Prostitution : Is It Wrong To Pay For Sex ?

[GuestHouse]

These abuses already bother me - just like workers who are exploited making products for Westerners in the 3rd world - but if the vast majority of venues are not abusing these workers, why point your accusing finger at all of them?

Because the abuse does exist here in Thailand. I've given a link to a recent case of abuse in a brothel catering for foreigners in Pattaya, I acknowledge that you accept abuse exists, there are others here who do not.

Where I go further than you is I believe that abuse is far more prevalent than you do, and I do not accept that there is a clear line between establishment's where abuse exists and establishments where abuse does not exist.

To draw that line you'd have to be absolutely sure of the history and motivations that have brought each and every woman to work in any establishment you choose to 'patronise'.

[GuestHouse]

Here’s an interesting observation is that Police investigations of Thai women working in illegal brothels overseas (across numerous national police/law enforcement jurisdictions) almost always reveal abuse, women bonded by debt, passports seized by the brothel owners, physical/emotional abuse, threats against family at home in Thailand and imprisonment of the Thai women working as Prostitutes. Very often the abusers are themselves Thais. Or Thais play part in the abuse along the trafficking line that got the women into the overseas Thai brothels.

Refer recent cases from: Singapore, Malaysia, Bahrain, the UK, South Africa, the US.

Meanwhile in Thailand, refer earlier links, Thai women caught up in abuse at a brothel in Thailand seek assistance from the Thai police and are told that the Police do not have time to deal with the case.

There's a stark contrast between investigations of abuse overseas and investigations here in Thailand.

Why is that so?

Is it because abuse hardly ever happens in Thailand or is it for because abuse does happen but is not investigated (Perhaps not a Police Priority)?

Regardless, the huge disparity between what is reported by Thai police to be happening to Thai Prostitutes in Thailand and what is being reported by numerous overseas law enforcement agencies is happening to Thai prostitutes overseas.

With this in mind it is very difficult to argue that abuse in Thailand is not being under reported.

[sarahsbloke]

With this in mind it is very difficult to argue that abuse in Thailand is not being under reported.

Who cares!

Thailand is a violent place, beatings between the sexes are very common, some women even beat their husbands.

Why go out of your way to pick on violence in brothels .... it's totally irrelevant to this thread.

You have already admitted to using prostitutes earlier in this thread, same as everyone else.

This thread is primarily about bar girls, not Thai brothels, westeners usually don't even know such places exist, and we generally wouldn't be allowed in anyway.

Edited July 22, 2010 by sarahsbloke

[Ulysses G.]

With this in mind it is very difficult to argue that abuse in Thailand is not being under reported.

It might very well be "under reported", but there is still very little of it in the sex industry aimed at farangs. Any abuse of humans in any industry is a sad thing, but that does not mean that the workers, decent customers and benign employers should be condemned.

[IanForbes]

YOU made a wrong choice....

I was married to my husband for 28 years and worked throughout, earning a similar wage - most times a bit less, some times a bit more.

Came to Thailand and he dumped me for a woman he met in a bar . I lost out big time financially - I thought we were secure financially, only to see 50% taken away - through no choice of my own.

All my friends back in the UK worked - they didn't prat around with their husband's money.

You were unlucky, don't you dare insinuate that all Western women are the same!

I'm not blaming anyone for the choices I've made. I just have to live with them. And, I've never, ever said that all women are the same...what ever country they've come from. . I'm just basically saying that I had to pay for my wite's company, but the financial and emotional losses were worth the good times we had... at least for me. I can't speak for her. In her case she left with more than she came into our relationship with.

But, as I've pointed out before, it works both ways. The splitting up of assets in a divorce in western countries is probably more fair today than it was 20 or 30 years ago. The courts can't get into the details because nobody can determine correctly who was right and who was wrong. As you pointed out, there are many marriages today where the woman works and contributes as much or more than the husband.

Thailand works on a slightly different basis. There is no social security. Only the women who have conned farang husbands into buying them property gain anything in a divorce. Thai men can split from their wives and leave the ex wife destitute with small children to look after. No wonder so many Thai women want to marry farang husbands. There is far less risk for them if they get a home and property in a divorce settlement.

