aimbc

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/asia/thailand/11313714/Koh-Tao-murders-suspects-in-killing-of-David-Miller-and-Hannah-Witheridge-say-they-were-framed.html

Prosecution documents seen by The Telegraph allege the two men “repeatedly smashed and chopped Mr Miller's face and head many times, which resulted in his death”.

They are then alleged to have beaten Ms Witheridge until she was unconscious before raping her. Finally the men “smashed and chopped” her head with a hoe in order to kill her and cover up her sexual assault and Mr Miller’s murder.

His head wasn't smashed was it?

I thought he was drowned too?

Who was restraining Hannah at this gruesome point, or was she waiting politely?

How does smashing splitting her skull almost in two cover up a sexual assualt?

Are these guys the strongest Hobbits on record?

What a complete ant utter sham!!!

"How does smashing splitting her skull almost in two cover up a sexual assualt?"

It leaves no witnesses, for both the rape and the, murder of Miller.

As for the strength of the accused men, you could try an experiment, find some similarly built men and ask them to hit you in the head with a blunt object, a garden hoe or a bottle, as hard as they can... how do you think you'd fare?

Smashing her skull will NOT cover up a sexual assault as has been proven in this very case! Did you fall asleep?

Re. the hoe and bottle: Well it would seem he wasn't hit with either of those !

Do you work for the Thai Police because you certainly sound and act like one of them! You know, like making stupid things up as you go along without thinking things through!

People that say David was hit with a hoe or a bottle like the pancake translator said are not sane, they are insane. Even the "early" RTP recognized that and pointed out a fight and wounds on his knuckles. On top of that the pictures of David his wounds, which are clearly to see on a certain FB page, show beyond any doubt multiple stab wounds. This fact alone will blow away the prosecutors case if they stick to their hoe theory. I am a 100% convinced they were from wannabe bad boy push knifes with one of the attackers being left handed. I heard Mon & NS are both left handed........coincidence?

Punches.jpg

What do you think the possibility of a UK coroner report will be made available to the defense team? I wonder if it would provide an analysis of the wounds and what possible weapons could have made those wounds. I agree with you, the hoe or bottles could not have possibly made such an incision.

'We are victims of influential people.'

They said.

Good to hear it from the horses mouths.

Hmmm, They say they were drunk and have no idea who killed the pair. How could they know they are victims of influential people.

If you believe them, and I do, they know are being set up (they are innocent). There are not too many logical explanations that lack influential people pulling strings for whatever reason (note island mafia protecting others is one theory, but not the only one).

Remember, this is a translation and it may be lost in translation. I would like to offer that we look at the overall context of the situation.

• The island is run by corrupt cops. Which means they have confirm that first. One of it is by proving that migrants workers who are there without papers had to pay off the police in order to stay. That is source of influential people.
• There are so many illegals there that it's obvious that labor force is needed because the business owners require it. And I would go even further that family members or friends connected to the business owns these businesses. This is another source of influential people.
• The police can't be directly connected to the business owners for providing illegal labors, so steps in the Mafia. The mafia are the middle man in this illegal transaction. This is another influential people.

But at the end, everyone wins on the island, but as overall, Thailand looses. But that is another topic all together. These influential people are so influential, that the government has not done their cleanup duty on the island yet. How can there be so many illegals working there, and their allegation of paying the police a monthly fee to work there. Has there been any encroachment issue with public lands (or is this island rented out?) The current military has successfully reclaimed some of the public lands back, they should do so here. But there are enough influential people to stop all inquiry from happening.

I think these influential people need to be demote them from that status, then witness will start to talk.

But I am not sure how or if that can be done. But somehow, getting to these people would be the first step to minimizing the intimidation.

UPDATE as of 5:04 PM

• Andy Hall ‏@Atomicalandy 4m4 minutes ago

  Just spoke Wei Phyo/Zaw Lin in court. Both smiled innocently as usual, said 9 months in prison is a very long time for them. But seem strong

• Andy Hall ‏@Atomicalandy 19m19 minutes ago

  Prosecution witness hearings set as 8th July to 28th August 2015. Defense witness hearings set as 1st September to 25th September 2015.

