rinteln

Was your first sentence a direct reference to me or just a generic statement assuming people who are hanging cant go home ?

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Why would you think I was referring to you? Not referring to anyone specifically.

And no assuming, just pointing out a common situation where many people are getting by month to month but don't have anything at all in the bank, can't afford the ticket home, can't afford to get legal on their visa, can't afford the fine required to exit the country, nothing for a deposit on a flat once they do get home, no job waiting for them.

That's what I refer to as "down and out" rather than legitimately "hanging in there".

If someone was in the situation you describe above then yes I would agree with you but seems a bit of an extreme example. As it did come as a direct reply to my quote I have the feeling you may of been referring to an assumed position of mine which actually Ive had before because and shows its all about expectation.

I think what the OP is trying to imply is that he thinks Thailand should only have Expats in it with surplus amounts of money where in actual fact Thailand is no way near ready for that yet. Thailand is doing ok but we are not talking about living in Singapore are we. Even a poor Expat in this country is probably still more of a benefit to the state than the average Thai financially.

Thailand is not at the stage yet where they can start evaluating its immigrants in such a way and I would be interested to see what definitive reason and burden or negative effect someone who isnt rich has on the Thai state.

Interesting topic and as someone said earlier I do think it almost seems a bit troll like to be honest. Plus a hint of arrogance.

I think alot of this subject depends on what your definition of "broke" is and definition of "hanging in there". My question is why would hanging in there be a bad thing anyway ?! Hanging in for a foreigner will still be pumping more money into the system than many Thais do.

This is Thailand not the UK, there is no social system here. If an Expat is hanging in then it is still by default a positive for Thailand. Its impossible to be a burden on the Thai state as a foreigner. Plus hanging in there in Thailand is probably still better than being in the UK in my opinion.

I am a perfect example of this. I am 33 and have been living here for 6 years now. My monthly average income has probably never been more than 25,000 a baht and I have lived a healthy life, visited many parts of Thailand, never had visa issues, have a nice apartment, motorbike and even get out for the sports and some nightlife when i want. Should I not be here then ?

Its all about expectation. I've met people who laugh that i live on 25,000 a month and they say there is no way they could ever do that do that but in actual fact I my income is more than twice the national average wage.

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The problem is when you've been "hanging in there" for years, continually slipping down and down without money in the bank to be able to get home, where do you go when you hit the bottom.

That "get home and re-establish yourself fund" should IMO be a requirement for remaining in Thailand longer than say six months no matter what the visa status.

New idea for the Thai government both to help cut down on the riff-raff and to help those sex addicts that can't help themselves?

Wouldn't apply to pensioners with a guaranteed income of course, something the down-and-outers will likely never see in their entire lifetime unless they come from one of the lucky nanny-state countries.

Was your first sentence a direct reference to me or just a generic statement assuming people who are hanging cant go home ?

Nowhere is racism and sexism practiced more profoundly than in Farangland.

Such profoundly true words...I am impressed Beetle dude.

Every time a farang mentions the word "racism" in the Thai context, it really dilutes the real meaning. Because in Thailand, there's no historical context. Unless one considers being a member of a privileged group to be a "victim." Well, that's how it used to be in Thailand, although that's eroding a bit due to the types of farangs arriving on these shores every day. But the word "racism" as applied to how farangs are treated in Thailand has almost no meaning to the average Thai. None. To put it simply, they have no idea what the heck you're talking about. And they shouldn't.

The term racism as applied in the American context conjures up all kinds of ugly and horrible images from our past. We're talking rapes, lynchings, cross-burnings, and of course, slavery. It's a factual part of our history that we'd very much like to forget. So a racist in America is truly scum, putting it as mildly as I can. No one wants to be associated with that term because of the historical context.

So from that perspective, a farang complaining that he's a victim of racism in Thailand is almost comical. A victim of what, a life of leisure? Well that's what it seems to the average Thai. And again, calling a Thai a racist is meaningless because they have no idea what you're talking about.

Great post. Yes totally agree in regards to the how the word is used.

I have always regarded the word racist as a term that should be used for someone who is intentionally discriminating, should know better or having some sort of evil streak in it. That's the kind of image i get anyway. I think Thais still discriminate but its more about ignorance as opposed to intention and I dont think it has any bad intention in it. They are just brought up to believe all Westerners have money and dont know yet that it isnt right to treat one human different to another human in the same situation.

Although I agree the word racist shouldn't be used I do think that there is quite a bit of discrimination in this country. Not only towards us but actually even within their own people depending on status and skin colour. Watch a day's worth of Thai TV soaps if in doubt. This may be another debate on another thread but thats my view.

