Trademark Domain Names

[jaysun]

Please do not take offense, but I believe you are being scammed.

I do management for a company that has a bunch of domain names (some .th, .net, .com) and we frequently get spam mail with similar text. Either trademark, or copyright, etc... they are phishing you. ignore it.

[ManOnTheRoad]

You found a 5 letter .com domain that was unregistered...that someone had a trademark on...something doesn't add up?

What's the domain?

Sorry mate cant reveal it now. I just signed a NON Disclosure agreement with them.Still negotiating with them i hope this can end soon and ill get some cash out of it.. update soon

What i can say is that .net.info.org and other domains for this 5 words are all taken up by them before ... found out my .com was registered 8 years ago and recently expired i was just in time to grab it .

Edited July 4, 2012 by ManOnTheRoad

[ManOnTheRoad]

Hi guys,

The domain in question is a 5 letter dot com , i didn't realized it was a brand name . I bought it in good faith thought it could be the next google, yahoo or even apple. A brand that could make good use of it.

So i received alot of calls from a private number early morning in bangkok while having a nice sleep. So i only realized that this law firm from New York is trying to get hold of me. In the letter sent via USPS they required me or my representative to contact them.

When they told me that the domain name i own infringe trademark of their client i was shock , made a research and my they are a multi billion dollar jewelry company .

Well i didn't call them yet as it is weekend today in thailand, but will try and call them noon NY time. Lets see perhaps this might be my golden opportunity to earn some hard cash from this and just sell and let go the domain to them hahaha if at least they pay me Half a million UDS. lol

more updates soon

Are you planning to use it for a jewelry related business?

lol no not jewellery business was thinking of setting up some internet based business like webhosting or something

[ManOnTheRoad]

Please do not take offense, but I believe you are being scammed.

I do management for a company that has a bunch of domain names (some .th, .net, .com) and we frequently get spam mail with similar text. Either trademark, or copyright, etc... they are phishing you. ignore it.

My last word with them if they are really serious about it and wants to buy it offer me a figure and complete the transaction by sending a representative to Bangkok and ill transfer the domain over to them when i receive the cash or cheque with bank verification.

too risky doing it over the internet, who knows this might be some scam

lol waiting for their responds .. this is interesting

Edited July 4, 2012 by ManOnTheRoad

[samsiam]

I read somewhere that if they had it registered before themselves and it just lapsed...you are screwed and it can be awarded back to them very easily in court.

[dave111223]

Sorry mate cant reveal it now. I just signed a NON Disclosure agreement with them.Still negotiating with them i hope this can end soon and ill get some cash out of it.. update soon

What i can say is that .net.info.org and other domains for this 5 words are all taken up by them before ... found out my .com was registered 8 years ago and recently expired i was just in time to grab it .

Basically you are screwed then, some idiot at their company forgot to renew it and you bought it out from under them. If they actually have a trademark on it too, you've got no chance.

If I was you I'd try and turn a quick buck off the situation...maybe 1000USD? At that price it's probably worth just bunging you the money instead of going through the whole process. If you start getting greedy it may just be easier for them to process the thing with ICANN and just get the domain taken back.

And if you start getting really greedy you may really piss them off and they might decide they want to come after you for lost revenue etc...

Having a rep. come out to Bangkok to do the deal...some pretty unrealistic/unreasonable to me...come on...

Edited July 4, 2012 by dave111223

[jaysun]

how much do you want to bet their next reply(s) will be along the lines of a 419 scam:

1. we will offer you ONE MILLION DOLLARS, just wait while we get our paperwork figured out!
   
2. by the way, i'm a sexy woman! i hope to have sex with you when i fly to finish our deal!
   
3. oh the bank needs proof you have ownership! can you please setup an account at our bank? it requires a minimum 20k USD deposit to open the account because we will give you so much money! Here you can deposit this (fake) check in your account first to get the money, then just put the 20k into this new account!
   