• Andy Hall ‏@Atomicalandy 22m22 minutes ago

  Koh Samui court sets full witness hearing dates in Koh Tao case trial: 8th July to 25th Sept 2015. Total 18 days of witness hearings.

• Andy Hall ‏@Atomicalandy 57m57 minutes ago

  Zaw Lin/Wei Phyo both replied strongly to the judge's question: 'We really don't know. We were drunk, just went back home. We know nothing.'

• Andy Hall ‏@Atomicalandy 58m58 minutes ago

  Koh Samui court head judge just asked both Zaw Lin and Wai Phyo: 'If u not involved in this crime, tell us who is. Don't be scared.'

I am grateful to see people are active in search for the truth, by discussing it here on this forum and other social media. I believe it is a revolution of some sort. Social issues will never be buried as it had in the past.

I am glad to see that there are people out there who cares about humanity and do not stand idle by and let our brothers and sister perish needlessly.

How ever effective this social media is, we have yet to learn. But at least it's able to pressure all government to look into the police statement.

I believe if this social action did not occur, the two would not have the courage to fight the allegations. And I am truly grateful that many decided not to wait till the trial started.

I think a lot of people raised great views which may have helped convince the Myanmar government to back the two. And most importantly gave courage to the two to fight. And I will continue to fight, as I want to bring the murders to accountability.

@Atomicalandy Zaw Lin/Wei Phyo words today: 'before we had no chance to prove our innocence, we are victims of influential people'

Did they say who this influential people are?

Just be patient we will get to the bottom of this......

Koh Samui court sets full witness hearing dates in Koh Tao case trial: 8th July to 25th Sept 2015. Total 18 days of witness hearings.

What I have said over and over again is that I want to see how the evidence stands up to scrutiny in court, and in the meantime I take a stand about people that spread speculation based on at best third hand accounts, partial information, conflicting reports, outright misinformation and not a small dose of prejudice.

If you believe in that, then can you tell me that you honor the claim of the two defendants that they were tortured and force to plead guilty. You need to give it as much weight as the police. They never receive the justice, as the police refuses to answer to the human rights people. And this is very relevant, as it will change the course of the police investigation. If found to be true. Remember, the law needs oversight as well. You can never surrender your rights and freedom to the government. They must be held accountable. But RTP would like to stay above the law. If they didn't do such a thing, they have nothing to be scared of. Migrant workers are guest to Thailand. They come to do work that Thais do not want to do. Everyone should be thankful for that, in any country. We should never be prejudice against them.

Use your logic this time and tell me, why the police refuse to answer these allegation with the human rights people? So going into trial with the police having an unfair advantage is not a trial. These are things that makes everything stink about the whole investigation.

Logic says that they have not gone to trial, so they are not guilty. If they not guilty, then they the proper respect of any human being. And that is what I believe and that is what I am advocating here, along with everyone who believes in saving humanity. Because it's worth saving.

If it takes speculation as you call it, but I call it putting it to theory. Even police investigation starts with speculation. The what ifs. As we have here, and add it all up, the probability of some of the speculation appears to be high. But since no one has access to key evidence or question it, it will appear to be speculation. But it doesn't mean that it's not valid. Just that it hasn't been proven yet. And with all the speculation, there is bound to be one that can stand on it's own.

• My speculation, is that wounds on the male victim can not have been from just the hoe. So it's not probable that these two murdered the two.
• My speculation is that the two victims did not have intimate relationship with each other on the beach, as they are hardly seen together that night. Even from the CCTV footage.
• My speculation is that the two in jail, did not get so excited to need to grab a hoe to raped and kill the two victims.
• My speculation is that the male victim did not fight the two accused off, as they don't even have any marks on them.
• My speculation is that the entire investigation will look quite weak and will be thrown out. Then the police will blame each other for their incompetence and that everyone will just forget about this as they know nothing ever changes. And the killer will still be on the loose because the crime scene was so contaminated. And that was the idea in the first place to contaminate it so that they can protect the killer.
• My speculation is that the killer is well connected enough for the police to protect them.

