Credo

July of 2021..... can't you find something a little more recent and relevant?

Elderly people have nothing to do the health of a species. They are done reproducing. So, you won't put them on an ice flow, but dying of a disease which is preventable is OK?

I have been well outside my comfort zone and I've listened to the noise surrounding various debates. On one side, we have what I can only describe as a cheerleading squad for the virus. Here's a few of their arguments: 1. It's not much more than flu. Well look at the actual data on flu hospitalizations and deaths. The answer is it is much more than flu. It's much more contagious and it's much harder to treat. That is simply a fact, and it can be substantiated by statistics from numerous countries. 2. It's mostly older people and people with comorbitities that are dying. That assumption has some grounding in truth, but is there some reason that elderly people should be allowed to die? Is it OK for obese people, people with diabetes, people undergoing cancer treatment and those with immune disorders to die? This type of reasoning is not rational thinking and is just a way of minimizing the significance of the deaths. 3. Masks don't work. They do. Again look at the countries/cities with strong mask mandates and you will see a definite slow of the spread. Don't cloud the issue with statistics from sparsely populated areas with those with dense populations. Density matters. If that isn't enough, take a look at mask mandates in schools in the US and compare it to those without any. In the US the difference is stark and shows that masks most certainly do work. They aren't perfect, but they work. Oh, and most people forget that masks AND social distancing go together. 4. Vaccines are dangerous/bad/ineffective. Well, compare vaccinated to unvaccinated in any area and by almost any metric and it's clear that vaccinated people are faring significantly better than their unvaxxed counterparts. Even the earliest and less reliable vaccines have a pretty decent track record in keeping people out of the hospital or the graveyard. As far as being dangerous, they aren't. With absolutely anything we put in our body, from eggs, peanuts to vaccines, there is a possibility of an anaphylactic reaction and death. Deaths from all of the vaccines is minuscule on any metric you put it. 5. Lockdowns: Again, they work, but they happen at a potentially huge cost both economically and socially. People are social creatures and we do not do well in isolation. The arguments against lockdowns is understandable and is one that needs to be looked at carefully when this is over. Should they occur? How far ranging should they be? How long can they be sustained? I hate wearing a mask. When I put it on I feel like I am smothering. I am sure I am not getting enough oxygen, yet the last time I went to the Dr., I wore it for over an hour and my O2 level was at 98%. So much for what I read about it causing a build up of CO2.

Yes, it was eradicated, but the smallpox vaccine was not 100% effective. Its efficacy was quite high at 95%, but when enough people are vaccinated, the disease will grind to a halt. Humans are the only host of the smallpox virus, so with a dwindling number of people to infect, it eventually died out. Immunity to smallpox is fairly long lasting, with vaccinations being effective for between 3 to 5 years. There are a lot of factors at play in catching a disease. A guy I know who works at a large grocery store has not been vaccinated and only wears a mask if forced to. He's a little on the elderly side. The store has had major outbreaks of Covid among employees, both vaccinated and not, both young and old, but for some reason he has dodged a bullet. I suspect luck is a factor.

Ah, the typical ruse, the 'they would probably have died anyway.' Well, you will find that most of them had no known condition that would have caused them to die, except Covid. You might want to check about MIS-C. So many ways to minimize Covid. First people compare it to road deaths and since more people die from that then Covid isn't so bad. Now we have a comparison to kids drowning in pools. The insinuation that vaccines don't work or don't neutralize the disease is another canard. No vaccine does that. They all come with with an efficacy that is less than 100%. We will all die, but I suspect the parents who lost their 10 year old boy to Covid would rather have not had it happen when it did.

