Non Imm O

    first.  So get the Non Imm O at the Thai Embassy in your

    country to save time, expense and hassle

That may well be the case at Suan Plu, but they will extend a Tourist Visa for Retirement purposes at Soi 8 in Pattaya with no conversion to a Non-Imm ‘O’.

Although it may be futile trying to apply logic to Immigration procedures, I really cannot see the point in them changing a Tourist Visa to a Non-Immigrant ‘O’ just so they can give the extension, nor why the rules should be different in BKK.

In Pattaya, the wording etc used for the extension is exactly the same whether you extend a Tourist or Non-Imm ‘O’: they simply extend your permission to stay in the Kingdom to one year following your date of entry.

Whatever, anyone intending to apply for an extension on the grounds of Retirement is best advised to come in on a Non-Immigrant ‘O’, in my opinion, as at least the rules there seem to be clear.

Thanks Doc! Top was actually the one I used last time so I will try City Clinic.

Does anyone have a relatively recent firsthand experience of getting a Doctor's Certificate in the area from Pattaya Tai to Jomtien? I need to get one for the renewal of my ‘O’ Visa extension in a day or three.

Yes, I know there are clinics everywhere, but would appreciate a recommendation for one in the area above from someone who has recently used one.

Last year I used one in Pratumnak Road and the guy was a tad over-keen for my liking. Thirty minutes for a Doctor's Certificate and 200 Baht? I am as fit as a butcher’s dog but why he needed to know if I had ever had German Measles, Chickenpox etc as a child made me shake my head, followed by his failed intention amongst other things to make me cough if you know what I mean.

Somewhere easy to park nearby would be good, too.

Thanks for any info.

Phil

This artcle was published in The Pattaya Trader recently:

KING OF THE ROAD

By

Will Baring

Being a passenger in any motorized vehicle in Thailand could be justifiably described as unwise. To actually drive oneself runs the risk of being labelled mentally unstable, despite personal driving skills.

Thai drivers are much maligned for their perceived lack of road sense, particularly by farang. Of course farang believe they know better and in some cases may have the notion of commonsense on their side. Have you ever wondered why a Thai driver who only escapes death by the fact that you stood on the brake looks at you in complete bewilderment? Why you have given him/her the single-digit salute as your mouth moves uncontrollably whilst your face contorts is a total mystery to the person whose life you spared. Most often, Farang wish they had not bothered hitting the brake when they realise that their act of saving another's life is met with contempt. Many a time they wish they had run over them and then reversed over their head, just to make sure they got the bastard.

Perhaps the biggest difficulty from the farang perspective is the failure to grasp the fundamental principle of Thai driving. The classic Thai driver knows exactly where he/she wants to go and sees absolutely no reason why their intentions should be shared with anyone else. Yes, of course, they may well have a last minute change of strategy, but that is their right as they have the freedom of choice. It is not the business of others to be apprised of where they are going in advance. That is why those amber winking lights on vehicles are regarded as a recreational addition to the drivers' enjoyment of the driving experience. Flashing lights, including those at junctions where the traffic lights have given up the ghost, are regarded only for their entertainment value. As a driver approaches a T-junction with the 'clear' intention of turning left, the very sight of the winking light on the driver's side of the vehicle adds to the feeling of independence. To put on the hazards causing all the lights to flash at once is bordering on the orgasmic. They appear blissfully unaware that fellow road users may glean some meaning from their antics; some may even believe they have a mechanical problem.

Regardless, certain drivers firmly believe this is the internationally recognised way of indicating the intention of going straight ahead at a crossroads, regardless of the fact they will turn either left or right at their whim.

It should be obvious that the use of rear-view mirrors is optional as far as the law may be concerned, yet obligatory from a Thai social standing point of view.

From the male perspective, mirrors are a must to ensure that nose picking is executed in a stylish manner. From the female perspective, whilst nose picking is far from out of the question, the primary purpose of any mirror is for checking and re-applying make up.

There are of course fundamental physiological differences vis-à-vis Farang and other races, one of which is seemingly endemic to the Thai. I refer to peripheral vision. Should horse racing ever become the rage in Thailand, the sports press will not have to waste time suffixing the names of the Thai horses with 'B', as it will be assumed they are all blinkered, allowing them only to see what is directly in front of them through a six inch tunnel of vision. Anything left or right of their main focus is guaranteed not to interfere with their chosen path, because as far as they are concerned there is nothing there in the first place.

