hopdafru

ahaa, saw a bit of a white sprinkle that lasted 1/2 second...

anyone else? (just passed 36.500 km, a bit north / north west of vertical...)

about to cross the 36k km geo sync sat altitude... going out for a last look north north west... you never know...

Cant see it with naked eye. need a binock or telescope. should be passing from south soutwest to north northwest. for the next 20 mins almost directly overhead, slightly to the west.

same here in Laos, can't see it with naked eye... did you (or anyone?) see it with a binock or telescope?

Time to Zzzzzz...

If I recall correctly comets normally come from Oort cloud or Kupier belt, which are further away than our planets.

http://en.wikipedia....rt_cloud<br />http://en.wikipedia....iki/Kuiper_belt

Asteroids are from between Mars and Jupiter. The place where one planet was supposed to be formed, but it never did.

Now it the time of the Asteroid 2012 AD14 flyby, and nothing did hap

just past 2.30 am and DA14 just went from 'approaching' to 'leaving' at around 27k km... could still crash with a geosync sat although unlikely as they are mostly along the equator and the thing is tiny... (DA14 is flying north south I think)

Very odd though that DA14 is said to be unrelated to the meteor in Russia this morning, not everybody seems to agree...

Excited to see the comet coming in a few months

PS: link re. realtime sat tracking... very cool! (from a TV user on the other DA14 thread...)

http://www.satflare.com/track.asp?q=a2012da14#TOP

Just curious why you would then state "why would you get married when there 100's of 20 plus women wanting a western trial"

As for post #60...as I mentioned the family and I have never heard of this happening. My wife has lived here (on the same piece of land) for the past 36 years, her father the last 60 years, her mother the last 58 years, her grandmother the last 98 years and none of them has ever heard of the OP story ( a woman walking up to a strangers door and offering a child for sale).

Underage brothels they have heard of but have no hard evidence of their existence (none of the family have admitted to having sex with underage girls/boys but all of them have expressed their disgust with it).

Would I call the authorities, absolutely! And here is a starting point if you ever see, hear or have personal knowledge of (as poster Number 60 you should be calling these people and get the ball rolling for the protection of children) a child being or the potential to be exploited!

TO REPORT A SUSPECTED INCIDENT OF CHILD TRAFFICKING, CONTACT:

• Phachabodi Hotline Center (Ministry of Social Development and Human Security): Hotline: 1300, email: call1300@

hotmail.com.

• The Anti-Trafficking Coordination Unit Northern Thailand (TRAFCORD): TRAFCORD was established in August

2002 in cooperation with the Coordination Center for Protection of Child and Woman Rights Chiang mai (CPCWRC) in

response to the problem of human trafficking in upper Northern Thailand. 24 Hr. Hotline: 087 176 5797

• The Center for the Protection of Child Rights (CPCR): an NGO registered in 1997 working to protect and support

child victims of forced labour and prostitution, sexual and physical abuse, neglect and trafficking. Tel: 0-2412-1196 ,

0-2412-0739 , 0-2864-1421, email: [email protected], website : http://www.thaichildrights.org/

• Saidek 1387 (Child hotline): Hotline: 1387

• ECPAT International: [email protected] ; Tel: 02.215.3388 (available 9:00 – 17:00 M-F)

• ECPAT Foundation (Chiang Rai & Northern Provinces): [email protected]; Tel: 05.375.0167 (available 9:00 –

17:00 m-f)

#60 was my post just in case the numbers change if posts are deleted (believe I observed this recently)

@rct99q I'm not challenging what you said or trolling etc.

Actually It's great that you posted the above contact info, a few places have been raided recently thanks to these people's efforts, I'm not sure how much real progress is being made as I am also observing/getting reports of increased numbers of underaged girls in various places.

To make things clear though, I've worked with these people and while a lot of effort is being done locally, trafficking is an international issue / effort. With consequences well beyond what one would see on Nana/cowboy or in local karaoke's.