4. Did i mention that I want to have sex with you?
   

yadd yadda yadda

[phl]

how much do you want to bet their next reply(s) will be along the lines of a 419 scam:

1. we will offer you ONE MILLION DOLLARS, just wait while we get our paperwork figured out!
   
2. by the way, i'm a sexy woman! i hope to have sex with you when i fly to finish our deal!
   
3. oh the bank needs proof you have ownership! can you please setup an account at our bank? it requires a minimum 20k USD deposit to open the account because we will give you so much money! Here you can deposit this (fake) check in your account first to get the money, then just put the 20k into this new account!
   
4. Did i mention that I want to have sex with you?
   

yadd yadda yadda

If its a scam, it think the reply would be along the lines of providing full bank details for them to transfer the money.

Really unsure how it works with bank details, but many many scammers, always ask for bank details

[bangkockney]

You're example is still trademark infringement.

No it's not if the domain was purchased in good faith and is unrelated to the trademark owner.

For example:

ABC.com sell empty beer cans, and has a trademark on "ABC"

I buy AB-C.com and start an online dating website; without any knowledge about ABC.com trademarks etc..

No customers could get confused between the two companies as they are running totally different businesses. ABC.com would have to prove bad faith (such as me planning on selling my own empty beer cans, or me only using the site as a parked advertising placeholder to capitalize on ABC typos, etc..)

P.S. To the OP I would make sure I put up a quick HTML page on your domain (NO ADS) which says something like "This is the future home of XYZ, we will be doing this and that etc..".

Again this all assume that you will be running a different business from the complaining company.

While it is true that normal trademarks are protected against identical and confusingly similar trademarks used for the same or similar goods or services, this rule does not apply to so-called famous (or notorious) trademarks. If a trademark is qualified as "famous" (e.g. Coca-Cola) its scope of protection extends to all kind of goods and services.

This also depends on the national legislation, i.e. the country where the trademark is registered and where the alleged infringement takes place. Remember: the scope of protection of a trademark covers only the country where it is registered. In other words, a trademark registered in USA, but NOT in Thailand, has no effect in Thailand.

The problem is that while trademarks are territorially limited, domain names are not. Any domain can be accessed from anywhere in the world. So even if a trademark is not registered in Thailand, the domain owner in Thailand might infringe the US trademark with his domain name. (Because the website behind can be accessed in USA as well).

Trademark / domain name conflicts are very delicate and complicated. Better seek advice from a professional.

While true, don't forget that a trademark can be internationally registered in all member countries of The Madrid Protocol, with a single application.

It probably comes as no suprise to many that Thailand has not signed up.

[bangkockney]

The scam-talk here is nonsense. A few minutes work reveals if the text used in the domain has been trademarked.

Notwithstanding the fact you could independantly verify the lawyer's details.

To advise no action is dangerous at best.

[jaysun]

The scam-talk here is nonsense. A few minutes work reveals if the text used in the domain has been trademarked.

Notwithstanding the fact you could independantly verify the lawyer's details.

To advise no action is dangerous at best.

the scam talk is not nonsense, as I do think it's appropriate to make Mr ManOnTheRoad aware of potentially very real dangers. If it's not a scam, then no harm in keeping your guard up.

Mr ManOnTheRoad should do as you suggest and do some fact-finding to determine if his domain name is trademarked. right here: http://www.uspto.gov/

and as for scammers always asking for your bank details, that only worked in the first few years and/or on total idiots. now days they do sneaky stuff like send you fake checks to cash and deposit for them, or have you call phone numbers that charge USD 20/minute

[bangkockney]

The scam-talk here is nonsense. A few minutes work reveals if the text used in the domain has been trademarked.

Notwithstanding the fact you could independantly verify the lawyer's details.

To advise no action is dangerous at best.

the scam talk is not nonsense, as I do think it's appropriate to make Mr ManOnTheRoad aware of potentially very real dangers. If it's not a scam, then no harm in keeping your guard up.

