deepskyfreak

Women, kids and the elderly are aksed to leave rally by 3pm. Vehicle to take them home provided. Well, I hope they are welcomed outside the rally site not just by soldiers alone but nurses, psychologists and a couple of monks to give them a feeling of being treated well in Thai society. Some of them might have been in there for weeks, listening to radical speeches and seeing hate, shootings, fire and murder fro both sides. It won't be easy for many to coe back to regular life.

I feel sad for them. But I have no mercy for their rogue, bloodthirsty leaders and their fellow protesters who now turn to be looters.

For the 100th time. Abhisit offered elections a year early. These morons are only concerned with burning Bangkok to the ground and getting their criminal hero back in power. It's really that simple. I don't understand why some people are calling this some kind people power thing. This is about one guy and his inability to accept defeat.

If Thaksin comes back and is PM again, that's when I'll truly pray for the people of Thailand.

A mountain of evidence could fall on some people and they would still refuse to see the facts. They don't let facts get in the way of an opinion already cemented in place.

Just like all of those brain-dead conspiracy-believers claiming the WTC was blown up by CIA and the moon landings were fake. Now they discuss over Abhisit conspiracies and doctored BBC reports showing, in fact, fake snipers or staged riots. If it wasn't so tragic, I would laugh all day long, even though I know it's a waste of time...

For the 100th time. Abhisit offered elections a year early. These morons are only concerned with burning Bangkok to the ground and getting their criminal hero back in power. It's really that simple. I don't understand why some people are calling this some kind people power thing. This is about one guy and his inability to accept defeat.

If Thaksin comes back and is PM again, that's when I'll truly pray for the people of Thailand.

So why did he refuse to give a date to dissolve parliament? A date to dissolve parliament is needed in order to register the official election date with the Election Commission. Otherwise a promise of an election date is worthless. He kept saying "you can calculate it yourself" and refused to give an answer. Why?

Exactly that's why Thailand is in such trouble. Because of this tit-for-tat "..but this is not clear enough.." Count yourself as one of those folks unable to move forward for the sake of a nation of 66 million people.

Shame on the Farangs here supporting this red group is all I can say

really guys…. what is wrong with your thinking?

Get a grip on reality… really no joke.... this is embarrassing to hear, coming from supposedly educated folks

Don't assume that "Farang" equals well-educated or smart. Some yes. Many self-proclaimed rescuers of Thai society - no. Their brains don't go much further than beyond the horizon of a bar table and your doggy might actually be smart in comparison...

doest it means than all administrations, like immigration office, will be closed ????

my friend ed visa finish on 18, he is on his eay to bangkok................

some one know somethings ????????? please

Go to Kanchanaburi Immigration... 125 km, 2 hrs on bus, 198 Baht return, southern bus term. get it there. Or Nakhon Pathom, 60km (if there is an Immi? don't know)

Is there any notification from Bank of Thailand? Will banks close or not?

Sure closed... go by express boat to Nonthaburi, 40min ride... different province there... from the pier it's 100m to several banks.

Excellent!! Time to go on a shopping spree ... uhh... nevermind

Doesn't count for Nonthaburi... Sh§!#*

So we have one armed blackshirt.. One guy shooting a Grenade.. And the army guys in the truck..

Versus..

100's possibly 1000's of youtube clips of army firing, including BBC, Al Jazera, CNN, and 100's of blogers and people on the street..

Your point is...that you are surprised that the military is using weapons, as announced, against criminals?

UNARMED protesters Journalists etc you can see the video of them being shot unarmed you cannot deny it even shot while already hit and shot 2 more times while on the ground

NO EXCUSE

Have you ever been in the armed service? Or with the police force or even security guard?

Fired a rifle?

A black-clad man crawling behind cover at a distance with other men (that actively throw things at the soldiers etc) isn't easily IDed as a journalist!

If he was more than a 'freelancer' he would have done what CNN and other outlets reporters did, sport a blue helmet and vest...

There are rules to bring the situation back to normal. The unarmed civilians are criminals. The police and military are trying to protect public property and their rule is: Don't torch or destroy it and stay away from zones that we created to disengage clashing people/forces and bring back a calm situation.

The thugs ignore those orders. So they are shot at, as announced by the military. No Excuse.

It is the red leaders' fault not to distance themselves from those criminals in the first place. They allowed them in, now they cannot control them. They even think that their destructive behavior is good for the cause.

Never in history have riots like this one brought about a sustainable improvement of a situation.

I think you all live in a dream world, or you are too preoccupied with tit-for-tat revenge and hatred to see the big picture.