The Burmese claimed they were threatened with torture, it's not the same as being tortured. Besides that they also confessed to the crime to a Myanmar delegation and the Human Rights Commission, did they torture them into confession too?

In any case if they were tortured that doesn't make them innocent, it means there are two cases to answer for, the murder of the two British tourists and the torture allegations; furthermore confessions are not the deciding factor in a case, physical evidence is the most relevant.

You speculations and conspiracy theories bore me, come back when you have anything to back them up.

Everything is relevant, even allegation of abuse can turn in to reality. Police made mistakes where false announcements. And you forgive their stupidity.

When this two get threaten with their lives, you are hanging on to their confession. This is why inquiry needs to happen. But it hasn't. They are innocent. What is your logical I opinion.

You are so weak. Please continue to defend the police as you believe these two are guilty. I will continue to defend them. Because they have not been found guilty. I will make sure the world never forgets. I am glad at least you read it. Thanks.

Another poster found this interesting comments from Met Police.

BBC News at approx 01:01:48

Met police Confusions and inconsistencies

http://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/b04ttl5c

Thanks...this is good development.

Porntip, who is director-general of the Central Institute of Forensic Science, told the Manager news agency that the investigation into the murders of Hannah Witheridge, 23, and David Miller, 24, on Koh Tao in Thailand’s Surat Thani province, was weak and the results not fully trustworthy as police did not involve forensic specialists at the crime scene.

She added that since the police force handled the investigation on their own, the Thai public doubted the outcome of the case.

http://www.irrawaddy.org/burma/respected-thai-forensics-specialist-criticizes-koh-tao-murder-investigation.html

This is a very damning statement about the investigation. But as we know if it's in front of a jury, it may help to sway the defendant case. But I heard Thailand do not have a jury system. Does anyone know how the defense using that to their advantage? I hope they can as I feel the same way that the investigation was less than transparent.

What I have said over and over again is that I want to see how the evidence stands up to scrutiny in court, and in the meantime I take a stand about people that spread speculation based on at best third hand accounts, partial information, conflicting reports, outright misinformation and not a small dose of prejudice.

If you believe in that, then can you tell me that you honor the claim of the two defendants that they were tortured and force to plead guilty. You need to give it as much weight as the police. They never receive the justice, as the police refuses to answer to the human rights people. And this is very relevant, as it will change the course of the police investigation. If found to be true. Remember, the law needs oversight as well. You can never surrender your rights and freedom to the government. They must be held accountable. But RTP would like to stay above the law. If they didn't do such a thing, they have nothing to be scared of. Migrant workers are guest to Thailand. They come to do work that Thais do not want to do. Everyone should be thankful for that, in any country. We should never be prejudice against them.

Use your logic this time and tell me, why the police refuse to answer these allegation with the human rights people? So going into trial with the police having an unfair advantage is not a trial. These are things that makes everything stink about the whole investigation.

Logic says that they have not gone to trial, so they are not guilty. If they not guilty, then they the proper respect of any human being. And that is what I believe and that is what I am advocating here, along with everyone who believes in saving humanity. Because it's worth saving.

If it takes speculation as you call it, but I call it putting it to theory. Even police investigation starts with speculation. The what ifs. As we have here, and add it all up, the probability of some of the speculation appears to be high. But since no one has access to key evidence or question it, it will appear to be speculation. But it doesn't mean that it's not valid. Just that it hasn't been proven yet. And with all the speculation, there is bound to be one that can stand on it's own.

