.png.3b3332cc2256ad0edbc2fe9404feeef0.png)
Virgil
-
Posts
131 -
Joined
-
Last visited
Content Type
Profiles
Forums
Downloads
Posts posted by Virgil
-
-
They now have these two men's DNA profiles and the 'samples' from within the body of the victim. Could anybody tell me if they are matched then that would be conclusive? What I mean is, there is not way that they would be 'made' to match is there? I just didn't like the fact that the PM ordered the police to find the culprits. The police should be doing their utpmost in any case. What would happen if there was no DNA match and the PM had ordered the police to find somebody. A tich up would be very difficult in the UK due to the amount of red tape and proffessional objectivity of those involved but how about Thailand?
DNA testing proticol for criminal investigations is a very thorough process. Governments legislate the process so that it is difficult to question in court. For example, one country that I have lived in ensures that the victim and accused are never at the same address until DNA testing has been completed. Ie: they are interviewed at separate police stations. DNA samples are physically taken from these separate addresses and sent to separate labs. Each lab does not know if it is receiving the sample from the victim or the accused. The results of each sample are sent back to the police who then send these results to an independent expert. Meanwhile, each lab gets the other sample to test and each lab must then report on whether the sample matches the first one or not. The police will have a report from each lab plus the independent report. They must score 3 out of 3.
Not wishing to elaborate too much but, in this particular case, I suspect that the police have been able to get other samples from the victim for testing too - such as pubic hair, skin under fingernails, bite marks on either victim or accused ... I could go on.
In short, it is reasonably safe to say that the Thai police will be making every effort to see that the DNA testing and other forensic evidence is thorough and conclusive. Regrettably, it appears that some of the evidence at the scene was tampered with - such as the note and shoes. As to the confession - remember that statements will have to match the evidence as found. For me, the only question that arises seems to relate to the tides and currents of the area and reports that the body could not have washed up where it did. So, who made that statement and under what authority? Expect a police launch with a dye test in the near future - if it hasn't already been done.
Virgil
Well, I didn't want to spoil everyone's mood about the culprits being found, but the note and shoe thing still don't add up for me. What are the odds that a note left out ends up in a trash bin and her shoes are taken on the night of her murder? Very strange.
But maybe the guy who saw her shoes saw incorrectly, and some early morning cleaning staff removed the note, I dunno.
If these guys are the right guys, I hope they suffer in a miserable hel_l-hole for the rest of their lives.
*edit: If I remember correctly, the guy said first her shoes were gone, and then at 2:30 a.m. or so he saw her shoes outside near the front door. Maybe he was mistaken about the shoes.
Kat,
I don't think the guy ever said that the shoes were inside the bungalow. Please check post #150 in this thread, that's where the quotes originate from.
They now have these two men's DNA profiles and the 'samples' from within the body of the victim. Could anybody tell me if they are matched then that would be conclusive? What I mean is, there is not way that they would be 'made' to match is there? I just didn't like the fact that the PM ordered the police to find the culprits. The police should be doing their utpmost in any case. What would happen if there was no DNA match and the PM had ordered the police to find somebody. A tich up would be very difficult in the UK due to the amount of red tape and proffessional objectivity of those involved but how about Thailand?Hadrian,
To the best of my knowledge, DNA samples can't be messed around with.
If they fit, they're guilty. AFAIK they not only confessed but also the DNA evidence fits them.
What I don't understand, the police claims that the DNA samples ties both of them to the murder but one guy refuses to plead guilty on the rape charge. That doesn't make sense to me.
Limbos,
The DNA sample might be from skin under nails, bite marks, hair, or blood injested by the victim if she bit the accused. The samples might have come from clothing or other personal belongings. The samples might actually prove that one of the accused did not rape the victim at all.
Virgil
Swimming at night with all those sharks, mariners are not that stupidYou're right. The fishermen knew they were safe ..... sharks sleep at night !!!!!!!!
-
Diolch yn fawr i MIB o Cymru
Llugaid am Llugaid
Amen
TRANSLATION
Thank you to the MIB from Wales.
Eye for an eye.
Amen.
Gareth1 !
"An eye for an eye" comes from the Old Testament of the Bible - that part that is shared with the Q'ran. It is the New Testament that separates Christians from Muslims. The New Testament talks of forgiveness. Albeit not without it's consequences.
Virgil
-
good job, it shows what the thai police can do if they get off their asses and put 100% into something.. Its a shame it takes international pressure to make this happen though
What??????????? Are you kidding? The Thai police do as good a job of investigating crime and solving cases as any police force. Most murders in Thailand are solved by police, whether they involve tourists or not. They use DNA testing just like any other police force. In fact, they might use it more ... DNA testing in Thailand is likely to be cheaper than in most western countries.