I cannot leave this topic without mentioning the Thai ladies who drive top of the range motors, typically silver in colour although distinguishable by other factors. The mainstream dead giveaways include: the car is apparently being driven on autopilot as there is no sign of a head protruding above the driver's seat; the car is travelling at slightly faster than buffalo strolling pace; the person in control of the vehicle seems to have no idea where it wants to go and is prone to unexpectedly stop in order to practice a thirty-nine point turn whilst attempting to park. The antithesis of the Thai female 'quality' car driver is of course the Thai male. These most often soon-to-be Non-Performing Loans are easy to spot. The speeds they employ are either foot to the floor or dead stop (the latter speed usually due to ramming the vehicle in front). They seems to have some misconception that any lane in which they choose to travel should be clear at all times. If some selfish motorist has the audacity to get in their way, despite the fact that the traffic ahead would only be avoidable if they were in a helicopter, the automatic reaction is to tailgate them from a distance of less than a foot whilst flashing their headlights. If this scare tactic does not work, then they will dart in on the inside and take off a layer of paint as they gain that imperative vehicle length advantage by cutting back in.

The above may come across as suggestive that Thai drivers are not as well versed in driving skills, common courtesy, road etiquette and the sense they were born with as farang. That, whilst empirically speaking being not far from the truth, is not always the case: cue the Farang King of the Road!

I of course allude to some of the inadequates who need to look down on other road users from their lofty driving position behind the wheel of a 4 WD vehicle. These specimens live in their own little world and certainly do seem to believe that they are invincible. Why oh why they delude themselves by mentally placing themselves in the make believe and exalted position of road supremo is quite beyond me. I have many theories but the fundamental has to be an inferiority complex.

Perhaps they were bullied at school; they have no friends as people think they are tossers; their genitals are so small that paid for company laughs out loud that at them even after they have swallowed a four pack of Vitamin V; they always wanted to be a lorry driver or Fireman since the age of seven. There are many more possible reasons but I think you will get the gist of the breed.

Of course not all drivers of such vehicles never to be used for the purpose they were designed are arrogant inadequates devoid of the required skills to control of the vehicles they mistakenly believe give them 'status'. The inability to be able to: keep their vehicle within the boundaries of their chosen lane, park in a space that a novice Tour Bus driver could drive into without reversing and to show a modicum of regard to other road users are but a few of their traits.

Many of these people delude themselves by truly believing other road users revere them. The sad truth is that many are seen for the incompetent, dangerous and arrogant pains in the arse they so often prove themselves to be.

Much criticism is directed at Thai drivers by farang and often justifiably so in my view. That said, whilst many Thai drivers are indeed a menace, the farang ‘Kings of the Road’ in their inappropriate conveyances are an infuriating nuisance who give farang drivers in general a bad name.

Time they gave themselves a reality check methinks. I bet that several of the people I am referring to will read this and sagely nod, as they do not see themselves as the subject.

The 'I'm a great driver!' syndrome is sadly an incurable condition once the sufferer has been crowned 'King of the Road'…

Humm...the TPV are an insult to every law abiding boy scout!

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Yes, but they seem to have a awe-inspiring collection of merit badges!

Dr Pong, I think you are out of line with the "moo" reference. Any civilized society is going to require a well-trained and respectable police force.

But it seems apparent that the TPV's are neither and hence garner more than their share of malice because of it.

I have no time for a group of untrained and pompous wannabes searching for that respect they never got back in the real world.

And anyone with a work permit knows that immigration issues thrm for a particular type of job at a certain location. Obviously TPV's would be in violation of the law, whether they are doing anything of worth (debateable) or not. Paid or unpaid, same same.

The character in the middle of the picture below was very prominent most evenings in October on Walking St of this year. I'm not talking about the real police on the right or the pooying on the left who was my excuse for taking the picture! Anyone know him?

(Yeah Dave, it's me!)

~WISteve

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That looks very much like a Kiwi by the name of Brian Brizzell.

Whats the score with these volunteer Farang Plod?

