PhuketFarang

If a person has 1 year extensions from being married to a Thai, can they apply for a work permit not connected to a company? For example, a free lancer?

Yep. Went to 3 of those Kodak places. Nothing. I guess everyone just has printers of their own to do these things.

Sorry... I didn't explain correctly. I'm looking for a print shop that has these to make me these cards from my designs. I don't want to buy this machine myself.

I wouldn't have a problem even going to fraudsters to have this done. But doubt they have a storefront?

Went hunting today for a print shop that has a printer that does a 1-off PVC ID card with no success.

Anyone know a place in Phuket?

Steele. Been thinking about doing that. Heading out diving has never been much of a problem. I dive 3-4 times a week. in the OP, I was mentioning showing my non-diving friends diving. This is done as a DSD. THIS is what could land me in jail since it's teaching.

But starting a non-pro rec diving group would be a great idea. You going to sign up for it?

Nancy... one of the many reasons I love CM. SO much easier up there. Did you know that you can get into NPs and many other cultural attractions for free just by showing your Thai drivers license? I haven't paid any of these tourist fees for a few years now.

As for the van situation, I have a friend that came visit who is technically a Thai. Both parents are Thai and they both live here but he was raised and lives in the US. So no Thai ID at all. He hired a tour mini-van to take him from Phuket to Krabi and was stopped by the police. They were detained for about an hour questioning if this was an authorized tour with the van driver. Of course my friend didn't speak Thai all that great so he was no help at all. They ended up paying a 1500b "fine" to the policeman because they couldn't produce the proper paperwork.

So you're lucky in a few ways. Things are more laid back in CM and you haven't ran into a policeman in a bad mood yet. I should just make the ocean an occasional visit and move north. Been thinking of doing that for awhile now.

There are quite a few recreational divers here actually, but the hassle and expense of a 1.5 hour boat ride out and back to the same dive sites gets redundant. Now if you had a boat and were looking for recreational divers to go with you to new spots, you'd get quite a bit of interest I would think.

Steele. There are plenty of shore diving you can do off the island. Kata Reef, Airport Reef, Banana Bay, Paradise Beach, Kamala Rocks, and I'm sure there are plenty more that I have yet to discover. Plus there's night diving, glow diving, spear fishing, and other ways to dive at these places. No need for the hassle or expense of a dive boat and I do have a couple of friends I go out regularly with. But that's off topic of the original post/question.

If you're a rec diver and want hook up, let me know! I'm always ready to head out.

I think people should be reading the original post again. Or is the one reference to showing a friend diving as an example confusing everyone?

I don't think wanting to do things legally is living in fear, is it? Or is life only living in anarchy?

No, it's not that he wants to work, per se, it's that he wants to lead diving groups. I admit I don't know much about what's involved in a dive. Never been on one and don't have any desire to start now, but I've been deep sea fishing.

What's to stop the OP from chartering a boat and inviting a bunch of friends to go diving together? How is this illegal? Don't they have private diving parties in Phuket? Doesn't someone have to organize them -- hire the boat, figure out where you're going, point out interesting sites to everyone along the way.

How is this any different from when a friend of mine organized a weekend trip to the Textile Festival in Mae Chaem, sent out emails to her friends, asked them to forward to other friends and before long we had a couple mini vans of ladies going out of Chiang Mai for a fun weekend of shopping, taking in native culture and girl-time? Was this friend engaging in work without a permit? Nobody stopped us and the local town officials in Mae Chaem (and along the way) seemed to like have 20 ladies from Chiang Mai come in to spend money.

If you read the original email, showing my non-diving friends a DSD dive is the LAST thing on the list. What about the others? Like offering free weekly spay/neutering? Heck, I know someone who got into trouble because he helped another friend set up wifi without a work permit.

As for your question.... how is taking a bunch of friends diving illegal? Because you're guiding them. And that is not permitted even with a work permit. I guess the police would take your word that they are your friends and not customers, because a farang would never lie about that, right?

As for your tour, if a police officer in a bad mood decided he wanted to take someone to jail and stopped your van, you (or whoever would confess to be leading this group) could easily end up in jail or pay him an on-the-spot fine... or both... and then you would have to sort out the legalities of it later, if you can.

Again, you would probably get the same answer as I gave from the MOL. I come up with new questions like this to them every other month.

Nancy.. so you're saying I'm being over cautious and ignore the Thai law in this case?

