Tanasak tells UN why Thai Army took control of the country

[whybother]

The was no private army rampaging through Bangkok, you just want to whitewash your blood lust by lying to yourself.

Suthep's thugs were armed with military weapons, seizing territory, setting up checkpoints, kidnapping people and holding them in their territory, torturing people, shooting people who moved traffic cones, bashing foreign journalists, using violence to stop elections.

These are just the first things that came to mind, but more than enough to qualify them as a private army.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You live in a fantasy land to justify and condone the murder of real people, you have no moral standing.

What part of my argument is fantasy? A bit of Googling will find plenty of news stories covering each of the examples that I listed.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

How does the acts of "Suthep's thugs" justify the killing of innocent bystanders in completely different locations. That's just amazingly stupid.

[ThailandNoob]

I have never been to Rayong, but I know that the Ratchaprasong Big C was right next to Suthep and his mob, who had by that time committed numerous acts of violence.

I would have much rather than the army had done their job and cleaned those pigs out. But they did not, blatantly proving which side they were on, neglecting their duties and letting the city collapse into anarchy (I think I know why, but this post would be deleted if I wrote it here).

You speak about the Red Shirt protests, but they were about trying to get an election, as opposed to trying to stop one. Forgive me if I am biased in favour of democracy.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

OMG!! You've never been near one of these (or the red shirt) protest sites in your life have you? You really have no idea!!

How does even being near a protest site make it OK for someone to throw grenades and kill innocent bystanders ... not even protesters, and not even anywhere near where any of the "numerous acts of violence" occurred.

It wasn't the army's job to clean out the protesters until they were asked by the government to do it. Both protests were about trying to force a legitimate government to step down. One of the protests had an armed militia backing them up.

Big C Ratchaprasong was right next to where the PDRC (who had a rich history of violence) were camped out. Do you seriously believe that they didn't have "an armed militia" backing them up?

And do you seriously believe that the army would have cleaned out the protests even if they had been ordered to?

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[whybother]

Big C Ratchaprasong was right next to where the PDRC (who had a rich history of violence) were camped out. Do you seriously believe that they didn't have "an armed militia" backing them up?

And do you seriously believe that the army would have cleaned out the protests even if they had been ordered to?

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

You continue to show how little you know.

[AleG]

You live in a fantasy land to justify and condone the murder of real people, you have no moral standing.

What part of my argument is fantasy? A bit of Googling will find plenty of news stories covering each of the examples that I listed.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

There was no armed thugs rampaging through Bangkok, except the ones murdering anti-PTP protestors.

There were acts of violence committed by the PDRC, but not in the ridiculous scale you want to believe to dress up as noble righteousness the pleasure you derive from the deaths of people you know nothing about.

[AleG]

well, now you have a good point. A couple of things...

I do second TN's point about people who consider others basically subhuman, but I did not post it, and should have, that I don't ever think that hate is the right response. Hate is a very precise word that we use too much. It is, IMO, never the appropriate reaction - not for me, and I don't think it is good for other groups and people to indulge themselves in hate.

And I don't support violence either. Not from any side and there has been a lot on ALL sides. The attack at Big C was shameful as was Suthep's staged (IMO) attack on himself - which killed one of his supporters if I recall correctly.

Related directly to this thread, I seriously do not like the ultra-rich elite's power-grab. It is a group in Thailand that has never supported democracy and values control for the purpose of supporting their own interests. General Tanasak can say what ever he wants at the UN, the truth is evident.

You talk about values and not approving of hatred yet endorse a posts like this one.

Intellectual honesty, have you heard of it?

Edited October 4, 2014 by AleG

[ThailandNoob]

You live in a fantasy land to justify and condone the murder of real people, you have no moral standing.

What part of my argument is fantasy? A bit of Googling will find plenty of news stories covering each of the examples that I listed.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

There was no armed thugs rampaging through Bangkok, except the ones murdering anti-PTP protestors.

There were acts of violence committed by the PDRC, but not in the ridiculous scale you want to believe to dress up as noble righteousness the pleasure you derive from the deaths of people you know nothing about.

