EU to offer May hope of post-Brexit talks at summit - draft text

[Khun Han]

11 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Did it ever occur to you that the UK might actually be in a weaker position?  What's in it for your potential new partners to give the UK terms more advantageous than it would enjoy as a member of the EU? Has it ever occurred to you that given the relative size and economic clout of the EU vs the UK that other countries might actually be reluctant to give the UK better terms? That they might not want to piss off the huge economy represented by the EU? In other words, what's in it for them? What will they gain vs. what will they lose? You really should at least try to consider the question from your prospective new trading partners' point of view. I guess you won't, though, because if you seriously do, you'll find the view from there isn't nearly so rosy as you believe.

 

How about you provide good reasons why countries outside the EU won't want to buy and sell with us outside the EU's hugely restrictive environment. It's sop for remainers to scaremonger over this. They suggest that the UK has little or nothing to offer the world. Well why does the EU want to be involved with us then? Out of pity/sympathy? Fact is, the world is queueing up to get closer to us (outside of said EU restrictive environment) for pretty much the same reasons the EU does. But we won't be paying any silly membership fees or taking it up the backside over sovereignty in our dealings with the rest of the world.

Edited October 14, 2017 by Khun Han

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, Khun Han said:

 

How about you provide good reasons why countries outside the EU won't want to buy and sell with us outside the EU's hugely restrictive environment. It's sop for remainers to scaremonger over this. They suggest that the UK has little or nothing to offer the world. Well why does the EU want us involved with them then? Out of pity/sympathy? Fact is, the world is queueing up to get closer to us (outside of said EU restrictive environment) for pretty much the same reasons the EU does. But we won't be paying any silly membership fees or taking it up the backside over sovereignty in our dealings with the rest of the world.

Well, for starters the EU market without the UK is still vastly bigger than the UK. And I don't know what remainers you are referring to, but i never said that the UK has little or nothing to offer the world. It just doesn't have nearly as much as the rest of the EU.  To believe otherwise is delusional.

[shanesox]

Let’s wait for Eu to collapse when European country producers get angry with their politicians for not sorting out a trade deal! Problem is May is supine and not tough enough to stick it out to the 11th hour 59th minute !


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[taipeir]

How did the EU take away British sovereignty ?

Did it force UK to fight wars, close your embassies, change your political system, use another currency?

Did it force the UK to join the EU in the first place, to abide by the rules of the single market and customs union?
Was it forced to do any of these things?

Examples please !!

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[taipeir]

Let’s wait for Eu to collapse when European country producers get angry with their politicians for not sorting out a trade deal! Problem is May is supine and not tough enough to stick it out to the 11th hour 59th minute !

 

 

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Delusional.

 

If the UK wants to play that game it will end in a very bad economic situation.

 

Even planes will not be allowed land or take off at that time. imports and exports will decide up. Many international service jobs will disappear.

 

Investments will crater to nothing at that period.

 

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[Khun Han]

Just now, ilostmypassword said:

Well, for starters the EU market without the UK is still vastly bigger than the UK. And I don't know what remainers you are referring to, but i never said that the UK has little or nothing to offer the world. It just doesn't have nearly as much as the rest of the EU.  To believe otherwise is delusional.

 

Of course the EU market as a whole is bigger than the UK's. So what? It's far too restrictive and comes with far too much baggage (which is only going to get heavier in the future). And the rest of the world's markets dwarf the EU one. You know full well what I'm referring to wrt demeaning the UK. There are plenty of such posts in every brexit thread.

[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, taipeir said:

How did the EU take away British sovereignty ?

Did it force UK to fight wars, close your embassies, change your political system, use another currency?

Did it force the UK to join the EU in the first place, to abide by the rules of the single market and customs union?
Was it forced to do any of these things?

Examples please !!

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What makes that kind of talk particularly ridiculjous is that the UK is not a member of the Eurozone. If it were, the Brexiters would have a much stronger case. But Britain has complete control over its budget including its expenditures. It can run as big a deficit as it desires without the EU having any say in it at all.

[taipeir]

The EU is 44 per cent of the UKs export market.

 

Your claim that the rest of the world's markets dwarf the EU is simply untrue.

 

You kNow that the UK is currently able to trade with the rest of the world often with advantageous trade terms being a member of the EU!

 

You just wave your hands around and say 'so what `.

 

Looking for a job in the cabinet are you? :)

 

 

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[ilostmypassword]

1 minute ago, Khun Han said:

 

Of course the EU market as a whole is bigger than the UK's. So what? It's far too restrictive and comes with far too much baggage (which is only going to get heavier in the future). And the rest of the world's markets dwarf the EU one. You know full well what I'm referring to wrt demeaning the UK. There are plenty of such posts in every brexit thread.

