Farang Pretend-police

[Ulysses G.]

I haven't seen any of these farangs who dress up in uniforms and supposedly help the Thai police for a long time, but I did spot one at the beginning of Songkran and was instantly filled with embarrasment on their behalf.

I know that they are supposedly doing a good deed, but I feel certain that something is seriously wrong with anyone who would take on such a job unless they were in severe financial straits and getting paid a salary. I will admit that I am willing to sink to any low to remain in Thailand, including teaching at a University.

I know that p1p volunteered for this program at one time - so there must be a few good ones - but, he seems to have quit as soon as possible since I never saw him marching around in a policeman suit.

Am I the only one who feels this way about these guys?

Edited April 16, 2008 by Ulysses G.

[sceadugenga]

Some people will do anything for a uniform and a stick.

[Blinky Bill]

If I said what I truly think about these folks I would probably be banned for life.

I am certain that there are a few that really believe they are doing some good. But..........................

I know one of these guys is a former member of the Australian Federal Police who has a rather successful business running in Chiang Mai. I really can't understand why he would want to carry on wearing a uniform in Thailand. Must be some sort of power trip.

As a former cop (many, many years ago) I have never felt the urge to wear a uniform since getting out.

I am sure many of these blue overall wearing folks want to stand out in a crowd and say, "Hey, look at me. I am living here and I am wearing a police outfit, I must be pretty special."

I see some are carrying handcuffs as well as a few other items that cops like to carry and I am sure a lot of them would also like to have a big gun strapped to their hip as well.

[gpdjohn]

If I said what I truly think about these folks I would probably be banned for life.

I am certain that there are a few that really believe they are doing some good. But..........................

I know one of these guys is a former member of the Australian Federal Police who has a rather successful business running in Chiang Mai. I really can't understand why he would want to carry on wearing a uniform in Thailand. Must be some sort of power trip.

As a former cop (many, many years ago) I have never felt the urge to wear a uniform since getting out.

I am sure many of these blue overall wearing folks want to stand out in a crowd and say, "Hey, look at me. I am living here and I am wearing a police outfit, I must be pretty special."

I see some are carrying handcuffs as well as a few other items that cops like to carry and I am sure a lot of them would also like to have a big gun strapped to their hip as well.

As a recently retired cop ( 20+ yrs) who worked in a gang suppression unit ( 11 yrs ) within a major US city, where 3 officers would respond to calls, 2 to handle the call, one for counter sniper protection...it never amazes me...cop groupies.

These people are scary and need medication..

Saw a few of these kinda "hang-arounds" at the PD and they would cause more trouble than they were worth.

My department even gave them radios ONCE and that lasted for about 3 days...The Sergeants on the street demanded that the radios be taken away..these idiots would call anything and everything in..

I know there might be a few who really would like to help and know the place they are supposed to be in..but the other 98% give 'em all a bad name.

But like you, BB...I would never put a PD uniform on again..had enough of it.

Hey,

You asked..

[garro]

I wonder if they are looking for farang lollipop men? If they supply a uniform and a whistle, I'd be interested.

Edited April 16, 2008 by garro

[Pushit]

I haven't seen any of these farangs who dress up in uniforms and supposedly help the Thai police for a long time, but I did spot one at the beginning of Songkran and was instantly filled with embarrasment on their behalf.

I know that they are supposedly doing a good deed, but I feel certain that something is seriously wrong with anyone who would take on such a job unless they were in severe financial straits and getting paid a salary. I will admit that I am willing to sink to any low to remain in Thailand, including teaching at a University.

I know that p1p volunteered for this program at one time - so there must be a few good ones - but, he seems to have quit as soon as possible since I never saw him marching around in a policeman suit.

Am I the only one who feels this way about these guys?

These human specimens are psycologial Nazi anal retentives' but of course should be allowed to parade around in "uniforms" to get the attention they crave, no skin off anyones' nose and good for a laugh.

[BlackArtemis]

I've seen a few act as translators between tourists and the boys in brown, I guess thats a good thing.

[Pushit]

I've seen a few act as translators between tourists and the boys in brown, I guess thats a good thing.