A couple years back I was pointing out these places where trafficking was done accross borders, (thus making the girls practically helpless and beyond abuse). I wanted to perhaps change the NGO focus from helping the occasional in between rice harvest easy job for quick cash (I'm simplifying) enabling photo shoots of the new girl at the shelter to secure donor funds - to working on the more difficult task of finding the under-aged, abused and detained ones and repatriating them + setting up a partnership between those involved (NGO/police etc.) along with a legal framework to make it work.

Perhaps quite naive as, to make a long story short, I ended up in a small dark room with 10 military guys going through my passport (quite a memory! still feels like an old war movie with the fan rotoring above my head) and having to sign a document in Lao which I couldn't read at the time.

All my paperwork was in order and I was asked a few days later to meet another person who told me in english and very nicely, that I was welcome in the country but that I shouldn't talk too much (I had written a report explaining my findings and point of view) and that my visa renewal was basically based on my 'behaviour'.

My contract wasn't renewed, I did some further work but never got paid etc...

As far as I know these places are still open for business (in thailand) - I'll never forget the feeling of having an obviously sick 14 yo clinging on to me begging for help and not able to do anything in that moment given the guys with guns outside -

It does look though as the legal framework mentioned above is moving forward. I certainly hope so.

To get back to the OP, I've had several instances such as a grandmother would ask me and my gf to adopt a luuk kreung kid (50/50) even though the father back in europe/west was sending money and the mother is working somewhere (or with minorities in the mountains where only 12 yo girls are 'available' as all the older ones have been married/sold already etc.). An old lady showing up with a child, albeit oddly asking for 500k ???, doesn't necessarily mean just selling the kid and who cares what happens to him/her as I wrote in my previous post (there could be debts involved, a violent 'family' member etc...) If you really want to help, these things can be discussed and each situation individually understood, by bringing in the local authorities or some of the above organisations. I don't think it's as easy as it sounds though, like someone suddenly shows up (especially outside major cities), pays the debt or whatever, deals with the family/police and handles living, schooling, psychologist/doctors etc.

edit: this could be a reason why some people run out of options as they were promised some help / it was expected through some organization who advertized it and it never came, they built up debt and are still trying to find help for the child... ahaa...

I do like the individual adopting though as in my earlier post - not a solution for everyone but i've seen it work. Some (rare/motivated/found early) girls can also be sent back to school with minimal cost/follow-up and a possible turn around.

Of course selling off a child as a direct transaction such as the OP is completely insane/abusive etc. but I haven't seen this either, except for trafficking abroad - rarely locally as most girls decide this on their own for a whole bunch of reasons: family, 'fun', easy money, having friends, meeting a magic falang etc. - that's where education / information would fit pretty well - a whole other story but a good start!

Long post again... I've been at this for over 3 years and looking for a more happy and beautiful environment!

Well I am not sure what part of Isan the OP lives in but I too live in rural Northeast (52 months continuous and counting) and have never heard of one story similar to this. My wife and family are well connected in the village and after talking with her about this subject it was made explicitly clear this would not happen near our village.

Police would be called and the Thai person would be traced and the child removed and taken into custody to be relocated with other family members (if possible and not saying they would be any better but there is always a chance). A young girl in the next village to ours was abandoned by her parents and my wife and mother in law took her in for a 4 months until we could track down responsible family members down south. She was obviously shaken by the turn of events but in no way did she feel abandoned.

So for those rene123 bashers......the wording may not have been the best but understand the sentiments of the statement. I too would not turn my back on any person who required assistance.

So my advice would be.....

Call the tourist police, give them a statement as to what happened, describe the two people as best you can, provide dates, times and as much detail as possible. Go on record with these details start getting a history of events in case it happens again or you hear of it happening again you have a police report. If you are too scared to tell them the same story as you have put in TV then I guess that is up to you.

There are plenty of places providing underage girls from across the border in the northeast... won't detail here... not a single girl over 18, dozens well under, with no advertizing/lights and armed guys sitting outside. Easy to find out about them and short time starts at 200thb. (for those wondering it's for local consumption, not falang), local law enforcement gets freebies.

