SDM0712

Wow thai dl for flights? so it was worth the hustle at the dept of land transport

...... and it doesn't stop there....down here in Phuket if we show our Thai Driving Licence we pay Thai prices for most tourist attractions, Bangkok and Pattaya too. Also I find that banks etc always prefer the Thai Licence when offered the choice of passport and DL.

SDM

Basically, correct. It matters not how dangerous a country is. If you have a high standard of defensive driving, anticipation and able to do a basic risk assessment you will be able to stay safe and avoid these idiots.

I think broadly speaking this is correct but where I live it is very mountainous. We have had a number of incidents over the years where buses/trucks/WMDs (sorry, commuter vans) have lost control due to driving too fast or having their brakes overheat on the way down. Unfortunately if you are in front of one of these it really doesn't matter what style of driving you adopt.

SDM

Exactly.

If a truck behind you loses brakes on one of those roads Im afraid your past driving history is unlikely to affect the result unless it entitled you to an ejector seat. You could try arguing with the truck's compressor that you have driven the last billion miles (or whatever you claim it was) incident free and this shouldnt be happening to you.

Good luck with that.

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Really? i think you are basing your theories of driving on LUCK.....you might find on investigation that this is an unsound approach to understanding road safety.

Clearly you have not understood this post and taken the literal meaning rather than the intended meaning which highlights that driving skill plays no part in this scenario. To survive this kind of accident is truly more down to luck than skill.

SDM

I for one really enjoy my life in Thailand and get on very well with most of the people I meet here.

I don't hate the country or the people but find the wasted 26000 lives every single year very tragic and can't for the life of me understand why nothing is done to stop the carnage.

As for the 'go home if you don't like it' comment where should my Thai mother in law go? Her son was killed by a drunk driver who escaped all liability by paying off the Police.

Where should my Thai friend go? Her father was killed by a drunk driver only last month.

I echo your comments and agree once you do a tally of the good and bad I think this is a wonderful place to live. It's not perfect but where is.

When you compare the loss of life here with that of a developed country such as the UK it is shocking. I live in Phuket and it seems that I see or witness an accident almost every day, bikes, cars, buses we get it all. Most are down to driver error, a few to mechanical failure.

I believe other causes fall into basic area ;

Apathy/Ability; Most Thais feel that driving is a simple skill that involves the basic ability to operate the vehicle. Many have no wish to improve their driving skills and if anything believe that the ability to, drive, drive fast, we might say recklessly, and not have an accident is confirmation of their driving ability. For those of us who learnt to drive in the West we know that the ability to drive the vehicle is the most basic part of being a competent driver. The most important part is awareness of our situation. By the use of our mirrors and observation most Western drivers are aware on an almost subconscious level of traffic that is behind us and to either wide, also traffic that was to our side and is now in a blind spot. One other difference is that when looking ahead most Thai drivers will be concentrating on the area immediately in front of their vehicle, as Western drivers we are taught to also be looking 500/1000 metres ahead.

Education; In the West we have a system whereby we are formerly taught to drive by a professional teacher, or a driver with experience and skill who no doubt would have had formal lessons him/herself. We are taught around a set of basic requirements/skills and when we have mastered those are allowed to do a formal test, which is also based on those same basic requirements. If we satisfy the test we are licensed to drive alone, or as some see it to continue our driver training alone with a basic set of minimum safety standards and skills. However over here there is no formal training requirement and skills are learned by experimentation and guesswork. Most Thai drivers are taught by a family member who learned in the same manner. In my opinion this is the route of the problem but since the fine for driving without a licence of is low or it is a very simple process to get a licence, coupled with the fact that drivers believe the ability to drive is no more difficult then riding a pushbike, it will never change. For anyone who doubts this let me mention a few buzzwords that will speak volumes; lane discipline, corner cutting, overtaking on bends and other inn appropriated situations, the list goes on and we all know it. These failings are because the drivers know no better.

Equipment failure is also a big problem here due to lack of maintenance, broken lights, faulty brakes etc.

SDM

Yet another view that is only partial........Why don't you brush up on the 5 Es and get the whole picture???

You seem to be posting in English, but I have no idea what you are talking about. What are "the 5 Es" ?

Also you haven't explained what you mean by "quod erat demonstrandum" in your earlier post. As I said in that case I understand the definition perfectly, what I do not understand is how you are attempting to apply it.

Is English your first language ?

SDM

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Thank u very much for all the replied, I've collected so many info about Phuket. Actually what is the best idea of relaxing stuff to do in Phuket?