Agree: they must be good for something

[Maejo Man]

These human specimens are psycologial Nazi anal retentives' but of course should be allowed to parade around in "uniforms" to get the attention they crave, no skin off anyones' nose and good for a laugh.

Of course you have a degree in psycologial

[Blinky Bill]

I've seen a few act as translators between tourists and the boys in brown, I guess thats a good thing.

Trouble is many of these characters (not all) don't have much of a clue when it somes to speaking Thai and need a translator themselves.

[Pushit]

These human specimens are psycologial Nazi anal retentives' but of course should be allowed to parade around in "uniforms" to get the attention they crave, no skin off anyones' nose and good for a laugh.

Of course you have a degree in psycologial

Dude It's Psycology, Yes

[Priceless]

These human specimens are psycologial Nazi anal retentives' but of course should be allowed to parade around in "uniforms" to get the attention they crave, no skin off anyones' nose and good for a laugh.

Of course you have a degree in psycologial

Dude It's Psycology, Yes

Try "psychology"

/ Priceless

[Blinky Bill]

Dude It's Psycology, Yes

Best get your dictionary out Dude.

[mcgriffith]

Don't really see any thing wrong with it. I don't want to question anyone's motives in doing this job....

I was in the old (left) bldg at CM Imm to get a residency cert for a drivers license in Jan this year.

There was a dude there, American, mid 60's, fully decked out with the whole drill.

He seemed to know at least one Immigration officer there, they exchanged wai's, etc.

Only problem, as far as I could see, was that he had a middle aged Thai lady with him as his assistant, who had to explain everything that was going on procedurally, and he seemed totally at sea as far as figuring out some elemental paperwork.....I arrived after him, got the same paperwork done in minutes....he was still floundering about, with a full time assistant/translator, when I left. He had not a word of Thai, and could not understand even the most basic aspects of Thai law and bureaucracy.

Didn't give me a very good impression....

[mcgriffith]

I will add one comment; I don't think these people are paid at all, they are volunteers.

I have a lot of friends here, and back in the US who are professional law enforcement, including a few rather high ranking ones.

I can fully appreciate how these professionals who lay their lives on the line, and have been through the grist-mill, can look at these volunteers as "wannabees"

However, these volunteers probably do serve a valuable function here. If there is a farang involved in a crime, as a victim, whether it be rape, robbery, or a petty dispute involving a hotel bill.....you think the BIB are gonna be able to understand? Or care?

Let them do their thing, I think they might be of help to a certain degree.

Just my 25 satang's worth....

[JacknDanny]

I haven't seen any of these farangs who dress up in uniforms and supposedly help the Thai police for a long time, but I did spot one at the beginning of Songkran and was instantly filled with embarrasment on their behalf.

I know that they are supposedly doing a good deed, but I feel certain that something is seriously wrong with anyone who would take on such a job unless they were in severe financial straits and getting paid a salary. I will admit that I am willing to sink to any low to remain in Thailand, including teaching at a University.

I know that p1p volunteered for this program at one time - so there must be a few good ones - but, he seems to have quit as soon as possible since I never saw him marching around in a policeman suit.

Am I the only one who feels this way about these guys?

Its wrong and its potentially dangerous. Putting unqualified personnel into situations that are potentially dangerous is foolhardy.

I also am bemused as to WHY somebody would want to do this especially with it being voluntary.

Also, what about the work permits?

[mobs00]

I haven't seen any of these farangs who dress up in uniforms and supposedly help the Thai police for a long time, but I did spot one at the beginning of Songkran and was instantly filled with embarrasment on their behalf.

I know that they are supposedly doing a good deed, but I feel certain that something is seriously wrong with anyone who would take on such a job unless they were in severe financial straits and getting paid a salary. I will admit that I am willing to sink to any low to remain in Thailand, including teaching at a University.

I know that p1p volunteered for this program at one time - so there must be a few good ones - but, he seems to have quit as soon as possible since I never saw him marching around in a policeman suit.

Am I the only one who feels this way about these guys?