I listed the first half dozen or so violent acts by the PDRC that came to mind. These alone more than qualify the PDRC as "armed thugs rampaging through Bangkok". In particular, how they used violence to stop the election proves that they are the lowest form of life on Earth.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[whybother]

I listed the first half dozen or so violent acts by the PDRC that came to mind. These alone more than qualify the PDRC as "armed thugs rampaging through Bangkok". In particular, how they used violence to stop the election proves that they are the lowest form of life on Earth.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I still don't get how a few violent acts justifies the killing of innocent bystanders who happened to be nearby to a protest camp where none of the violence took place, and most likely none of the violent protesters were near.

Yet, you have an issue with the deaths of protesters that were with and around a heavily armed militia.

No bias there!

[ThailandNoob]

I listed the first half dozen or so violent acts by the PDRC that came to mind. These alone more than qualify the PDRC as "armed thugs rampaging through Bangkok". In particular, how they used violence to stop the election proves that they are the lowest form of life on Earth.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

I still don't get how a few violent acts justifies the killing of innocent bystanders who happened to be nearby to a protest camp where none of the violence took place, and most likely none of the violent protesters were near.

Yet, you have an issue with the deaths of protesters that were with and around a heavily armed militia.

No bias there!

This discussion is going around in circles. I said before that I have infinitely more sympathy for people killed in protests trying to get elections, than for people killed in protests trying to stop elections.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

[whybother]

This discussion is going around in circles. I said before that I have infinitely more sympathy for people killed in protests trying to get elections, than for people killed in protests trying to stop elections.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

<deleted> They weren't protesters.

Edited October 4, 2014 by metisdead
Profane acronym

[tbthailand]

well, now you have a good point. A couple of things...

I do second TN's point about people who consider others basically subhuman, but I did not post it, and should have, that I don't ever think that hate is the right response. Hate is a very precise word that we use too much. It is, IMO, never the appropriate reaction - not for me, and I don't think it is good for other groups and people to indulge themselves in hate.

And I don't support violence either. Not from any side and there has been a lot on ALL sides. The attack at Big C was shameful as was Suthep's staged (IMO) attack on himself - which killed one of his supporters if I recall correctly.

Related directly to this thread, I seriously do not like the ultra-rich elite's power-grab. It is a group in Thailand that has never supported democracy and values control for the purpose of supporting their own interests. General Tanasak can say what ever he wants at the UN, the truth is evident.

You talk about values and not approving of hatred yet endorse a posts like this one.

Intellectual honesty, have you heard of it?

yes, I am well aware of it.

In fact, if you pay careful attention, my post above was clarification of my reply to TN

[tbthailand]

This discussion is going around in circles. I said before that I have infinitely more sympathy for people killed in protests trying to get elections, than for people killed in protests trying to stop elections.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

<deleted> They weren't protesters.

while you are correct that some of the deaths were not protestors, and while I feel that none of the deaths should be celebrated, and I am certain that none of the deaths were justified, I would note that I seldom read such outrage here from 'NCPO' cheerleaders when the discussion is on 2010 rather than 2014.

[MaxYakov]

AFAIC, the official name of Thailand says it all.

[AleG]

well, now you have a good point. A couple of things...

I do second TN's point about people who consider others basically subhuman, but I did not post it, and should have, that I don't ever think that hate is the right response. Hate is a very precise word that we use too much. It is, IMO, never the appropriate reaction - not for me, and I don't think it is good for other groups and people to indulge themselves in hate.

And I don't support violence either. Not from any side and there has been a lot on ALL sides. The attack at Big C was shameful as was Suthep's staged (IMO) attack on himself - which killed one of his supporters if I recall correctly.

Related directly to this thread, I seriously do not like the ultra-rich elite's power-grab. It is a group in Thailand that has never supported democracy and values control for the purpose of supporting their own interests. General Tanasak can say what ever he wants at the UN, the truth is evident.

You talk about values and not approving of hatred yet endorse a posts like this one.

Intellectual honesty, have you heard of it?

yes, I am well aware of it.

In fact, if you pay careful attention, my post above was clarification of my reply to TN

Aware of it, right

"The attack at Big C was shameful as was Suthep's staged (IMO) attack on himself - which killed one of his supporters if I recall correctly."

not applying it, obviously.

[JAG]

The was no private army rampaging through Bangkok, you just want to whitewash your blood lust by lying to yourself.

Suthep's thugs were armed with military weapons, seizing territory, setting up checkpoints, kidnapping people and holding them in their territory, torturing people, shooting people who moved traffic cones, bashing foreign journalists, using violence to stop elections.