As I say to people I deal with professionally, here in Phuket we really have something for everyone. I'm not sure if I would call Patong a relaxing place though !

SDM

I have overstayed several times when i visited as a tourist. Never had a problem.

When I used to come here as a tourists I normally visited every third month, for a month. But sometimes on my December trip I would stay for 5 weeks. Being too lazy to get my 30 day tourist visa extended, I would just over stay by a week and pay the fine. This had no impact on subsequent trips and no impact on my subsequent annual visa now I live here.

Don't worry about it.

SDM

Overstaying once may be one thing; but to make a habit of it is IMHO inexcusable.

Two things are clear however. Firstly I was excused by the people who actually matter, and secondly I was able to contribute to the Thai economy, several times in fact. Although I think the word " inexcusable" is far too strong, to overstay intentionally is clearly wrong.

SDM

Not what my brief told me and I do have a work permit.

SDM

Basically, correct. It matters not how dangerous a country is. If you have a high standard of defensive driving, anticipation and able to do a basic risk assessment you will be able to stay safe and avoid these idiots.

I think broadly speaking this is correct but where I live it is very mountainous. We have had a number of incidents over the years where buses/trucks/WMDs (sorry, commuter vans) have lost control due to driving too fast or having their brakes overheat on the way down. Unfortunately if you are in front of one of these it really doesn't matter what style of driving you adopt.

SDM

I for one really enjoy my life in Thailand and get on very well with most of the people I meet here.

I don't hate the country or the people but find the wasted 26000 lives every single year very tragic and can't for the life of me understand why nothing is done to stop the carnage.

As for the 'go home if you don't like it' comment where should my Thai mother in law go? Her son was killed by a drunk driver who escaped all liability by paying off the Police.

Where should my Thai friend go? Her father was killed by a drunk driver only last month.

I echo your comments and agree once you do a tally of the good and bad I think this is a wonderful place to live. It's not perfect but where is.

When you compare the loss of life here with that of a developed country such as the UK it is shocking. I live in Phuket and it seems that I see or witness an accident almost every day, bikes, cars, buses we get it all. Most are down to driver error, a few to mechanical failure.

I believe other causes fall into basic area ;

Apathy/Ability; Most Thais feel that driving is a simple skill that involves the basic ability to operate the vehicle. Many have no wish to improve their driving skills and if anything believe that the ability to, drive, drive fast, we might say recklessly, and not have an accident is confirmation of their driving ability. For those of us who learnt to drive in the West we know that the ability to drive the vehicle is the most basic part of being a competent driver. The most important part is awareness of our situation. By the use of our mirrors and observation most Western drivers are aware on an almost subconscious level of traffic that is behind us and to either wide, also traffic that was to our side and is now in a blind spot. One other difference is that when looking ahead most Thai drivers will be concentrating on the area immediately in front of their vehicle, as Western drivers we are taught to also be looking 500/1000 metres ahead.

Education; In the West we have a system whereby we are formerly taught to drive by a professional teacher, or a driver with experience and skill who no doubt would have had formal lessons him/herself. We are taught around a set of basic requirements/skills and when we have mastered those are allowed to do a formal test, which is also based on those same basic requirements. If we satisfy the test we are licensed to drive alone, or as some see it to continue our driver training alone with a basic set of minimum safety standards and skills. However over here there is no formal training requirement and skills are learned by experimentation and guesswork. Most Thai drivers are taught by a family member who learned in the same manner. In my opinion this is the route of the problem but since the fine for driving without a licence of is low or it is a very simple process to get a licence, coupled with the fact that drivers believe the ability to drive is no more difficult then riding a pushbike, it will never change. For anyone who doubts this let me mention a few buzzwords that will speak volumes; lane discipline, corner cutting, overtaking on bends and other inn appropriated situations, the list goes on and we all know it. These failings are because the drivers know no better.

Equipment failure is also a big problem here due to lack of maintenance, broken lights, faulty brakes etc.

SDM

Wilcops

"QED"

Are you confirming that I have confirmed my opinion by demonstration of fact or you have ? If it is the former, thank you for being honest, if it is the latter perhaps you should read my later post, a recent article quoted from the Phuket Gazette which truly does confirm my opinion and that of every expat who I know.

Out of interest, do you live in Thailand ? If you do are you in a village, City or tourist area ? Just curious.

