Darkknight666

YOU are talking about Koh Tao being a dangerous place to visit. I am simply comparing the dangers of going to Koh Tao as to visiting the US.

It is a fair comparison to make - put it this way, where would you feel safer, walking around or drinking in a bar in Koh Tao or in the heart of gangster territory in the Bronx?

Rather be in Compton, Watts, Oakland etc than Koh Tao... At least their crimes like these take priority and we nail the animals 9/10 times.

Thing about Koh Tao is, obviously, some folks are above the (barely existent) law.

Yes I'll take the Bronx. Or even queens.

There isn't even enough evidence to prove that Wei ever touched David's phone. He found a phone on the beach but the police also found a phone at the beach and the one they found was at the crime scene. Which one is more likely to be David's?

They also claim to have found a phone near Wei's residence. Now given that we have strong evidence for a frame up, including torture and concealment of evidence. I must assume that planting the crime scene phone, in a place where they knew Wei's friend had tossed the other, is a distinct possibility. In fact it is highly unlikely the police would have discovered a phone out in the bushes had they not been tipped off.

If this is not the case then who's phone did the police find at the crime scene if it wasn't David's?

So Wei's friend admits he smashed the phone he received from Wei, while the phone that the police found at the crime scene wasn't smashed.

I'm sure the UK police is able to recognize if the phone that carries David's IMEI is smashed or not.

Wei being in possession of the phone proves nothing but he has a phone, which we can't be sure online if it's indeed David's phone. What bothers me is that Wei wasn't in bed at 4 am like I previously had thought was the case. Now, being that they aren't regular drinkers I could see Wei maybe getting sick and not being able to sleep, realizes he's lost some valuable (to him) clothes and other items and decides to look for them since he's awake anyways.... All my speculations of course. What I do believe without a doubt is the B2 aren't the killers, they may know more and are afraid to speak, I don't know, but somebody is certainly being shielded from prosecution and it isn't the B2.

Too many coincidences, too much silence, too little cooperation from the prosecuting lawyers in the trial... If these two boys commuted this crime where is validation of all of the evidence? Why is the prosecution so snake like if they really think they've got their perp's? It doesn't add up. Also, Warot's name just came out of thin air? He's so unlucky that he was fingered for a crime by a police commander who knew fingering him would be a big deal? And Panya would just accuse him with zero evidence and risk a possible law suit? No, my friend.... It doesn't add up.

The prosecution did show their hand somewhat today, Bringing last second evidence out and almost certainly by influencing the Miller family. It's shows, to me, that they're not at all confident in their case at this point, and they shouldn't be as most of us are aware. I have one last shred of hope and that is the judges do the right thing.

Don't engage the trolls guys! I know it's hard but chaos is what they seek... Don't participate in that junk.

I'm very very very surprised that not a single person hasn't picked up on the fact that not one of the accused had any defensive wounds on them, if Hannah and David were using the hoe to protect themselves.

And, Dave had wounds NOT from the hoe........Looked them, 100% sure.....Also sure the UK knows what caused those wounds..

In order to subdue David there had to be either multiple assailants or a gun. With big ears cop up Mon's bum 24/7 a gun wouldn't be surprising to me. David's wounds were most certainly cause by a blade and I didn't see any indication at all he was hit with the hoe even once. How did the B2 manage to overpower two people larger than themselves and do so without getting a scratch on them.... And, rather than gtf'outta town after the murders they stuck around. To me all that has changed is the part of Wei's story where he went back out and found the phone, that's not a good thing to hear after claiming he was asleep from 2am on.

The worst part of all of this is,, nobody cares about th killers walk freely aside from the victims family's... Thai officials couldn't give less of a toss so long as their face and tourism is saved.

Horrifying.

If Wei was at the scene and observed the murder , wouldnt it work in his favor to tell the court who he saw that night on the beach ?

If he is innocent and set free he will go back to Burma anyway so he shouldnt worry about his life will be in danger if he talks.

That's what I think too.. BUT... They're in police custody and rocking the boat could get him killed. I can imagine that if the torture allegations are true the B2 are likely terrified of the police and what they can/will do to steer this case in their preferred direction.

boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:boomerangutang, on 12 Oct 2015 - 03:06, said:

Could police have 'planted' the phone? Initially, they said the found phone belonged to Hannah, then they changed their story.

When the defendant (note: one defendant, not two) claims he found the phone on the beach, what time did that happen ....before the crime? after?

If he made that claim during torture, than it means absolutely nothing. He could admit to being The Pope under torture.

The worst the phone incident shows, is one of the defendants might be a petty thief who took something off a beach.

You need to read Andy Hall's facebook post which was reposted by StealthEnergiser a short while ago. Wai Phyo testified that he found the phone at around 4:00am on 15 September while he was out looking for his guitar and clothes.