The difference in this country is that many foreigners regard it as a non issue because it has no direct harm and most people take the rough with the smooth. What people do is they think just because it has no real harm that is must mean its not discrimination. For example if your here and you get charged more for your chicken and rice because you are perceived by your appearance to have more money then you laugh it off. Back home you would be stunned for 5 minutes, contest it and perhaps even get the company fined or in trouble. So we all know the principle but we allow for it because of other conditions. The fact it happens here and alot more accepted does not change the fact its discrimination, it only changes how we react.

Not more than 15 - 20,000 a month to live comfortable I would say.

Depends how much they have been influenced by the west I suppose !

Comfortable by whose standards?

My in-laws ma + pa even refused my offer of buying them a nice bed, they can't sleep on a mattress and think they are awful, so they have to sleep on the floor as they have done since they were born....that's just one example of comfort for them. They own a load of land and have no shortage of good fresh food, that;s another example of comfort for them.

However, for the sake of the thread, just give them 25K and tell them there's more from where that came.

Agreed the word "comfortable" could be argued, which is partly why I said it depends how much western influence they have had.

I think for the purpose of the thread I would define comfortable at the very least as eating well, drinking well (not alcohol I mean), having adequate enough accommodation to sleep, clean and commune in. This is surely the minimum for the term comfortable in any country. If that is the minimum then surely 15 - 20,000 is enough.

Not more than 15 - 20,000 a month to live comfortable I would say.

Depends how much they have been influenced by the west I suppose !

Pattaya police don't work weekends or after dark, or when it's raining or during the heat of the day or on public holidays or if there's no money in it for them. By warning the crooks in advance the police will get a crime free weekend without having to turn out.

So true !! The whole thing is about status and big headlines whilst at the same time trying to do as little as possible.

Pattaya Police prepare for weekend crime crackdown

I am sure the criminals will appreciate the heads up. They can now make plans for a weekend holiday and return on Monday for business as usual.

These rediculous crack downs only last for VERY short time periods and they are then forgotten by the BIB. The BIB doesn't seem to be able to enforce more than a few laws at any one time.

How about enforcing all of the laws relating to dangerous situations, all of the time and forget the stupid smaller problems like Viagra sales and 200 baht "gambling dens".

Fantastic !!

When are these people going to learn to pay their weekly bribes to the police !! lol

That's what happens when you don't give the police their cut !!

Another story that sounds like there is more too it !!

Either way he must be a tourist as any expat knows that even if your in the right you still don't mess with the Thais, especially connected Thais like taxi drivers.

Hardly pressing news in a city already full of sin !!! lol

On the contrary, this sort of intrusion is very upsetting for women. She wasn't putting on a public show.

Im sure it is and im sure the correct justice will be meated out for it (probably 500 baht in a policemans top pocket for the whiskey fund)

But in a city where we have mass encouraged prostitution, widespread corruption amongst police and politicians, daily thefts, assaults and a city whos backbone is basically alchohol and paid sex (which really does mess up many women) I dont think its big news and surely much more to worry about.....a sarcastic lol !!

Hardly pressing news in a city already full of sin !!! lol

Its the amount incidents that we don't find out about or have been paid off thats worrying !!

As I mentioned in another post on the same topic this whole situation is a case of "wont" as opposed to "cant"

The opinion of whether city hall and the police get a cut on these scams is obviously not a debate anymore, we all know that they do. The issue here and the embarrassment is how they continue to try and make people believe its a "cant stop" problem when actually its a "wont stop". The fact its gone on for years within a small area only leaves 1 of 2 options/conclusions. Either they are trying to stop the scams but cant and thus must be the most incompetent police force in the world. Or they are all in on the cut. Now I think the Pattaya police force are probably one of the worse that I have ever seen but surely cant be that bad at stopping crimes.

Conclusion................they are all in on it, always will be, always can be (new tourists, flesh meat) . We should really stop approaching these scams as if a presumption of wrong doing has been made already. They dont count it as a wrong and dont care whether any future reputation is effected, its all about here and now. City Hall, the police and everyone associated want these scams to carry on. Its a big money business with an almost full proof process with an infinite amount of victims available. These scams are so old that its probably even a part of some policeman's expected salary every month. It doesn't matter who is involved or how high up they are, if they can be paid off then they can be paid off.

Jetski scams will only stop when officials stop being corrupt, this is likely to be a long time. I would never normally have such a defeated attitude but really does anyone seriously think this will stop soon. City Hall and the police must be laughing at us always discussing this in our very Western moral way while they are counting there 1000 baht notes.