SDM

An interesting article in our local newspaper. Interesting because the stats are drawn from our local figures and not compared with other countries. It also represent the opinions of Thais themselves rather than foreign "experts"

" Over 300 people from throughout Southern Thailand yesterday concluded a two-day seminar geared to develop methods to reduce road-traffic deaths.............

“Someone dies in Thailand from a road accident every half an hour. In Phuket, we have one death every three days. That's why it is imperative that we find a way to reduce the death rate,” Dr Thanapong told the Phuket Gazette...............

“We've managed to reduce road deaths from 200 in 2007 to 111 in 2013,” Dr Wiwat said. “We expect to have fewer than 100 road deaths this year.”

The more we know about what causes road accidents, the more we are able to prevent them, Dr Thanapong stressed................

However, one of the most critical things to do is to change how Thais think about accidents, Dr Thanapong said.

Thais have traditionally felt that accidents occur because of bad fortune, or other kinds of mysterious forces. An Assumption University poll showed that 26 per cent of a survey group believed that accidents could not be prevented. "

It's only an extract, the full text is on the Phuket Gazette website for anyone that doesn't get the paper. We can conclude that although the death rate is still high, it would seem to be improving.

SDM

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I don't understand why people who hate Thailand and Thai people and consider this to be one of the most dangerous places on earth (for driving at least) come to this country and waste their time posting in this forum.

Why don't you go back to your own country and find a forum there where you can post about how wonderful it is.

The accidents stats are from an outside source rather than people here that have voiced opinions about how dangerous a place Thailand is too drive.

As someone who has lived in Thailand for many years I think it's fair to say that there are good points and bad points of living here, as with any country. But I think it is also fair and undeniable to say that the general standard of driving here is appalling. It is also clear, from a factual point of view rather than just an an opinion, if these stats are to be accepted, that Thailand is actually one of the most dangerous places in the world to drive.

I

SDM

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The problem with this post is that it is devoid of any critical analysis and simply accepts personal experience as indicative and an illogical/naive interpretation of the stats.

What the significance of this statement is eludes me. "The accidents stats are from an outside source rather than people here that have voiced opinions about how dangerous a place Thailand is too drive." - it simply doesn't make sense. how can stats be from an "outside source"?

Critical analysis ? I'm not qualified to make such an analysis although anyone that actually lives here, or spends any kind of time here who doesn't think it's " fair and undeniable to say that the general standard of driving here is appalling" is quite frankly living in dreamland and I don't mean the amusement park by the same name.

My "personal experience" is not an " illogical/naive interpretation of the stats", it is confirmation of them in so far as I personally see accidents on an almost daily basis, some so serious that must involve some fatality.

To be clear when I say the stats are from an "outside source rather than people here who have voiced opinions about how dangerous a place Thailand is to drive" I mean that the stats are not from the people here on this thread, or on Thai Visa, they are from a source that is independent of Thai Visa, ie an "Outside source", it makes perfect sense to me.

SDM

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I'm not an expert, but once you have an "O" and are getting annual extensions to stay, are further visa runs really required?

No. Once you convert your visa to a marriage visa (it doesn't say that anywhere on the stamp) you don't need to do visa runs, just report to immigration every 90 days, and you are entitled to a work permit.

You have to apply for an extension to this visa every year at a cost of 1900 baht.

SDM

When I used to come here as a tourists I normally visited every third month, for a month. But sometimes on my December trip I would stay for 5 weeks. Being too lazy to get my 30 day tourist visa extended, I would just over stay by a week and pay the fine. This had no impact on subsequent trips and no impact on my subsequent annual visa now I live here.

Don't worry about it.

SDM

1) As far as I am aware the Law does not prohibit the granting of another 30 year lease after the previous one has expired. However it is clear that the Law is specifically designed to prevent a foreigner from having more than a 30 year lease, so the intentional setting up a of structure whereby a new 30 year lead/extension would automatically start at the expiration of the previous 30 year period would seem to be in breach of the spirit of the Law even if it is not specifically prohibited in Law. Until a case comes to Court no one can give a definite indication as to how safe this 30,30,30 year structure is. Anything you see written here or anywhere else is speculation.

2) I have never heard of such a lease structured in this way and it is not in the Landlords (would-be seller) interest to deal with it in this way, ie they want all their money upfront !

2b) Since the idea of these leases is really to circumnavigate Thai land ownership Laws rather than as a landlords leasing investment this situation would not occur. Normally once you have paid for the first lease that is it and some admin fees from the Land Department for the issue of lease extensions.