Saw it first hand at several occasions while working for NGO / CSEC.

You need joint action from specialized teams/authorities in both countries (ie thailand and country of origin of the girls) for anything to happen. Calling locally won't do anything, calling abroad could initiate action. Very dangerous though...

I'm curious to hear what your wife / family would say about this, and if you would call the (local) police to make a report.

Just sayin' as from your post I concluded (wrongly perhaps?) that 52 months - or more - in Issaan doesn't give access to this kind of stuff unless one insistently scratches the surface. no pun intended.

Also, given the increasing divide between rich and poor, access to credit etc. I wouldn't be surprised to see more of this happening in the region, including 'offering' 12 year old brides/girls to more well off foreigners, be they falang or Asian.

Actually, as I write this, I can also see how - in some cases - a child would be perceived better off with a falang (mixed) family especially given for example the recent story of the 12 yo birman girl burned and cut repeatedly over 5 years by a couple in a neighboring country. (many, many more such similar stories I am sad to say)

Perhaps something should be done to make it not too difficult to adopt these kids (it's easier to make a positive difference in their life when they are younger), there are many good people out there who can't have kids of their own and face very complex paperwork / procedures to do so; too much paranoia perhaps (I know a falang/lao couple who adopted 3 kids without parents from the mountains although local adoption is illegal here in Laos - kudos to them and the local authorities who made it really easy on the basis of common sense)

Also not every parent / grandmother / family member (in the OP's type of situation) is out there directly gambling/drinking their money away, some are simply in such difficult situations for us to even conceive that they are desperate to find a way for a better future for these kids. I don't know of any parent (except maybe some extremely rare exceptions), who would go on and simply sell off their kids no questions asked and not hoping for a better future.

touchy touchy subject indeed - sorry for the long post.

I suggest that anyone who thinks that monks have an easy life ordain for a few months, preferably somewhere like Wat Nong Pah Pong or Wat Pa Nanachat, and then come back here and tell us all how easy it was...

My conclusion after a two week 'trip' at the wat was that I could now survive almost anything / anywhere!

No regrets though, definitely a great, unforgettable experience!

If possible before Pimai, I would wait for the passport and avoid the embassy. Then enter across the bridge using 2 separate booths (your gf and son through one, you through another)

I wouldn't get too paranoid though, my advice is general (and based on the info you provide) and to avoid unnecessary stress - Laotians are mostly cool and you should be fine in Vientiane if gf and family tell you it's ok. In doubt, stay at a nearby hotel or guesthouse (plenty in the sticks / suburbs - lots of clean brand new ones with hot water, A/C)

As far as crossing, never had trouble at bridge / boat landing - had some issues at airport though (some friends as well) as they are more 'serious' - generally, keep your cool and smile, whatever happens; and if needed have your gf do the talking.

Can you expedite passport for your son (before mid april?) Pimai is a big deal for Laotians and a time when almost everyone returns home to visit the family - your gf and family might be disappointed if you can't all make it.

The 'kid' issue is an important one though and you should gather as much info / input as possible - e.g. if your gf can enter Laos with just a birth certificate that could be interesting (how do they get out though?)

FYI British embassy/consulate just opened in Vientiane but they probably don't have much experience with these particular issues yet.

Again, don't get too paranoid, keep your smile and get as much info as possible from different sources, including about your gf/family, many have gotten burned here / lost money / spent time in jail (usually their 'fault' / misguided action). note: serious issues usually come up a couple/few years down the road but with warning signs.

how long have you been together? Have you visited the family together before? what does your gf say?

SokhDee.

Can't answer 1-3.

4. If child was a Thai citizen he would need to get a border pass which would only be good for 3 days.

Since I assume child is not a Thai citizen are you talking about him entering as a Lao citizen. I suspect you would need something from the Lao Embassy or consulate for him to enter Laos.

But he would not get back into Thailand unless he had a passport.

