Divorce--advice Sought

[slippery when wet]

Hello I am after some advice to see legally where I stand.

Things have turned a litle sour lately and I cant continue as we are doing.

I was wondering legally where would stand if we were to divorce. We both live in the UK but if we seperate I'm pretty sure that my wife would return to Thailand and be with her family. I have some assets in property in the uk and I endevour to save these as much as possible and am looking at the legal implications, what she is entitled to etc.. I was wondering if it matters that we married in Thailand or not.

I look forward to your advice

[Lickey]

Depends upon how many assets are in joint names, eg, bank account, house, ect,you could be very lucky in a way that you didnt marry in the UK,

Perhaps promise her a fair sum of money if she agrees to the divorce, and signs the relevant papers,

I hope it all ends up amicable for both of you, Rgds, Lickey.

[slippery when wet]

Basically all my assets are in property in the UK but only in my name, however I am sure as my wife she is entitled to something. I am still trying to make it work as I believe that we did love each other once and with some effort can do again. However I am looking a a worst case senario here in the event that we cant work through opur problems.

Thanks slippery

[Mosha]

Have a chat with the CAB, they will fix you up with a free 30 minutes with a solicitor for advice if you like. Or at least they did 10 years back.

[nam-thip]

I live in Thailand and as I understand the laws of marriage here which is where you married its states that what you own going into a marriage stays with you on divorce.

That said offer her an acceptable amount of money (Buy her off)

Above all else Thai’s worship money and on separation there has to be a pay off which usually ends up in the family’s or the Thai boyfriends grubby hands.

A pay off should get her out of your life.

Just put it down to one of life’s lessons and in future try and avoid getting yourself involved with another Asian female as very few farang and Thai relationships work out in the long term.

Over the years I’ve seen many foreigners in Thailand loose their life’s savings by putting everything in the ladies name and the law here always falls on the side of the Thai. At least you appear to have your valuables in your name along with the advantage of being on home soil.

Had you been in Thailand you might have found yourself facing elimination for cutting off the families supply route.

[Geekfreaklover]

As far as I know it doesn't matter if you were married in Thailand or the Uk. A registed marriage in thailand has legal due-restriction in the country of your origin. The important thing is where you divorce... Try not to divorce in the Uk.

I think in this situation I would cosy up to her somewhat and at the same time suggest that there are some relationship 'problems' that need to be sorted out. Suggest taling a holiday to Thailand to try and 'make things work'

Once in Thailand, make sure that the relationship 'problems' get worse and tell her you want a divorce. Offer an amount of money to divorce and have the divorce completed, if she is in agreement, at an amphur office. Very important to have a lawyer/translator present.

If she is not in agreement then fly back alone. Increase the cash offer for divorce by telephone. don't give any money until the papers are signed. This can be done by international post.

Try and divorce in thailand if possible. ane once you have done that you need to register the divorce in the Uk.

If there are kids involved it is obviously much more complicated.

Best of luck

Edited October 31, 2008 by Geekfreaklover

[GuestHouse]

Regardless of where you are married your assets, property, savings and pensions are shared between you and your wife - 'The I have some Property' is actually 'We have some Property'.

As your wife has been in the UK for four years it is almost certain that she is aware of her rights. Attempts to deny her her rights would certainly only make matters worse.

You have stated that you had a good relationship and that you believe with effort you could have a good relationship again. I therefore suggest that you should consider contacting 'Relate' (what used to be called the Marriage Guidance) see what help they can offer, either you or both of you.

------

I think in this situation I would tell her that you are having relationship 'problems' and suggest taling a holiday to Thailand to try and 'make things work'

Once in Thailand, make sure that the relationship 'problems' get worse and tell her you want a divorce. Offer an amount of money to divorce and have the divorce completed, if she is in agreement, at an amphur office. Very important to have a lawyer/translator present.

If she is not in agreement then fly back alone. Increase the cash offer for divorce by telephone. don't give any money until the papers are signed. This can be done by international post.

If there are kids involved it is obviously much more complicated.

You meet the Nicest people on ThaiVisa

[Geekfreaklover]

You meet the Nicest people on ThaiVisa

The OP was asking about the lagality of marrying in Thailand and how to protect his assets in the advent of a divorce.

They married in Thailand, they can divorce in Thailand? - what could be fairer than that???

[GuestHouse]

They are not his assets, he's married, they are shared assets.

The advice you have given is to remove the woman from the UK to where she cannot obtain her rights under UK law.

Like I say... The Nicest of People.

[Geekfreaklover]

They are not his assets, he's married, they are shared assets.

The advice you have given is to remove the woman from the UK to where she cannot obtain her rights under UK law.

Like I say... The Nicest of People.