This whole episode makes me think that the mayor is making a cut from the scam. Yes, I know he made a PR appearance to the jet ski scammers last summer and "scolded them". He has so much power, he only has to put the police on it or his own "hit men". He definately is connected with this scam or else he would faithfully, consciously make an attempt to stop this bad situation which gives Pattaya a bad name. come on, it is a no brainer that he could wipe this out within 2 days. And just think how the Western countries would handle this...or Japan...or Singapore...or Indonesia

"This whole episode makes me think that the mayor is making a cut from the scam"

Agreed and actually at this stage can be the only logical conclusion as this is clearly not a "cant stop" issue, its a "wont stop" issue.

The opinion of whether city hall and the police have a cut on these scams is obviously not a debate anymore, we all know that they do. The issue here and the embarrassment is how they continue to try and make people believe its a "cant stop" problem when actually its a "wont stop". The fact its gone on for years within a small area only leaves 1 of 2 options/conclusions. Either they are trying to stop the scams but cant and thus must be the most incompetent police force in the world - if they cant stop a repeated crime at the same location by the same people. Or they are all in on the cut. Now I think the Pattaya police force are probably one of the worse that I have ever seen but surely cant be that bad at stopping crimes.

Conclusion................all in on it, always will be, always can be (new tourists, flesh meat) . Leave it, move on you will never change it !!

C'mon lads how much are we talking about here? Some of these Baht Bus franchisees pay a 1000 baht to hire the bus for a day I've heard. Then there's fuel, repairs, potential accidents. I feel so sorry sometimes for these would-be entrepeneurs running about empty most of the day trying to make a crumb.

Yes, I know there's the bad type too.

I think a lot of us aren't worried about 10 more baht, its the way they cram you into them at the bus station. Since I have a choice by walking about 50 meters further, I vote with my feet

"I think a lot of us aren't worried about 10 more baht"

The OP certainly is !!

I only see an issue here if drivers are charging more than advertised somewhere in the station. If not then this is a simple case of that's how much they charge, deal with it !

If you think its too much then you have a choice, there are other options. I don't think there is an obligation for drivers to be offering services for x amount, its not a government department or something.

Also the thing to think about is the people getting these buses are more likely to be tourists and expats are more likely to have their own transport or know other options. Now if tourists are complaining about paying 1 USD for some 1/2 KM transportation when they are on holiday then i would suggest there will be quite a few issues for them with the rest of their holiday.

All in all its really a none issue. A rip off in my book is when you pay more than agreed or was advised, not if someone just thinks they are paying too much for something. Its supply and demand baby. Its not the first time that knowledge is used to charge more for something and wont be the last. You can get the bus there nice and easy for 30 baht or walk somewhere and try to find it for 10/20 baht. Im sure the extra 10 baht is worth it. Frankly if i was here on holiday i would not care and as an expat i would expect to have my own options.

"Compare to the American Embassy for example. My friend here is renewing his next week. 5000 baht in Bangkok, ready in 7 days !!"

US passports are issued in the US.

I think it's less than 5K baht.

Terry

They are issued in the US but the embassy sends application over their network to the US which reduces the time to get one.

Cost is $110 or about 3300 baht.

That's great.

Really does beg the question then of why a British passport is more than double the price to make exactly the same thing with presumably the same process.

"Compare to the American Embassy for example. My friend here is renewing his next week. 5000 baht in Bangkok, ready in 7 days !!"

US passports are issued in the US.

I think it's less than 5K baht.

Terry

Proves my point even more then. Cheaper and quicker than the British Passport office. Plus you guys can have pages added.

But I've seen recent reports of passports being delivered 10-14 days after the application reaches in HK, in which case its a pretty good service I'd say.

If that is the case then thats better than I expected. Still wouldn't say its a good service though.

Put into context, 14 days to issue a document that they already have all the information for and presumably all the materials for also. 7000 baht, plus the courier fees. Might aswell call it 10,000 baht

Compare to the American Embassy for example. My friend here is renewing his next week. 5000 baht in Bangkok, ready in 7 days !!

As I said, seems us Brits are getting worse service every year.

Thanks for the quick answers.

Blimey, service for us Brits is really getting worse by the year isn't it !!

Hi guys,

During this month I was planning to actually fly to Hong Kong and renew my passport at the consulate in person as opposed to sending the renewal paperwork off which takes 4 weeks. I need a new passport fairly quickly in order to start a work permit application here in Thailand.

Without paying their stupid 4 GBP fee for webchat or 1 GBP per minute phone calls I was hoping someone might of had a recent experience of this and could advise.

How long did the application take in person ? Is there an express service where I can pick the new passport up perhaps 1-2 days later after submitting ?

Thanks in advance

Native Portugese speaker needed for tour company in Bangkok

Needed for a 2 week period in May. Date to be confirmed.

Candidate must also speak a good level of English.

For more details please message me.

Thanks

Thanks for the replies. Im sure from those options Ill find it. Its one of those books you should just have a copy of if you know what I mean.

Thanks