Great information, thanks. Looks like I've got a trip to the Lao Embassy coming soon. I was worried about them asking for a marriage certificate and my girlfriend getting into some sort of trouble. I have also heard that the Lao Embassy is not that helpful towards their own citizens. If we want to go to Laos I guess I'll just have to find out for myself.

Thanks again

I'd be carefull going to the Lao embassy, if they learn about your trip with gf/child and not being married you could be setting yourself up - info would go straight to the government / immigration and you could find yourself with reduced options in the future (if you decide to get married, already having a kid can cost dearly; people usually declare that they had no sex before marriage at the police interview - ie. there are no kids - even if everyone konws it's BS...)

Why not just go ahead with the kid's passport (falang or thai?) - might just cost 1000 baht and you get 30 days no questions asked.

SokhDee.

PS: are you flying in or going through the bridge?

1) Is this still the case, will they want my money?

It depends. If you stay together in the village long enough and someone decides to call the army / police to share the prize it'll cost you... now more so in the $500 range but could be more. Also depends on the province: e.g. LuangPrabang is known to be very severe.

Very little to worry if you are staying in a hotel or even local guest house. If you want to visit the village, your gf will ask permission to the naibaan / village chief and you should be ok for a night or two (always a good idea to bring a bag of coffee to the office). In any case she will know.

2) Will we have problems with Lao immigration if we go through together?

No, you're not registered in any way (I assume... - you didn't declare the kid to the Lao authorities did you?)

3) Will it be a good idea for her and my son to go through immigration first and then for me to follow on afterwards?

If you go together don't show any signs of affection and you should be ok (people might start asking about you, your luuk kheung etc. though). To avoid any tipoff or such - and just for your own 'good feeling' - there's nothing to loose going seperately, it's only a few minutes anyways on the Lao side.

4) Is it also possible for my son to cross the border without a passport and just his Thai birth certificate as identification?

not sure, usually needs a family book or such (free 3 day visit?), maybe lovelaos has an idea.

I think another thing that surprised me was that it's so open to everyone but the man. It's a fairly small rural town. She works in a high profile job that requires a university degree. She isn't hiding this from anyone but the farang. Everyone around her knows about it and thinks it's no big deal. They know the long time boyfriend, and about him, and then they see the farang come and visit for a vacation.

Even my good friend there just shrugs it off, saying she believes in Karma. No one seems to think it's all that wrong.

Many western men here brag about their extra-marital adventures / one night stands / short times / gik / mia noi etc. in a totally open manner with their expat friends who happen to know the wife/girl friend. The 'secret' holds every time and 'no one seems to think it's all that wrong' either...

do 'we' have some sort of right that 'they' don't?

so... how did it go?

I'm curious as I also thought that VOA meant hopping on the plane with a couple of pictures and $50. Doesn't look that way!

interesting 3 'I' rule:

1. innovators

2. imitators

3. idiots

My personal feeling is many are in the 3rd category as far as gold (silver/other past investments) is (are) concerned... please show me otherwise.

have started to watch this series on the fall of america, quite interesting and in my view plausible as with so much national debt people holding USD will (are?) soon try to 'get rid' of them - I wonder in exchange for what... other currencies? (which ones?) land / businesses in Asia? (I'm still not sure about gold being the top/best investment)

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-DHmgM2MmFo

Assuming the USD will fall significantly in value, how would such a scenario affect the THB? (and other SEA currencies such as kip which seems pegged to the USD?)

It's like an addiction... while knowing it's bad for you, you still do it

I'd like to point out a glitch in the daily updates of TV topics (general topics at least...)

The links don't work.

e.g.:

This is your daily new topics digest for forum General topics!

Forum:General topics)

Topic: Confused - What Year Is It?! ( robsamui -- Yesterday, 20:34 )

http://www.thaivisa....hat-year-is-it/

..............................

I need to manually remove the index.php? part in order to access each link I click on...

anyone else with this issue?

... We will then have created a generation of Idiots.

If it is indeed A. Einstein who predicted this decades ago, it seems he was (almost) right...

having coffee / dinner with friends...

At the museum...

having drinks...

geez... at a football game!