Mr ManOnTheRoad should do as you suggest and do some fact-finding to determine if his domain name is trademarked. right here: http://www.uspto.gov/

and as for scammers always asking for your bank details, that only worked in the first few years and/or on total idiots. now days they do sneaky stuff like send you fake checks to cash and deposit for them, or have you call phone numbers that charge USD 20/minute

I know of no scams that involve saying you own a domain whose text is trademarked, involving calls to a mobile, letters and NDAs. If you have some letters, NDAs etc from scammers please share them.

The common scam is the reverse: "a company has recently tried to register the following domains based on your [trademark]. Our sophisticated auditing software blah blah blah. We are giving you the chance to register them first. Blah blah blah. "

All these come by email not post.

[ManOnTheRoad]

Guys, here's the update :

They got in touched with me on the phone offered me USD $ xxxx k.... with the help of the domain registrar support and paypal customer service we manage to settle the dispute. The buyer transfered the money via paypal. I verified and transfered the domain to them. All settled.

This is my first experience with this kind of situation. Its better to let it go rather than playing hard ball and go through all the problems with court and lawyers. After all they have the money which i dont.

Thank you for you guys support and advices and hope others can make good use of this discussion.

Cheers

Edited July 5, 2012 by ManOnTheRoad

[samsiam]

So...at least 1000k (thats 1,000,000) or 9999k..(thats 9,999,000).....wow outstanding effort for such a novice.

Of course I presume you have your xxxx's and k's all a little confusing like.

[jaysun]

i would assume xxxx k could range from 9999k to 0001k and since it's sent thru paypal, i assume something closer to the later but great luck, and glad you didn't get scammed like i was assuming!

[ManOnTheRoad]

Opps sorry , its btw $1k to 10k , i cant say the exact amount or the domain name as it prohibits me from making it public. thats what it says in the NDA.

ill make good use of the money i received and perhaps start a domain business lol

P.S i think their Tech or marketing side screw up their domain renewal ... so thats why they have been very kind to me in the process of obtaining the domain name.

Edited July 5, 2012 by ManOnTheRoad

[samsiam]

There are companies out there that scour the internet searching for domain names about to expire and then grab them when available if forgotten. They even use whatever it is called to auto scan it all and find them......so you a tad late setting that little baby up.

[phl]

Opps sorry , its btw $1k to 10k , i cant say the exact amount or the domain name as it prohibits me from making it public. thats what it says in the NDA.

ill make good use of the money i received and perhaps start a domain business lol

P.S i think their Tech or marketing side screw up their domain renewal ... so thats why they have been very kind to me in the process of obtaining the domain name.

Congratulations on making some money and coming out on top.

Next time you find domain name like this, could you please contact me to go partners

[Guest]

I would not congratulate you as it seems that you are the scammer in this deal and the person who is charging for an company which made an mistake.

If you think the whole picture, it's also possible that the person who did not renew the .com domain, will be fired for this costly mistake.

From the start, you knew that the domain was theirs for years and you reserved it anyway as you had an chance. In a decent world you could just notified them for their mistake and they would have renewed their own domain name. No harm done to anyone.

Well, we all live with our own principles.

[samsiam]

I would not congratulate you as it seems that you are the scammer in this deal and the person who is charging for an company which made an mistake.

If you think the whole picture, it's also possible that the person who did not renew the .com domain, will be fired for this costly mistake.

From the start, you knew that the domain was theirs for years and you reserved it anyway as you had an chance. In a decent world you could just notified them for their mistake and they would have renewed their own domain name. No harm done to anyone.

Well, we all live with our own principles.

All's fair in love and internet business.

[ManOnTheRoad]

I would not congratulate you as it seems that you are the scammer in this deal and the person who is charging for an company which made an mistake.