I'm reminded of a matter in 2004, I think, where two Thai prostitutes were murdered in Darwin, NT, Australia. They were tied up and drowned in a croc infested river. Their bodies were recovered before the crocs got them. It was months before the Australian police pressed charges. There was plenty of international pressure over that one.
I think the Thai police do a pretty good job, especially considering the weather they have to contend with ... every bloody day! I've seen plenty of police in America, UK, Japan, France, Italy ... oh! the Italian Police ... and various countries in Africa, all appearing to be "not-too-busy". But I've also seen police in each of those countries do a fine job. Especially the Thai police.
Congrats to them for catching the bastards who did this. And "poo poo" to police bashing.
===================================================================
Virgil; anyone who actually knows what he/she is talking about (viz. having lived in this Kingdom for a substantial period) will totally agree with you !
It's oh so easy to criticise the Thai Police, but beware, because there's a big difference between "street-cops" and "criminal investigative cops" in this country.
These chaps take their jobs very seriously and are very motivated and highly skilled in the various disciplines of their chosen carreers - ergo; a good many of them have been trained in the US, Canada & OZ.
But hey; don't take it for granted: just try and rob a bank, or something - and see how you go . . . . . . .
My point exactly Jaapfries (this reply is not meant to criticise you, btw). Anyone who understands how policing works will know that your average foot patrol officer is taught three things about murder investigations: 1. Detain everyone at the scene, 2. Dont touch anything, 3. Leave the rest to the specialists. Each police officer is given his position for a reason .... I've lived in Japan, Indonesia, Thailand and Australia and officers are the same in EVERY country. Frankly, on a stinking hot day in Ubon Ratchathani, I can understand why a cop is reluctant to direct traffic during the rich farang S.E. Asian Bicycle Road Race. Pity the poor sod in that charcoal grey uniform.
Regarding unsolved murders in Thailand: Australia averages more than one murder per day, with a population of 20m. How many murders are committed daily in Thailand? To have 2500 unsolved murders is not unrealistic given the size of the population. While certain crimes in Thailand are on the decrease, the fact that Thailand is a thoroughfare for the smuggling of drugs, contraband, prohibited animals and species, as well as people trafficing can't be ignored. These types of crimes lead to an increase in murder rates.
That the police have not completed reports MAY NOT BE unreasonable. I'm reasonably sure that many of the murders involve illegal immigrants - either as victim or purpetrator. Not all, but many. Just look at the issues in the south for example. How many Thai soldiers and police have been murdered down there in the last 2 years? More than one per day on average, if my memory serves me correctly. How many well trained forensic officers does the Thai Police Force have? Not enough, I can assure you.
Virgil
Anyone who has seen these two guys on tv has probably also noticed that they seem very aware of their future.This case has drawn so much international attention that a life sentence is most likely out of question..
A sad ending story for all of the involved.
I agree Iom. Nobody on this earth has the right to take life - not even as a punishment for murder. I would prefer that the be sent to goal for the rest of their life and be required to write the name of their victim on a piece of paper everyday - so they never forget.
Virgil
We probably don't get to know about it untill now when unfortunately these two smugs decide to rape anybody that comes their way and it happened to be Katherine.
In their statement, according to TV 3, they state that they've been watching pron vdo's or dvd's and than decided to go to land and rape somebody.
<deleted> unreal but I'm almost afraid to know how many times this happens with Thai girls.
My thoughts exactly. We also don't know how many times these beasts have already raped and harmed other innocent people, or possible innocent soi dogs, for that matter.
I agree ... but Kat: innocent thai girls are going to conceal what happened and not report it to the authorities for fear of shaming their family. At least you can tell when the innocent soi dogs have been raped - its the odd way they walk and the excessive attention that they pay to their behinds.
On a serious note: I wouldn't be surprised it this has become a sort of "sub-culture" for visiting fisherman in the area - to arrive at night, commit the act and then piss off in their boats. I'd be surprised if it was the first time for those two guys.
Virgil
-
good job, it shows what the thai police can do if they get off their asses and put 100% into something.. Its a shame it takes international pressure to make this happen though
What??????????? Are you kidding? The Thai police do as good a job of investigating crime and solving cases as any police force. Most murders in Thailand are solved by police, whether they involve tourists or not. They use DNA testing just like any other police force. In fact, they might use it more ... DNA testing in Thailand is likely to be cheaper than in most western countries.
I'm reminded of a matter in 2004, I think, where two Thai prostitutes were murdered in Darwin, NT, Australia. They were tied up and drowned in a croc infested river. Their bodies were recovered before the crocs got them. It was months before the Australian police pressed charges. There was plenty of international pressure over that one.
I think the Thai police do a pretty good job, especially considering the weather they have to contend with ... every bloody day! I've seen plenty of police in America, UK, Japan, France, Italy ... oh! the Italian Police ... and various countries in Africa, all appearing to be "not-too-busy". But I've also seen police in each of those countries do a fine job. Especially the Thai police.