Tete a tete Dinner... (although I can see this could come handy to avoid an argument in public)

Driving (seen more and more, even while driving the motorbike... scary!)

So, what do you folks think?

And for those with old enough kids, how do you deal / plan to deal with this increasing phenomenon?

With this decision, word is out that xanax can be used for date rape, people using xanax for anxiety will have to find another molecule, and xanax will still be available on the street at a much steeper price. Loose loose IMO.

The government should come out with a press release in a few weeks saying they studied the effects of xanax and came to the conclusion that it doesn't work for date rape and xanax will be available again by prescription only from specialized doctors such as neurologists.

They might as well apply this to the other 'zepams' to control their avalability and make sure they are available only (almost) to those who really need them.

My 2 cents...

But as the OP pointed out, the THB over the last month or so has rocketed against various currencies, including the Malaysian ringgit (and anyone with an interest in this can comment on other Asian currencies), and I doubt that change has much to do with the deliberate devaluation of Western currencies.

The Euro, I believe, is prevented from devaluing for political expediency, so the Europeans will have to put up with deflation instead - a much more bitter pill than devaluation.

SC

.

THB went up 7% in the last week vs Lao Kip as well. People flocking to thailand for jobs as daily wage there is now almost twice as much as here (short time daily jobs - otherwise quadruple)

As for EUR, as Lao Kip fixed to USD, very good deal to stay here, EUR keeps rising and we get 11% on 1 year fixed account in Kip (9% yearly for 6 months)

Surprised the Bancor hasn't been mentioned yet.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bancor

Is there any likelyhood it will be more present in the world economy and how would it affect the THB vs. other currencies such as EUR, USD, YEN etc.?

I would strongly advise anybody who feels I am pressing the alarm button unjustifiably to do their own research. Oh, please do please let me know if I am wrong. I shall be greatly relieved!

I feel you are wrong, and Thailand is on the brink of disaster.

Unfortunately forum rules prevent me from explaining why I think this.

huh?

please do explain. I'm sure it's possible within TV rules, s'il vous plait

talk to the guys doing aquaponics outside bangkok, urban aquaponics if I recall correctly, sending you PM with link.

I'm curious how/if the recent increase in minimum wage affects the THB. FYI just found an article mentioning it (describing as well what seems to be an economy in pretty good shape):

For employees, the government, and labor unions, the hope is that in a time of economic growth (5% predicted for 2013) and low unemployment (0.6% at the end of 2012), increased income for workers will boost consumption and force productivity gains and innovation. This will then drive a more balanced, modernized, and competitive economy and help Thailand avoid the much-dreaded middle-income trap.

http://asiafoundation.org/in-asia/2013/01/30/thailand-adopts-nationwide-minimum-wage-policy-amid-controversy/

http://en.wikipedia....tive_Order_6102

again what about this scenario .? so if you are the lucky ones that get the physical gold ( sorry for those that purchased on a promise of delivery u were never going to get it) they slam u with this ...and they have no choice ...

"In Australia part IV of the Banking Act 1959 allowed the Commonwealth government to seize private citizens' gold in return for paper money where the Governor-General "is satisfied that it is expedient so to do, for the protection of the currency or of the public credit of the Commonwealth.^[18]" As of January 30, 1976, this part's operation is "suspended".^[19]"

Buy a little gold every month

So where and how do you suggest we buy it ? I really am interested in this suggestion.

There are brokerage firms in Thailand that allow you to buy gold at spot prices in the commodities exchanges. They will even house the gold for you so you dont have the risk of it being stolen, lost etc....

555! there's a business idea: selling gold one doesn't have - after all banks have gotten really rich selling money they didn't have.

Special offer to TV members: buy gold from the comfort of your couch: I will store it for you for a small fee as to avoid theft, loss etc. don't worry, it's safe with me.

And come the day you want to sell it I will tell you to hold on to it as it's value will rise again in just a few months, you'd be a looser to sell now. I'll even lend you money if you need some, well worth it for sure!

And don't worry, we are AIG insured, you are protected... 555!

couldn't resist