On this topic of prostitution it is like all motherhood issues where we go round and round debating polarized points of view. All I ever point out (as does Ulysses) is there is no defining right or wrong answer. There are too many grey areas and too many exceptions... of which many have been pointed out by personal experiences.

[sokal]

re Mr Forbes novel an UGs reply to my comment.

I have no problems with the notion of a commercial transaction for sex between consenting adults.

All i see here is a man who made some stupid choices trying to equate his ex with a whore. strangely, i thought that with a prostitute you met, came to an agreement, had sex and then parted ways.

Despite some of the potentially expensive consequences of a failed marriage i don't see the parallel, nor do i see the point in trying to draw it unless you are trying to justify paid sex as equivalent to an actual relationship.

This discussion is fraught with folks who can't seem to make the distinction.

An actual relationship is just as much about sex and money as prostitution. In prostitution you are paying for sex, in marriage you are paying for free sex. No difference.

I know allot of men that have lost half their net worth plus half their future earnings paying for free sex.

Try finding a guy that will stay in a relationship with a woman that NEVER puts out. It just doesnt happen.

how can you not see the parallel ?

[sokal]

I reckon most of you blokes are obsessed with sex workers.

define sex worker please.

[sokal]

Let me make some comparisons and tell me if I didn't pay for a woman's company when I was married.

When Maria came into my life it was second marriage for both of us. She had a job when we first met, but the government shut it down a short time later. After that she did not work except for a dozen small businesses that I financed for her. Before any of the businesses became successful she quit and started another. They varied from hair stylist, to doing nails, to selling jewelry, to selling Amway goods, and then running a day care for children. In each case I paid for the start up costs and kept things going, including doing the accounting. I know what the costs were. I put up with the constant career changes because I understand that not all careers suit everyong equally. One of her friends had a successful day care business and Maria though she would like that. It looked like a smart idea because I knew her friend was making a good income from her day care business. But, we needed a larger home than the nice little one I already owned and that was perfect for just two people.

So, I sold the small home and took out a big morthgage for a larger home in a better location, specifically so she could run the day care. The business was a success from the start and the location was great. But, Just before the day care started making money she turned it over to her daughter who only lasted another year with it before she also quit. Then, I was stuck with a big house we didn't need with a mortgage I didn't want and no income to pay for it. The whole thing cost me a lot of money. During that time, I also helped out her two adult children in trying to get them careers. I also bought Maria two new cars that her son prompted destroyed. Fortunately, the insurance (which I paid for) covered most of the damage costs.

When her adult son got into the drug scene I was naive in thinking I could help. I had to buy him out of a rental home that he destroyed, and he moved in with us. !0 months after he moved in she moved out and left her son with me. A short time after that I had to get the police to get her son out of my home because he was smashing it in fits of rage. A couple months after that she filed for divorce and wanted half of everything. Over the 7 years we were together she had contributed nothing other than her body and her company. When we finally parted she walked away with half of what I had worked all my life for. We probably had sex about 3 or 4 times a week... about what I get now when I'm in Thailand. I don't want to hear all the usual feminazi claptrap about looking after the home for me. I did all the cooking and the clean up afterwards when we were together, and I did all the yard work. She contributed by doing the laundry and the lnterior house cleaning. I could have paid Molly-Maid house cleaning for that.

I put up with all that because I truly was in love with the lady and would have done anything for her. Ienjoyed her company and we had some great times together, but If I were to divide all the times we made love together into what it cost me financially it would come to far more than I've ever paid for prostitutes. Yes, the sex was mostly better (but not always) and for the good times we had together it was worth it to me. But, don't tell me I didn't pay for her company. And, it wasn't a lot different than the few special ladies that visit me now on a regular basis.

Thanks for sharing that, it puts things into perspective.

[Piengrudee]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

[Ulysses G.]

If wishes were horses, beggars would ride.

[sokal]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

Women leverage security and/or money through sex always.There is a few different names for it, one is marriage, another is prostitution.

[GuestHouse]

You have already admitted to using prostitutes earlier in this thread, same as everyone else.

Can you please provide the quote where you say I have admitted to this.

[kpmsprtd]

GuestHouse: What is it that you want? Do you have a goal? What is it exactly that you are trying to convince us?