This is not a revolution where 2,000,000 people demand justified change - this is a riot instigated by a frustrated, revenge-seeking billionaire who manages to drag along narrow-minded "leaders of the poor" who promise their supporters a paradise in Thailand by getting rid of the elite. They are so blind that they do not even realize that ALL their supporters in the background are just another rich elite, waiting for the cake to be split up between them.

I know real leaders of the poor, such as Krutee Roigaew of Chiang Rai. He and his team have managed to bring change to communities in the North - unarmed, using existing laws, uniting people peacefully for their cause and by creating an understanding of their wishes (with authorities). And guess what - it works, slowly, but it works.

Riots and hardline views are tools that only create resistance. The reds should clean up the mess out in their home-provinces first before going to BKK and creating trouble there.

95% of you folks who blast your unrealistic views into the air in this forum neither speak the language, nor have they worked for many years in Thailand or have a clear picture of what was going on during Thaksins rule. You only know the 30-Baht scheme. And the pointless throwing away of a million Baht for every Tumbon, a measure which has brought nothing to sustainably improve communities. Wow. You have no clue how vote-buying worked, how opposition leaders were removed, TV-Channels were taken over by eliminating critical journalists, tax-money used to finance projects of his firms, expensive short-term measures ntroduced in rural areas but with no follow-up mainenance of the projects, lawyers killed for acting against land-grabs by Thaksins cronies, etc, etc...

Live, learn and look around for a little longer before you decide if you really support that.

TNN: Khunying Potjaman left Thailand for Singapore. Chavalit to Kunming & Banharn will fly to HK.

Looks like my countries finest are taking a day of from ochestrating peace, and understanding.

Hope not Thaksin and Potjaman are going to hold a sleep-inn in Amsterdam like John and Ono for world peace

Noooooo, Potjaman and Banharn have just gone for weekend shopping as Central World is still closed. And Big Jiu might be in Kunming looking for a Chinese bird

http://www.ems.bangkok.go.th/report/listdead%2022.00.pdf

If you read Thai, they are not all male. Female included in the list of dead.

sorry chantorn to go over your head with the play on words : mail EMS

EMS or "Suun Erawan" - I believe Erawan Medical Service, the English abbr. does not match the Thai meaning word by word.

BTW - one female on the list - age 32.

Don't you have something better to do than to scream at Unknown farangs on a message board.

It is not farang that are fighting is it.

It is you Thais that are killing each other.

Get a clue.

And it farangs like you who moraly support the bad elements in our society.like some here on this forum, by spreading false information about how good Thaksin was/is and how bad Khun Abhisit.

Sorry to all you nice one who condemn the redshirt violence

Hey, iciparis, do not take things in this forum to serious! Most Thais realize within little time that the crap so many farangs spit out in Thailand is just hot air. Today they might admire them for their ideas but their inability move things forward in Thailand becomes obvious very soon. Those farangs who are helpful parts in Thai society don't make big stories of their successes. And they are just as frustrated with all those bar-stool strategists complaining about Thai society while watching the tragedy with a beer in one hand and a prostitute in the other. Just ignore them.

Which PM in the last 5 years pacified the country?

Thaksin was the one that divided it with his corruption, power trips and attempts at becoming a dictator (he missed out on controlling the army, but controlled everything else).

Abhisit is trying to mend the divide. Thaksin is doing all he can to stop him.

I remember well an interview in which Thaksin said (at the beginning of his second term in office): "Thai Rak Thai will be the ruling force in Thailand for the next 20 years and I will most likely be the prime minister" He said that with his disgusting, perfidious smile...

He also mentioned that police would take over security in some sois within closed zone from soldiers.

Hmm...sure that will make the army lads up front full of confidence about whose got their backs.

Police intends to bring security to residents in the cordonned off zone. The army guys are not experienced in policing and might face more resistance than police.

What a disgrace. Shooting at 70% women and children now

Indeed it is .

Reading 101, you fail.

The shots are NOT aimed at women and kids.

Infact, there are mostly young males being wounded by anything these last 24 hours. As they are attacking the army lines.

The army has no will to try to break through - only way to reach the old women and kids - the red lines to start firing at a few hundred sitting down eating.

So, please, do tell us, where is the army firing at women and kids at will?

Good - finally someone who has the FACTS and not post just mere speculation.

Can you please name the source for this- "mostly young males being wounded"? What is their total number? They attacked the army lines with what kind of weapons?

And what about the dead ones? 22 was the last number i heard, all civilians. mostly young males as well?

And the others, outside this 'mostly' group, what kind of people, what age group?

And also good to hear that the army will not fire at women and children. That will set some minds at rest. A couple of posters were really worried about them. All-clear now.

Please keep us updated.

The news I heart on Ch9 around 9pm was 22 dead, all male (confirmed by hospitals) and 172 wounded, 11 wounded in critical condition. Source was a phone interview with a high ranking police officer. He also mentioned that police would take over security in some sois within closed zone from soldiers.