Its wrong and its potentially dangerous. Putting unqualified personnel into situations that are potentially dangerous is foolhardy.

I also am bemused as to WHY somebody would want to do this especially with it being voluntary.

Also, what about the work permits?

That's probably why they do it....

[FolkGuitar]

I haven't seen any of these farangs who dress up in uniforms and supposedly help the Thai police for a long time, but I did spot one at the beginning of Songkran and was instantly filled with embarrasment on their behalf.

I know that they are supposedly doing a good deed, but I feel certain that something is seriously wrong with anyone who would take on such a job unless they were in severe financial straits and getting paid a salary. I will admit that I am willing to sink to any low to remain in Thailand, including teaching at a University.

I know that p1p volunteered for this program at one time - so there must be a few good ones - but, he seems to have quit as soon as possible since I never saw him marching around in a policeman suit.

Am I the only one who feels this way about these guys?

Its wrong and its potentially dangerous. Putting unqualified personnel into situations that are potentially dangerous is foolhardy.

I also am bemused as to WHY somebody would want to do this especially with it being voluntary.

Also, what about the work permits?

The theory of the volunteers was a good one. The practice, not quite so.

When it first began several years ago I was asked to join. The police wanted foreigners who could act as go-betweens when a problem came up for a visitor. NOT TO ACT AS POLICEMEN. The theory was that the volunteers would be able to answer questions for visitors, direct visitors to the correct destinations, to assist foreigners when they found themselves involved in problems with Thais or other foreigners and Police. NOT TO ACT AS POLICEMEN. Not to carry a big stick. Not to enforce laws. To assist visitors and answer their questions regarding to whom to speak when they had a problem with passports, problems with getting robbed, problems with getting cheated by unsavory vendors. NOT TO SOLVE THE PROBLEMS, but to help direct the visitors to the proper places to get their problems solved. Again, the theory was that this unit would NOT BE POLICE and have NO authority.

Many visitors from Japan, Germany, France, or Korea do not speak any Thai or English. To be able to tell their problems or ask for help from a native speaker is a very valuable thing for them in times of stress. And we all know, travel = stress. We were told that we would be welcomed to donate any amount of time that we could spare to this end.

One morning, not in any uniform, I came across two Swiss girls who were scraped and bruised from a snatch and grab during the night, crying in their guesthouse. Early twenties, they were at a complete loss as to what they should do. Here they were, in a strange country, as travelers they were under much more stress then they would have been in their home countries, and couldn't even think straight. As it happened, this occurred on one of the 'Police Days' when just about every cop in town was three sheets to the wind and they couldn't even get one to listen to them, much less understand them. They had lost their passports and credit cards. I acted as facilitator, (probably nothing different than you would have done,) first with the Tourist Police, then along with a TP officer, with the police at Phra Singh station, taking the girls to report the crime, and then called up the Swiss embassy in Bangkok to request for the special pickup of the passport on a Saturday so that the girls could get to Koh Pang Ngan by Tuesday - and the full moon party. After all, that's why they came to Thailand in the first place! They took the bus to Bangkok very happy with the help they had received. I would have done the same had I not been involved with the volunteer group. The fact that I was, simply meant that some of the regular officers knew me and were willing to listen when I brought the girls to the office. Other times, in uniform, I helped people on the Walking Street and in the Arcade bus station. Not enforcing laws. Assisting visitors who couldn't figure out where the toilets were or how to get where they wanted to go. Not 'playing policeman.'

Sometimes long working cops get the idea that their only role is to deal with garbage. 99% of the time it is for them. The volunteers were created to deal with that other 1%. At least, that was the plan.

That was then.....

Then some of the sorts of folks that our board ex-cops are talking about started standing out. Most of us didn't like that. It wasn't what we were formed for. WE WERE NOT POLICE. But some were police wannabees, I was once accused by a tourist of being able to exceed my authority, I had to explain to him that I had NO authority. He could make a citizen’s arrest just like the next person if they are witness to a serious crime. You don't need a badge to do this. You need morality.

