Does Oil Go Bad?

[Generalchaos]

I bought a 5 litre bottle of 90 weight Gear oil today. The container looked filthy like it had been standing on a shelf in sunlight for the past millennia.

When I took the top off it still had the foil seal so it looked good to go.

I cracked open the foil seal and tipped a bit out into the lid, it was certainly thick enough to be Hypoy 90 weight, but it was as black as molasses!

It is manufactured by PTT and in a rather old looking container. I only want to use it as a chain lubricant for a motorbike. So does oil deteriorate over time and turn black in the tropical heat, one would think it would "Mature" rather than decay?

It even has a different smell to the normal 90 weight oil (which usually stinks) Very little odour.

It is extremely sticky and if it offers protection should be great in the way it clings to the chain.

 

 

[Kwasaki]

It should be Ok some oils look different in colour & smell but many motorbike users now use types of chain sprays and dry chain sprays these days but l don't like em I have always used SAE140 and will continue to do so. 

[Generalchaos]

Sorry Kwasaki the quote button isn't working for me here using Edge, but I too am not a fan of these spray on chain sprays. Interesting you mention SAE 140!!! I saw that oil grade in the shop I bought the 90 weight from but really have no experience using that weight of oil. ( Honda recommend 90 weight) But interesting you mention it, is it good for chains? I expect it is a heavier weight than 90, if you have any info on it I would be interested.

 

Never heard of 140 before, so I didn't buy it, the girl in the shop told me it was good for gear oil but I was worried I would end up with something that was not that good for an O ring chain. The shop where I am buying this from have probably had this in stock for years and no one seems to buy it, I can get the 90 or the 140 for 240 Baht for 5 litres, it is crazy cheap.

 

Edited August 13, 2016 by Generalchaos

[johnnybgood]

Does oil go bad ...?

Probably in Aberdeen.. Alberta... Stavanger..  Gulf of Thai places like that

[canthai55]

Oil itself does not go bad. It gets contaminated, and the additive package breaks down / gets used up. Back in the day, before Oring and Xring chains, we used to place chain in a tin can after cleaning, add 90 weight gear oil, hear until hot, let cool, wipe off excess and reinstall. This thinned out the oil and allowed it to get into the space between the rollers and the pins, and between the side plates. But still flew all over, and you had a line on your back from shoulder to hip. 

[Kwasaki]

18 hours ago, Generalchaos said:

Sorry Kwasaki the quote button isn't working for me here using Edge, but I too am not a fan of these spray on chain sprays. Interesting you mention SAE 140!!! I saw that oil grade in the shop I bought the 90 weight from but really have no experience using that weight of oil. ( Honda recommend 90 weight) But interesting you mention it, is it good for chains? I expect it is a heavier weight than 90, if you have any info on it I would be interested.

 

Never heard of 140 before, so I didn't buy it, the girl in the shop told me it was good for gear oil but I was worried I would end up with something that was not that good for an O ring chain. The shop where I am buying this from have probably had this in stock for years and no one seems to buy it, I can get the 90 or the 140 for 240 Baht for 5 litres, it is crazy cheap.

 

 

It's no big deal,  use to use 80 or 90 at one time and found 140 better because of the very little throw off being a heavier oil that's all.

l apply it to the chain with a toothbrush, leave a while and wipe any excess with a clean rag.

 

The spray stuff that l used once because of it being soooo sticky seemed get grit stuck to it so l was put off by it and it made chain cleaning harder too.

Some motorcycle riders liked the Scottoilers l found they made a load of mess too.

 

I like the old fashion way.

Anything you want knowing about motorcycles best go " Motorcycles in Thailand " forum these car guys here are a bit weird..  

[rayinkrabi]

Interesting, especially the part where you say it was as black as...I'm no expert but in all my years I have never come across (new) black motor oil of any kind.  Old oil yes..but that's surely 'cos it's contaminated from use.