All:

While reading all the posts in this (so far) 26-page thread, I received a call from Deum. Characterstics: University grad, works for a Japanese-owned trading company in Bangkok. Lives with mom and three sisters in a BKK suburb. Drives a Carryboy.

I like Deum. I enjoyed doing a couple of things with her and her family a couple of years ago. (She was always well escorted...)

I have not heard from her since I last saw her in January 2008, I think it was. But tonight I get the call out of the blue. "Yes. I've been really busy. I quit my job. I've opened a small shop. I've got x number of workers. Two of them quit, but that's okay. I'll hire more if we get busy. You can send me an e-mail."

In Pattaya, on the other hand, there are several ladies eager to be my friend. They have agreed in advance to spend time with me. After we spend our time together, that will be it. They will not contact me, and I will not contact them. I will once again leave town with only the memories.

So, there is Deum, the civilian, and all the possibilities that she entails. Then there is the corps of Pattaya ladies and all the possibilities that they entail.

Here's the riddle: Who represents a greater danger to me? Is it Deum, the university graduate, small business owner, good girl? Or, is it the Pattaya ladies, the working girls, scorned by several on this forum with labels such as "whore" and "prostitute"?

GuestHouse: What say you, sir, with your obviously superior-to-the-rest-of-us-here intellect? I'm in a quandary.

[sokal]

You have already admitted to using prostitutes earlier in this thread, same as everyone else.

Can you please provide the quote where you say I have admitted to this.

have you ever had sex ?

[t.s]

re Mr Forbes novel an UGs reply to my comment.

I have no problems with the notion of a commercial transaction for sex between consenting adults.

All i see here is a man who made some stupid choices trying to equate his ex with a whore. strangely, i thought that with a prostitute you met, came to an agreement, had sex and then parted ways.

Despite some of the potentially expensive consequences of a failed marriage i don't see the parallel, nor do i see the point in trying to draw it unless you are trying to justify paid sex as equivalent to an actual relationship.

This discussion is fraught with folks who can't seem to make the distinction.

An actual relationship is just as much about sex and money as prostitution. In prostitution you are paying for sex, in marriage you are paying for free sex. No difference.

I know allot of men that have lost half their net worth plus half their future earnings paying for free sex.

Try finding a guy that will stay in a relationship with a woman that NEVER puts out. It just doesnt happen.

how can you not see the parallel ?

i cannot see the parallel because the parallel does not exist, and i think your endless insistence that it does belies a much deeper pathology.

you seem unable to comprehend that women are capable of sex for sex sake and that a man may actually enter into an intimate emotional relationship in which sex is a byproduct of that intimacy.

By the same token, am man and a woman can engage in a commercial transaction whereby one receives money and the other is able to indulge a fantasy, a biological imperative or both.

the need you have to tar all relationships with the same brush speaks more of your own shortcomings than those of the women around you.

Edited July 22, 2010 by t.s

[Kwasaki]

In answer to the Question :- No! I do not think it is wrong to pay for sex, that is my choice and my opinion.

People that agree with me may or may not pay for sex.

It is something that is happening in all countries around the world and carry out since maybe population times began.

Maybe I'm showing my age but to throw some humour on the subject, this reminds me of a joke that many may of heard already :-

While in conversation a man said to an attractive lady, "would you go to bed with me for a million pounds", the lady said," well! yes for a million pounds" the man then said "how about twenty five quid then" the lady then quite angrily said "who do you think I am a prostitute" the man said "we have already established what you are we are mearly dicussing the price".

Here's one for Guesthouse.

The position of prostitution and the law varies widely worldwide, reflecting differing opinions

on victim-hood and exploitation, inequality, gender roles, gender equality, ethics and morality,

freedom of choice, historical social norms, social costs and benefits.

[cardholder]

So, having paid my partner for sex when, if ever, does she stop being a whore ?

In some cases, unfortunately, never. Can you hear her brain go cha-ching every time you hit it?

Everybody has to eat and have a roof over their head. Being of a whore mind-set goes beyond just money. It's more an attitude that they expect something for being with you. That's other than just caring and looking out for both your best intyerests. Otherwise, as they say on Maury's, she's a ho.

Thanks Shotime.