• My speculation, is that wounds on the male victim can not have been from just the hoe. So it's not probable that these two murdered the two.
• My speculation is that the two victims did not have intimate relationship with each other on the beach, as they are hardly seen together that night. Even from the CCTV footage.
• My speculation is that the two in jail, did not get so excited to need to grab a hoe to raped and kill the two victims.
• My speculation is that the male victim did not fight the two accused off, as they don't even have any marks on them.
• My speculation is that the entire investigation will look quite weak and will be thrown out. Then the police will blame each other for their incompetence and that everyone will just forget about this as they know nothing ever changes. And the killer will still be on the loose because the crime scene was so contaminated. And that was the idea in the first place to contaminate it so that they can protect the killer.
• My speculation is that the killer is well connected enough for the police to protect them.

Just wondering, were the two Britain's ever seen walking together in any the video? Like they had a romantic interested in each other?

I am sure their friends can confirm whether they were interested in each other. All I see that night from the cctv footages that they were walking around with two different group of people. If they were somehow attracted to each other, wouldn't we see them walking together with each other? Does any one have video of that?

It appears the murders watched to many Hollywood movies about loose foreign women and think that the two went to the beach for a one night stand. So they staged it that way. So the whole confession about the 2 Burmese getting worked up, and the reason for their crime maybe something the police force them to say. Crime scene investigation is all about the highest probable scenario. From there you can follow the trial.

JTJ and others of the 'Gang of 4' (jdinasia, Balo and AleG) are going to vehemently challenge any hint of evidence that Nomsod was one of the perps of that crime. The fact remains that he was a prime suspect initially, he avoided police for a week, he avoided a DNA test for several weeks, until it was assured that his DNA wouldn't match the DNA from the victim. Of course it's questionable whether the DNA labeled 'from Hannah' is really what it claims to be. We're waiting for independent British verification of the DNA trail, but the Brits don't have all the DNA samples (Thai officials won't share with them), and the Brits have shown that they're adverse to rocking the Thaitanic ship of state.

As for no evidence of Nomsod being on the island or being involved: Again, there's some evidence which the Gang of 4 are spooked about: The KT CCTV footage which shows Nomsod looking spooked, in the minutes right after the crime. the face, his gait, the haircut, the thin tall body (none of the B are tall) and his odd mannerisms (left arm bent as if clutching his belly) - all indicate it's Nomsod.

Those two factors, among others which implicate Nomsod, are going to continue to be hotly contested by the Gang of 4 and Thai officials , and it's obvious why: They're committed to shielding the Headman's people. The ensuing weeks/months of testimony should be interesting, although the people who should be the prime suspects, aren't, and we all know the real reasons why they're no longer prime suspects.

The whole case turned 180 degrees, in an hour, when the replacement head cop came down from Bkk.

"Those two factors, among others which implicate Nomsod, are going to continue to be hotly contested by the Gang of 4 and Thai officials , and it's obvious why: They're committed to shielding the Headman's people."

Is that something you tell yourself in the mirror in the morning, "the Gang of 4 are shielding the headman's people" to motivate yourself? Come down to reality.

\

I think the motivation for people posting here is to get the truth, and to give the two defendants an opportunity for a fair trial. Hopefully to make the rtp more accountable in the future. And hopefully make Thailand a safer place.

But their are those who blindly believe what ever is fed them. Especially from the way that the entire investigation was carried out. And knowing how money can buy out cops. Further more, I wonder why people need to defend the rtp statement if in their mind it's already true. If it's true, let it be and enjoy the show. Or is it their desire to convince themselves that it's true.

"But their are those who blindly believe what ever is fed them"

Yes, like who? Do you have any examples to share?

Obviously boomerangutang is not looking for the truth, based on his compulsive repetition of the "Gang of 4 ...committed to shielding the Headman's people"

He's been told repeatedly that is not the case, he continues doing it, so he is not interested on the truth; he wants to convince himself of a "truth" that makes him look more righteous, facts don't get into it.

So tell me if you believe in the police statement as the truth or not?