Funny thing about leading hikes, it's a HUGE no-no to lead dives. Leading a group is one of the protected Thai jobs and they really burn you down here for doing that.

I think things are so much easier up in CM then it is down here. Maybe because there are more people to abuse any leeway that the authorities may give.

I'll just keep hoping that I get a sympathetic ear from an MOL officer one day.

Ref O visa. It is possible to get a WP on an O visa. Multi entry and extensions. I have done many times for short term and long term work over the past ten years. It is just the fact that many offices are not aware that it is possible.

Retirement O and extensions can also be used for a WP but again it depends on the local office and how they interpret, or, how well they know the regulations.

I couldn't agree with you more Overhere. That's why I keep going back to the office every other month. The official stance in the Phuket office is that you can get a WP for any O VISA with the exception of the retirement OA visa. I'm hoping that one day I get someone who will go ahead and grant me a WP or the office changes it's position. It's bee a long haul so far but I'm not giving up.

Thanks Steele. I think I'm posting more on how can I do my hobbies and interests legally while retired instead of asking for things to do.

One thing about diving here VS where I used to live, there's really not that many living here that dive recreationally. They are mostly all pro's. You go on a dive boat and the only people you see repeatedly are the ones who are instructors. Where I used to dive, the boat is always filled with locals and you eventually get to know everyone in the area where you can almost always call up a friend for a last minute shore or night dive somewhere.

The other things can easily be done with my Thai friends.... I'm just not allowed to do it with them.

Shoot. That won't work with my situation then. Thanks for the info anyways Nancy.

BTW, CM is my FAVORITE city. If only there was an ocean nearby.

Thanks Nancy! Got it.

"Fifteen (15) day temporary work permits are available only to foreigners urgently needing to travel to Thailand to engage in business or provide services for a limited period of 2 weeks or less. The list of work considered urgent is extensive and includes attending conferences and seminars, conducting negotiations and inspections, to engage in demonstrations, testing or training, to recruit or to purchase or even non-profit activities."

Not sure if they will let me go back to get a new one every 2 weeks. After 15-20 times, they may not consider that I am "urgently needing" it anymore. They would do that in CM?

Nancy. Like I mention, I also know many who take part of such activities without a WP but that does not make it legal. As per your specific question about comparing teaching bridge with showing diving, I don't know specifically about bridge but I DO know specifically about diving because I asked MOL directly. This is VERY prohibited and WILL land someone in jail and/or a huge fine. I think if you look at the law and ask the MOL, ANY type of teaching will fall into the same category.

And I have asked like minded retirees and expat's as you suggested. These are the people, again as I mention, that are doing these things under the table and just taking the risk. And I have contacted various organizations in some of the areas I have training and interest in. They all say the same. They cannot provide a work permit. Again, everything is under the table just like what Seligne2 said he was doing. Or they will not accept a non-thai volunteer at all.

Am I being too cautious? Should I treat this like speeding violations (which I admit doing all the time)?

I would like to know about the temporary work permits you mentioned. Can you point me to a website with details on that?

JusMe is correct. As seen here: http://www.thaiembassy.com/thailand/working-thailand.php

"The term “work” in Thai law is defined very broadly, covering both physical and mental activities, whether or not for wages or other form of compensation. Even volunteer or charity work requires a work permit in Thailand."

I realize MANY people do things like this under the table. Even for pay. But that does not make it legal and it could come bite them in the butt someday. I just want to keep legal and hopefully there is SOME way to do this.

I haven't asked any officials but was wondering if I started a Thai Foundation, could I get a volunteer work permit with this Foundation and keep my OA? Anyone with a guess?

I'm currently on an OA VISA, apparently the only non-imm VISA that doesn't allow a work permit. The reason MOL gives is that you're suppose to be retired, no work!

But I don't want to be like so many ex-pats I see who starts the day off at the local pub and closes the place down. There are many activities I cannot do without fear of being busted for not having a work permit. I'm not talking about making ANY money, just want to be active in the things I've always been interested in and have the skills for including starting up a free spay/neuter day at my local vet clinic. Offering free English classes at the local schools. Taking my non-diving friends scuba diving (DSD) Kata Reef. And several other activities that could land me in trouble with the law.

I do NOT want to change my VISA status because it's an easy extension process and hopefully apply for permanent residence status someday.

Is there any way for me to get SOME kind of work permit so that I can have an active retirement with the things I love? Or should I just succumb to becoming an alcoholic?