I take care of her (as I would a Western partner). She doesn't ask for things - I guess she is now cured ?

[zthyadat]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

"Should be" is a nice thought... but since paid sex has existed for at least as long as recorded history, it looks like it is here to stay.

[mark45y]

You have already admitted to using prostitutes earlier in this thread, same as everyone else.

Can you please provide the quote where you say I have admitted to this.

A little history for Guesthouse. Because I don't think you will read the short story I recommended.

First came the seamen (no pun intended). Then came the planters. The South Pacific has a lot in common with Thailand in that all the islanders had lots to eat. Plenty of fruit, vegetables and fish. Shelter wasn’t much of a problem because it was warm all year long. What did the people do? They partied. The women didn’t wear much clothing like Thailand 500 years ago. They were topless and happy. They partied hard. The women danced sexy dances and the men danced manly dances and every body got horny and had sex. Unwed mothers and children out of wedlock was not a problem because there was enough to eat. The villages took care of the children like they were their own. Everybody was happy.

The planters added an extra dimension to the scene as they needed labor and gave the natives jobs. So in addition to the free food and shelter the natives had money. Everybody was still happy. Occasionally seamen still docked at the islands and they gave the natives money too. Sometimes for food and sometimes for sex. Everybody was still happy.

Then the missionaries came. The missionaries were not happy. They saw the people without guilt. They were having too much fun. They were partying naked and having sex with just about anyone. Age didn’t make much difference. If a woman could have a baby she did and that was that.

The missionaries were people like Guesthouse. They found all this happiness and sex too much to handle. They searched for reasons to stop all of the happiness. First they put clothes on the natives and next they stopped the parties and rampant sexuality. They natives told they to go fly a kite but the missionaries had an ace in the hole. The planters. If the missionaries told all the people back home in America about the naked natives and free (or almost free) sex the planters would be in deep do do. So the planters didn’t give jobs and money to any natives who staid naked and screwed everyone.

The missionaries won, sort of. That is what the story Rain is about.

Guesthouse would have you believe that there is extreme abuse going on in the prostitution business in Thailand and that is a reason not to participate in that business.

Since western men began recording their interactions with Thai’s 500 years ago there has been large scale brothels and rental wives available in Thailand. The rental wife concept even had laws that governed the rights of both parties. And if the truth be know that is what most GI’s did during Vietnam. They didn’t go to Pattaya because it was only a small village used by locals and in country GI’s. The Vietnam warriors staid in Bangkok and rented a wife for a week and drank cheap beer at the PX.

A large part of the industry is still like that. A tourist comes to Thailand and rents a girlfriend for a week, month or perhaps a few hours. It is what makes Thai prostitution different than western prostitution.

If you buy Guesthouse'a argument that you are participating in abuse (if it really exists on any large scale) by going to prostitutes then since prostitution is such a large business in Thailand and a large part of the GNP you would also be participating in abuse if you come to Thailand and spend money or live here and pay taxes. The only way to really protest the abuse is to boycott Thailand.

But some people like Guesthouse can’t see sex outside of marriage without guilt. And they have to make you feel guilt too.

Why? I have an idea but that would be better left to history or good literature to decide.

[mark45y]

re Mr Forbes novel an UGs reply to my comment.

I have no problems with the notion of a commercial transaction for sex between consenting adults.

All i see here is a man who made some stupid choices trying to equate his ex with a whore. strangely, i thought that with a prostitute you met, came to an agreement, had sex and then parted ways.

Despite some of the potentially expensive consequences of a failed marriage i don't see the parallel, nor do i see the point in trying to draw it unless you are trying to justify paid sex as equivalent to an actual relationship.

This discussion is fraught with folks who can't seem to make the distinction.

An actual relationship is just as much about sex and money as prostitution. In prostitution you are paying for sex, in marriage you are paying for free sex. No difference.

I know allot of men that have lost half their net worth plus half their future earnings paying for free sex.

Try finding a guy that will stay in a relationship with a woman that NEVER puts out. It just doesnt happen.

how can you not see the parallel ?

i cannot see the parallel because the parallel does not exist, and i think your endless insistence that it does belies a much deeper pathology.

you seem unable to comprehend that women are capable of sex for sex sake and that a man may actually enter into an intimate emotional relationship in which sex is a byproduct of that intimacy.