Congrats to them for catching the bastards who did this. And "poo poo" to police bashing.
-
never get involved with a bar girl period.
Generally good advice I'd say. If you do at least be realistic about what what you're getting involved in. I don't buy the prevailing notion here that most bar girls are rotten to the core (though plenty are), or that they are prone to violence (small minority). The heavy drinkers seem to be the really crazy ones (what a suprize, goes with the guys too) Bar girls are fine if you want to have a kept women for a while.
Bar girls are in the bars for a reason, and honestly is NOT one of those reasons folks - wake the hel_l UP!Biggest reason: Single motherhood with no decent means of support. This poo may or may not have had a husbund. If so, fantastic odds he's an alcoholic deadbeat, and poo would love to ditch him but is not in a position to.
This is not in itself a cause of lying. I belive bar girls are reasonably honest with me, but then I don't come off as a sucker who's going fall in love with them, or go back to my country and send them money. Maybe speaking fluent thai helps too. As far as I know, I have never had a girl lie to me about having a child (most do). IMO the guys that get lied to are the guys that lie to themselves about who these girls are, and want to be lied to, in some way, by the girls.
If it's not single motherhood, it's family debt, often at usurious interest rates, or they enjoy the bar girl-lifestyle (partying & lots of $) The later two are more likely to be really rotten IMO.
But they all become bar girls looking for a meal-ticket, and that's most likeley what you will remain for the duration of your relationship with a bar-girl.
Sadly, the skidroads to hel_l begin with a very gentle downhill slide. Whatever the reason (and most of them are good) when a girl takes the step to sell out her moral standards and work in a bar she is usually unaware of what she's getting into. Apart from the sudden influx of cash, she has to deal with corruption, bribes, drugs, offers of loans to be paid back at exhorbanent interest rates and keeping the hours of a vampire. Once she starts mixing with the crowd she becomes part of it. Maybe there is more to be said for leaving the child with it's grandmother and working double shifts in a factory .....
-
Just a quick question. Our dog(black lab ) is part of our family . From what I understand she would have to spend a long, long time in quarantine in Australia. Anyone give insight into costs and a time frame ? Like I say she is a member of the family...but if qaurantine is too extreme...maybe finding her a new home in Thailand would be better .
You will have to prove that you've been in a relatioship with this dog. You will need evidence that you supported the dog. Did you feed the dog regularly?
You will also have to prove that your dog isn't a bar dog. Did it sleep around? Or is it faithful. The government takes a dim view of dogs that just sleep around.
Do you have photos? Take them with you. They will probably want to interview the dog too ... in a separate room of course.
Only joking. Expensive exercise ... but well worth it for mans best friend. If the dog is part of your family then you owe it to your dog to spend the money on getting it here. I also believe that you can visit the animal in quarantine.
Cheers
Virg'
-
Guys,i have had some great advise but im a little confused at the moment as i have had conflicting opinions on what to tell the embasy for a tourist visa for my thai g/f...i have been told to tell them that we plan to marry and are using the tourist visa to see how she adapts to australian culture,food,weather,ect.
i have also been told this could back fire in resulting them to refuse the visa..
what are some of youropinions about this.,all i can do is way up the opinions here and hopefuly get through.
the e/mails we sennd to each other also indicate that wew are in a romantic realtinship..would this be exeptable in applying for the tourist visa..
many thanks..
Tell them the truth, the whole truth, and nothing but the truth. What does your girl do for a job? How did you meet? How long has the relationship been going? Met her family? Stayed in her house? All of that. You and her should each write a statement - make sure you have hers translated into english. My gf was here for 3 months for exactly that reason. And we told the embassy that. Still, we needed a lot of supporting evidence. A lot.
Good luck
Virg'
-
I am here wanting to ask some questions and maybe get some answers for our second visit for my g/f to oz..Using 48r form
1 My g/f first got a visa granted in august and stayed about 6 or 7 weeks due to health matters in her family.. Does she need to tell them as to why she went back to Thailand earlier than her 3 months stay? Or does it look good on her application?
2 When we first applied for her visa and i was her sponsor, She had just finished University and since she went back she has not worked, but i have travelled back with her then back again in november , I dont know if becuase she is not working that they will refuse visa? Yes or No ??
3 I have sent money western union and kept my phone records got lots photos and all my relevant documents from first time also some stautory decs from relations who met my g/f
4 Q2 on 48 r form asks to tick either 3 month short stay or long stay !! If she decides to tick long stay more than 3 months and they refuse long stay will they allow short stay? Am i better off just to tick 3 month stay again like last time?