Apologies, but the original question was not

'How can I lose most, if not all, of what I have worked for all my life?'

- the question was

'How can I protect what I have?'

She is not being removed from the Uk. She would be free to travel between the UK and Thailand (her home country and where the marriage took place) Obviously she has a visa. But from the original post it appears that she would like to go and live in Thailand and things are not working out for the couple.

Edited October 31, 2008 by Geekfreaklover

[dbrenn]

They are not his assets, he's married, they are shared assets.

The advice you have given is to remove the woman from the UK to where she cannot obtain her rights under UK law.

Like I say... The Nicest of People.

That's correct. If you marry in Thailand, then move to the UK with you wife, in the eyes of UK law you are married. It's as simple as that. After all, the OP likely used the fact that he was married to get his wife a UK visa, so it's hard to understand how he can now expect UK law to allow him to slectively appear unmarried now that his assets are at stake. His wife has every right to sue him under UK law for all that she would have got had she married in him in the UK. Caveat Emptor.

Marriage in Thailand is considered marriage in the UK too. Otherwise, many would have a wife in every port :-)

[2008bangkok]

I would suggest the same as geekfreek lover and if after you have tried to resolve it you cant then just come on a 'holiday' to thailand and sort it out here

[joskydive]

Hello I am after some advice to see legally where I stand.

Things have turned a litle sour lately and I cant continue as we are doing.

I was wondering legally where would stand if we were to divorce. We both live in the UK but if we seperate I'm pretty sure that my wife would return to Thailand and be with her family. I have some assets in property in the uk and I endevour to save these as much as possible and am looking at the legal implications, what she is entitled to etc.. I was wondering if it matters that we married in Thailand or not.

I look forward to your advice

You would be best off getting some advise from a Solicitor there. You can have a 30 minute interview for free. Was the marriage officially registered at the British Embassy at the time and have got children with her?

For divorce in Thailand you both need to go back to the Amphur where you married.

Also, if it can be proved that you lived together for more than 6 months in the UK the assets are up for sharing. If you have children, you are responsible financially until they are 16 or until they finish their Education, whichever is the latter. If she can prove that you are the one at fault she can also apply for maintenance from you until, if/when she marries again.

[Thai at Heart]

They are not his assets, he's married, they are shared assets.

The advice you have given is to remove the woman from the UK to where she cannot obtain her rights under UK law.

Like I say... The Nicest of People.

Apologies, but the original question was not

'How can I lose most, if not all, of what I have worked for all my life?'

- the question was

'How can I protect what I have?'

She is not being removed from the Uk. She would be free to travel between the UK and Thailand (her home country and where the marriage took place) Obviously she has a visa. But from the original post it appears that she would like to go and live in Thailand and things are not working out for the couple.

As far as I know, under Thai law she is entitled to 50% of everything accumulated during the term of the marriage. If he divorces in Thailand, she could go for that. If he divorces in the UK it would be a whole lot more complicated.

[Geekfreaklover]

Yes, to clarify. Divorce in Thailand takes three shapes / stages.

1. Both parites go to an amphur (local district office) and they agree to the terms of the divorce. Once agreed upon the document is signed by both parites and a witness. this is a legal document which can be used, once translated to divorce in the home country.

2. Contested divorce. First stage mediation. Both parties with or without legal representation sit before a judge and try to come to a soloution for both parites.

3. Trial.

It's all well and good saying who is entitled to what. But at the end of the day it is an agreement between both parites endorsed by the law. It is normally best to come to an agreement at stage 1 or 2.

I divorced a Thai and was entitled to 50 percent of all assets. However I gave my ex wife all assets (land, houses, cars etc), at stage 2, in exchange for custody of our two children. A deal she seemed quite happy with.

[jayjayjayjay]

Can someone with experience with UK divorce provide a likely outcome. Interested to her how much a girl married for 4 years to someone with obviously a lot more assets can gain from this relationship! ie % she can walk away with and what defense does a guy have. Guesthouse might be critical of the guy, but I see his point, I worked all my life for this, I shared it in our union, but why should she get half the deal or whatever when walking away from the union! I'm not woman bashing, just interested to see what UK law acutally says!

[bangkokboro]

Can someone with experience with UK divorce provide a likely outcome. Interested to her how much a girl married for 4 years to someone with obviously a lot more assets can gain from this relationship! ie % she can walk away with and what defense does a guy have. Guesthouse might be critical of the guy, but I see his point, I worked all my life for this, I shared it in our union, but why should she get half the deal or whatever when walking away from the union! I'm not woman bashing, just interested to see what UK law acutally says!

