think_too_mut

I agree that it will take a while for those levels to return, but the traditional sources - such as Northern Europe - have been replaced already by Middle Easterners, Indians, and those from elsewhere in Southeast Asia.

What you probably don't know is that every weekend there are at least six, and often as many as 15, overseas property exhibitions in Singapore. That's on top of the 40+ pages of property ads in The Straits Times newspaper. Singaporeans are nuts about property and what's attractive about Thailand for them is that it's cheap. For the price of a top-end development in Bangkok you can barely buy a mass-market HDB flat in Singapore. Singaporeans will increase their buying activities in Thailand over the coming months and years because it's still largely off-the-radar at the moment.

That difference in price was even starker 5-6 years ago and hardly anyone had noticed anything significant coming from Singapore.

What is happening now is rather that there are only Singaporeans left in the game so it's hard not to notice them when there is nobody else. Americans, EUR zone...all with their own woes.

Then take (add up) formerly marginal markets of Russia, Middle East and India and you get some activity...but that's a far cry from 2002-2008.

In good days, buyers are flocking into Bankok, not sellers going to their place and claim a trimphant sale when in fact only 20% of the merchandise is just "deposited" and has not left the ground yet.

I've been a journalist for many years and I'm fully aware of what constitutes PR hype. The units that were sold in Singapore were the subject of legally-binding contracts for which the deposit amount was substantially larger than THB 20,000. Obviously buyers need to conduct due dilligence to ensure they are entirely happy with all aspects of their purchase - but this story is just one of many that have been published this year which indicates that Thailand property is becoming increasingly popular with overseas investors. That's a fact.

It's going to take years or forever before "popularity of Thailand property" returns to 30% of the level it had been until mid 2008.

The fact is, the source of money for "popular Thailand property" has gone bust. Then you get desperate attempts like one above that tells quite a different "fact". For Mickey Mouse deposit money they declare properties (to be build in 3 years) "sold". Even with alchemy like that , not more than 20%.

This is the first time I've seen this strategy (developer having a global launch in Singapore) for a Thailand property. It happens fairly often for London developments and I've also seen it for Sydney and Melbourne projects in the last six months too. This was also the first time that SC Asset has taken any of its projects overseas - so they must be extremely happy.

The fact is that Singaporeans' interest in Thailand property is growing. Knight Frank Thailand noted it was already happening in Phuket and we're seeing it now in Bangkok. There's hardly a weekend that goes by without a Thailand developer exhibiting in Singapore. Normally it's Phuket or Pattaya, and occasionally Bangkok. Amazon Residences (Pattaya), The Charm (Phuket) and Circle (Bangkok) have been to Singapore in the last few months - and Mahanakorn and Raimon Land are fairly regular exhibitors too.

Just read again:

The 28-storey freehold condominium, which will feature 265 units, is expected to be completed by the end of 2015. It will comprise 183 one-bedroom units (from 35 sqm to 53 sqm), 39 two-bedroom units (from 66 sqm to 77 sqm), 33 duplex apartments (from 82 sqm to 110 sqm) and 10 penthouses (from 86 sqm to 100 sqm).

Prices for sales achieved in Singapore were between THB 174,650 and THB 188,000 per sqm for units on the 16th floors and above, according to the SQFT Global Properties, the Singapore real estate agent responsible for the launch event.

That says, 20% of the units were booked with whatever booking fee may be, could be as low as 20,000B. Nothing had been, nor could be, sold, completion is in 2015. Even if all the interested walk away from their deposits, the advertisment like article quoted here will have done more than a much more expensive campaign.

When I bought my unit, a smallish development at the former open air bbq restaurant, corner Sukhumvit and if I recall correctly very Soi 34, units were going (completed, ready to move in) for 60K baht per sqm. This one is 3+ times that. Right, not same level of luxury but still. At that, oil and steel are at half or third the price they were in mid 2008 when I bought.

You really need to drop a bombshell like Singapore "sale" to launch bombastically with those who don't know the place and are unaware of the oversupply around.

One more thing, foreigners buying in Thai would not be eble to get a loan in Thai easily. When they buy in Singapore, they can, its Singapore rule of law.

To me, looks more like a PR exercise than real business.

Classifieds, in the local papers, notice boards at supermarkets, walk in condo receptions and ask and also look at agents. 10k will get you a reasonable place in Jomtien. Normal is one month and one month in advance. Some posters will say stay away from agents as they are more expensive, that just isnt true, commissions are paid by the owner. If you go it alone you have no comeback when anything needs doing and it is unlikely you will get all your deposit, if any back, whereas through an agent you will not have these problems. Electric should be around 4 baht a unit and water 20 Baht, make sure you ask first.

Agree.

Those renting directly (to avoid 1 month rent agent fee) and advertise with handwriten cardboard signs won't give any contract or may conjure up something in Thai.