5 On first application my g/f had to graduate in university in january 2006 and i am thinking that they granted her visa on the grounds she will return to Thailand because she has to graduate ?? Now she will have already graduated by the time we apply for second visit to Oz so i am guessing they will want her to show some reason for why she will return to Thailand?? She has 15 Rai of land i know not a huge area but would they look at that document which states she has that land
as a good reason to return?
6 As we are wanting to marry !! Yes marry, We have decided to go to laksi and register for marriage, but as we will be registering for marriage a week b4 applying for visa, would that help our prospects for second visa? Or should we not tell them about registering?
7 Q34 on 48R it states about whether she applied for temporary entry to Australia in last 5 years ? Does she have to complete this section?
8 Her first visa was single entry. Does that make any difference in applying second visit..
Well i hope i have not bored you all with this but i am wanting to prepare any other documents and making sure everything will be ok and pass.. We dont want to b/s about visa same as first visa..
Thanks and i wait for some answers to any or all the above questions..
Cheers tinytot
Tinytot,
You really should have a meeting with a lawyer. You can do the application yourself, but a lawyer specialising in Thai immigration would be able to give you the most accurate assistance with your questions. Check Thai-Oz News newspaper. A few advertise there.
Cheers
Virg'
-
Tinytot,
Bring your girl to Oz for a holiday. Make sure she goes home in time. Don't apply for any further visa's here. Her second visa will most likely have a "No further stay" condition on it. Simply, it means she can't apply to extend her visa while she is here.
If you want to marry her, propose and get engaged here. Then send her home. Marry in Thailand and THEN apply for a spousal visa. It will take about 6 months or more.
Evidence that you have been supporting her is good. Although it goes against my personal belief. Immigration will want to know why she doesn't have a job. She should get a job immediately and start changing her life. Don't stand for any bull shit about not being able to find a job. There are jobs around in retail etc. that she can do.
This link will help you with information about visas http://www.austembassy.or.th/visas/index_eng.php
If you are contemplating a future together, download Booklet 1, Partner Migration from this link. http://www.immi.gov.au/allforms/books_migrate.htm
Get yourself a good immigration lawyer. I can recommend a couple if you like.
Good luck.
Virg'
-
Hi FlySti,
1. I've done what you want to do. I brought my fiance to Sydney for 3 months. Even though we had evidence of a relationship spanning more than 12 months we almost didn't get the visa. She has a degree and works for a large resort company. She chats on line with my parents and friends. After 3 trips to thailand the Embassy was still reluctant to give us the visa.
2. Here is the link to her uni http://chula.ac.th/cuweb_en/directories/index.html Find her course and check that her degree actually exists. I presume you have her full name and residential address. Contact the department via email and confirm she is a student there. Things will either stack up or stories will start to lead you to more questions. Do your homework. Even my fiance would tell you to be careful.
3. Good thai girls are exactly that. Don't expect to sleep with them. Don't even expect to kiss or hold hands on a date or even in public. Get a book called Culture Shock Thailand and learn about customs. When you meet her family Wai and offer the appropriate greetings. Don't talk about wanting to spend time alone with your girl. Don't talk about sex. Don't talk up your job or the amount of money you earn.
4. Don't give or send money. My fiance has friends who scam money from guys over the internet. They openly tell me that they love these guys but can't choose one yet. Never give or send money. Never. The girl is not your financial responsibility. However, when you go to meet her, by all means take a small gift for her and members of her family. Read SMALL. No need to buy gold or jewellery on your first trip.
5. Play it cool. If this means you've got to jerk off in the shower every morning before you see her then do it. But play it cool.
6. Don't stand for "thai culture" when they ask you to pay for something or do something. My standard line was "If you want thai culture marry a thai man." The whole thing just went away.
7. Do not marry for at least 10 years. You're 18. You should have 3 or 4 girls before you settle for the right one. Try an Aussie or 2 as well.
8. Don't get into a relationship with someone you feel sorry for, think you can give a better life, or pity. Don't feel guilty if you break up for these reasons. Don't fall for "my cousin is in hospital" or "my aunty had a heart attack and we need money". Walk away.
I'm in Sydney, so we can't meet. I will be marrying in Thailand next March. My parents, sister, brothers, and about nine friends have all booked to come. I think I have one of the few success stories. But in the past, I have had trouble with thai girls ... even a little with the girl I'm marrying. Mostly, it's cultural. But you still need to stand your ground.
If you would like to chat more please fee free to send me a private message and give me your email details. Most importantly, expect to be in a relationship for a year or more before you even consider bringing a Thai girl to Australia. That's the truth.
Good luck
Virg'
-
Good luck, I think the farang/thai divorce rate is close to 100% and that's not bar girls. The worst thing you could do is take her back home with you. You would be lucky to last a year.