These are just the first things that came to mind, but more than enough to qualify them as a private army.

You live in a fantasy land to justify and condone the murder of real people, you have no moral standing.

What part of my argument is fantasy? A bit of Googling will find plenty of news stories covering each of the examples that I listed.

You simply do a cut and paste of words to make a sentence. Following you ignore the reasons for some of the actions.

BTW in some Westerns Countries condoning violence as in "I hate them" can and is being used against posters (on facebook a.o.).

PS I do not condone the violent actions by some of the PDRC / PCAD guards, but with all the violence they themselves were subjected to I'm not really surprised it happened. Especially with Thailand being such a violent society at times.

I am very well aware of "the reasons for their actions". With their feudalistic mindset, they consider people from the North and NE to be subhuman, and that those areas are therefore not worthy of government spending.

The problem is that those areas contain the majority of people in the country, and they can therefore do abominable things such as "selling" their votes in exchange for such unreasonable things as the government letting more than 10% of taxpayer's money go outside Bangkok.

The North and the NE are too stupid to realise that government revenue is the god-given right of the "khon dee" in Bangkok, and are therefore too stupid to vote. Elections must therefore be prevented at all costs, even if it means stirring up violence so that your army buddies have an excuse to step in and launch a coup.

That is the reasoning behind the PDRC's violence.

Sent from my IS11T using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

One might also add that there is a pressing need to have a government which is shall we say favourable to certain interest groups in power. This need is not unconnected with an imminent sad event. The fall of the elected government just had to be engineered. In the end it took a coup. Now that has been achieved I doubt that those in power give a damn what anyone at the UN thinks

[retsdon]

There's a dour Scottish Calvinist homily, ' Let the laddie play with the knife, he'll learn.' Wisdom is never achieved without making mistakes, and sometimes those mistakes are painful. But that's just how it works.

The Thai electorate were making a serious mistake by repeatedly voting in the venal and incompetent Shin clan. But if the mistake had been left to run its course, although the fallout would have been painful, the lesson would have eventually been learned. Instead, the military coup has stunted, and quite possibly irretrievably damaged, Thailand's progress towards a sustainable and mature political dispensation.

The logic behind the coup is understandable. But just because it's understandable doesn't make it right.

[tbthailand]

well, now you have a good point. A couple of things...

I do second TN's point about people who consider others basically subhuman, but I did not post it, and should have, that I don't ever think that hate is the right response. Hate is a very precise word that we use too much. It is, IMO, never the appropriate reaction - not for me, and I don't think it is good for other groups and people to indulge themselves in hate.

And I don't support violence either. Not from any side and there has been a lot on ALL sides. The attack at Big C was shameful as was Suthep's staged (IMO) attack on himself - which killed one of his supporters if I recall correctly.

Related directly to this thread, I seriously do not like the ultra-rich elite's power-grab. It is a group in Thailand that has never supported democracy and values control for the purpose of supporting their own interests. General Tanasak can say what ever he wants at the UN, the truth is evident.

You talk about values and not approving of hatred yet endorse a posts like this one.

Intellectual honesty, have you heard of it?

yes, I am well aware of it.

In fact, if you pay careful attention, my post above was clarification of my reply to TN

Aware of it, right

"The attack at Big C was shameful as was Suthep's staged (IMO) attack on himself - which killed one of his supporters if I recall correctly."

not applying it, obviously.

maybe you would like to elaborate on your logic for making such a statement.

[tbthailand]

There's a dour Scottish Calvinist homily, ' Let the laddie play with the knife, he'll learn.' Wisdom is never achieved without making mistakes, and sometimes those mistakes are painful. But that's just how it works.

The Thai electorate were making a serious mistake by repeatedly voting in the venal and incompetent Shin clan. But if the mistake had been left to run its course, although the fallout would have been painful, the lesson would have eventually been learned. Instead, the military coup has stunted, and quite possibly irretrievably damaged, Thailand's progress towards a sustainable and mature political dispensation.

The logic behind the coup is understandable. But just because it's understandable doesn't make it right.

you make good points.

In addition, if the reason for the coup was not the one given to the public, and I do not believe that it was, then the military did not have time to let things run their course and then also hope that the Democrats could have pulled off an win in the scheduled elections.

[MaxYakov]

I'm calling it an MD. Ahem, that would be a "Moderated Democracy" and sometimes the "moderation" can get a little severe.