If they were keen to avoid 1 month fee to an agent, how eager they may be when deposit return time comes?

Pattaya with kids, any time. More than 2 weeks of sightseing and attractions without even hitting the (bad) beach.

The sleeze? Never came up, been to Pattaya more than 50 times, Jomtien. Could be a year worth of stay over 10 years. The main reason was Pattaya Water Park, for the kid.

There could be a parallel world that we have enjoyed but it does exist.

Poor George. He has not traveled much and brought this junk article to the admiring public, as a teenage googler.

Mickey Moyse BTS does as much ferrying per month as most (of many) of Tokyo rail companies do per day.

2 million passengers through Shinjuku station, daily. Daily, more than 4 months worth of the BTS mickey mouse chuggy on all stations together.

If BTS were in Tokyo, it would have had not only 4 carriages, it would have had a circular of 150km long ring composition bumper to bumper going around the city. And that would be only 1 line, out of dozens.

Edit; you can make a substandard rail system crowded anywhere, in Nairobi, without doing much value to the economy.

That's what mickey mouse BTS is. Incomplete, out of the needs, solved nothing about traffic jams.

The BTS is NOT a public transport system. More likely, a "manifestation of it".

Im guessing you missed the satire.

people can be thick

On second reading, the article was a satire indeed. I apologize for jumping to what I said.

Been to that place 2 times in Osaka. It is supposedly open in Bangkok now, at Siam Paragon.

Great day for kids.

Would be different sponsoring busineses in Thai (not ANA airways for piloting, flight attendant roles but Thai Airways). And all others would be Thai centric, which is normal as long as they provide same experience for kids.

http://www.kidzania.com/kzjournal/eng/?tag=kidzania-bangkok

Anyone been there or knows if it is operational now?

... The better schools recruit almost exclusively from abroad and offer 'foriegn hire' contracts, which are loaded with all the benefits mentioned above and much more. If you are a qualifed teacher (usually meaning that you are licensed in your home country) you would seriously be selling yourself short if you accepted a local hire contract anywhere.

My daughter is in full blown International school in Japan. Just compared the prices with Bangkok Pattana school.

What is for her 800,000THB for next year in Japan, it's 600,000THB at BKK Pattana.

One thing, the classes in Japan always have 2 teachers: class owner, a native speaker, professional teacher with experience from their native country + assistant teacher, a Japanese national bilingual or excellent English, also a professional and certified teacher.

The class last year had 12 students (went to 14) and 2 teachers. Always. So daily duties of a teacher are shared, the assistant doing home work checking and all the admin tasks.

One of the teachers told me that they are "a chain of people" who circulate around the world and their next post will see them inheriting furniture and fittings from the teacher who is leaving for another place. People out of the chain can step in but will be fully certified and experienced teachers from 1 of 7 (only those 7) English speaking countries.

Can't imagine a local, unless going for assistant teacher and native Japanese, could break in.

Salaries are not significantly higher than in their native countries (~40-50K US$ a year) but housing and opportunity to put their own children into the school for 30% of the price and get them out of the creaking US education is a great boon. 4 times 3 years and their kids are at Uni age.

There was a huge condo tower built in soi 1Sth Sathorn back in the late 90's called Pantip Tower. They wanted 90,000 b per month which at the time was two times more than Sukhumvit rates. You even had to pay a fortune to put a phone line in !

Not surprisingly the place was mostly empty. There were a couple of units that appeared to be occupied (pot plants on the balcony) , i bet they were relatives of the developers. Free rent. Thais certainly wouldnt pay for it.

You can build a large house in the provinces for 500,000 b... lock up stage.

I'd really like to know where and who can build a house for 500k baht? we're getting ready to have one built in a small remote village in Issan and 500k baht won't get very far.

This house, Wang Nam Yen, was 120K baht. hundredtwenty. The guy (a farang) paid that much for building materials. The family was building 2 houses at the same time, next to each other (rightmost is a glimpse of that other house), all labour was from the family at no cost. OK, hardly anyone can pull that off, just trying to say what the basic cost is.

The house has western kitchen (fittings not included in 120K) and bathroom, aircon-ready, 90sqm. Been in it, tiles on the floor.

This one, nearby, was for sale for 250K baht, probably 300sqm. In need of renovation throughout. A policeman bought it, refurbished and now it's for sale 500K .

Poor George. He has not traveled much and brought this junk article to the admiring public, as a teenage googler.

Mickey Moyse BTS does as much ferrying per month as most (of many) of Tokyo rail companies do per day.

2 million passengers through Shinjuku station, daily. Daily, more than 4 months worth of the BTS mickey mouse chuggy on all stations together.