Are they just jumped up no marks who want to feel important or are they actually experienced former coppers who are providing a decent service to tourists?

All I can seem to find on them is that they are the former rather than the latter and I'd appreciate any feedback on them.

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Many of them indirectly work for Easy Snacks, rewarded via a commission-based compensation package.

Their task is to visit established businesses in the Pattaya area that already serve food.

They come in as a threesome and explain that the proprietor must sign up with them, if they know what is good for them.

Confirm or deny, Howard, or have they not yet cut you in?

If you do not know about this, you are therefore either a liar or a fool.

Ask your 'Boss'.

Cheere Tot's

Hmmmm Phill so kindly pointed out tha Howard has 2 identities PCN and HTV

So who is Phill ??

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I am the one who has asked Howard the Volunteer the following questions:

1. Why did you join the Tourist Police Volunteers?

2. How did you join, were you approached or did you apply?

3. Do the Authorities have anything on you?

4. Was it suggested that if you did not comply then your current visa status etc might be reviewed?

5. What are your duties and the purpose of your role?

6. What powers do you have?

7. Do they supply you with a Work Permit (WP’s are issued for a particular ‘job’ so one you may already have is inapplicable, may the ‘job’ be non-paying or not).

8. Are you not concerned about the bad reputation volunteers have as the motive for enlisting is, to say the least, questionable?

9. Are you not concerned that some of the lowlife that exists in Pattaya may get to you before you, in their minds, get to them?

10.  What would you do if you stepped in to a situation, potential or otherwise, and the farang told you to get lost or else?

For some reason he stubbornly refuses to answer.

One can but only wonder why...

Mr Clark,

I won't answer your questions because this thread is nothing to do with me being a TPV, that subject is closed for now, as far as I am concerned, accept it or not.

Part of your post interests me. I can't say too much because I believe direct accusations naming businesses or individuals is not permitted. I urge you though to make a complaint to the Tourist Police Station if you have ever been approached by Ferrangs wearing ID badges whilst trying to sell you convenience food. This is not the first case of this happening and it must be stopped but can only be stopped if people complain about this. There are two officers you should complain to: Police Captain Chirawat or Police Captain Siam from the Tourist Police. If you dont complain, NOTHING can be done. If they have made any threats towards you, this is wrong and must be stopped. If you wish to discuss this matter with me personally please IM me with your mobile number and I will call you.

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The misplaced supercilious content and tone of your words is actually quite astonishing.

I posed some very simple questions to you, yet for some reason you have buried them in your ‘too difficult’ basket.

Why?

This thread was started by you and you are a Thai Police Volunteer.

Is that not the case?

Are you not ‘working’ for Pattaya City News, the front man of which is also one of the farang cosy TPV club and of dubious pedigree?

You chose to sign yourself as Howard as you spammed the board under the guise of Pattaya City News.

True?

I wonder why that was allowed, unless you have something on the Webmaster? If that is the case (and I hope it is not the case), why are you being allowed to get away with it on this board?

You and your credibility therefore have everything to do with this thread. Your background and involvement as a ‘TPV’ are fundamental, as is the extremely tolerant attitude of the Management of Thaivisa.com.

You now pompously tell me that the TPV subject is closed?

Sorry, Mr Howard the Volunteer, it will not be closed just because you say it is.

All you are doing is succeeding in confirming many in the view that there is something very wrong here.

You now want me to IM you and give you my Mobile Number?

Thanks for the offer, but I would prefer it if you IM me and give me your mobile number.

I will then call you back, saving you money in the process as it could be a lengthy exchange. I am only thinking in terms of your cost of telephoning, as I am sure you were mine.

Worry not, I can afford any call whatever the duration and will regard it as a Public Service.

I await your IM and look forward to a nice chat.

My Very Best Regards,

Phil Clark

PS. If you yet again plead the fifth on the simple TPV questions, I will go out of my way to meet you face to face when you are ‘on duty’. You will not be hard to spot, as I have seen you mincing around many times. I look forward to the chat, if you are allowed to talk without a brownshirt taking notes after he has copied my Passport.

hmmm

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Thanks so much for your extensive input; I am sure many members are deep in thought as they weigh up its merits whilst considering the ostensibly absent profundity.

It certainly must be very deep.