When testing a drug/vaccine, there is more than one phase. As a we age, the immune system becomes less responsive. The immune system reacts differently at different ages. When we are an infant, it basically lacks any knowledge of what to target, although it has all the tools necessary, it simply lacks exposure. At the other end of the spectrum, it begins to slow in the mid-fifties. By the 70's the slowing is significant (much of that has to do with the Thymus). The immune response is most likely still strong enough to include the entire 50's, but that is also the age, especially for men, that deaths from other causes start to increase which can skew the results of any testing. If it works on the age range they have selected, they will have a clear view of how effective it is, whether there are any side effects -- without running a risk of increased deaths, which starts happening with the older group -- and it will lay the groundwork for further exploring it's effectiveness on older adults as well as on children and adolescents.

It makes you suspicious or it simply supports your narrative and gives you an excuse to dismiss the outcome? Pretty much everybody who follows studies knows that they will target a group that is younger and healthier in the initial trials. It will then be expanded to include other groups. Do you think they should start with infants, as well? You can be assured that were many other criteria beside age, such as general health, absence of specific diseases, smoking, drug use, etc.. Take a look at the occasional ads for participants in a study on any medication. I suspect no matter what they do, you will be suspicious.

The last time we had someone post something like that, it turned out to be false. I suspect this is as well. Without some substantiation, it most likely is made up.

I am curious about what long-term effects you think will occur? Vaccines really don't work that way, they get into the body, they stimulate our own immune system to produce antibodies and then they are out of our body. Any effect is quite quick, usually within a matter of minutes to a few days.

It's positively amazing that they can write a story and not even mention the Blue Diamond affair, the deaths and the various side issues that caused the entire debacle that led to the 'strained' relationship between the two countries.

The issue of noise has always mystified me. I have lived in areas where having parties until the wee hours of the morning is not uncommon. Loud music, motor bikes, and dogs barking all night seem to be the norm. When I would have a party for colleagues and employees, at about 10:00, I would try to move it indoors -- at least the music came indoors.

It's a common tactic of a certain group to deflect and minimize the seriousness of the pandemic. How many times have you read it's no worse than the flu, or a bad cold or if people weren't obese or otherwise unhealthy? It's how they roll and how they troll.

What we hear from anti-vaxxers is an endless litany of reasons to minimize the impact of the pandemic. Obesity is a reality. Maybe these acutely knowledgeable people could give us a 6 or 8 month warning before the next pandemic so we can all get into shape. Of course, if you're just plain old or unfortunately have cancer, then you're screwed, but, hey, you probably weren't living by the secretive and always moving anti-vaxxer code. The vast majority of people who are victims of the pandemic had little or no control over their eventual fate. Most are people who had little choice but to go to work each day to support their family. I wish they would stop with the victim-blaming and it's not much more than just that.

Very misleading.

Not far from the truth. Most pigs are raised in large factory farms in extremely close quarters, this results in the spread of the disease.

I don't know that 'opening up' is the solution. There are a lot of factors at play. Are you going to let people who are positive just move around the country without quarantining them? Do you think the local people and workers in the hotels, bars and restaurants are going to be willing to deal with sick people without mitigating policies in place?

The idea that Giuffre was after money, it should be noted that she never contacted the police. When she escaped Epstein's grip. While Giuffre was establishing her family in Australia, she was contacted by the Palm Beach Police who were investigating Epstein after a 14-year-old girl and her parents reported his behavior. That was in March, 2005.