By the same token, am man and a woman can engage in a commercial transaction whereby one receives money and the other is able to indulge a fantasy, a biological imperative or both.

the need you have to tar all relationships with the same brush speaks more of your own shortcomings than those of the women around you.

When my father tried to tell me about sex and marriage and relationships I looked at him with the same wide eyed disbelief that you are showing in your above response.

If you can say the same things after being married for 7 years than you are really a man among men. You are a god. 50% of men get divorced. 25% are living in unhappy marriages and 24% are on prozac or some other mood altering medication. The leftover 1% come to Thailand and trade the prozac for beer and the failed marriage for Soi Six in Pattaya or someplace like it.

However if I am wrong and you have been married for longer than 7 years and are happy and sexually active. Good for you. I wish you all the best. But please realize what a small minority you are in.

[t.s]

re Mr Forbes novel an UGs reply to my comment.

I have no problems with the notion of a commercial transaction for sex between consenting adults.

All i see here is a man who made some stupid choices trying to equate his ex with a whore. strangely, i thought that with a prostitute you met, came to an agreement, had sex and then parted ways.

Despite some of the potentially expensive consequences of a failed marriage i don't see the parallel, nor do i see the point in trying to draw it unless you are trying to justify paid sex as equivalent to an actual relationship.

This discussion is fraught with folks who can't seem to make the distinction.

An actual relationship is just as much about sex and money as prostitution. In prostitution you are paying for sex, in marriage you are paying for free sex. No difference.

I know allot of men that have lost half their net worth plus half their future earnings paying for free sex.

Try finding a guy that will stay in a relationship with a woman that NEVER puts out. It just doesnt happen.

how can you not see the parallel ?

i cannot see the parallel because the parallel does not exist, and i think your endless insistence that it does belies a much deeper pathology.

you seem unable to comprehend that women are capable of sex for sex sake and that a man may actually enter into an intimate emotional relationship in which sex is a byproduct of that intimacy.

By the same token, am man and a woman can engage in a commercial transaction whereby one receives money and the other is able to indulge a fantasy, a biological imperative or both.

the need you have to tar all relationships with the same brush speaks more of your own shortcomings than those of the women around you.

When my father tried to tell me about sex and marriage and relationships I looked at him with the same wide eyed disbelief that you are showing in your above response.

If you can say the same things after being married for 7 years than you are really a man among men. You are a god. 50% of men get divorced. 25% are living in unhappy marriages and 24% are on prozac or some other mood altering medication. The leftover 1% come to Thailand and trade the prozac for beer and the failed marriage for Soi Six in Pattaya or someplace like it.

However if I am wrong and you have been married for longer than 7 years and are happy and sexually active. Good for you. I wish you all the best. But please realize what a small minority you are in.

And i again ask what does any of the above twaddle have to do with whether or not prostitution is wrong?

i made it 8 years when we decided to call it quits and we are still raising a child together and see each other daily. She is still one of my closest friends in Thailand and will continue to be. Beyond the child we lead our own separate lives.

When the end came, she moved out of my house and did so with no financial aid from me and, given that she gave me a child, i was the one who benefited most from our time together.

but anecdotes about marriage have no place in this thread about paying a woman for a sexual encounter.

I am not denying that marriages go wrong, just as i am not denying that prostitution has its dark side.

All relationships are not equal. I once ate an oyster that made me sick, but i still like oysters.

Forgive me but thus far i have been able to distinguish between women i have used for pleasure and the women i have loved and who have loved me.

sorry, i have little patience for the failed marriage brigade and their baggage. life's a bitch and then you die. move on.

[Ulysses G.]

You have already admitted to using prostitutes earlier in this thread, same as everyone else.

Can you please provide the quote where you say I have admitted to this.

A little history for Guesthouse. Because I don't think you will read the short story I recommended.

First came the seamen (no pun intended). Then came the planters. The South Pacific has a lot in common with Thailand in that all the islanders had lots to eat. Plenty of fruit, vegetables and fish. Shelter wasn't much of a problem because it was warm all year long. What did the people do? They partied. The women didn't wear much clothing like Thailand 500 years ago. They were topless and happy. They partied hard. The women danced sexy dances and the men danced manly dances and every body got horny and had sex. Unwed mothers and children out of wedlock was not a problem because there was enough to eat. The villages took care of the children like they were their own. Everybody was happy.