[See the bears]

There's a dour Scottish Calvinist homily, ' Let the laddie play with the knife, he'll learn.' Wisdom is never achieved without making mistakes, and sometimes those mistakes are painful. But that's just how it works.

The Thai electorate were making a serious mistake by repeatedly voting in the venal and incompetent Shin clan. But if the mistake had been left to run its course, although the fallout would have been painful, the lesson would have eventually been learned. Instead, the military coup has stunted, and quite possibly irretrievably damaged, Thailand's progress towards a sustainable and mature political dispensation.

The logic behind the coup is understandable. But just because it's understandable doesn't make it right.

you make good points.

In addition, if the reason for the coup was not the one given to the public, and I do not believe that it was, then the military did not have time to let things run their course and then also hope that the Democrats could have pulled off an win in the scheduled elections.

But what is astonishing is the TVF yellow cheer-leading squad who ignorantly continue to repeat the party line.

[AleG]

Aware of it, right

"The attack at Big C was shameful as was Suthep's staged (IMO) attack on himself - which killed one of his supporters if I recall correctly."

not applying it, obviously.

maybe you would like to elaborate on your logic for making such a statement.

Maybe you should elaborate in your logic behind your accusation that Suthep staged an attack on himself. You know, with arguments, evidence, that sort of thing.

You may keep in mind that the grenade on the attack I think you are alluding to had the same lot number as other grenades of the same type found in the hands of Red Shirt terrorist.

[See the bears]

There's a dour Scottish Calvinist homily, ' Let the laddie play with the knife, he'll learn.' Wisdom is never achieved without making mistakes, and sometimes those mistakes are painful. But that's just how it works.

The Thai electorate were making a serious mistake by repeatedly voting in the venal and incompetent Shin clan. But if the mistake had been left to run its course, although the fallout would have been painful, the lesson would have eventually been learned. Instead, the military coup has stunted, and quite possibly irretrievably damaged, Thailand's progress towards a sustainable and mature political dispensation.

The logic behind the coup is understandable. But just because it's understandable doesn't make it right.

you make good points.

In addition, if the reason for the coup was not the one given to the public, and I do not believe that it was, then the military did not have time to let things run their course and then also hope that the Democrats could have pulled off an win in the scheduled elections.

But what is astonishing is the TVF yellow cheer-leading squad who ignorantly continue to repeat the party line.

Mysteriously made a last minute unannounced route change that went right past the room. Then after the incident Suthep's hired thugs (i.e. off duty soldiers) ran straight up to the room and didn't allow the police to investigate the seen until they had done whatever they needed to do.

[AleG]

Mysteriously made a last minute unannounced route change that went right past the room. Then after the incident Suthep's hired thugs (i.e. off duty soldiers) ran straight up to the room and didn't allow the police to investigate the seen until they had done whatever they needed to do.

Meanwhile, in the real world:

Police arrest two more over grenade attacks on rallies

[tbthailand]

There's a dour Scottish Calvinist homily, ' Let the laddie play with the knife, he'll learn.' Wisdom is never achieved without making mistakes, and sometimes those mistakes are painful. But that's just how it works.

The Thai electorate were making a serious mistake by repeatedly voting in the venal and incompetent Shin clan. But if the mistake had been left to run its course, although the fallout would have been painful, the lesson would have eventually been learned. Instead, the military coup has stunted, and quite possibly irretrievably damaged, Thailand's progress towards a sustainable and mature political dispensation.

The logic behind the coup is understandable. But just because it's understandable doesn't make it right.

you make good points.

In addition, if the reason for the coup was not the one given to the public, and I do not believe that it was, then the military did not have time to let things run their course and then also hope that the Democrats could have pulled off an win in the scheduled elections.

But what is astonishing is the TVF yellow cheer-leading squad who ignorantly continue to repeat the party line.

pretending that the events as they occurred do not represent today's reality is a finely honed skill on this forum.

[tbthailand]

Mysteriously made a last minute unannounced route change that went right past the room. Then after the incident Suthep's hired thugs (i.e. off duty soldiers) ran straight up to the room and didn't allow the police to investigate the seen until they had done whatever they needed to do.