To my knowledge you dont have to be even married these days for her to be entitled to the same as if you were.If you have lived together for 2 years i think it is the assets will be divided depending how many children and who has custody i.e 1 child 60%-40%

in favour of the legal guardian.

When i got divorced we seperated amicably until the lawyers got involved then the shit hit the fan and they cost me a fortune so my advice is be nice and make a settlement between yourselves for what you both think is reasonable and not throw money into the leeches(lawyers)pockets life is to short.

Good luck

[Geekfreaklover]

Can someone with experience with UK divorce provide a likely outcome. Interested to her how much a girl married for 4 years to someone with obviously a lot more assets can gain from this relationship! ie % she can walk away with and what defense does a guy have. Guesthouse might be critical of the guy, but I see his point, I worked all my life for this, I shared it in our union, but why should she get half the deal or whatever when walking away from the union! I'm not woman bashing, just interested to see what UK law acutally says!

Think you will find that Guesthouse is female.

As to Uk law. It is important to understand that divorce in the Uk or Thailand is a process where each party presents their individual case to a court of law. There are guidelines, but to say that there are hard and fast rules is an oversight. Did Heather Mills get 50% of Pauls wealth. No. She got a lot if it, but not 50%.

[rick75]

Geekfreak, I think using a divorce involving an estate worth hundreds of millions of pounds and legal bills that run into the tens of millions as an example of the average divorce settlement is a little of the mark.

[Geekfreaklover]

Geekfreak, I think using a divorce involving an estate worth hundreds of millions of pounds and legal bills that run into the tens of millions as an example of the average divorce settlement is a little of the mark.

Yes. You are right Ricky. Most guys end up losing much more than 50%

[rick75]

Geekfreak, I think using a divorce involving an estate worth hundreds of millions of pounds and legal bills that run into the tens of millions as an example of the average divorce settlement is a little of the mark.

Yes. You are right Ricky. Most guys end up losing much more than 50%

Only if kids are involved, it sucks that most guys only marry these girls so they can get a visa, the government forces your hand if you want them to come and stay in your home country.

Edited October 31, 2008 by rick75

[Geekfreaklover]

Geekfreak, I think using a divorce involving an estate worth hundreds of millions of pounds and legal bills that run into the tens of millions as an example of the average divorce settlement is a little of the mark.

Yes. You are right Ricky. Most guys end up losing much more than 50%

Only if kids are involved, it sucks that most guys only marry these girls so they can get a visa, the government forces your hand if you want them to come and stay in your home country.

True.

On another note..

I took my ex back to the Uk and she found it very difficult to settle. As did most of the other Thai's that I met in the UK. As a comparision of Asians living in the UK, it seemed that the Chinese, Bangladeshi's, Indians were able to adapt to living in the West very comfortably; second, third, fourth generations...

All the Thai people, that I met in the UK, seemed to be waiting until they could get back to Thailand. Can't say that I blame them for that.

[sumrit]

Hello I am after some advice to see legally where I stand.

Things have turned a litle sour lately and I cant continue as we are doing.

I was wondering legally where would stand if we were to divorce. We both live in the UK but if we seperate I'm pretty sure that my wife would return to Thailand and be with her family. I have some assets in property in the uk and I endevour to save these as much as possible and am looking at the legal implications, what she is entitled to etc.. I was wondering if it matters that we married in Thailand or not.

I look forward to your advice

If you were married in Thailand you can divorce in either the UK or Thailand.

If you divorce in the UK you will be subgect to UK divorce laws on sharing property, bank accounts, pensions etc that are held by both of you, jointly or indivdually plus the excessive solicitors fees involved and the time it takes(two years apart if you both agree,etc).

If you divorce in Thailand, PROVIDING YOU BOTH AGREE, it costs nothing and is completed in less than an hour at a local Amphur and there is no time delay before being able to divorce nor is there a need for solicitors to be involved. Any assets you hold IN THAILAND, either jointly or individually are usually subject to a 50-50 split but you can agree to any split as long as you both sign to agree to it. You also have to have an agreement on any children from the marriage (who they will live with,etc). Any assets held outside Thailand are not covered by Thai law and so remain the property of the person in whose name they are held.

So if most of your assets are in the UK and your wife will be returning to Thailand anyway then maybe you would be financialy better off taking a trip here yourself and divorcing here.

If things are not too good at the moment try not to let them get bad enough for her to seek legal advice in the UK as the first thing her solicitor will do is register her interest in your house with the Land Registry Office and that will mean you can't do anything with your house (sell it or even remortgage it) without here consent, even if you subsiquently divorce in Thailand and she returns there to live, you will need her signature to do anything. I should know, it happened to me when my (now ex) wife went to the local council to ask about a council flat because we were thinking of parting. They (wrongly) told her she would need a legal separation first and arranged an appointment with a solicitor who immediately registered the interest in my house. It cost me £25,000 to pursuade her to sign the papers to let me sell the house, even though we divorced in Thailand.