 

Reminds me of some thinners I bought from a local shop some years ago..unscrewed the lid, popped off the standard metal insert / seal as normal only to find the can was only 30 to 40% full.  The can was in good condition, no damage or perforations so there was no way the contents could have simply 'evaporated'  I came to the conclusion that someone was playing a dodgy 'game' of  creating many more cans of the stuff by filling new cans nicking out of others.

 

This means (if true) they would have found a way to remove and re-seal without it obviously showing (not that difficult I guess)....I wonder if this can be done with oil containers also? 

[Kwasaki]

@rayinkrabi

My SAE140 is very dark,  the thicker the oil the darker it is,  if an oil is off you can smell it's off if you have nose for it same with transmission fluid.

[ClutchClark]

7 minutes ago, transam said:

Who remembers dark green oil.........

 

Answers on a post card too admin....First out the hat gets a Trans song collection CD vol.3.......

 

Thats a good one.

 

I recall some gear oil I had that was green out of the drum years ago.

 

 

[Kwasaki]

l know but l don't want win any your CD's especially if your singing.  .   

Edited August 17, 2016 by Kwasaki

[Kwasaki]

2 minutes ago, transam said:

But you might get lucky and your name isn't drawn out the hat....

 

Nah !!  l'm still going to Duck out of it.  

[Ace of Pop]

A lot of Hams make their own C.D.s

[ktm jeff]

Duckhams  Multigrade / QXR.  One of the first multigrades to be widley marketed.  Poured like "Fairy" washing-up-liquid . As used in my old Mini Coopers.   PS  can i also opt out of the prize draw. 

[MYKTHEMIN]

23 hours ago, transam said:

Who remembers dark green oil.........

 

Answers on a post card too admin....First out the hat gets a Trans song collection CD vol.3.......

Duckhams

[ClutchClark]

14 hours ago, ktm jeff said:

Duckhams  Multigrade / QXR.  One of the first multigrades to be widley marketed.  Poured like "Fairy" washing-up-liquid . As used in my old Mini Coopers.   PS  can i also opt out of the prize draw. 

 

Thats a relief...never was a US product.

 

I thought my memory was really failing.

 

Fun trivia.

[Estrada]

Oil does not go bad, it has survived millions of years underground and is refined for use in your engine. I used to manufacture and sell oil reclamation units to the bus industry. Your old oil can be filtered to remove particles and put back in the engine. Silkolene is on brand that is reclaimed oil and used in racing cars that they sponsor.

If your oil is still in the can, shake it up and pour some into a glass and inspect for contaminants in suspension and for precipitation after allowing to stand for 2 hours. If nothing untoward, reuse it.

 

With reference to certain common practices in Thailand. Old branded oil drums and cans are collected by some shops and they pour in old oil and sell it as new.

[masuk]

3 minutes ago, Estrada said:

Oil does not go bad, it has survived millions of years underground and is refined for use in your engine. I used to manufacture and sell oil reclamation units to the bus industry. Your old oil can be filtered to remove particles and put back in the engine. Silkolene is on brand that is reclaimed oil and used in racing cars that they sponsor.

If your oil is still in the can, shake it up and pour some into a glass and inspect for contaminants in suspension and for precipitation after allowing to stand for 2 hours. If nothing untoward, reuse it.

 

With reference to certain common practices in Thailand. Old branded oil drums and cans are collected by some shops and they pour in old oil and sell it as new.

 

Two thoughts for this discussion:  Agreed that crude oil kept underground lasts for millenia, but refined oil exposed to air/oxygen might well go off in time, same as gasolene.

 

Certainly gasolene which has been through a fracking process has a limited storage life, and possibly oil also.

 

The oil  you describe sounds as if it would be great for chain saws.  It's made to stay on the chain and not on the operator.

[bark]

If it was in a dirty container. Why didn't you at least check the  Packaging date on the side ?

You would with oil for cooking ?

And I know your not going to drink it; but use your head, dude.