How strange that Howard has yet again failed to answer simple questions that many Pattaya visitors and expats alike are asking.

Let’s face it, they are not exactly difficult questions, so what is his problem?

He obviously has not lost the ability to post, as his recent begging letter demonstrates.

Sorry if I sound impatient, but I am trying to be fair and balanced. I just want him to answer the questions before I up the ante by quizzing him about prevalent rumours that Farang Volunteer Tourist Police are threatening local businesses by trying to coerce them to use certain trade suppliers of fast food.

The greater the silence there is from those ‘in authority’, the louder the rumours will become.

Are they nothing more than malicious rumours, Howard?

I will take a lack of response as confirmation of their validity and spread the news accordingly, not that the current talk on the street will need any help.

Pattaya City News has been asked by Khun Tawit, the Chairman of Pattaya City Council to undertake an email campaign to support their case to revert back to the 2 am bar closing times. We would like as many people as possible to send an email to us and every sensible email will be printed out and presented to the Council Chairman personally. Although I cannot guarantee this will have any effect, I would like to do my bit helped by members of this board to try and get the new regulations reversed. The fact that he asked me to arrange this gives me some hope that something can be done. I will keep you informed of developments on this board as they happen.

Please send your emails to: [email protected]

Please give your name and location (not full address). Please mention your thailand experience (If you live here, how long have you done so; if you holiday here how many times have you come here and would you consider not coming to Pattaya anymore because of the new regulations).

In the interests of fairness, if you support the new regulations, your emails will also be forwarded.

Please support this campaign, maybe we can make a difference.

Many Thanks

Howard

Pattaya City News.

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Well, if the Chairman of Pattaya City Council has to ask farang Tourist Volunteer Police hacks to make an impression on the powers that be, then it seems likely that Viagra sales will be ‘up’ soon as impotence is obviously on the rise.

A farang-driven e-mail campaign to persuade Thai Officialdom to change its mind?

What a ridiculous notion!

Howard, you must think we are as thick as you seem to be.

I see that you have the time to come out with this nonsense, yet lack the inclination to answer previous posts querying the purpose of the farang Tourist Volunteer Police.

Hmmm, I wonder why that is?

If you cannot recall one of many such requests, then I refer you to this:

The Farang Tourist Volunteer Police presence has to be the most contentious issue to hit the Newsgroups, Chat Rooms, Discussion Boards et al since the debacle caused by rumours alluding to visa exemption regulation changes and early closing panic warnings manifested themselves, only to die a predictable death as they were bul***hit.

The latter two turned out to be cr*p, as expected, although the former issue has more sinister implications as it is real.

We actually see these farang striding around full of their own self-importance as they sport some cra*py T-shirt that they had to buy with their own money to elevate themselves to the level of the ‘unwashed’ (so some might say).

I happen to know of several of the ‘volunteers’ but am in many ways happy to state that I do not know them on much more than a nodding basis. I have always been careful with whom I mix as guilt by assocation has to be a consideration so whilst I know some of these people, avoiding them will hardly cause a stir as they cannot set me up for something I have not done.

Despite certain websites strangely deleting any mention of these ‘volunteers’, Thai oriented websites whose members consist of farang continue to debate the issue, just as Thaivisa.com does.

What I find interesting is the high profile that one of the already maligned volunteers adopts. I, of course, refer to the member of this forum who calls himself ‘******* the Volunteer’.

The conundrum to me is the fact that ****** does not make a very clear, simple statement to explain the obvious, so I will ask him ten simple questions:

1. Why did you join the Tourist Police Volunteers?

2. How did you join, were you approached or did you apply?

3. Do the Authorities have anything on you?

4. Was it suggested that if you did not comply then your current visa status etc might be reviewed?

5. What are your duties and the purpose of your role?

6. What powers do you have?

7. Do they supply you with a Work Permit (WP’s are issued for a particular ‘job’ so one you may already have is inapplicable, may the ‘job’ be non-paying or not).

8. Are you not concerned about the bad reputation volunteers have as the motive for enlisting is, to say the least, questionable?

9. Are you not concerned that some of the lowlife that exists in Pattaya may get to you before you, in their minds, get to them?

10.  What would you do if you stepped in to a situation, potential or otherwise, and the farang told you to get lost or else?