Meanwhile, in the real world:

Police arrest two more over grenade attacks on rallies

are you surprised by that?

also in the real world and reminder of the events, sorry, the link is not allowed, but the text is:

Shortly after the attack, PDRC guards refused to allow police entry to the scene, which hampered the investigation. A number of military personnel were the first to be allowed access. Police were allowed entry later

[AleG]

Mysteriously made a last minute unannounced route change that went right past the room. Then after the incident Suthep's hired thugs (i.e. off duty soldiers) ran straight up to the room and didn't allow the police to investigate the seen until they had done whatever they needed to do.

Meanwhile, in the real world:

Police arrest two more over grenade attacks on rallies

are you surprised by that?

also in the real world and reminder of the events, sorry, the link is not allowed, but the text is:

Shortly after the attack, PDRC guards refused to allow police entry to the scene, which hampered the investigation. A number of military personnel were the first to be allowed access. Police were allowed entry later

So in one hand there's your worthless opinion and innuendo from an unnamed source, no evidence, no argument, nothing, just BS; on the other hand i provided a news link where men implicated with the confess in providing the grenades for the attack, men belonging to a group responsible for many other similar attacks.

Here, let me help you because I don't think you actually grasp what intellectual honesty means:

• One's personal beliefs do not interfere with the pursuit of truth;
• Relevant facts and information are not purposefully omitted even when such things may contradict one's hypothesis;

From the link I provided, AKA, reality:

POLICE presented two more suspects at a press conference yesterday, who according to deputy national police chief Pol General Somyos Phumphunmuang, were arrested for alleged links to grenade attacks against protesters on Bangkok's Banthat Thong Road and Victory Monument.

Chareon Phromchat, 38, and Natthapan Bangla, 40, were arrested on Monday after being named by suspect Apichat Poungphetch, 42, who was arrested earlier. Apichat reportedly confessed that he gave RGD-5 hand-grenades to the two suspects, as well as to the Krissada Chaikhae, who is still on the run, Somyos said.

While Charoen denied any wrongdoing, Natthapan reportedly admitted that he was given the four grenades, but claimed he did not use them, Somyos said. Police have launched a manhunt for Krissada who was accused of lobbing one grenade at protesters in Banthat Thong and two at a rally near Victory Monument.

Now, do tell again, who is avoiding reality?

[tbthailand]

Meanwhile, in the real world:

Police arrest two more over grenade attacks on rallies

are you surprised by that?

also in the real world and reminder of the events, sorry, the link is not allowed, but the text is:

Shortly after the attack, PDRC guards refused to allow police entry to the scene, which hampered the investigation. A number of military personnel were the first to be allowed access. Police were allowed entry later

So in one hand there's your worthless opinion and innuendo from an unnamed source, no evidence, no argument, nothing, just BS; on the other hand i provided a news link where men implicated with the confess in providing the grenades for the attack, men belonging to a group responsible for many other similar attacks.

Here, let me help you because I don't think you actually grasp what intellectual honesty means:

• One's personal beliefs do not interfere with the pursuit of truth;
• Relevant facts and information are not purposefully omitted even when such things may contradict one's hypothesis;

From the link I provided, AKA, reality:

POLICE presented two more suspects at a press conference yesterday, who according to deputy national police chief Pol General Somyos Phumphunmuang, were arrested for alleged links to grenade attacks against protesters on Bangkok's Banthat Thong Road and Victory Monument.

Chareon Phromchat, 38, and Natthapan Bangla, 40, were arrested on Monday after being named by suspect Apichat Poungphetch, 42, who was arrested earlier. Apichat reportedly confessed that he gave RGD-5 hand-grenades to the two suspects, as well as to the Krissada Chaikhae, who is still on the run, Somyos said.

While Charoen denied any wrongdoing, Natthapan reportedly admitted that he was given the four grenades, but claimed he did not use them, Somyos said. Police have launched a manhunt for Krissada who was accused of lobbing one grenade at protesters in Banthat Thong and two at a rally near Victory Monument.

Now, do tell again, who is avoiding reality?

as you well know links to the post are not allowed.

the events of the attack and blocking the access to the scene by the PDRC are not my opinion or innuendo but were events widely reported from multiple sources at the time.

[AleG]

So in one hand there's your worthless opinion and innuendo from an unnamed source, no evidence, no argument, nothing, just BS; on the other hand i provided a news link where men implicated with the confess in providing the grenades for the attack, men belonging to a group responsible for many other similar attacks.