3) The right to approve/veto the sale of the Lease/Land to any third party and if you sell on the Lease that a new 30 year period ( + + ) will be given to the person you sell on to.

An unpopular view amongst my "brother " agents I am sure, but if you take a lease on a 30 year basis with the promise of two extensions in 30 & 60 years time, only assume that the first 30 year period is completely safe. In the real world of course I must speculate that if a case ever did come to court and a ruling went against the lessee that this would undermine the value of all properties bought in this way in Thailand and stop the flow of lots of inbound foreign currency.

SDM

I suggest that if this your first visit, you contact my good friends at Easy Day Thailand, They can pick you up at the airport and take you to your hotel, or organise one for you.

They specialise in private tours, dive trips , boating , island hopping and are very reasonably priced,

PM me for more info. Enjoy yourself

I can second that, I know the owners quite well professionally and can assure you that you will be fine with them.

If you haven't driven in Thailand before and are just off a long haul flight or connexion I really wouldn't hire a car from the airport as soon as you arrive. There are a few quality car hire companies that I would be happy to recommend in Phuket, otherwise I have used Avis a lot and never a problem, just get all the extra insurance.

One of the chaps made a comment re parking in Patong and it is quite true that only a few of the big hotels have parking. I live in Kathu and rarely take a car into Patong, far too much traffic and idiot tourists riding scooters either very badly or like they are in a race.

SDM

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

I don't understand why people who hate Thailand and Thai people and consider this to be one of the most dangerous places on earth (for driving at least) come to this country and waste their time posting in this forum.

Why don't you go back to your own country and find a forum there where you can post about how wonderful it is.

The accidents stats are from an outside source rather than people here that have voiced opinions about how dangerous a place Thailand is too drive.

As someone who has lived in Thailand for many years I think it's fair to say that there are good points and bad points of living here, as with any country. But I think it is also fair and undeniable to say that the general standard of driving here is appalling. It is also clear, from a factual point of view rather than just an an opinion, if these stats are to be accepted, that Thailand is actually one of the most dangerous places in the world to drive.

I

SDM

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand

Never used it to buy or sell property but have checked it out for prices of property in general.....seem like a pretty good internet site for property sales in Thailand

http://www.ddproperty.com/

This is arguably the best property website in Thailand, I get more hits in this one than any of the others.

SDM

Can we get 4G here ??

There was a conference here in Phuket a month or so ago and one of the officials confirmed that in Phuket we have 2 road deaths every three days. It doesn't surprise me if it's true and apparently this is only deaths that occur at the roadside and does not include subsequent deaths in hospital. Scary stuff.

SDM

I always thought a Richard was a bird, but apparently not, it's something quite different.

SDM

Brits back at it again? Look around especially at fish n chips shops. Hey, Samui is a small island.

Or in a cake shop at about 4.30.

SDM

PS. Or in a Kebab shop at chucking out time...

For some reason, possibly something to do with a gentleman's gentleman area it seems that many visitors check their brains in with their cases when they arrive. They allow themselves to be drawn into things that they would never give a second thought to at home. SDM

C.

PM sent.

SDM

So yes - I have been in contact with a surveying company and they are willing to do it for around 6000 baht - I also read the sticky assessing a condos condition with had lots of good tips in (http://www.thaivisa.com/forum/topic/654322-assessing-a-condos-condition-structure-leakagesetc/).

Has anyone any experience with the property lawyers here? In particular Interactive (www..com) - they were one of the English speaking lawyers that have been recommended to me.

I do know of Siam Legal but the prices they quoted were over double that of Interactive.

C

Happy to recommend if required but I think my choices will be more than you are willing to go if you think Siam are expensive.

I have never heard of this firm but can only advise you that cheap rarely means good. Of course it doesn't mean bad either but if a firm does a good job it doesn't need to be cheap to attract business.

Go with a firm that has been recommended from direct experience of whoever is doing the recommending.

Having said all of that if the condo is a Foreign Freehold under the a Condominium Act it should be quite clear cut. If it involves a lease or series of leases safeguard yourself with a decent lawyer, or better still find another one that is on a Foreign Freehold.

SDM

No idea, but my Ninja definitely prefers 95 pure, even if my wallet doesn't.

High performance engine needs Oct 95 or Oct 98

In Australia we sell Octane 98 at the pumps and that's what all rev heads prefer to use, to prevent pinging, knocking or early detonation.

That has always been my thinking, we can't get 98 over here but in the UK I ran my 911 on 98.

SDM