The planters added an extra dimension to the scene as they needed labor and gave the natives jobs. So in addition to the free food and shelter the natives had money. Everybody was still happy. Occasionally seamen still docked at the islands and they gave the natives money too. Sometimes for food and sometimes for sex. Everybody was still happy.

Then the missionaries came. The missionaries were not happy. They saw the people without guilt. They were having too much fun. They were partying naked and having sex with just about anyone. Age didn't make much difference. If a woman could have a baby she did and that was that.

The missionaries were people like Guesthouse. They found all this happiness and sex too much to handle. They searched for reasons to stop all of the happiness. First they put clothes on the natives and next they stopped the parties and rampant sexuality. They natives told they to go fly a kite but the missionaries had an ace in the hole. The planters. If the missionaries told all the people back home in America about the naked natives and free (or almost free) sex the planters would be in deep do do. So the planters didn't give jobs and money to any natives who staid naked and screwed everyone.

The missionaries won, sort of. That is what the story Rain is about.

Guesthouse would have you believe that there is extreme abuse going on in the prostitution business in Thailand and that is a reason not to participate in that business.

Since western men began recording their interactions with Thai's 500 years ago there has been large scale brothels and rental wives available in Thailand. The rental wife concept even had laws that governed the rights of both parties. And if the truth be know that is what most GI's did during Vietnam. They didn't go to Pattaya because it was only a small village used by locals and in country GI's. The Vietnam warriors staid in Bangkok and rented a wife for a week and drank cheap beer at the PX.

A large part of the industry is still like that. A tourist comes to Thailand and rents a girlfriend for a week, month or perhaps a few hours. It is what makes Thai prostitution different than western prostitution.

If you buy Guesthouse'a argument that you are participating in abuse (if it really exists on any large scale) by going to prostitutes then since prostitution is such a large business in Thailand and a large part of the GNP you would also be participating in abuse if you come to Thailand and spend money or live here and pay taxes. The only way to really protest the abuse is to boycott Thailand.

But some people like Guesthouse can't see sex outside of marriage without guilt. And they have to make you feel guilt too.

Why? I have an idea but that would be better left to history or good literature to decide.

An excellent allegory for the forces of conformity and dullness in general.

[MB1]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

Women leverage security and/or money through sex "always".There is a few different names for it, one is marriage, another is prostitution.

Sigh@Sokal, "ALWAYS" Hey, you just can't get it can you, so why do "party sluts" as you mentioned earlier on in the thread have sex, why are they having sex, I think most of us on here can agree that prostitutes have sex for money/payment but come on Sokal, explain why "party sluts" have sex..

If no ones paying them or giving them security, why do they do it...

[t.s]

why do party sluts have sex? I, personally, do it for the drugs.

[mark45y]

When my father tried to tell me about sex and marriage and relationships I looked at him with the same wide eyed disbelief that you are showing in your above response.

If you can say the same things after being married for 7 years than you are really a man among men. You are a god. 50% of men get divorced. 25% are living in unhappy marriages and 24% are on prozac or some other mood altering medication. The leftover 1% come to Thailand and trade the prozac for beer and the failed marriage for Soi Six in Pattaya or someplace like it.

However if I am wrong and you have been married for longer than 7 years and are happy and sexually active. Good for you. I wish you all the best. But please realize what a small minority you are in.

And i again ask what does any of the above twaddle have to do with whether or not prostitution is wrong?

i made it 8 years when we decided to call it quits and we are still raising a child together and see each other daily. She is still one of my closest friends in Thailand and will continue to be. Beyond the child we lead our own separate lives.

When the end came, she moved out of my house and did so with no financial aid from me and, given that she gave me a child, i was the one who benefited most from our time together.

but anecdotes about marriage have no place in this thread about paying a woman for a sexual encounter.

I am not denying that marriages go wrong, just as i am not denying that prostitution has its dark side.

All relationships are not equal. I once ate an oyster that made me sick, but i still like oysters.