If it's so restrictive why do all the major nations of the world, and most of the minor ones, at least those that have something to offer, do so much trade with it? Masochism?

And since you were replying to me, why did you bother to drag in what other posters might be saying? At least you should acknowledge the lack of pertinence of your comment.

[Khun Han]

Just now, ilostmypassword said:

If it's so restrictive why do all the major nations of the world, and most of the minor ones, at least those that have something to offer, do so much trade with it? Masochism?

And since you were replying to me, why did you bother to drag in what other posters might be saying? At least you should acknowledge the lack of pertinence of your comment.

Of course the world wants to trade with the EU, because it's a big, wealthy market. They don't trade with the EU on the same restrictive terms that countries within the EU have to trade. And the UK can offer the rest of the world much more flexible, less restrictive direct trading. I will choose what to put in my posts, not you. So long as they're ontopic, and not dishonest (unlike your claim that you're not aware of the UK-bashing that goes on in these discussions), it's not for you to lay down the posting law.

[ilostmypassword]

Just now, Khun Han said:

Of course the world wants to trade with the EU, because it's a big, wealthy market. They don't trade with the EU on the same restrictive terms that countries within the EU have to trade. And the UK can offer the rest of the world much more flexible, less restrictive direct trading. I will choose what to put in my posts, not you. So long as they're ontopic, and not dishonest (unlike your claim that you're not aware of the UK-bashing that goes on in these discussions), it's not for you to lay down the posting law.

So where did I claim that I'm "not aware of the UK-bashing that goes on in these discussions"? I simply pointed out how am i supposed to know that you weren't imputing that UK-bashing to me since you were replying to my post? How would I possibly know that? It was entirely irrelevant to the points i was making.

So now you're asserting that it's easy to trade with the EU if you're not a part of it? So the incentive to trade with the UK and potentially piss off a huge partner that is easy to trade with is what exactly? 

[Khun Han]

3 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

So where did I claim that I'm "not aware of the UK-bashing that goes on in these discussions"? I simply pointed out how am i supposed to know that you weren't imputing that UK-bashing to me since you were replying to my post? How would I possibly know that? It was entirely irrelevant to the points i was making.

So now you're asserting that it's easy to trade with the EU if you're not a part of it? So the incentive to trade with the UK and potentially piss off a huge partner that is easy to trade with is what exactly? 

 

27 minutes ago, ilostmypassword said:

Well, for starters the EU market without the UK is still vastly bigger than the UK. And I don't know what remainers you are referring to, but i never said that the UK has little or nothing to offer the world. It just doesn't have nearly as much as the rest of the EU.  To believe otherwise is delusional.

 

"And I don't know what remainers you are referring to"

 

It's easier for non EU countries to trade with the EU. I thought that was obvious: they don't have to buy into all the cr@p that EU members have to. And there you go with the unsubstantiated scaremongering: that the EU will force the rest of the world to avoid trading with the UK. Just utterly pathetic.

[ilostmypassword]

2 minutes ago, Khun Han said:

 

 

"And I don't know what remainers you are referring to"

 

It's easier for non EU countries to trade with the EU. I thought that was obvious: they don't have to buy into all the cr@p that EU members have to. And there you go with the unsubstantiated scaremongering: that the EU will force the rest of the world to avoid trading with the UK. Just utterly pathetic.

Nice misleading partial quote: here's the rest of it "...but i never said that the UK has little or nothing to offer the world" I never said that there weren't people saying that, just that I don't keep track of them. Again, why did you even mention them in a reply to me without at least signaling that I wasn't among them?. 

And where did I say that the EU will force the rest of the world to avoid trading with the UK? But it does stand to reason that they will not accept the UK getting better terms than they do which is what you seem to believe will happen. And given that UK trade with the EU will suffer, how does the UK come out ahead?

[citybiker]

Such as?

Explain!

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[Khun Han]

1 hour ago, ilostmypassword said:

Nice misleading partial quote: here's the rest of it "...but i never said that the UK has little or nothing to offer the world" I never said that there weren't people saying that, just that I don't keep track of them. Again, why did you even mention them in a reply to me without at least signaling that I wasn't among them?. 

And where did I say that the EU will force the rest of the world to avoid trading with the UK? But it does stand to reason that they will not accept the UK getting better terms than they do which is what you seem to believe will happen. And given that UK trade with the EU will suffer, how does the UK come out ahead?

 

I'll leave you to the semantics now .