Then the Pattaya police began using the volunteers as undercover agents. No training. No assistance. No back-up. No authority. THIS WAS NOT THE ORIGINAL PLAN. I don't know if this was ever done in Chiang Mai, but I wouldn't be surprised. A lot of us in Chiang Mai stopped attending when we were told that we HAD to carry handcuffs. A lot stopped when we were told that we HAD to put in 20 hours a week. A lot stopped when they tried to make us behave as policemen. Between you and me, I had my fair share of saluting 40+ years ago. I really didn't need it again now.

So what started as a good idea five years ago, with 50-60+ people willing to help others when they could, the program devolved into 6-10 people carrying handcuffs and batons, riding in cruisers, standing in parade formations, saluting and spit shinning their boots. I'm sure a couple of them are still well-meaning and non authoritative, but the numbers just are no longer there.

It's the visitors who are losing out. This is a program that has been in effect in Monaco for many years, and is working well. It just lacked the planning and training when organized here. It's too bad. When you really need a toilet in a foreign country and can't speak the language, THAT is a VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM!

[john b good]

These human specimens are psycologial Nazi anal retentives' but of course should be allowed to parade around in "uniforms" to get the attention they crave, no skin off anyones' nose and good for a laugh.

Of course you have a degree in psycologial

Dude It's Psycology, Yes

I always make an effort to avoid making comment about folks (belittling) who clearly do not possess a dictionary, but when these self same people try to defend the fact that they never got past 7th grade and their attempt (s) at spelling proves it beyond any doubt, well they are gonna be fair game in my book.

You can only help some of the people some of the time "not all of the people all of the time"

[mrtoad]

These human specimens are psycologial Nazi anal retentives' but of course should be allowed to parade around in "uniforms" to get the attention they crave, no skin off anyones' nose and good for a laugh.

Of course you have a degree in psycologial

Dude It's Psycology, Yes

I always make an effort to avoid making comment about folks (belittling) who clearly do not possess a dictionary, but when these self same people try to defend the fact that they never got past 7th grade and their attempt (s) at spelling proves it beyond any doubt, well they are gonna be fair game in my book.

You can only help some of the people some of the time "not all of the people all of the time"

I think the use of the word "dude" gave a fair insight.

[sriracha john]

I haven't seen any of these farangs who dress up in uniforms and supposedly help the Thai police for a long time, but I did spot one at the beginning of Songkran and was instantly filled with embarrasment on their behalf.

I know that they are supposedly doing a good deed, but I feel certain that something is seriously wrong with anyone who would take on such a job unless they were in severe financial straits and getting paid a salary. I will admit that I am willing to sink to any low to remain in Thailand, including teaching at a University.

I know that p1p volunteered for this program at one time - so there must be a few good ones - but, he seems to have quit as soon as possible since I never saw him marching around in a policeman suit.

Am I the only one who feels this way about these guys?

Its wrong and its potentially dangerous. Putting unqualified personnel into situations that are potentially dangerous is foolhardy.

I also am bemused as to WHY somebody would want to do this especially with it being voluntary.

Also, what about the work permits?

From the current and similar thread...

http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=183807

Approach By Tourist Police

Opinions needed please. I have just had the tourist police up trying to recruit me. It was them car/badges etc, so discount a wind up. They are looking for Farangs with English language skills to join the police in assisting tourists. They implied it was voluntary work. Now I understand that volunteers in Phuket at the time of the tsunami had problems because they had the wrong visa. The guys they have shown me from Chumpon appear to be living here on the same basis as me, that is 12 month extension based on a Thai family. I told them before I commited myself to this I would want to hear immigrations opinion. They implied that it was not a visa issue, but they would wouldn't they. If this is is the wrong forum please move it, but I did not know where to post it, as I feel it is just seeking opinions.

You want to hear from the Labor Ministry, not Immigrations, as they are the ones in charge of work permits.

Despite repeated requests, not once have Farang Volunteer Police produced either the required Work Permit or Work Permit Exemption Letter.

[Blinky Bill]

The theory of the volunteers was a good one. The practice, not quite so.