What a truly STUPID post. My wife and i have been in the uk for over 3 years and married for 4. I have met a few Brits who are married to Thai girls and most of them have been in the U.K for 4 years upwards. So unless you know the facts i suggest you shut up making stupid comments like the one above.
Ditto mate ... I am sure divorce rates are quite similar all over the western world ... regardless of race or class ... and ... put ya hand up if you were once married to a farang girl ... only to get divorced?!
Virg' raises his hand !!!
-
Never pay a dowry. If the girl truly loves you, she will agree not to pay her parents to mary you. Now you might have to pay some loans that your future wife has outstanding, but a dowry to mom or dad is just another way the family has in extorting money from you.
But this is costum of Thai u should be honour her , if you love her
Impossible Me ..... you are brilliant ... it is western custom that the father of the bride pay for the wedding ... I will ask her parents to pay for everything ... because I know that she honours me so much too ... absolutely brilliant idea, Impossible Me .... why didn't I think of that before?
Virgil
-
Hi Impossible Me
Thanks for your reply .... no .... I am not clear about what will happen in the wedding process. If you have time, it would be good to know about this.
Cheers
Virgil
hi virgil i think ae's mom want to Ae is happy in her life , The dowry isn ot expensive for you and Ae's mom will pay back after you will get wedding Ae's ... and you should have a guide for converse wiht her mom > i called him / her is matchmaker < it is meaing somebody who converse about marry with Ae's parents >in the case wedding that prepare trees banana , clothing < for recive to pay respect Ae's family , fruits, dowry and procession of the groom's parents < started near groom 's home > ,friends for dance thai and shoout out for joyed
after u will converse wiht Ae's parents u will get marry her> oh forget , before u will find ur 's groom u will pay goden door and silver door < friends ' groom will seperate goden door and silver door>
i dont know u will pay for Ae's i think if u fallen in love her and be happy wiht her shoud u do ? and u will be happy wiht your marry
Where are u ? Are u clear >> i advice you coz i am Thai gal and learn english bussinees too >>> Are u clear about thai cultural ?
Can i help u i am delighted for you and every friends
Impossible_me
-
No slacker ... I haven't given up on you ... or the girl
Ae is back in Thailand at Uni after living with me for 3 months. She loves OZ. My family really like her ... especially my parents and my two nieces. She seems to fit right in with the family and enjoys Sydney.
She was bored in English class .... her English is better than the other students ... really, it is good enough for her to work.
Now she is back in Thailand and going crazy ... we talk about 2 hours everyday. I think things are going to work out ....
Still wrestling with the dowry ..... but her mother has said the balance will be returned.
Keep you posted ....
Virgil
Where is Virgil?He has given up on us if not on the girl!
-
UPDATE:
Ae has been here for 3 months and is in love with Oz .... just went back to Uni last month. Her mother has said that the cost of the wedding would be taken from any dowry and the rest returned .... I'm skeptical .... but listening ....
We are now pursuing the engagement party etc.
Virg'
Just a few thoughts that hopefuly arent too much of a ramble.Maybe worth thinking from the parents side.
The Parents worked hard to put her thru uni??
How old are they?
Are there other useful brothers or sisters to help look after them?
Thai parents invest in their kids so they can take over the business if wealthy or look after them in old age.
Whipping the daughter off to OZ may be upsetting to them.
Get AE over to aust for three mths and dont marry her!
See if she can genuinely cope with living here.
If you are in Sydney need help with meeting some thai gals for her to som tam with here let me know.
My lady knows heaps ,and has one sister here and has had one other sister visit recently....she didnt like it ,they love it and would never go back to thailand.
Talk thru with AE these family expectations,dowry sure ,but dont forget you will be seen as wealthy falang ,make sure you set expectations up front regarding ongoing money back home,the requests WILL come.
Spend the three mths ,let her go home,and think about things,you need to cool off and think about things too.
Sure lovely to look at,great sex,but do you have a real connection?
What will she do if she comes back to stay?
DO you ,Does she want kids?
The more work you put in up front the easier it will be..
Finally the visa.
Keep records of everything now
Phone calls
Emails
Photos
You will need to show about 6 mths or more to make the ghouls at oz embassy happy.
7. Shouldn't they consider that I do all the travelling, and will have to pay for Ae to come to Oz, and future trips, phone bills and the like? Doesn't this enter into the equation at all?
A bit about me: 38, fit, professional with my own business, house and car. Never planned to meet a Thai girl ... it just happened. Not supporting Ae financially, except for when she arrives her for three months. Married before. Divorced 5 years ago.
Virg'
I often asked myself the same question when I was married over 4 years about the wifes family considering all the other things I must be responsible for. The answer is yes, they should consider it but resoundingly do not!
By the way, why did you feel the need to tell us you were fit? How does this enter into your discussion at all?