Until the above questions are satisfactorily answered, I suggest that anyone wearing a T-shirt telling but not telling the world who and what they are supposed to be, then the so-called volunteers are putting themselves in jeopardy and undermining any good intentions they may or may not have.

Apologies if the above ruffles any feathers, but to my mind the only crime I can be accused of is stating the obvious. I also apologise if the answers to the above were in the thread that was deleted.

There are many genuine expat’s such as myself who wonder what lengths these volunteers will go to to retain their as currently is ‘dubious’ status.

Either way, it is time for the ‘defensive’ volunteer(s) to either put up or shut up.

Once we know what they are really all about, we can treat them accordingly.

It should not be that difficult, should it?

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I await your comments, but doubt any will be forthcoming.

How transparently sad if that is the case.

PS. Oh, of course, if you cannot answer the farang Tourist Volunteer Police questions, then perhaps Khun Tawit can?

Please be sure to forward this mail to him and openly copy me when you do.

Hey I was just trying to help.

"You can lead a horse to water, but you can't force it to drink"

Suit yourself.

shrug. 

I will suit myself, thanks for the guidance.

You are right with your analogy to horses, especially when there is no water at the prescribed destination, only: “daalah”. The horses tend to sense a bull a mile off and shun their droppings, so I have been told.

I may have wrongly assumed that by: “daalah” you were transliterating the Thai slang for ‘BS’?

No offence intended, but are you from a Southern State of the United variety?

Drawl could explain the ‘interesting’ transliteration and there is nothing wrong with that (apart from my interpretation perhaps, which is doubtless equally wrong to a different ear).

Subject closed as far as I am concerned.

Just to make a general point to all, when one is not knowledgeable on a certain subject, it is probably wise to exercise restraint in the advice field as others may end up wasting their time etc. Erroneous advice, however well-intended, is best left unsaid in my view unless supported by some semblance of factual personal experience. Even then it does not necessarily mean that others will be treated the same.

I will wait and see as to how I get on with my quest with TOT to the end before I make it known as to how it went. If it all goes pear-shaped or I succeed, either way I will post my findings so that others can benefit from a real experience, not conjecture based on what a similar experience with a different organisation suggested should be the case. I hope that others also share what happened in their own real experiences, detailing all that actually happened.

Beware the Barroom Barristers!

[shrug] [sigh] [grin]

Phil Clark: You must understand that in Thailand it would ALWAYS be a waste of time to expect the telco to contact you for anything. You MUST push them again and again if you want anything done.  Generally they should not take more than two weeks about this, anything more is daalah.  You need to choose an ISP (See above for some price details) and a plan (256/128 is plenty) and buy a router ("adsl modem"). The telco will sell you one or you can buy it in any well equipped computer store.  Any model will work but of course if you need help with it you need to either make sure the shop will help you or that you get a model that the telco is familiar with.

Madsere,

Thanks very much for your advice as I am sure it was well-intentioned.

However, when a senior member of staff at a “Telco” specifically and ostensibly knowledgeably states a piece of information as fact, I see absolutely no point in pushing them in the manner you suggest. All that does is cause friction and even if they were fobbing me off (they were not in the case, or so I now believe), all that would do is cause the member of staff to lose face with consequent barriers being raised. It may work with a junior, but not necessarily with a more senior member of staff.

As I previously stated, they told me after much discussion that nothing would happen until at least two months.

You state that anything over two weeks is “daalah”.

I can just imagine me going back in day after day or week after week once your quoted two week “daalah” period had expired only to be asked: “Now which part of nothing can happen within two months did you not understand?’

I have lived in Thailand many years; I am not just off the boat.

Rather than go through the rest of your comments blow by blow, I will just point out that I was, as stated in my post, referring specifically to TOT, not T.T.T.

There are clearly fundamental differences as far as ISP options, modem sales and support, costs etc are concerned between the two organisations. Perhaps that is where some confusion has arisen?

Sorry to have troubled you, I will leave you to wrestle with your own T.T.T., C.A.T./GBLX problems and wish you success in solving them. I will carry on with my own quest with TOT in Pattaya and hope I get there in the end. I will not be holding my breath, despite the excellent progress in terms of contacts made and information received when I spoke with the Branch Manager of TOT at Pattaya Klang at length today.