When it first began several years ago I was asked to join. The police wanted foreigners who could act as go-betweens when a problem came up for a visitor. NOT TO ACT AS POLICEMEN. The theory was that the volunteers would be able to answer questions for visitors, direct visitors to the correct destinations, to assist foreigners when they found themselves involved in problems with Thais or other foreigners and Police. NOT TO ACT AS POLICEMEN. Not to carry a big stick. Not to enforce laws. To assist visitors and answer their questions regarding to whom to speak when they had a problem with passports, problems with getting robbed, problems with getting cheated by unsavory vendors. NOT TO SOLVE THE PROBLEMS, but to help direct the visitors to the proper places to get their problems solved. Again, the theory was that this unit would NOT BE POLICE and have NO authority.

Many visitors from Japan, Germany, France, or Korea do not speak any Thai or English. To be able to tell their problems or ask for help from a native speaker is a very valuable thing for them in times of stress. And we all know, travel = stress. We were told that we would be welcomed to donate any amount of time that we could spare to this end.

One morning, not in any uniform, I came across two Swiss girls who were scraped and bruised from a snatch and grab during the night, crying in their guesthouse. Early twenties, they were at a complete loss as to what they should do. Here they were, in a strange country, as travelers they were under much more stress then they would have been in their home countries, and couldn't even think straight. As it happened, this occurred on one of the 'Police Days' when just about every cop in town was three sheets to the wind and they couldn't even get one to listen to them, much less understand them. They had lost their passports and credit cards. I acted as facilitator, (probably nothing different than you would have done,) first with the Tourist Police, then along with a TP officer, with the police at Phra Singh station, taking the girls to report the crime, and then called up the Swiss embassy in Bangkok to request for the special pickup of the passport on a Saturday so that the girls could get to Koh Pang Ngan by Tuesday - and the full moon party. After all, that's why they came to Thailand in the first place! They took the bus to Bangkok very happy with the help they had received. I would have done the same had I not been involved with the volunteer group. The fact that I was, simply meant that some of the regular officers knew me and were willing to listen when I brought the girls to the office. Other times, in uniform, I helped people on the Walking Street and in the Arcade bus station. Not enforcing laws. Assisting visitors who couldn't figure out where the toilets were or how to get where they wanted to go. Not 'playing policeman.'

Sometimes long working cops get the idea that their only role is to deal with garbage. 99% of the time it is for them. The volunteers were created to deal with that other 1%. At least, that was the plan.

That was then.....

Then some of the sorts of folks that our board ex-cops are talking about started standing out. Most of us didn't like that. It wasn't what we were formed for. WE WERE NOT POLICE. But some were police wannabees, I was once accused by a tourist of being able to exceed my authority, I had to explain to him that I had NO authority. He could make a citizen’s arrest just like the next person if they are witness to a serious crime. You don't need a badge to do this. You need morality.

Then the Pattaya police began using the volunteers as undercover agents. No training. No assistance. No back-up. No authority. THIS WAS NOT THE ORIGINAL PLAN. I don't know if this was ever done in Chiang Mai, but I wouldn't be surprised. A lot of us in Chiang Mai stopped attending when we were told that we HAD to carry handcuffs. A lot stopped when we were told that we HAD to put in 20 hours a week. A lot stopped when they tried to make us behave as policemen. Between you and me, I had my fair share of saluting 40+ years ago. I really didn't need it again now.

So what started as a good idea five years ago, with 50-60+ people willing to help others when they could, the program devolved into 6-10 people carrying handcuffs and batons, riding in cruisers, standing in parade formations, saluting and spit shinning their boots. I'm sure a couple of them are still well-meaning and non authoritative, but the numbers just are no longer there.

It's the visitors who are losing out. This is a program that has been in effect in Monaco for many years, and is working well. It just lacked the planning and training when organized here. It's too bad. When you really need a toilet in a foreign country and can't speak the language, THAT is a VERY SERIOUS PROBLEM!

Interesting post FG. Thanks.

Edited April 16, 2008 by Blinky Bill

[gpdjohn]

I think that would be a great idea still, to have volunteers assist tourists.

No uniforms, no cuffs, complete disassociation from the police or looking like one.