Quote from Britmaveric:
Personally doweries are a waste of time. I guess the bigger question is how would your prospective fiance feel about no dowery? (deal breaker or would she care less?)
Dowery is normally a face thing to show the village, and should be returned, but you never know. The idea kind of reminds me of buying property and that isnt what love is about.
End quote.
Here, here Brit. I am totally in agreement with you on your comment
-
MMmmmm...Fly into town? well that narrows it down a bit
I really do not want to sound like a bucket of cold water...and I guess my views are known to others here....and I have stuck my scrawny neck out here into your business, which is none of mine...but you did ASK!!
I would like, for the most part, to wait and see what any one else has to say.....
But.....what would I do now?...I would not have known how to do it 15 years ago......I came to Thailand a complete novice...it took me 10 years to meet my wife and in so doing I had to progress from Patong Bar Girls to Chinese Hi-So and back to the Thai Middle Class.....
Really truthful summary of what you have here...you know lots more than I/We do..you now just let slip the bit about alcoholic relatives...this is a common problem.with Issan poor...but should not be so with teachers........
I would for a start ask myself reality questions about everything I thought was important...ie Do I actually, with evidence, know the truth......and of course you can add Do I Care!?
It sounds to me as you go on that you are in the classic Issan dilemma...you met a girl you think is fantastic; you have not the slightest clue about the reality of her and her family's life..except what they tell you, allow you to see..and what you thought you saw or heard.....and wish to think.
If you were her..you would sound like a dream come true....
Without wishing to be brutal...the daughter of Issan teachers sleeping..was she? or even being the 'boyfriend' ..with an..one??.. American when she was 19..is not good news for you unless she has a VERY plausible explanation...being 'liberal' definitely does not count.....then move on...If she had a US boyfriend..and the parents knew...she is in Issan Bride Price Terms...Used Goods...which makes 600,000 even more loopy
Guess you hoped this was simple?!
Take care
S
Yes mate, your points are valid. Re: fly into town. Yes, the guy still lives in BKK ... he might very well be reading or even contributing to this topic. Who knows?
Your comments don't offend. The point of the topic is to learn what other people think. And what they've experienced. If I had a cry everytime someone tells me what they think where would I be?
Yes, the alcoholic relatives .... they're not teachers. Ae's family prefers to steer clear of that. They rarely drink and no one in the family smokes. A lot of Ae's relatives are farmers ... when they're not working they are smoking or drinking, it seems.
Yes again ... I believe that what I've seen is the truth. Even with regard to Ae's past relationship. Ae has told me all about it. Her mother knows as well. She had mentioned briefly on the internet that she never met the guy and didn't like him. I often chat with Ae's mother on the internet ... especially when Ae and her are having an argument.
Do I care that she's not a virgin? No. Would I care if she had been a bar girl or something? Yes. Certainly. But then, let me tell you a little personal truth: I married my childhood sweetheart who I'd known since I was 14 .... she left me for a guy with a fatter wallet after 8 years of marriage. A friend of mine met a girl on a Contiki cruise 12 years ago. He was 7 years older than her. She was 20. They spent 21 days together then he was back in Sydney. A month later she moved up from Melbourne and they married 3 months after that. 4 years later, when she was pregnant with their first child, he learned that she had worked in a classy brothel in Melbourne for 18 months .... seems that the past always catches up with you, doesn't it? .... They are still happily married, with 3 kids. It took him some time to get his head around it ... but now he laughs and says that he always wondered why the sex was so good.
Just to emphasise: NO, I would drop a gogo girl, bar girl or working girl like a hot potato .... not for me. I doubt Ae is any of those.
Back to the dowry .... 600,000 is loopy. It won't happen. Ae has already told me this. We are working on it.
Finally, yes, I had hoped this would be simple ... what ever happened to 2 sheep and a goat?
Cheers
Virg
-
Just a quickie...More later
600,000B is loopy, no not loopy...on another planet..........
How on earth did she come up with that figure?
Gets worse....
About the cousin...and then the farang boyfriend.....there is no such thing as a middle class ie teacher parents/liberal, university educated Thai Girl with farang boyfriends in 1993.....1993..I don't think you ever said how old she is....I would like someone else's view on that!?
Without revealing all or anything...maybe which Jangwat are we in? With a University? What is a degree in Business English? Ho Hum!? Not on offer at ANU, or Monas, I fear I think you should go back to square one.....and save on the phone bills.
Don't get me wrong...all power to love and you...but sounds like you are in the wood!
Do not move without the Expat Daddies' permission!!!!
My mistake ..... farang boyfriend was 2003 ... it was too late at night for me. Ae is only 21. He was American. Used to fly into town every few weeks.
