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Myanmar says workers innocent of murdering Britons on Koh Tao


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thanks for posting that. crappy translation, though. But still, the message gets through. Ms Porntip will be the best defense witness. Granted, she didn't witness the crime, but she can shred the handling of the DNA - but that's supposing (hoping) the judge isn't already chummy in the camp with the powers-that-be who are all intent on nailing the B2. Sure, the Brit coroner would be an interesting witness, but that's assuming he won't just take the safe/diplomatic route and answer every question with: "I"m not at liberty to comment about that at this time. The inquest report will come out in ....weeks."
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thanks for posting that. crappy translation, though. But still, the message gets through. Ms Porntip will be the best defense witness. Granted, she didn't witness the crime, but she can shred the handling of the DNA - but that's supposing (hoping) the judge isn't already chummy in the camp with the powers-that-be who are all intent on nailing the B2. Sure, the Brit coroner would be an interesting witness, but that's assuming he won't just take the safe/diplomatic route and answer every question with: "I"m not at liberty to comment about that at this time. The inquest report will come out in ....weeks."

There would be ni issues legally with a coroner giving a list of witnesses in a case like this.

Whether he wants to or indeed will is up to him/her.

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DennisF, on 20 Dec 2014 - 05:44, said:
thailandchilli, on 20 Dec 2014 - 04:22, said:

Looks like Andy Hall is asking the same questions (tweeted 1 hour ago):

Koh Tao defense case:if anyone has evidence UK police/officials took statements from witnesses either in UK/Thailand pls contact me ASAP

https://twitter.com/atomicalandy

Depending on the response Andy gets this could change things dramatically.

IF the court allows the defence to call witnesses from abroad and they call Brits who have made statements to the UK police things could change very quickly.

I am wondering if the Brit authorities have suggested this move, it takes them out of the loop whilst giving the defence some room.

Remember the FCO declared on the family statements that it did not necessarily reflect their own views.

Standard caveat but not so usual when explaining released documents of this type.

I doubt the British witnesses would want to come back to Thailand to testify at the trial, for the same reasons the Burmese witnesses do not. The Ware brothers in particular were treated very badly by the RTP and there was a report in the Jersey Evening Post some weeks ago that they had been chased and intimidated in Bangkok by sinister types on motorbikes. Whether these were plain clothes cops, or others, nobody knows.

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rockingrobin, on 20 Dec 2014 - 06:34, said:

People the last link i posted does work but be aware that for reasons uknown to me the site sometimes is not available.

I found it an interesting read

It would be good if this lady could be called as a witness for the defence in this trial.

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People the last link i posted does work but be aware that for reasons uknown to me the site sometimes is not available.

I found it an interesting read

Khunying Pornthip said : This case lack of reliability from people because there were no simulation and the police didn’t act right according to the forensic process.

So in this case, about the first section that i have to say is the enquiry officers needed to have knowledge, the weak point is maybe because they didn’t understand that this case needed to use forensic experts then they didn’t ask forensic experts from Surat Thani to come manage. Then the 2nd section is collected witnesses and evidences, in this case is a murder case that has 2 dead bodies, 100% that you must had forensic experts only.

Khunying Pornthip : The missing part of this case is the simulation, this is 1 of the steps of forensic method be cause they didn’t have this step that why it had became an issue in social media that put on a lot of observations in this case, be cause in this case only had re-enact. Besides i think, to collect to DNA, needed to do it the right way and follow the step, which will know the result in 24 hrs. In the murder cases and others, usually collect DNA from 2 parts both evidences and persons, furthermore to collect DNA samples from object evidences has to depend on damaged conditions with humidity,temperature, time, chemicals,radiation and disease. And about the evidences in this case that had found were DNA on the hoe, which is a weapon to kill the victims. If it was in sea then that couldn’t collect the DNA sample but if the hoe wasn’t in the sea then that possible to mistake collect the DNA sample. Besides the DNA test of Woraphan Tuwichian, the headman of Koh Tao couldn’t insist that his son ( the suspect ) is innocent only be cause it didn’t match with the evidences in the crime scene.

more here

https://democracyforburma.wordpress.com/2014/10/09/khunying-pornthip-koh-tao-forensic-work-needs-to-separate-with-police-authority/

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Koh Tao murder suspects’ defence team gets parliamentary support

Members of Myanmar’s Upper House of parliament has made a pledge to ensure the safety and security of Myanmar migrant workers on Thailand’s Koh Tao if they come forward as witnesses in the case of the murders of two British tourists, according to the Myanmar embassy’s special team helping with the defence.