If you think the whole picture, it's also possible that the person who did not renew the .com domain, will be fired for this costly mistake.

From the start, you knew that the domain was theirs for years and you reserved it anyway as you had an chance. In a decent world you could just notified them for their mistake and they would have renewed their own domain name. No harm done to anyone.

Well, we all live with our own principles.

Its a free world mate

[jaysun]

Its a free world mate

maybe i didn't read the thread closely enough, but I was under the understanding that this was "just some other" dictionary word that you happened to grab at the right time.

If you are a cybersquater... as your reply implies.... then yeah.. this is about the lowest set of ethical values you can keep without being thrown in jail.

I don't mean to be overly offensive, but seriously, "go [expletive] yourself". cybersquater asking for (and getting) advice on how to exploit others.... really.... come on

[samsiam]

Its a free world mate

maybe i didn't read the thread closely enough, but I was under the understanding that this was "just some other" dictionary word that you happened to grab at the right time.

If you are a cybersquater... as your reply implies.... then yeah.. this is about the lowest set of ethical values you can keep without being thrown in jail.

I don't mean to be overly offensive, but seriously, "go [expletive] yourself". cybersquater asking for (and getting) advice on how to exploit others.... really.... come on

Wow....if this is your low mark....says more about you than him.

[jaysun]

lol, maybe i'm old fashioned? but yes, now that you make me think about it, I'd say extramarital relations and excessive gambling (is that still ethics?) is worse

anyway, i suppose i'm more upset at myself for giving advice to a cybersquater

[samsiam]

lol, maybe i'm old fashioned? but yes, now that you make me think about it, I'd say extramarital relations and excessive gambling (is that still ethics?) is worse

anyway, i suppose i'm more upset at myself for giving advice to a cybersquater

You are still low balling.....much worse out there......but excessive gambling could be one.

Here is a hint.....think real low, excruciatingly low.......like kiddi porn and associated activities ??

[jaysun]

well, i was saying cybersquatting is as poor ethically that you can get, WITHOUT being put into jail.... but maybe "kiddiporn ==jail" depends on the country thou....

[BngkkB]

"When they told me that the domain name i own infringe trademark of their client i was shock , made a research and my they are a multi billion dollar jewelry company ."

Multi-Billion dollar company? I am curious what the name of the company is, a quick google search shows De Beers at 5.6 Billion and Tiffanies at 3+ Billion.

[dave111223]

I would not congratulate you as it seems that you are the scammer in this deal and the person who is charging for an company which made an mistake.

If we take the OP at face value in his original story, that he just happened to buy this domain with no prior knowledge...then I think it is only right he gets paid something for the inconvenience caused by this company.

In a decent world you could just notified them for their mistake and they would have renewed their own domain name.

I mean really who goes to Godaddy.com types in a domain, it says "AVAILABLE"....you then go research the domain history and email all the previous owners just to make sure they didn't want it anymore???

But the more the OP posts, the more it seems like he probably had this domain setup for months just hoping they'd let it expire so he could squat in and earn a payday for doing nothing...but maybe i'm wrong.

I myself have domain expiration dates marked off on a calendar, but not because I want to cybersquat them, because they were domains I wanted to buy for various projects, and there were unavailable, i just stick them on a calendar and see if they become available in the future.

Edited July 6, 2012 by dave111223

[ManOnTheRoad]

Thank you guys Since now i see it as a profitable ways to make some quick bucks with domain names. I am going to use the money i received from selling the domain to do more research and buy more domains...

After reading all the threads that posted by you guys i thank you for this very knowledgeable ideas and advice. And will start buying lots of so called trademark domains.

Well there's nothing to lose, $9 for a domain is not that big. After all i could just lose $9 or worst comes settle it outside of court.

Just an idea

Edited July 6, 2012 by ManOnTheRoad

[jaysun]

ManOnTheRoad, thank you for acting like a grown up and resisting the chance to troll, your maturity is refreshing.