Forgive me but thus far i have been able to distinguish between women i have used for pleasure and the women i have loved and who have loved me.

sorry, i have little patience for the failed marriage brigade and their baggage. life's a bitch and then you die. move on.

Forgive me for pointing it out but you are a member of the "Failed Marriage Brigade", but you are taking it better than most. Congratulations!

As for the anecdotes about marriage in Thailand and prostitution. Perhaps you have forgotten this is Thailand and a lot of men marry the prostitutes they met in bars. Thousands upon thousands. So maybe marriage and prostitution is a good mix in this forum at least.

Distinguishing between love and pleasure for me is difficult. I define love as unconditional positive regard. I don't think I have ever been loved by anyone. Good on you if you have. I know sometimes I used to get mixed up between my wife and a whore. The value received seemed to be backwards. If you consider your wife as the one who is supposed to love and cherish you. I do have a sneaking suspicion that I might not be the only one. And if that is the case then it is surly appropriate to discuss marriage and hookers in the same forum.

[sokal]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

Women leverage security and/or money through sex "always".There is a few different names for it, one is marriage, another is prostitution.

Sigh@Sokal, "ALWAYS" Hey, you just can't get it can you, so why do "party sluts" as you mentioned earlier on in the thread have sex, why are they having sex, I think most of us on here can agree that prostitutes have sex for money/payment but come on Sokal, explain why "party sluts" have sex..

If no ones paying them or giving them security, why do they do it...

Usually drugs or alcohol are involved. Also these kind of girls are usually abused at some point in their lives and they have psychological short comings.

[Ulysses G.]

these kind of girls are usually abused at some point in their lives and they have psychological short comings.

Abused? Maybe we should give up free sex too?

[mark45y]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

Women leverage security and/or money through sex "always".There is a few different names for it, one is marriage, another is prostitution.

Sigh@Sokal, "ALWAYS" Hey, you just can't get it can you, so why do "party sluts" as you mentioned earlier on in the thread have sex, why are they having sex, I think most of us on here can agree that prostitutes have sex for money/payment but come on Sokal, explain why "party sluts" have sex..

If no ones paying them or giving them security, why do they do it...

If guys have a lot of sex they are a stud. If girls have a lot of sex they are a nympho or slut.

What this means is society condones men having a lot of sex but not women.

Girls/women are supposed to have sex for money/security or some form of that like love or procreation.

The reason people think that is because it is the norm.

Womens lib changed all of that. In the 60’s women gained freedom with the bc pill. For the first time were freed of the fear of pregnancy. The little honeys went crazy for a few years, love in’s and stuff like that.

Now it is fairly well understood that women who have a lot of indiscriminate sex have some kind of emotional problem. Parents didn’t love them or insecurity or are they are writers or from Ireland.

[mark45y]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

Women leverage security and/or money through sex "always".There is a few different names for it, one is marriage, another is prostitution.

Sigh@Sokal, "ALWAYS" Hey, you just can't get it can you, so why do "party sluts" as you mentioned earlier on in the thread have sex, why are they having sex, I think most of us on here can agree that prostitutes have sex for money/payment but come on Sokal, explain why "party sluts" have sex..

If no ones paying them or giving them security, why do they do it...

Usually drugs or alcohol are involved. Also these kind of girls are usually abused at some point in their lives and they have psychological short comings.

You forgot about fat girls. Fat girls have a lot more sex than skinny girls. I don't know why. It is why a lot of guys like fat girls. I have always found ladies buying books like fat but fit are great fun and a pleasure to be with. People write off fat girls too quickly. It is really the person that counts not the pounds.

[MB1]

Sex should be free, and not paid.

Women leverage security and/or money through sex "always".There is a few different names for it, one is marriage, another is prostitution.

Sigh@Sokal, "ALWAYS" Hey, you just can't get it can you, so why do "party sluts" as you mentioned earlier on in the thread have sex, why are they having sex, I think most of us on here can agree that prostitutes have sex for money/payment but come on Sokal, explain why "party sluts" have sex..

If no ones paying them or giving them security, why do they do it...

Usually drugs or alcohol are involved. Also these kind of girls are usually abused at some point in their lives and they have psychological short comings.

"Usually", ahhh well at least you never said "All" or "Always"...