[onzestan]

For once I have to agree with Guesthouse.

The OP asks for guidance because he did not think of making an agreement with his wife to be, before marrying.

Anyway I find it very discomforting that nearly everybody assumes it has to be the Thai wife's fault.

There are always 2 sides to every story.

Just my 2 cents

cheers

onzestan

Edited October 31, 2008 by onzestan

[jayjayjayjay]

For once I have to agree with Guesthouse.

The OP asks for guidance because he did not think of making an agreement with his wife to be, before marrying.

Anyway I find it very discomforting that nearly everybody assumes it has to be the Thai wife's fault.

There are always 2 sides to every story.

Just my 2 cents

cheers

onzestan

I just wonder what would happen if you married into one of the elite families in Thailand. Let's say you married one of the heirs to Central group of companies(ie, 20% owner). If you stayed together for 10 years, how would they calculate 50/50 split of what the partners earnt over that time. Would all assets, including new companies purchased by the group be included.

Would a westerner get a real deal where he walked away with a pretty fortune. I am talking about the reverse situation, where the assets he walked away with were realatively huge compared to his earning capacity in his home country (let say the UK)..............

[Boo]

Geekfreaklover

Think you will find that Guesthouse is female.

Hmm really, got anything to back that up cause reading GH's posts over the years it is obvious he is a man married with a thai women & they have children.

It's really amusing that because a man doesn't automatically start blaming the women in a senario like this that "he" has to be a "she" . Grow up!

Op go see a solicitor, if you are serious about making your relationship work then all this speculating is pointless, better imo that you know for sure whatt he worse case senario is & then concentrate on fixing things with your wife.

But if it does go tits up with your wife you should be trying to keep it as amicable as possible for both your sakes.

[Geekfreaklover]

For once I have to agree with Guesthouse.

The OP asks for guidance because he did not think of making an agreement with his wife to be, before marrying.

Anyway I find it very discomforting that nearly everybody assumes it has to be the Thai wife's fault.

There are always 2 sides to every story.

Just my 2 cents

cheers

onzestan

I just wonder what would happen if you married into one of the elite families in Thailand. Let's say you married one of the heirs to Central group of companies(ie, 20% owner). If you stayed together for 10 years, how would they calculate 50/50 split of what the partners earnt over that time. Would all assets, including new companies purchased by the group be included.

Would a westerner get a real deal where he walked away with a pretty fortune. I am talking about the reverse situation, where the assets he walked away with were realatively huge compared to his earning capacity in his home country (let say the UK)..............

Excellent point. I would imagine he wouldn't get a satang.

Money talks, bull#$*t walks, in the South East Asian court system.

That is why it is in the OP's interest to get divorced in Thailand.

[haltes]

Far too much hearsay and comments that are not based on any legal facts on this thread.

e.g. There is no common law (relationship) status in law i.e. the idea of a common law spouse does not exist!Cohabiting couples living together for a period of time do not acquire the same rights as married couples, it's a total myth.

There are questions you need to answer, one of the most important being: do you have children?

But you also need to think about a lot of other factors: Do you have your own business? Does she work? Is she totally reliant on you? Do you have a pension?

She might be entitled to half the assets accrued during the course of the marriage (this can include part of your pension). She might be entitled to certain rights but you need proper legal advice

Talk to a lawyer who deals with divorce law and good luck.

[Geekfreaklover]

Geekfreaklover

Think you will find that Guesthouse is female.

Hmm really, got anything to back that up cause reading GH's posts over the years it is obvious he is a man married with a thai women & they have children.

It's really amusing that because a man doesn't automatically start blaming the women in a senario like this that "he" has to be a "she" . Grow up!

Op go see a solicitor, if you are serious about making your relationship work then all this speculating is pointless, better imo that you know for sure whatt he worse case senario is & then concentrate on fixing things with your wife.

But if it does go tits up with your wife you should be trying to keep it as amicable as possible for both your sakes.

Apologies, the reference to Guesthouse being a female was taken from reading a previous post on a different subject. I may have been mistaken and confused (probably was), but I recall something Guesthouse posting about a Thai Husband on a different thread.

sorry, i'll get me coat.

[MKAsok]

There is no common law (relationship) status in law i.e. the idea of a common law spouse does not exist!Cohabiting couples living together for a period of time do not acquire the same rights as married couples, it's a total myth.

You're half right. At least as far as English law is concerned. Unmarried couples don't acquire rights over property through common law remedies, but through equitable ones e.g. constructive trusts. Through such remedies they are able to acquire identical rights to married couples.