Maybe he shouldn't lump you in to the group, but you being the logical guy, ignored other illogical statements made by the other three. Which leads people to believe that you are part of the gang. As you seem to rebut almost every post made questioning the RTP. Just be fair and rebut others that is defending the police statement. This way you won't be misunderstood.

I don't put you in that group though. Unless you tell me that you think 100% that the police report is not tainted. You just state what is already been reported. Many here are talking about probabilities. And do not believe the police and their shoddy investigation.

I think everyone here is trying to find the truth. If you have the truth, please share with us. But don't tell me that the truth is in the police statement. Because no one knows if it's true or not. Unless you want to tell me that we should wait till the trial. It may be too late to save two innocent lives. Sorry, I believe in innocent until proven guilty beyond a reasonable doubt.

JTJ and others of the 'Gang of 4' (jdinasia, Balo and AleG) are going to vehemently challenge any hint of evidence that Nomsod was one of the perps of that crime. The fact remains that he was a prime suspect initially, he avoided police for a week, he avoided a DNA test for several weeks, until it was assured that his DNA wouldn't match the DNA from the victim. Of course it's questionable whether the DNA labeled 'from Hannah' is really what it claims to be. We're waiting for independent British verification of the DNA trail, but the Brits don't have all the DNA samples (Thai officials won't share with them), and the Brits have shown that they're adverse to rocking the Thaitanic ship of state.

As for no evidence of Nomsod being on the island or being involved: Again, there's some evidence which the Gang of 4 are spooked about: The KT CCTV footage which shows Nomsod looking spooked, in the minutes right after the crime. the face, his gait, the haircut, the thin tall body (none of the B are tall) and his odd mannerisms (left arm bent as if clutching his belly) - all indicate it's Nomsod.

Those two factors, among others which implicate Nomsod, are going to continue to be hotly contested by the Gang of 4 and Thai officials , and it's obvious why: They're committed to shielding the Headman's people. The ensuing weeks/months of testimony should be interesting, although the people who should be the prime suspects, aren't, and we all know the real reasons why they're no longer prime suspects.

The whole case turned 180 degrees, in an hour, when the replacement head cop came down from Bkk.

"Those two factors, among others which implicate Nomsod, are going to continue to be hotly contested by the Gang of 4 and Thai officials , and it's obvious why: They're committed to shielding the Headman's people."

Is that something you tell yourself in the mirror in the morning, "the Gang of 4 are shielding the headman's people" to motivate yourself? Come down to reality.

\

But their are those who blindly believe what ever is fed them. Especially from the way that the entire investigation was carried out. And knowing how money can buy out cops. Further more, I wonder why people need to defend the rtp statement if in their mind it's already true. If it's true, let it be and enjoy the show. Or is it their desire to convince themselves that it's true.

First thing we hear after the murders is that 'No Thai could have done this'.

My interpretation of this is 'We know a Thai did this but we're going to try and brainwash you into believing that it wasn't a Thai because we have to and can't divulge why'.

The Burmese are then tested first round and a negative result is found. Thai police round up loads more Burmese to take DNA to make it look like they're doing a grand and thorough job (press overload) but all the while knowing that they are going to chose the suspects they first tested. Why? Because someone who committed the murders saw them on the beach that morning. They may not have seen who they were or known who they were but they would be the perfect scapegoats. And maybe the real killer/s think or know that the B2 witnessed the crime.

McAnna is threatened by Mon and cop to confess to the murder. Mon is on record as saying he did have a word with McAnna as he suspected he may have been involved with the murder. How come the police didn't divulge what Mon suspected to the public like they did almost everything else?

Round about 23rd Sept Headman offers a massive cash reward to police:

“I would never protect anyone who has committed a crime, even if it was a close friend, my own brother or son. I am an honest and straight forward person. If the provincial police are able to obtain evidence proving this I would gladly give them a one million baht reward.”“I would never protect anyone who has committed a crime, even if it was a close friend, my own brother or son. I am an honest and straight forward person. If the provincial police are able to obtain evidence proving this I would gladly give them a one million baht reward.”