Lawyer U Aung Myo Thant told Mizzima on December 19 that the Upper House has made the pledge and plans to send law experts to Thailand to help the case of the two Myanmar men accused of the murders.

He was speaking in Yangon after meeting with Upper House officials.

The Myanmar special team earlier made a call for two foreign witnesses to come forward to help with the case.

U Aung Myo said that in addition, three MPs earlier pledged to give the Myanmar special team K30 million to help the two Myanmar suspects, but the team has received just K15 million so far, he said.

http://www.mizzima.com/mizzima-news/regional/item/16079-koh-tao-murder-suspects-defence-team-gets-parliamentary-support/16079-koh-tao-murder-suspects-defence-team-gets-parliamentary-support

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Khunying Pornthip said :This case lack of reliability from people because there were no simulation and the police didnt act right according to the forensic process.

Interesting, she's the first official of any stripe to mention the word 'simulation'. One of the most telling simulations which could be staged is the reenactment of the Ko Tao CCTV footage. I've mentioned this before, sorry for the repetition. Here's how to do it: have the same camera, and (as much as possible) the same lighting as that fateful night. Have all suspects and former prime suspects (Mon and Nomsod) reenact the scene as seen by the CCTV. Have them wear identical clothing as the person in the CCTV.

It would have to be set up by non-Thais, because Thai folks are incapable of setting up a reenactment without a bevy of handlers shouting directions and physically manipulating other peoples' body parts. Simply stated: Thai officials are hopelessly subjective about the case. Another reason the above-described reenactment couldn't be orchestrated by Thai authorities: They desperately don't want Nomsod or Mon involved with this case on any level. Thai authorities want us, the general public, to forget about them completely. Do as you're told!

The Myanmar government has agreed to provide security and expenses in Thailand for the main defence witnesses of the accused Myanmar migrant workers in the Koh Tao murder case, said the embassy investigation team.

Five Myanmar workers returning from Thailand came from Koh Tao. Thailand told witnesses to stay away from the case and bribed them not to make telephone conversations. Thats why some workers are afraid to testify, said Aung Myo Than.

That addresses one question I had. If foreigners are summoned to be be witnesses, are they required to pay their own travel expenses, hotels, food, etc,.... to do so? However, if witness' expenses were covered, the Gang of 4 would say, "Ha, paying for witnesses! A sham, I told you so!"

Edited by boomerangutang
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The trial judge will be adjourning this trial over and over for months and months waiting for guidance from the executive. I said this trial will run for a long time. The Thai police and govt. have already put their feet in their mouths many times over this case and subsequent cover-up. I believe now they will wait for the parties outside of their control to show what evidence they have before proceeding with the case.

Remember, they are now where they want to be. They have kept the Tuvichian connection out of jail, not charged and that is the goal. The Thai police and politicians orchestrating this can now sit back and wait.

Edited by Briggsy
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All the usual rhetoric from the expat community ... accusing the RTP and Government of being complicit in all the corruption, murder and other illegal activities ... and yet here you all are supporting the regime.

How many times have I heard people calling for change and yet refuse to take action that brings about that change. You should all be ashamed of yourselves but I guess there's no dragging you off that bar stool.

I've said it before, I'll say it again ... it is YOU, not the Gov, that holds the power to change. All you need to do is leave and then publicly state why you left ... yes change is possible but only if you initiate it otherwise anything you say here is mere hollow words that the Thai officialdom will laugh at.

It's not the RTP or the Gov that's just corrupt or inept ... it's the foreigners who live in Thailand.

i'm not leaving Thailand although i have considered it

i am boycotting Koh Tao, that is where it happened.

RIP Hannah & David

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ABC also carrying the story

Myanmar investigators say accused workers are innocent of murdering British tourists in Thailand

Posted

Thu at 10:36pmThu 18 Dec 2014, 10:36pm

Two Myanmar men accused of murdering two British tourists in Thailand are innocent but witnesses who might be able to prove their case will not testify because they fear Thai police, Myanmar investigators say.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-12-18/myanmar-workers-did-not-kill-uk-tourists-thailand-investigators/5977726

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The Myanmar government has agreed to provide security and expenses in Thailand for the main defence witnesses of the accused Myanmar migrant workers in the Koh Tao murder case, said the embassy investigation team.