Yes, I think 600,000 is crazy. I won't stand for it. I was going to write to her mother and negotiate directly with her. I was going to suggest 50,000 for the wedding and 50,000 bride price. Ae told me that her brother-in-law paid 200,000 and that her mother gave most of it back. I thought that if they need to show face they can borrow some of their own money to make themselves look good .... is this unreasonable on my part?
OK, I'd like some comments about the social ladder in Thailand, if I could. Ae's parents are both primary school teachers. She claims they are important in the town and that everyone can know them. Therefore they must have face if I am to marry their daughter. Is this true? Important?
Yes, I am in the wood ... and that's why I'm talking to all you "expat daddies".
I was going to write to her mother and propose the above 50,000/50,000 ... along with 10,000 per month once Ae starts work and to continue for as long as we can aford .... along with one trip to Oz for her mother each time a baby comes along and one trip for Ae's youngest sister to study here for a year ... in about 4 years time. I thought that is a more appropriate dowry than paying a huge sum of money that Ae's aunts and uncles are going to piss up a wall ..... they all drink whisky like water.
Any other thoughts?
Dump the girl? Mate, I am in love. I think Ae is too. It is now about 10 days since she's talked with her mother .... but then, that might all be part of the game, right?
Please comment, all and sundry
Virg'
-
I recently saw a message in another forum how the guy saves about 10 dollars australian by travelling by bus from bkk airport to Pattaya.
When i go to Thailand i spend around 1200 baht on a cab to Pattaya,about $35 australian.I decided to try the bus last time i went to Thailand to save money.
The instructions i followed weere take a taxi to Morchit ,which costs me around 320 baht,then wait there about 1 hour and paid 120 baht for a bus whick continually stopped all the time.
So i saved about 700 b about $27 dollars aussie but took 3 times as long to get to Pattaya on a hot crowded bus not to mention the 2 motorbike taxis i had to hire for 50 b each one to carrry my luggage to hotel and the other me when the bus stopped on the highway at Pattaya. Was it worth it? No!
Then i met a Scottish expat who wanted to give me thrift tips on how he saved money in Thailand.He bought 5 youghurts at 8 baht each from friendship supermarket and ate these thru out the day spending nly 40 baht a day on food.
How many of youse are scrooges and cheap charlies like this?
When i come to Thailand for my 7 days holiday every 3 months i want to enjoy myself.No more hot buses to go to Pattaya.
I mean i even was on a baht bus last November and this irish guy starts arguing withe baht bus driver that his fare should be 5 baht not 10 baht?
Cant belive it? Are you out to save every penny when on holidays,are you one of these scrooges? I mean its ok to be thrifty and not waste money but worrrrrying about 700 baht extra by cab to pattaya and putting up with a hot bus to save it is bloody ridiclous.
I'm with you billyboy .... when I come to thailand I stay out in the sticks with my girl's family ... it only costs me about 100bt per day ... even when I go shopping for the family meal ... then Ae and I go to BKK and live it up for a few nights at the Shangri-La .... they'll even wipe your arse for you there ... for a price. Ae loves it. AND SO DO I ..... er ..... not the arse wiping bit .... more kinda the living it up bit ....
Virg'
-
I don't get so embarrassed in Thailand... but here in Greece? "I wan discown." Then the vendor frowns... and I say, "No, it's ok babe, that's the pirce."
Just goes to show you .... you can take the girl out of Thailand but you can't take Thailand out of the girl.................
-
the silly Swiss bloke with a silly fat mouth ?
His web site, colourful as it was, disappeared over a year ago. It got me so excited about Thailand and Bangkok that I looked for a Thai girl on match.com ... and found one ... now I'll never have any fun in BKK ...
-
I did not read this before....I think you need to really wise up...You don't just marry a girl in Thailand..you marry her family...there will always be an issue, at least because of the difference in Incomes, about your role as a 'supporter of the family'.If you marry and then she has work and Ae has money of her own she will feel obligated to support her family to some extent.
And this thing about your money...in Thailand you can go into a restaurant and ask the boss how much she pays in rent, how much she earns, how much she takes a day...it is normal....no secrets about ordinary money like in Oz, UK.
Sure mate ... Ae and I have already discussed this. I accept the Thai way of life. No matter where we live I am prepared to go 50/50 with cultural issues. We plan to send money back every month. At this stage, around 10,000bt ... I think that is pretty reasonable.
Also, any year we don't fly to Thailand we will pay for someone (family or friend) to fly to OZ for a holiday. Especally if/when we have children. I expect to have the mother-in-law in town for around 3 months.
I don't have any problem with these things. They are fair in my eyes.
-
I think you have got some good advice!
Particularly as she is an ordinary person..ie not bar girl..as a lot of stuff here relates to, I am sure you should proceed as though she was an Oz girl or whoever you met and liked. Surely you must spend a lot more time together to know each other?
But there are some complicating factors for you, her and the family.