But by this time the deal is in the bag and the DNA has been messed around with/relabelled in the mobile unit on Koh Tao which no doubt Mon had access to as he seemed to have had access to everywhere else to do with the investigation. So headman could speak with utmost confidence.

Then the police got McAnna off the island post haste because they didn't want him blabbing anymore. His silence now speaks volumes. Someone gets enough threats they're eventually going to crack. As did the Burmese men.

And the pantomime re-enactment - that was done in an attempt to convince the whole world watching that the men were guilty without a doubt. The world is not as stupid as the RTP think clearly. How much longer can they keep this up?

"The Burmese are then tested first round and a negative result is found. Thai police round up loads more Burmese to take DNA to make it look like they're doing a grand and thorough job (press overload) but all the while knowing that they are going to chose the suspects they first tested. Why? Because someone who committed the murders saw them on the beach that morning. They may not have seen who they were or known who they were but they would be the perfect scapegoats. And maybe the real killer/s think or know that the B2 witnessed the crime."

Since the premise of your argument is false (That they were tested and cleared), your whole "theory" is nothing but hotair; then on top of that you follow with baseless speculations, there´s a term in computer sciences that applies here: GIGO.

Sure everyone opinion is all baseless but probable. Even yours, as you have no evidence to back it up yourself. So what are we discussing here on this forum? I think most people are refuting the police claim because

1. The police investigation has been done poorly. If that is true, it's a high probability that the police report was also done poorly.

2. With the reputation of the RTP, it made the inconsistency even worst. Credibility is very important. And as you know and most Thais know, RTP lacks that.

I am sure there are many more. These makes the probability high that the police report is tainted. I don't think any one can discount anything, if no one has access to the evidence. So people statement here are not baseless at all. If anyone clings on to the police statement as truth, then they have forfeited their ability to think.

Typical finger pointing has started. If the ex-minister things it's not as substandard, I welcome him to sell it to anyone for non substandard pricing. Rice is old and in bad shape. If you are entrusted with that much amount of money, and you squandered it on something without oversight, I think that is dereliction of duty. Even though they have been fairly warned, YS government refused to heed the warning.

It's time to put someone in jail, then future politicians will think twice about doing things without considering the huge amount of responsibility.

And your proof against these two men is based on...

I said evidence, not proof; proof is derived from evidence, the evidence is what the police collected and will be presented during the trial to be examined by the judge and countered, if possible, by the defense.

OK then, whichever you like. Where is the evidence?

Soon in a court in Koh Samui.

Wow, brilliantly answered. It took you how many post to come to this conclusion? You could have saved all the trouble by making this statement for anyone sharing their views on this forum at the very beginning.

But as you can see this is a forum. We discuss and share ideas. But since you have no ideas to share, why are you commenting any way? You should follow your own advice to every one and wait till the trial start.

What is your point really? I don't get you. Are you trying to lecture people how to discuss things? Besides you said that you have to wait till the trials to make any comments. So why bother commenting, as you can't back up any thing and can't contribute to anything.

Don't forget, this is a forum for public opinion and not the court. He is merely making a statement of possibility and not definite statement. You sure like to take things out of context and manipulate it so you can look smart, sorry to say, it's not working. It's having the reverse affect. And how you answered it, proves that.

"Are you trying to lecture people how to discuss things?"

As a matter of fact yes, I'd like to educate people in critical thinking and logic, I believe that would make the world a better place. Do you have a problem with that?

Ahh...As I thought. Then you need to learn communication than. Instead of spewing out: "...How do you know they didn't". It reads to me you are making a statement countering the other poster's. you don't read the context rather pick at something and tried to fabricate a flaw in the logic. I got it right away from his statement that he was not sure about it. Accept you.