[ClutchClark]

29 minutes ago, masuk said:

 

Two thoughts for this discussion:  Agreed that crude oil kept underground lasts for millenia, but refined oil exposed to air/oxygen might well go off in time, same as gasolene.

 

Certainly gasolene which has been through a fracking process has a limited storage life, and possibly oil also.

 

The oil  you describe sounds as if it would be great for chain saws.  It's made to stay on the chain and not on the operator.

 

The oil itself does not go bad over time but the additive packet will separate out. Ofcourse, it will have a much longer shelf life in the air tight factory container than it will inside of your engine.

 

Gasoline is a bit different story since it is a highly refined product.

 

As for the dark color the OP mentions, that is not something zi have ever seen of virgin motor oil. Typically, that is the result of contaminants which are captured in suspension. Usually the better the additive package of a motor oil the quicker it will turn dark.

[Generalchaos]

The oil I mentioned in the OP came in a sealed plastic container, when the plastic lid seal was removed there was a sealed foil cover on the plastic bottle - I had to break the foil to get at the oil. It is almost as black as tar.

I have changed oils for forty years, engine, gearbox, axles in bikes cars and lorries and have never seen a 90 weight oil quite like this.

 

I poured some into a jar to check and although it is very dark, (not unlike molasses) it is clean, no particles or any sort of contamination. I was wondering if it could be a recycled product, I recall GB Oils in the UK used to collect waste engine and gearbox oil and recycle it.

[thairay]

On 8/13/2016 at 10:00 PM, canthai55 said:

Oil itself does not go bad. It gets contaminated, and the additive package breaks down / gets used up. Back in the day, before Oring and Xring chains, we used to place chain in a tin can after cleaning, add 90 weight gear oil, hear until hot, let cool, wipe off excess and reinstall. This thinned out the oil and allowed it to get into the space between the rollers and the pins, and between the side plates. But still flew all over, and you had a line on your back from shoulder to hip. 

You took me back a bit there ..555 usually burned my clumsy ass .

[RBOP]

Should be good for thousands of years as long as it doesn't evaporate or get contaminated with something like dirt or water.

[lungnorm]

OILS AINT OILS. Oil cannot go bad it can deteriorate due to the additives but the purpose you wish to use this oil its fine. It would be  a different story if you were going to put it in your SUV gearbox or Diff. The stickier it is the better for lubricating a chain. Retired engineer.

[ClutchClark]

I missed the part this is a 90-weight oil.

 

We call this heavy type viscosity gear oil in the US.

 

 

[bazza40]

The OP may be the victim of a Maillard reaction. Many organic substances darken in colour when exposed to heat and/or oxygen.

 

If he's only using it as a chain lubricant, no problem. The lubrication demands are fairly low for that kind of application.

[rapom]

On 17/08/2016 at 11:22 AM, transam said:

Who remembers dark green oil.........

 

Answers on a post card too admin....First out the hat gets a Trans song collection CD vol.3.......

 

Kendahl GT 1

[rapom]

Some gear oils that contain moly are black.

[bazza40]

2 hours ago, lungnorm said:

OILS AINT OILS. Oil cannot go bad it can deteriorate due to the additives but the purpose you wish to use this oil its fine. It would be  a different story if you were going to put it in your SUV gearbox or Diff. The stickier it is the better for lubricating a chain. Retired engineer.

Perhaps you have not heard the definition of a chemical engineer. Too smart to be an engineer, not smart enough to be a chemist.

[thaiguzzi]

No such thing as new black oil. Even 90w gear oil should be clear. You've been ripped. Lucky it's going on a m/c chain and not inside a gearbox.

[Gary A]

Some gear oil does contain moly and it will be black. It is an excellent lubricant. It should say moly on the label. I have  a large rotary tiller. It runs off the tractor power take off. The gear box recommends 90 weight. A shaft runs out of the gear box and runs the tines off a chain. The chain runs in an oil bath and uses 140 gear oil. That oil is thick and stringy. The 140 weight is light colored, a carmel color.