I suspect there may be a long road to travel down yet!

Chok dee!.

Phil

I have absolutely no idea about the technical side of ADSL and would appreciate some very basic help from the experts.

I ‘signed up’ with TOT on Pattaya Klang back in mid-July. They advised me that their Engineer would not be able to visit my house to do whatever he has to do for at least two months, so I am not bleating about the delay. That said, I plan to call in tomorrow to check on the status as trying to get any sense by phone is a waste of time.

Provided they are eventually able to use my existing TOT line for ADSL, what are the next steps that I need to take? What sort of equipment do I need to buy etc? No doubt they will tell me what they think is best for me (or them), but I would like to hear from those who understand the alternatives/options.

Another basic question concerns the need for an ISP. Do I need to have a separate ISP or is all that handled as part of the TOT package?

I currently have a dial-up account with CSLoxinfo which gives me three e-mail addresses that I would ideally like to retain, although that is not a critical factor. I am currently on their Web 100 plan which costs me 900 baht per month for 120 hours connection time. From my uninformed way of thinking, that plan will no longer be appropriate as I will not be using dial-up once I have ADSL installed. Is there some alternative plan I need to switch to with CSLoxinfo (if I need to stay with them) and if so, what are the monthly charges?

Thanks very much for any help.

Phil, ADSL-challenged

I telephoned the Gf this morning and said to her I was born on 1956, how old am I. She told me I am 48 or 49 depending on the way you look at it.

Spose it's similar to Thai timekeeping. If they say they will call on you at 10am, they mean anytime between 10.00 and 10.59. Mind you even with that leeway, they'r still usually late!!. Think I will apply for retirement visa after 49th birthday , next March and see what happens. If successful will post result

I wish you every success but I would not hold your breath.

I tried the same tack with the officer by the name of Pallop at Soi Suan Plu last year in BKK.

He just laughed as he carefully explained as if talking to a child as to how I should calculate how old I was.

That said, you may strike lucky and get someone who does not bother checking the age you state or you may come across an officer who is lazy and/or mathematically challenged and does not want to lose face.

It will only cost 1,900 Baht plus cost of certified letters/reports to find out so go for it as if you are successful you will save a bundle.

I think the odds are very slim but best of luck!

Pattaya Immigration offices are closed on weekends.

It always used to be the case that they would allow you to extend on the Monday if the due date fell on a weekend.

However, a good couple or so years ago they changed the rules so that you had to apply on a working day before the due date if it fell on a weekend.

I found this out the hard way as they fined me two days overstay and made me wait hours before telling me to come back the next day only to be made to wait again for an age.

That said, on subsequent occasions they did date the extension from the correct date when it fell on a weekend. Again, nothing is ever certain as it may well depend on the officer in question on any given day.

Will they issue a new passport if you are only here on a tourist visa? I heard many embassys only do this for people with work permits?

I was issued a new British passport four years ago by the British Embassy in Bangkok whilst on a Tourist Visa.

I did not even visit the Embassy, I just posted everything off and the new passport plus clipped old one were returned within a week.

The women in the Consular office whom I spoke with on the phone was extremely helpful.

No doubt she was fired for gross competence...

Cant  verify  or  deny  it  100%......but  i  have  a  friend  who  has  been  here  since  last  December  on  a  Non  Immigrant  O  multiple  entry.....he/s  54  and  decided  this  week  to  go  down  to  Immigration  in  Pattaya  to  try  for  a  1yr  extension.....all  they  required  was  proof  of  800k  in  the  bank  and  a  medical  certificate.....he  has  a  Thai  bank  account  but  no  passbook  for  some  reason, this  didnt  bother  them......all  they  asked  for  was  a  letter  from  the  bank. He  dropped  his  passport  off  one  day  paid  the  1900 baht  fee  and  500  tea  money  and  picked  up  his  passport  the  next  day  complete  with  1 yr  extension  (obviously  the  extension  did  run  from  the  date  of  his  last  entry  into  Thailand  and  not  from  when  he  applied  for  the  extension)...........they  did  tell  him  however  in  a  round  about  way  that  if  there  was  no  tea  money  they  would  give  him  the  run  around  before  granting  the  extension!   

How much tea money was expected Flyer ?