Maybe a polo shirt, bright yellow.

Phoenix has what they call "Downtown Guides". Wear polos ( purple ) and are there to assist tourists in providing directions, etc. Equipted with city radios, not police ones and not on any police freq's , but able to have a marked unit respond if needed through a city dispatcher.

The PD also has "Victim Avocates", which take care of all the needs of victims of crimes, also not in a police uniform, and can be dispatched at the request of an officer.

And the psyco wanna be "when do I get to shoot someone" goofs have no desire to partake, since they don't get to wear a badge and have no authority.

I think it is a good idea, just going about it the wrong way.

[Jefferson]

What a great post by FolkGuitar..

So what to do with the remaining ones then who are in it for the power trip? Anyone ever get hassled by them?

[skippybangkok]

Not my cup of tea, but if ur a tourist in need, and have problems speaking to the local police ( which i am sure everyone has experienced ), i recon this would be meritorious.

If a power trip, that sucks

[Donnyboy]

I dont have a problem with them as such. Seen many walking around the nightmarket and even spoke to a few, and they seem ok to me.

Undercover volunteer cops in CM~ never heard of such a thing

[Cuban]

Then the Pattaya police began using the volunteers as undercover agents. No training. No assistance. No back-up. No authority. THIS WAS NOT THE ORIGINAL PLAN. I don't know if this was ever done in Chiang Mai, but I wouldn't be surprised.

Indeed. Everytime I hear on the news about the serious offence of 'showing' that the brave local force have captured on film in a Walking Street establishment - I wonder about the resulting fines and closure period and the effect on establishments owned by joe public and those owed by moonlighting police?

The phrase "protecting the tourists" is oft used - but I feel tourists need more protection from drunk drivers, price fixing or muggers than a bared body.

[FolkGuitar]

Not my cup of tea, but if ur a tourist in need, and have problems speaking to the local police ( which i am sure everyone has experienced ), i recon this would be meritorious.

If a power trip, that sucks

As I mentioned, this has been going on in Monaco for quite some time now, with very good results. Their group does wear a uniform, but it's a Middle Ages costume and not at all threatening. But Thailand is a very uniform-conscious country. Even the pharmacists have military uniforms for formal occasions. (Come to think of it, I wear a uniform every day!) I think that the tourists actually prefer to see their 'advisers' looking professional. Many of my clients have told me that they were actually frightened off by the various touts at train stations, bus stations, ferry docks, etc., trying to steer them into guest houses or restaurants because they looked so slovenly!

I will admit to two things;

1) helping the two cute Swiss girls did make me feel good

2) I might not have helped if they were two ugly Swiss guys.....

As for the power trippers..... I haven't heard of anyone being bothered directly by them in Chiang Mai, but there were reports from Pattaya of them rousting partying farangs. What I have heard most of is people complaining about them being police wannabees (no question about this one... very true but very limited, ) or abusing authority without any actual reports of them abusing authority! What I see with my own eyes is a very good program that ran itself into the ground. I won't post my beliefs as to why it actually failed. It did have the potential to be a very effective interface between the visitors to Chiang Mai and the opportunities that Chiang Mai could offer them.

[sabaijai]

What I have heard most of is people complaining about them being police wannabees (no question about this one... very true but very limited, ) or abusing authority without any actual reports of them abusing authority!

I think that about sums it up. The ones here in CM seem pretty harmless to me. They may even do some good. Since I'm a resident, not a tourist, I've had no occasion to interact with any of the vols.

[sweetchariot]

I am still waiting to hear from a few of our esteemed Pattaya members before I pass too much comment, but here is my take of it in Pattaya:

1. They are only based in the Police Station in Pattaya to act as go-betweens/ interpreters/ counsellors. Sounds like a good idea.

2. They do not go out on patrol, nor carry batons etc. Same as above.

3. They have recently been dragged into getting involved in Police roadblocks over Songkran. DANGER DANGER

4. A well known local businessman/ publisher is in charge??? GOD HELP US

I would love to hear a response from one of those involved to clarify or correct the above.

Cheers,

Swing Low...