Five Myanmar workers returning from Thailand came from Koh Tao. Thailand told witnesses to stay away from the case and bribed them not to make telephone conversations. That’s why some workers are afraid to testify,” said Aung Myo Than.

http://www.elevenmyanmar.com/index.php?option=com_content&view=article&id=8443%3Agovernment-to-pay-koh-tao-defence-witness-expenses&catid=44%3Anational&Itemid=384

Nice to see a government sticking out its neck in defense of their nationals!! Specially since the B2 are "nobody", so no political/monetary gains to be made.

I am sure the Myanmar investigators have something up their sleeve, judged by the confident way they are acting. The RTP might be in for a nasy surprise!!

Getting more and more convinced that the B2 will walk. If it is on a no guilty verdict or a technicality really doesn't matter, as long as two scapegoats are not executed.

Well done Myanmar!! A lot of countries could learn something from you.

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I don't know how similar court systems are between Cambodia and Thailand, but I just read a sobering article about a young Spanish fellow who was convicted and sentenced to 10 years. Get this: both the police and the prosecutor tried to convince the judge that the person supposedly murdered wasn't actually murdered (he died by his own drug use), .....but the judge didn't heed their pleas and went and found the Spaniard guilty and sentenced him. If Thai courts are anything like Cambodian, then we shouldn't be surprised if, even if there's overwhelming evidence of non-guilt, the B2 may wind up getting found guilty. It may come down to one or (in the case of Thailand) two judges to make a decision - even if prosecutors want to drop the case.

source

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As probable or improbable as two small Burmese guys carrying out the attacks. Substitute gay foreigner for person of influence getting henchmen to do his dirty work for him but leaving the final act of sacrifice and humiliation to the offended individual, just as likely. All possible theories and in the absence of reliable evidence and investigation, will possibly never get solved by an organisation whose main, if not, only purpose is to exploit both Thai nationals and foreigners for their own financial gain.

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That's as bad as the myth that ware was gay and topped his friend out of jealous rage. It was laughed out the door as soon as it hit Thaivisa. Great imagination though.

Pretty much like the hoe being the weapon that killed them both.

Really if you want to try and be clever at least make it plausable

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That's as bad as the myth that ware was gay and topped his friend out of jealous rage. It was laughed out the door as soon as it hit Thaivisa. Great imagination though.

Pretty much like the hoe being the weapon that killed them both.

Really if you want to try and be clever at least make it plausable

As implausible as that scenario is for us farang, it may become a fall-back scenario, useful for Thai cops. Who are the cops most eager to convince? Answer: the Thai public. All Thais believe in ghosts and regularly go spend money at hocus-pocus vendors, so how hard would it be to convince Thais that a jealous/spurned gay lover orchestrated the crimes? Plus, it fits with continuing to shield those who were, and should still be prime suspects.

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Koh Tao murder suspects defence team gets parliamentary support

Members of Myanmars Upper House of parliament has made a pledge to ensure the safety and security of Myanmar migrant workers on Thailands Koh Tao if they come forward as witnesses in the case of the murders of two British tourists, according to the Myanmar embassys special team helping with the defence.

Lawyer U Aung Myo Thant told Mizzima on December 19 that the Upper House has made the pledge and plans to send law experts to Thailand to help the case of the two Myanmar men accused of the murders.

He was speaking in Yangon after meeting with Upper House officials.

The Myanmar special team earlier made a call for two foreign witnesses to come forward to help with the case.

U Aung Myo said that in addition, three MPs earlier pledged to give the Myanmar special team K30 million to help the two Myanmar suspects, but the team has received just K15 million so far, he said.

http://www.mizzima.com/mizzima-news/regional/item/16079-koh-tao-murder-suspects-defence-team-gets-parliamentary-support/16079-koh-tao-murder-suspects-defence-team-gets-parliamentary-support

This is super. What a great thing the Myanmar government is doing. Guilty or innocent everybody just want a fair trial. People can donate a small amount. All those small amounts add up. I will not forget, nor give up until the right people are brought to jail.

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Koh Tao murder suspects defence team gets parliamentary support

Members of Myanmars Upper House of parliament has made a pledge to ensure the safety and security of Myanmar migrant workers on Thailands Koh Tao if they come forward as witnesses in the case of the murders of two British tourists, according to the Myanmar embassys special team helping with the defence.