Remember this is a discussion about a case that no one has evidence to back anything up. Not even you. So being the logic guru, why are you even making comments as not even you have any evidence to rebut their statement.

May I suggest to you how I could have phrased the response:

"I am sure that would be something the defense team should have done, however we can't be sure that they did or not." Something like that. In the context of things and for the sake of discussion, that word "surely" was appropriate.

Your statement makes the assumption that the poster didn't know how to present his view. He did just fine. I get his view.

If you going to be the guru of logic here, maybe learn how to communicate better would be a start.

You know, if you are going to get so worked up about communication you should pay more attention at what you read, it was JeremyBowskill how said "How do you know they didn't", or to be precise "Who said they didn't?", not me.

It really makes the rest of your post comically ironic, specially the part about cherry picking things to fabricate a flaw in logic.

Please stop shooting yourself in the foot. I am not sure you any more toes left. Communication is the key to human existence. This whole forum is about communication between people's idea. This whole internet is about communication for the masses. With all the logic in the world, if one can't convey it correctly, it's meaningless.

You are the one that truncated the thread. Is there a logic to save that mistake too? Or maybe, you didn't think far enough before letting your ego overtake you? I didn't cherry pick anything, your statement was quite short and concise and spoke your feeling. yes, you have your feeling too and it's not always controlled by logic. Or else, you wouldn't have made it. Learn to communicate, if you want to be the logic police, I am sure you have good intention, but you will be misunderstood. Unless you are following the RTP logic handbook. Then I will forgive you. And I am sure some people here on TV on would forgive you too.

a witness would be too scared to even cancel their work shift to get on the ferry to Samui...

I would like to add that thugs, will resort to threatening or harming their friends. So some of these workers don't want any harm to come to their friends. My opinion is to cleanse the island of these infestation. That is the only way to save face for Thailand. It will put the burden on the corrupt police. And will make Thailand look good to the world. If only the pm will take this opportunity. It is a must.

What people believe doesn't matter, this is a criminal case, facts are what matters.

You must be a hoot to go to a party with. BTW, this is an online discussion, not a criminal court in session. As such, people surmise, they make suggestions, offer scenarios as they perceive them, add professional advice/insight, make mistakes, reveal evidence, ....whatever. You want to play ball in a criminal court, go to a criminal court. If you want to discuss this issue, go ahead and join us in a discussion.

AleG already made it clear that he wants to wait till the trial starts. But he still wants to put his two cents in. What some people will do for attention.

Evidence , please show us some evidence that they are not guilty, its hardly a surprise that Myanmar found them to be innocent.....

The way I read it: the Burmese investigators have been convinced of the B2's innocence for weeks, based on what they have been told by the Burmese community on Koh Tao. No one with first-hand knowledge is willing to come forward officially, giving the reason that they are fearful of retaliation. This makes sense to me, but the claimed first-hand accounts might not be truthful. I doubt the B2's guilt, but the defense is sounding desperate.

I am sure they taped the statements by eyewitness. They will just have to do their best to protect the identity of these individuals and try to submit it as evidence. But I am sure the prosecution would like to cross examine them. How would they protect them now.

Actually with the Myanmar government having the two Myanmar back. Speaks very loud that they have enough to prove that these two are innocent. It would be a big risk for the nation if they were making it up. And now it seems to be a govt to govt challenge in the case. Neither will say that their investigation into the case was flawed. It's definitely getting interesting.

Does anyone know wether or not defense got a hold of the prosecutors files yet? Or when they are suppose to get them. I like the Myanmar hidden secret weapon. They probably pieced everything together for the boy's defense a long time ago. Just making sure the prosecution case are sealed in court, before springing this in them. We have to remember, it went back and forth so many times for revision.