I see a lot of victim blaming in this thread, which is really quite sad. Most of you might want to remember when you were 17-18 and how naive the girls who were 15-16 were? Well, multiply that by many fold because they had rich, older people manipulating and grooming them. There have been several good documentaries on both Epstein and Maxwell. There were also interviews with some of the parents. In most cases, the parents were pretty much clueless and thought it was a kind, rich lady who was offering the girls various kinds of work. They did not know, at least early on, that Epstein was in the picture. Most appear to come from lower-income, working families. So, you have girls who are young enough to be easily manipulated and most were not involved in sexual activity until they had been properly groomed over time. Maxwell was instrumental in grooming them for their eventual encounters. Without what seemed to be a trustworthy adult woman, most of the girls would likely have had nothing to do with Epstein. Epstein pleaded guilty and was convicted in 2008 by a Florida state court of procuring a child for prostitution and of soliciting a prostitute. He served almost 13 months in custody, but with extensive work release, basically, he had to sleep at the jail. It is alleged that during the days, he was engaged in sexual activity at his office, so not much of a sentence. He also was not required to register as a sex offender. Ghislane had accusations of being a 'procurer' around that time, but did not face any legal action until 2015. She was identified by Prince Andrew's accuser, Virginia Giuffre, who had been recruited by Maxwell when Giuffre was 15. At the time, Giuffre was working at Mar-a-lago. Guiffre was given specific instructions in how to perform oral sex on Epstein. There are numerous cases from underage girls against Maxwell as well as Epstein. Some of these girls were flown to places such as his private island, New York and his ranch in New Mexico. Guiffre, in addition to being sent to the UK for an alleged sexual encounter with Prince Andrew was also sent to Thailand to procure a 12 year old Thai girl and bring her back for Epstein. She met her husband to be and did not procure the girl, instead opting to go to Australia, marry and have a family. I fail to understand how anyone can make excuses for either Maxwell or Epstein. They were seasoned adults who knew exactly what they were doing. The girls were young, impressionable and groomed. They were introduced to a cycle of victimization long before they were old enough to have any real idea of what was happening.

I don't know that I would call it a panic. This variant is highly transmissible and people have a good chance of testing positive. If you are a tourist, do you really want to find yourself stuck somewhere for an extended period of time?

Marco Rubio is a senator from Florida. It seems he is not really up-to-date. The CDC is getting a great deal of heat for it, but they have lowered the period for asymptomatic people to 5 days and then an additional 5 days of mask wearing. Many of the same people who were screaming about quarantine aren't happy it's been lowered. And if it's not a surge, I wonder why both the governor and the Director of the Florida Health Department have criticized the White House for not sending more Monoclonal antibodies, even though some have had their EUA removed and are not effective against Omicron. It might be better for everyone if there was less political interference in the whole process. I am hoping that Omicron acts like most other viruses and when it is as easily transmitted as it appears to be that it burns itself out quickly. I also hope that, in addition to milder symptoms, there are no long term effects.

I have to agree. A lot of people got caught in situations well beyond their control. Some by circumstances, some by their own actions, some by a misjudged or misguided actions.

I find it interesting how so many caucasians can be so sure there is no discrimination or racism. They are wrong. I worked with a number of Black teachers from Africa, the US and the UK/EU. All of them had varying levels of discrimination. All of them were very well qualified, but yet were often rejected in favor of a much less qualified backpacker. They were also offered less money when they found employment. Where I worked, the standard starting salary at that time was 35,000 Baht. They were started at 32,000. Most of the Black teachers had a very difficult time finding housing. Many landlords simply didn't want to rent to them. At the school, one of the Thai admin would usually have to secure an apartment on their behalf. In everyday life, they had trouble with things like catching a taxi. They would simply drive right past them. Even the generally reliable songtaews would pass them by. A close friend, who worked at a hotel said that the management had a strict policy of not renting rooms to Blacks. The only time a Black person was given a room was if they made an advance reservation and the hotel did not know in advance they were black. Thais are not generally confrontational in nature, but they are cautious, careful and prone to stereotyping.

I prefer eating out doors.

But 'the' virus that we are talking about is a Coronavirus, not a flu virus. Influenza viruses are able to recombine with different strains and form an entirely new strain. The original strains can come from birds, other mammals (especially pigs) and there is a human strain as well. Coronaviruses have an 'error editor' that drastically slows down mutations. In spite of what it seems, there is a low rate of mutation in Coronaviruses.

And just to add, it's not just children in schools, there are a host of others who are at risk including teachers, administration, office personnel, cooks and cleaners. They may not fare as well as children.