Here, let me help you because I don't think you actually grasp what intellectual honesty means:

• One's personal beliefs do not interfere with the pursuit of truth;
• Relevant facts and information are not purposefully omitted even when such things may contradict one's hypothesis;

From the link I provided, AKA, reality:

POLICE presented two more suspects at a press conference yesterday, who according to deputy national police chief Pol General Somyos Phumphunmuang, were arrested for alleged links to grenade attacks against protesters on Bangkok's Banthat Thong Road and Victory Monument.

Chareon Phromchat, 38, and Natthapan Bangla, 40, were arrested on Monday after being named by suspect Apichat Poungphetch, 42, who was arrested earlier. Apichat reportedly confessed that he gave RGD-5 hand-grenades to the two suspects, as well as to the Krissada Chaikhae, who is still on the run, Somyos said.

While Charoen denied any wrongdoing, Natthapan reportedly admitted that he was given the four grenades, but claimed he did not use them, Somyos said. Police have launched a manhunt for Krissada who was accused of lobbing one grenade at protesters in Banthat Thong and two at a rally near Victory Monument.

Now, do tell again, who is avoiding reality?

as you well know links to the post are not allowed.

the events of the attack and blocking the access to the scene by the PDRC are not my opinion or innuendo but were events widely reported from multiple sources at the time.

The innuendo is from your part, not what the unattributed quote states, if you had anything resembling a spine you would articulate what you insinuate from your unattributed, out of context quote.

In any case it is moot, since it does not retract in any way from the article I linked to or your lack of intellectual honesty in avoiding the facts it contains.

[tbthailand]

(darn quote controls)

The innuendo is from your part, not what the unattributed quote states, if you had anything resembling a spine you would articulate what you insinuate from your unattributed, out of context quote.

In any case it is moot, since it does not retract in any way from the article I linked to or your lack of intellectual honesty in avoiding the facts it contains.

How about we agree not to insult each other from this point on?

So first of all, I have a spine. I'd send a picture but really don't feel like it.

Secondly, I stated that it was my opinion that the attack on Suthep was a setup by Suthep and the circumstances from the event with everything from the last minute route change, the guards instantly finding the right room, blocking access to the scene, and even to finding a red-cap in the room do nothing to make me feel inclined to think otherwise.

[AleG]

(darn quote controls)

The innuendo is from your part, not what the unattributed quote states, if you had anything resembling a spine you would articulate what you insinuate from your unattributed, out of context quote.

In any case it is moot, since it does not retract in any way from the article I linked to or your lack of intellectual honesty in avoiding the facts it contains.

How about we agree not to insult each other from this point on?

So first of all, I have a spine. I'd send a picture but really don't feel like it.

Secondly, I stated that it was my opinion that the attack on Suthep was a setup by Suthep and the circumstances from the event with everything from the last minute route change, the guards instantly finding the right room, blocking access to the scene, and even to finding a red-cap in the room do nothing to make me feel inclined to think otherwise.

The fact that you see nothing to make you think otherwise, on the face of the fact that Red Shirts implicated with the attack have already been arrested is why you are an intellectually dishonest person, thus your opinions are worthless.

[JAG]

There's a dour Scottish Calvinist homily, ' Let the laddie play with the knife, he'll learn.' Wisdom is never achieved without making mistakes, and sometimes those mistakes are painful. But that's just how it works.

The Thai electorate were making a serious mistake by repeatedly voting in the venal and incompetent Shin clan. But if the mistake had been left to run its course, although the fallout would have been painful, the lesson would have eventually been learned. Instead, the military coup has stunted, and quite possibly irretrievably damaged, Thailand's progress towards a sustainable and mature political dispensation.

The logic behind the coup is understandable. But just because it's understandable doesn't make it right.

you make good points.

In addition, if the reason for the coup was not the one given to the public, and I do not believe that it was, then the military did not have time to let things run their course and then also hope that the Democrats could have pulled off an win in the scheduled elections.

But what is astonishing is the TVF yellow cheer-leading squad who ignorantly continue to repeat the party line.

Oh I am sure that many of the most vociferous supporters of the suppression of Thailand's flawed but none the less essentially representative democracy are well aware of the reasons why it was suppressed. These reasons being undeclared, and having chosen to ally themselves, even if only on this forum, with the interest groups who overthrew the elected government they must parrot the party line as regards the reasons for and the benefits of the coup.