If BTS were in Tokyo, it would have had not only 4 carriages, it would have had a circular of 150km long ring composition bumper to bumper going around the city. And that would be only 1 line, out of dozens.

Edit; you can make a substandard rail system crowded anywhere, in Nairobi, without doing much value to the economy.

That's what mickey mouse BTS is. Incomplete, out of the needs, solved nothing about traffic jams.

The BTS is NOT a public transport system. More likely, a "manifestation of it".

Condo's are where the funny money is spent (hidden)

That could be the blurr westerners love to embrace.

Rich Thais, to park their money and show to the creditors what they have when applying for more credit to advance their businesses, that coul be it.

No interest in leasing, selling or anything. Just to insert that value figure in their applications, where they may have more than 1 property under their belt, perhaps dozens.

To verify what I am saying, in a Mickey Mouse way, just click on American Express Credit Card application - the property you own is essential.

Of course, they (rich Thais) are way above that, but the priciple is the same.

Khao Takiab has many condos with very few lights on, however they were all sold befor completion and most started at over 5 million.....its not an indicator as to whether they are sold or not. People own condos for holidays or maybe just a crashpad in the city. Thailand is a totally different market to Spain so thats like apples and oranges.

I would say, Hua Hin is not an example. That place has always been expensive, rich Thais getting a retreat home.

Some buildings even have rooms in the parking area of the building (40-50 box size dormitories, in the parking), where your driver rests while you are doing a woman upstairs.

Sorry, I believe HH is not a good example.

Cheap. But a bit of a dump.

A "bit" bargirl central and pisshead long stay tourists.

The mosque makes a racket too

http://www.thaivisa....khumvit-soi-71/

RAZZ

I would concur with that.

Absolutely no reason to, of all of Bangkok, live next to a mosque (their loud prayers over loudspeakers). I could stay there if a package tour placed me into some accommodation or somebody invited me to stay with them. But no way I would pay to live there, neither rent nor purchase.

The location is not cheap out of nothing. If you think, the proximity (and not that close) of BTS does not save you from taking a taxi after bi-weekly or monthly shopping at "near" Lotus or CareFour at OnNut.

My family had lived at Sukhumvit+, corner of Rama IV and Sukhumvit, Phrakhanong station 50m away. They had never used the BTS, no reason to go anywhere that BTS services.

The beach is not really suitable for small kids, in fact other than long walk, not good for anyone for what beaches are thought to be for. The water is murky most of the time, stray dogs and hardly anyone uses it for swimming except Thais who come on a day trip from the farms in the back of pickup trucks and have no hotel or swimming pool there.

Most hotels will be on or near the beach but don't count on it. Check what the hotel has to offer in case of rain, storm or unusable beach.

A hotel far from the beach with good pool facilities may turn to be far better holiday experience than one on the sands with no or small pool.

Just checked the prices, it is not now 900THB, it is a way more at that "Grand" hotel. We stayed there on our way to Koh Samui, one night, 2 times. Could be the prices have gone up, hard to believe they (the hotel) has done much to offer more for extra money.

Using Thai Airways FF points that will expire, we got certificates that give us 4 nights stay at many hotels in Thai. We picked Dusit Thani (not much choice at Hua Hin, by Thai airways plan).

The certificates say we have to call the hotel directly, quote the certificate code and make our booking.

Then, it becomes 1,600THB for all 3 of us, per day. I guess, that is more than run of the mill hotels , like Grand hotel Hua Hin charge for any stay (900THB a day) , no points or discounts.

We will have a car, so the hotel (Dusit Thani) being away from the city, won't be much of a problem.

Is it worthwhile? Or just discard the points (let them lapse) and go regularly, on our own location and other preferences?

I can't think any brand can make the rooms any larger.

We were on the ground floor (our request, for baby prem) easy in and out. Not sure now but I seem to recall there were no elevators for those staying at the upper floors (altogether 4 floors in the main building). My memory could be failing me, 8 years have passed.

And yes, that Marriott could be the worst one I have ever stayed with.

Just heard that Hua Hin has got it's water park recently and may return to the place after 8 years. Without it it was too boring for my child.

Looked it up on the net, Black Mountain Water Park, looks eery, hardly anyone there, as if it is incomplete.

On another forum, they say it is fully functional and open. The distance and fee (even at 50% discount it is 450B for adults, 225B for kids) could make it a flop?

Anyone been there recently?

The Marriott HH was something else before, a Thai hotel, same as the Hilton was Melia, can't remember what it was.

End of lease, 2002-2012. For the renovation cost they probably calculated there were better deals around. Out of ~ 600 hotels worldwide operating under the brand, Marriott owns only half a dozen. All franchizes.

Stayed at the Marriott HH in October 2004, you could tell it is not by Marriott standards. Rooms were (in size) rather like 1,000THB Pattaya "Welcome Inn" or similar patronaged by Russian and Chinese package tourists. The fittings were fine throughout and staff as expected.