<br />Any idea which weapon the this is?

just your standard m16, although with scope added

That's what I thought.

Would they be using M16's for sniping?

Yes, good enough for 300-400m

Had the chance to use it in an international military shooting competition many years ago. Participants were exchanging their natioanl weapons during training sessions.

Men in Black firing an M79(?) in a video: http://bit.ly/agMA2t /via @sternos @tulsathit

Peaceful reds but they only use their hands , how can this be can true must be photo shopped

Good video . No soldier dead so far . I have seen few other video showing army shooting

Now do you think killings by either side is going to put an end to divisions in Thailand ?

CNN reporting Thai soldier amongst latest fatalities

no more details..

black guards launched a couple of M79 from an empty 30-storey bldg under construction near rajprasong, according to a thai army officer in a phone interview on ch9 not long ago.

PM says not to believe everything you hear on the news as it is happening and things need to be verified. Lots of innacurate reports coming out ... at least initially

(FYI: GF is translating for me. So, maybe not getting this all exactly right)

Hi time to learn Thai, eh...

good point. finally someone who has a little bit of a clue whats going on in TH.

(quote)

well said and by the way, I don't think there is anyone here who would not rather see no red's in Bangkok and the country in peace with the first decent government working on improving peoples life. Oh, forgot this is besides the red supporters here.

But no, Thaksin wants none of that, he wants back and become president for life and the people who would have actually benefited the most from the governments reforms are busy destroying the countries economy to make sure that hubndreds of thousands of Isanies that work in the tourist industry are going to be out of a job and in the process, they are going to learn what real poverty means pretty soon.

All those Isanies who are not part of this red mob can thank them for your suffering in the future, you can not blame the government for it.

(quote)

What wrecks people's lives in Isan is not bad govt in BKK or anti-Isan policies by the same. It's a lack of proper and just implementation of policies. The responsible people for this implementation are the corrupt local "Nais" and "Thans" (polite for Mister and Sir) out there in Isan and the North. Most of them are from the provinces themselves and they just exploit their own people and then blame it on Bangkok. In the meanwhile they drive fancy new SUVs, live in 400 sqm houses surrounded by 20 rai of beautiful orchards and make villagers believe that the world is unjust. Same goes for most of the police boys out there in the provinces. I have always wondered (actually I know it...), how a policeman on 9,000 Baht a month can afford a brandnew 1,5m Baht SUV.

No doubt that many red protesters are genuine with their demands and have a point. Their leaders, though, are crooks.

(quote)

good point, but this is not only the case in Isaan, its a kind of national thing with the police. However, instead of creating anarchy in Bangkok, the reds should better be beating the &lt;deleted&gt; out of their local "leaders" ... oh hang on, they love their leaders don't they ? like the crooks on their stage here ..... the problem is simply, they are ... well there are really no other words sorry - stupid, dumb or thick, to realize anything except what their leaders tell them and believe anything they are told by them. Otherwise they would have realized reality by now and gone home

(quote)

I would say that there are 2 main streams of protesters: Those from the provinces who blindly follow their leaders and believe whatever they say (out of lack of education, opportunity of free discussion and intellectual isolation in their provincal village) and, jobless, moneyless opportunists who saw a few hundred Baht a day or the opportunity to loot and steel or bring some heroic adventure into their anyway miserable life. Their lack of education does not let them realize the dramatic impact they cause on Thailand and finally their own existance. The leaders have lost reality as well. They see millions they invested into the protests float away if they loose their "just battle". It is simply an all-or-nothing attempt to secure either future powerlessness and loss of money or, bring down the govt and then be rewarded with goodie jobs in the new administration. And therewith an opportunity to make up (and gain) on what they invested.

The true humanists and lovers of life and justice have long left the stage...

Just tell me, all of you blood thirsty western people; What would happen in your streets if your government removed all social benefits in your country.

Do you think they would bring out grenades and molotov cocktails?

And which government has removed any social benefits? The current government has started a old age pension, has made education free to 15 or 18 years old, and has made the health care free and actually funded the health system to provide for the people going to the hospitals (Thaksin had 30-baht health-care, which cost more to administer than 30-baht, and didn't fund the health system to cater for the extra people going there).

good point. finally someone who has a little bit of a clue whats going on in TH.

well said and by the way, I don't think there is anyone here who would not rather see no red's in Bangkok and the country in peace with the first decent government working on improving peoples life. Oh, forgot this is besides the red supporters here.

But no, Thaksin wants none of that, he wants back and become president for life and the people who would have actually benefited the most from the governments reforms are busy destroying the countries economy to make sure that hubndreds of thousands of Isanies that work in the tourist industry are going to be out of a job and in the process, they are going to learn what real poverty means pretty soon.