The way it worked for me and several friends in recent months was that the female officer would tap in your details and then say: "You must pay 500 Baht for use computer".

Like me, they all paid as jeopardising the extension for 500 Baht did not seem a wise move when you consider the potential cost of the alternative.

To legally retire out here the Immigration people want to see 80,000 baht per month coming in to your account, or a holding of 800,000 baht. This holding has to be money that is used - not a static deposit. So really you are looking at similar figures.

The monthly income required for an 'O' extension on the grounds of retirement is 65,000 baht per month, not 80,000 unless there has been a recent change.

Have they increased the requirement?

If you go the funds in the bank route, to my knowledge there is no requirement to demonstrate that you have used the 800,000 baht when you renew.

The Farang Tourist Volunteer Police presence has to be the most contentious issue to hit the Newsgroups, Chat Rooms, Discussion Boards et al since the debacle caused by rumours alluding to visa exemption regulation changes and early closing panic warnings manifested themselves, only to die a predictable death as they were bul***hit.

The latter two turned out to be cr*p, as expected, although the former issue has more sinister implications as it is real.

We actually see these farang striding around full of their own self-importance as they sport some cra*py T-shirt that they had to buy with their own money to elevate themselves to the level of the ‘unwashed’ (so some might say).

I happen to know of several of the ‘volunteers’ but am in many ways happy to state that I do not know them on much more than a nodding basis. I have always been careful with whom I mix as guilt by assocation has to be a consideration so whilst I know some of these people, avoiding them will hardly cause a stir as they cannot set me up for something I have not done.

Despite certain websites strangely deleting any mention of these ‘volunteers’, Thai oriented websites whose members consist of farang continue to debate the issue, just as Thaivisa.com does.

What I find interesting is the high profile that one of the already maligned volunteers adopts. I, of course, refer to the member of this forum who calls himself ‘******* the Volunteer’.

The conundrum to me is the fact that ****** does not make a very clear, simple statement to explain the obvious, so I will ask him ten simple questions:

1. Why did you join the Tourist Police Volunteers?

2. How did you join, were you approached or did you apply?

3. Do the Authorities have anything on you?

4. Was it suggested that if you did not comply then your current visa status etc might be reviewed?

5. What are your duties and the purpose of your role?

6. What powers do you have?

7. Do they supply you with a Work Permit (WP’s are issued for a particular ‘job’ so one you may already have is inapplicable, may the ‘job’ be non-paying or not).

8. Are you not concerned about the bad reputation volunteers have as the motive for enlisting is, to say the least, questionable?

9. Are you not concerned that some of the lowlife that exists in Pattaya may get to you before you, in their minds, get to them?

10. What would you do if you stepped in to a situation, potential or otherwise, and the farang told you to get lost or else?

Until the above questions are satisfactorily answered, I suggest that anyone wearing a T-shirt telling but not telling the world who and what they are supposed to be, then the so-called volunteers are putting themselves in jeopardy and undermining any good intentions they may or may not have.

Apologies if the above ruffles any feathers, but to my mind the only crime I can be accused of is stating the obvious. I also apologise if the answers to the above were in the thread that was deleted.

There are many genuine expat’s such as myself who wonder what lengths these volunteers will go to to retain their as currently is ‘dubious’ status.

Either way, it is time for the ‘defensive’ volunteer(s) to either put up or shut up.

Once we know what they are really all about, we can treat them accordingly.

It should not be that difficult, should it?

The only company I know of that is held in high regard is Master safety Enterprises - Dutch guy called Andre owns and runs it - been in Thailand about 20 years.  Never heard a bad word against him.    They have a web site and advertise in things like Pattaya Trader. 

I can definitely recommend Andre's company. Very professional and excellent after sales service.

Like most people, I had an alarm system installed AFTER I was burgled.

That said, two weeks after it was installed it foiled a second attempt.

Click on http://www.thaisecurity.com/

It is best if you already have an International Driving Permit,

otherwise you will have to take a written test and a driving test, in you own vehicle.

Not necessarily so, from my experience.

I applied presenting only a UK Driving Licence, which also includes a full motorcycle licence.

I was not required to take either written or physical driving tests to obtain both car and motorcycle Thai Driving Licences.

This was in March 2004.