"Some of those interviewed were "strong witnesses" who might provide evidence to exonerate the accused, said Kyaw Thaung, who heads the committee, but they were reluctant to testify and had returned to Myanmar for fear of being implicated in the crime." I think that should have read: for fear of being real dead, real soon. Like most on the island, they probably know that not only did the B2 not do the crime, they know who did and that it isn't the first time. While I doubt public assassination, and I doubt there are many, if any, Thai long range Thai experts, there are people that would give it a try ($$$$$$$$) and all it would take is the try to shut the witnesses up permanently. We have to remember, these witnesses are not people used to anything but fear, poverty and abuse, certainly not Spec. Ops. types. Also remember, they could be charged with a crime for being in Thailand illegally, does anyone believe our dear leader will give them immunity much less protection?

I wonder how many migrant workers are mysteriously killed or go missing. These group of people are the most venerable. Definitely a high risk life style. I hope for humanity sake, there is justice.

Why should it not be possible to bring the Burmese workers who fled to Burma back

under protection of their government and then back to Burma.

May be even some money could be found as a substitute for their loss of income in Thailand.

Would it be a total fantasy that the Thai government can guarantee the safety of these witnesses.

I say if the PM it's sincere, he needs to send in DSI into KT and expose any corruption. Jail those breaking the law, including police who have been extorting illegal migrant workers permission to stay, in the name of the royal kingdom. If these figures are out of the picture, witness would not be so intimidated. I know powerful families made many enemies and there are plenty of folks ready to snitch on them whenever they get a chance.

No offence, but the beloved supreme ruler is a cog in the machine. He sits at about number 8 or so in the pecking order. He has as much desire to get to the bottom of this as you would desire to catch ebola.

They also confessed to the legal team from the Myanmar embassy

https://www.dvb.no/news/koh-tao-murderers-were-tortured-says-burmese-embassy-lawyer-burma-myanmar/44781

Read the whole thing.

I admit, that was strange, that they purportedly retracted the admission of guilt, while also purportedly admitting they did it. What's the comparative time line on those statements? I feel strongly there's something about that interview which is eluding us observing outsiders. Was the re-admission of guilt claimed (by the B2) before or after they had spoken with their lawyers? Was it correctly translated? It seems too weird when, for several weeks now, we (the general public) are being told they've retracted their confessions. Perhaps they still felt some sorts of pressure, just days after their forced confessions. I don't know.

Was it correctly translated?

They made that confession to Myanmar representative and the report is in a Myanmar based website.

The HRC commissioner had Burmese speakers with him as well.

Perhaps the subsequent confessions were translated correctly (from Burmese to Thai to English, or from Burmese to English to Thai). If so, that could be interesting evidence for the prosecution team. However, there is still the 'time-frame.' Those conversations were quite soon (1 or 2 days?) after the forced confessions, so the suspects may have experienced lingering psychological jitters. At the 'safe house' they were confronted by stern-faced older men representing authority. At the subsequent encounter, they were faced by stern-faced older men representing authority. Very recent psychological scars of being tortured (or the threat of being tortured) by such men, were still in their minds. It's v. likely (common practice) for Thai authorities to threaten dire punishment (death, for example) if suspects don't plead guilty, - and offer leniency, if suspects plead guilty. Even so, that's water under the bridge, because as soon as the B2 understood how their Burmese speaking lawyers described their legal rights, the Burmese insisted on their innocence, and have done so every since.

I am sure they had a hard time trusting any one. I wouldn't doubt the police brought someone in who pretended to help them and threaten them again if they didn't say what they wanted to say. Again with the small amount of credibility these group of police have, nothing out of their mouth can be trusted

Why should it not be possible to bring the Burmese workers who fled to Burma back

under protection of their government and then back to Burma.

May be even some money could be found as a substitute for their loss of income in Thailand.

I say if the PM it's sincere, he needs to send in DSI into KT and expose any corruption. Jail those breaking the law, including police who have been extorting illegal migrant workers permission to stay, in the name of the royal kingdom. If these figures are out of the picture, witness would not be so intimidated. I know powerful families made many enemies and there are plenty of folks ready to snitch on them whenever they get a chance.