All those Isanies who are not part of this red mob can thank them for your suffering in the future, you can not blame the government for it.

What wrecks people's lives in Isan is not bad govt in BKK or anti-Isan policies by the same. It's a lack of proper and just implementation of policies. The responsible people for this implementation are the corrupt local "Nais" and "Thans" (polite for Mister and Sir) out there in Isan and the North. Most of them are from the provinces themselves and they just exploit their own people and then blame it on Bangkok. In the meanwhile they drive fancy new SUVs, live in 400 sqm houses surrounded by 20 rai of beautiful orchards and make villagers believe that the world is unjust. Same goes for most of the police boys out there in the provinces. I have always wondered (actually I know it...), how a policeman on 9,000 Baht a month can afford a brandnew 1,5m Baht SUV.

No doubt that many red protesters are genuine with their demands and have a point. Their leaders, though, are crooks.

Just tell me, all of you blood thirsty western people; What would happen in your streets if your government removed all social benefits in your country.

Do you think they would bring out grenades and molotov cocktails?

And which government has removed any social benefits? The current government has started a old age pension, has made education free to 15 or 18 years old, and has made the health care free and actually funded the health system to provide for the people going to the hospitals (Thaksin had 30-baht health-care, which cost more to administer than 30-baht, and didn't fund the health system to cater for the extra people going there).

good point. finally someone who has a little bit of a clue whats going on in TH.

I saw this on the updates,

THE NAION: Army: the 7-step is still on. "light -harsh" measures being taken because "most' of protesters R Thais.

Aren't "all" the protesters Thai?

No, there are some idiot, self-declared "Save Thailand" farangs out there, advising the reds on democracy and how to fight. Now they can play hero and mercenary and later boast their stories to some girls in a Sukhumvit bar... hilarious

are we to presume that these individuals were just shot by the authorities for being in the wrong place at the wrong time?

might be this picture.

http://img16.imageshack.us/img16/1023/2893...09094778009.jpg

That is some fuc_kin photo!!

this what we call army peacful means!!!!! hhh

And this is the red shirts' peaceful means....

Yes you never know. I have seen people killed from a single stray ball-bearing under the helmet (from a suicide vest). The guy just walked a few steps, then sat down, then laid down then just expired before anyone even knew he was hit. I've also seen people survive multiple rounds from a .50 cal (not in the head though) which I would not have thought possible.

Obviously even a glancing blow to the skull can still mess you up for good. A brain is just not supposed to be sloshed around like that.

Reminds me of a Polish comrade (military) of ours who was hit in the head. The projectile traversed his forehead along the skull bone and exited on the other side, leaving the brain stem and major blood vessels undamaged. He died a couple of days later when his brain started to swell from infections. Seh Daeng's chances of surviving the hit are indeed very low...

You are not a very respectful guest here. You obviously would like to tell the Thais how to run their country. That's pretty arrogant of you. Why not go home? Maybe no one their respects you?

Will you get over the guest crap.

We live in Thailand. We support Thai families. We have Thai friends. We pay Thai taxes. We work with Thais. We employ Thais.

We are not guests.

Maybe on your next border run you will discover the door can close for you. You don't seem to comprehend that it doesn't matter if you work or pay taxes orhow many times you've renewed your visa. Everyone with a bank account pays taxes even if they are not residing in Thailand. Only when you have been granted Thai citizenship can you claim to be Thai. Where you reside temporarily only make you a temporary guest. You're visa only gave you a right to enter the country not a say in how it is run. Get over it. Face it, you're just visiting here!

If you don't like the rules, pack your bags and go back to your homeland.

I'm not claiming to be Thai, but I plan to be residing here for a long time.

I am paying my way to be here. I am supporting other people here. I have family and friends here.

I have an opinion. This is a forum where I am allowed to express that opinion.

If you don't like farangs expressing their opinions about Thailand on a Thailand focussed web site, why do you bother reading it?

Hm, guests we are?

Well, quite a few "guests" have been invited to Thailand as advisers in governmental institutions - suggesting to the Thais how to work more efficiently/effectively. Hey, and some get even paid! What a surprise. Guests paid by Thai govt for an opinion - amazing Thailand.

With that in mind, it is understandable that so many guests train their opinion-expressing skills in this forum.

Maybe I should go to local Amphoe and ask them to issue a guest card for me... in addition to the Tabien Baan entry.

Yes, (The) Clashes Continue (between members), Turning Central Bangkok (Thaivisa Forum) In Virtual Warzone

. Its amazing so many big egos fit in this one little forum

Thailand's intellectual enrichment...