Lawyer U Aung Myo Thant told Mizzima on December 19 that the Upper House has made the pledge and plans to send law experts to Thailand to help the case of the two Myanmar men accused of the murders.

He was speaking in Yangon after meeting with Upper House officials.

The Myanmar special team earlier made a call for two foreign witnesses to come forward to help with the case.

U Aung Myo said that in addition, three MPs earlier pledged to give the Myanmar special team K30 million to help the two Myanmar suspects, but the team has received just K15 million so far, he said.

http://www.mizzima.com/mizzima-news/regional/item/16079-koh-tao-murder-suspects-defence-team-gets-parliamentary-support/16079-koh-tao-murder-suspects-defence-team-gets-parliamentary-support

This is super. What a great thing the Myanmar government is doing. Guilty or innocent everybody just want a fair trial. People can donate a small amount. All those small amounts add up. I will not forget, nor give up until the right people are brought to jail.

Absolutely nagree and I have done my bit.

What bothers me about this statement is that the upper house cannot guarantee the safety of families or retaliation at a later date from current employers.

They have to have a place to go to work after the case where they will be safe and their families also.

I believe this is what is holding a lot of the migrant workers back from speaking out.

I dont know what the answer is without throwing huge amounts of cash at it.

Its gonna be a really sh1tty Christmas for David and Hannahs families and friends.

Like most here, I just want justice and closure for the unfortunate families.

Edited by DennisF
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Why should it not be possible to bring the Burmese workers who fled to Burma back

under protection of their government and then back to Burma.

May be even some money could be found as a substitute for their loss of income in Thailand.

Take it one step further: - Why the impartial Thai Court wouldn't grant the witnesses protection in the interest of impartial Justice?

Why? - Because!

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Why should it not be possible to bring the Burmese workers who fled to Burma back

under protection of their government and then back to Burma.

May be even some money could be found as a substitute for their loss of income in Thailand.

Take it one step further: - Why the impartial Thai Court wouldn't grant the witnesses protection in the interest of impartial Justice?

Why? - Because!

The Thai government should be treating these 2 as guests in their home. They should be given every opportunity and assistance to prove their innocence. In the event that they were guilty the Thai could be at peace that they had done the correct and justified thing to all four families. I would think hannah and David family would want the whole truth, painful as it may be.

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ABC also carrying the story Myanmar investigators say accused workers are innocent of murdering British tourists in Thailand

Posted Thu at 10:36pmThu 18 Dec 2014, 10:36pm

5754838-3x2-340x227.jpgPHOTO: Thai authorities were under pressure to quickly find those responsible for David Miller and Hannah Witheridge's deaths. September 14, 2014. (Facebook)

RELATED STORY: Migrant workers deny killing British tourists on Thai island

MAP: Burma

Two Myanmar men accused of murdering two British tourists in Thailand are innocent but witnesses who might be able to prove their case will not testify because they fear Thai police, Myanmar investigators say.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-12-18/myanmar-workers-did-not-kill-uk-tourists-thailand-investigators/5977726

It is tragic that this has happened. But great that it is getting international coverage, that might help these young lads. I wish there was more I could do. Other than making a post a day. Any suggestion??

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ABC also carrying the story

Myanmar investigators say accused workers are innocent of murdering British tourists in Thailand

Posted

Thu at 10:36pmThu 18 Dec 2014, 10:36pm

Two Myanmar men accused of murdering two British tourists in Thailand are innocent but witnesses who might be able to prove their case will not testify because they fear Thai police, Myanmar investigators say.

http://www.abc.net.au/news/2014-12-18/myanmar-workers-did-not-kill-uk-tourists-thailand-investigators/5977726

I don't think any article from the west will make a difference anymore. What is needed now are articles from China and Asean countries.

I do wish though that the British police make a statement as to what their investigation entailed and uncovered

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Why should it not be possible to bring the Burmese workers who fled to Burma back

under protection of their government and then back to Burma.

May be even some money could be found as a substitute for their loss of income in Thailand.

Take it one step further: - Why the impartial Thai Court wouldn't grant the witnesses protection in the interest of impartial Justice?

Why? - Because!

The Thai Court should grant prospective witnesses for the defense protection from just whom?

Edited by JLCrab
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