You could get married in Oz and that would sort the legal bit...and then if you/she want a Thai ceremony that is fine and you would not need to go to the Amphur to register the marriage etc.
If the parents are teachers in a small town they probably do think they need to preserve face....if there are other farang married to girls in the town, were they bar girls..the parents wouuld want to distance themselves from that.
We are not talking dowries..we are talking bride-price 'kha sin sort'. The price quoted is probably about right. In gold, and yes should for the most part be returnable..it is not that much and if it was clear you were giving most of it to Ae..good.
What is Mama's proposal...you don't say?
Also when you stayed in Issan..where did you stay...were you sleeping with Ae...if so the family will know and will think you should be paying..honouring a commitment...
Read Chris Lyttleton's Chapter ..Changing The Rules: Shifting Bounds of Adolescent Sexuality in Thailand..in Jackson,P.A and Cook, N.M Silkworm Books Chiang Mai 1999
But caveat emptor!! and you are making a purchase in Thai eyes, because however much love marriage is still a matter of material support, often for an extended number of people, in rural Thailand.
You must be absolutely sure there are no Thai boys hanging around, let alone farang...that requires more than 6 weeks in Issan and 3 months in Oz....
And no...western culture..what is that? Expenses?..Your choice!
Also few 'good' Thai girls would start, let alone go that far down the Internet!
I could go on....Good Luck!
Yes, please, do go on..... We are spending as much time together as we can. If telephone and internet (webcam) count, it is running at 3 hours per day. When I was in Thailand I stayed in Ae's room, with her. Everyone in the town knows that we're sleeping together. I talked with her parents about this on the first evening. They said it was up to Ae.
I don't want to get married in OZ .... she has always wanted a Thai wedding and I'm happy with that.
Her mother's proposal .... 600,000bt. To cover everything, including the expenses of the wedding. This seems like an aweful lot to me. Any comments?
Yes, her cousin met a farang while working in BKK .... the family is reluctant to talk about her cousin's job in BKK .... I sort of put 2 and 2 together, but have kept it to myself.
"Also few 'good' Thai girls would start, let alone go that far down the Internet!" .... ok, enlighten me here ... do you think Ae might have spent time in "the wrong profession"? She is certainly "liberal" and admits to having had a farang boyfriend in 1993. I'd like to know your thoughts on girls on the internet etc.
Cheers
Virg
-
i am gonna do the sending the flowers to work trick. Can anyone recommend any good places in Bkk that offer a reliable service?
Hi Sarpedon,
I have used www.flowers2thailand.com about 6 times in the last year. Delivery has been perfect - every time. Prices start at around 1000bt. I am in Australia, so it seems pretty reasonable to me.
Oh shucks, you Casanova, you!!!
Cheers
Virg'
-
some of whom have already expressed an interest in what I do, what I earn and what I own.
This is normal for people to ask you.... even if they aren't relatives. Wouldn't you make inquiries if a close family member was in the same position?
cv
No. I wouldn't ask what people earn. I wouldn't ask about mortgage repayments, insurance, investments, cost of the car, what my business turns over and how much tax is paid .... and I don't tell people those things either. I'm happy to talk about the actual work I do, describe the house I live in, the colour of my car (silver) and the fact that I believe it is wise to have private health cover. But that's about it.
Virg'
Thailand News
in Koh Samui, Koh Phangan, Koh Tao
Posted
Right Patsycat,
As time goes on you will find more pieces of the jigsaw start to fit into place. I can assure you that investigators are eager to have the story straighened out. The problem is, the fishermen's story of a random drunken event without planning doesn't match the evidence. Let me put this scenario to you:
2 men watch a porno and agree that the WILL find a girl and rape her. They motor the boat closer to shore - in a different position to where it was in the morning. The swim/wade into shore - say 50m, intent on finding a victim. They see a western girl - just like the one in the porno (perhaps) and they grab her. But she's bigger, stronger, more confident than your average Thai girl. She screams, struggles and fights back. 2 guys have never had this happen before (maybe they are in the habit of raping girls from small coastal villages). They panic. They hit the victim until she is unconcious and do what the intended to do (at least one of them does). Now they have a body instead of a shy Thai girl who would normally run away. They don't know what to do about it. They drag it back out into the water. Maybe drag it down the other end of the beach or something or move their boat. I'm only speculating ... but does this better fit the evidence as found?
Virgil
Yes Lisa,
This is correct. There will also be anti-rejection drugs in the body and/or antibodies attacking the foreign tissue. It is very easy to check for this in a standard blood test.
Virgil
gburns57au,
I'm glad someone else here knows a little about DNA testing.
Virg'
A trial will still proceed in order to establish the facts for the record, including motive, premeditation, etc. A trial will still proceed to establish that the confession is real. Rules of evidence still apply. The confession is but one piece of evidence.