For low season rock bottom price (3,600THB) it was hardly a value even at that price. Regular high season price was 9-12,000THB, a serious rip off.

Through my company, I have top class worldwide coverage insurance with Aetna. BUPA does similar thing.

It covers any place on earth, Thailand too. Before joining me in Japan my Thai family was covered too.

What a ripoff. No way I would buy that plan myself even if I had money to burn. All covered, it is 1,250$ a month. That is full coverage, dental included. Once I ran BUPA quotation for Thailand, that same one was 1,800$ a month (possibly because it is 1 customer not a company who can negotiate a group deal for all their expats).

When you start going down from the most expensive ripoff "plan", you end up with one where most likely ailings are not covered or are under "pay first 2,000 baht yourself" which means, good chance you never get anything, if lucky, for lifetime. What would cost more than 2,000B in a reasonable Thai hospital anyway? Would you need any insurance at all if you always pay yourself?

So, some cheap insurance that covers unlikely ailings, accidents, open heart surgeries, multiple hospital days.

What you may really need is not covered anyway so why pay big names?

See above, someone with BUPA has never made a claim.

After the call to the building today, they said the first coat of paint has been applied (hope they cleaned up the stains first) but more is to be done. The damage is still visible they said.

The mirrors have to be changed as the sludge had petrified on the walls and mirrors, months in BKK heat with nobody there after the incident (we don't even know when it had happened).

Still, if someone has used some painter that can be recommended, we think it may be handy to know.

The epilogue: wife is now in BKK and the building has completed all the painting and replaced the mirrors. All done in our absence. Things can function in Thai, albeit with few caveats. Perhaps, they knew we won't be there before July 1 and just delayed it, also made it fresh paint so if not properly done, the stains may resurface...but not before we are gone for another year.

Thanks to all who read and replied.

Doesn't look like gypsum, that would have given under the water and fell

down. Also the way the light is mounted on top of the ceiling, instead of

sunk inside, my guess would be that is a concrete slab.

By the looks of it, it would need some serious cleaning first, and than

some decent primer, to make sure the stains not come through again.

Unfortunately I have not seen a decent painter in Pattaya. I am learning

from all the crap all these so called professionals are doing at my place.

I'd suggest to stay away from the expensive farang companies, as they

are typically worth than the thais, educate yourself as what needs to be

done, and than find some cheap thai laborers that will follow your

instructions. A lot more hassle than you want, but in my experience thats

the only way to get it done right.

Good luck,

rudi

Thanks, Rudi.

After the call to the building today, they said the first coat of paint has been applied (hope they cleaned up the stains first) but more is to be done. The damage is still visible they said.

The mirrors have to be changed as the sludge had petrified on the walls and mirrors, months in BKK heat with nobody there after the incident (we don't even know when it had happened).

Still, if someone has used some painter that can be recommended, we think it may be handy to know.

Looks ok from the outside, Parkland Srinakarin:

But unless the building has painted it since last august, ceiling in the 2 bathrooms is like this:

What material is your ceiling? If it's gypsum board, and if the water damage was bad enough, it may not be just a need to repaint, it may be that new gypsum board needs to be installed.

No idea. In few hours I can post pictures of the damage, if that can be told from there. The ceiling is a bit higher than normal, 2.65m I think and hard to reach and knock to check the sound (and we are not there anyway but will be July 2). When trying to repair the lights (covers were full of water and of course knocked the fuses) I think there was no resonation (as it would be expected if that gypsium board was present above me) from the ceiling, but now that you mentioned that I am not sure.

Indeed, judging by the building slowness and reluctance, I suspect more than simple painting could be involved.

I don't really want to paint the condo myself, did not know where to place this question, Mods can move it.

The unit above us had a pipe burst, about this time last year, we were not there as we live in Japan. It left stains on the ceiling of our condo, quite noticeable.

While in the condo July and August last year, we complained, the building said they will organize painting of our condo but 2 months later nothing.

We wrote a letter to the building management with pictures, their staff came to look and said they will do it.

Someone told us they might do it but only after they corner the owner whose pipes had caused the damage to pay for it and those pretend to be invisible.

We left the building the keys upon our departure to access the condo and do the work, with some tea money to the officer (1,000B).

When we called 3-4 times since August last year, whoever picked the call did not know whether the condo was painted or not. Good chance it has not.

So, rather than doing it over again, I want to engage professional painters to paint it at my expense. Anyone here doing that or used someone that can be recommended or knows of some company. Thai language not a problem.

Location is Bang Na, condo 66sqm, nothing fancy required, timeframe between mid-July to mid-August, when suitable. It's a brand new condo, I would guess 2 days work.