While this doesn't look good for Wai Phyo, it is still only circumstantial evidence linking him to the murders. It doesn't in itself prove that he and Zaw Lin murdered Hannah Witheridge and David Miller. We should also consider the possibility that he is telling the truth when he says he came across the phone by accident.

I wonder what happened to the sunglasses he is also charged with stealing?

This is nothing new really , he found the phone by accident and took it home with him. It should not change the outcome of this case unless there is more evidence waiting to be revealed . He will not be charged with murder for stealing a phone.

Well maybe not but in my eyes, after claiming they were asleep in their room all this time, Once on the stand he says he went back out for his shoes?, saw the phone but not the scene? I don't know man, I think the B2 have a pretty damn good idea what happened only they can't say anything. Don't forget, it would be easy as pie for RTP to "suicide" the B2 if they don't comply, and they've already been tortured and coerced. They most likely still fear for their lives, fear from a death penalty hanging over their heads and fear of being covertly murdered in police custody... I know I would do my best to get out of the situation alive. Then again, if Wei was a part in some way why wouldn't he confess to get a halved sentence? My guess is even if he wanted to he would be too scared of the consequences.

Mon Toovicien is the key to this puzzle, that man needs the screws out to his balls.... Figuratively speaking. He certainly is the closest thing to vulnerable in this case there is. Come on nail the guy RTP and get to the bottom of this.

Oh lastly, they're going the read the verdict on December 24th? Some timing, eh?

Please refrain from calling me a troll simply because my version of events differs from yours.

Simply answer this question - how was it possible that David's phone was stolen from his pocket by Wei if, as they claimed, that they "never went anywhere near the crime scene" in fact they didn't even know that a rape and double murder had taken place on the beach that night if I recall rightly!!

Also, don't you think that the fact that they incriminated themselves by admitting that they violated Hannah's body carries a little bit of weight as to their guilt!!

If you can answer these two questions in a convincing manner then you may call me for trolling.

I know this wasn't to me, but, I don't take their initial confession into account because it's been retracted and accusations of torture and even testimony states that the confessions were not given freely.. Knowing that they're in police custody, essentially at the Mercy of the RTP day and night after being tortured by the RTP I'm not sure they would say anything even if they knew exactly what happened.

I can't rule out that the Wei wasn't involved being that he was so close to the crime scene when the crime or bodies would have been seen by Wei for sure at 4am. I'm not so sure they're absolutely innocent. After saying all that, I do NOT think they're the prime assailants, they may have been near, they may have been ordered to help stage the scene, who knows really... But the investigation and behavior by RTP and the prosecution says to me there are assailants involved with tons of clout.... A lot of pull and those people, the headmans family or staff... Or both, killed David and Hannah.

If it were strictly the B2 all along this trial would look much much different. I believe whole heartedly the killer is either a VIP (dodo) or acted one behalf of a VIP.

The whole thing is making me quite sick.

I absolutely don't think the B2 killed them, as I said above.. I also don't believe anything about the phone from the Thai Embassy at the last moment....especially without anything other than hearsay to verify it. Maybe David's family knows more than anyone else, maybe they have even spoke to the friends who were on Tao that night... Or maybe this is yet another scandalous tactic by Thai authorities. The waters are so muddied I don't think anyone will every really know what happened.

I have to say, Wei admitting he was on the beach and took David's phone is bad... They were supposed to both be asleep in their room. I still don't think that the B2 killed David and Hannah but I do think they know much more than they are saying. No, the phone doesn't prove anything more than theft... Still this is not good.

New Judges, eh? Maybe that's a good sign! I know, I know.... Foolish thinking.

Anyone else find the weekend court schedule odd? I've never been to court here but I had thought it would be closed in Saturday and Sunday's.. No?

This case sadly does have all the markers for a typical Thai "bury it with time" line of thinking. To me, it's like the Thai judicial

System is actively trying to "bury" this case what with no notes taken allowed, journalists an translators threatened.. It's almost as if the entire culture on these torusirst islands is constructed to keep the "peace" so to speak.. And that usually includes kissing ass to the local Hi So's. All I can say is, the one valuable lesson I can take from this whole debacle is... Never go to a small Thai island ... Ever. Even Samui can be shady.

Pictures of Sharktooth stingray man in this PPTV thailand news clip also.

Hi Stealth, when is that video from? Must be blind cause I didn't see. Boy am I happy to see Ekkachai on the Thai news for all to see! That's something at least.

I was thinking this the other day... When the RTP in Bangkok said "there's no mafia on Koh Tao or the police would be aware of them".. What he meant was there is no Mafia as in Italian Mafia. Of course we know there's no Italian Mafia on Koh Tao.... The mafia on the islands isn't your typical type of crime syndicate as we're all aware, it's the local family's and their RTP buddies who run those rackets. Anything hey say can be twisted a million different ways with Thai cops... Same with the "lost" evidence that suddenly wasn't lost, it was a miscommunication by the press. Masters at covert lying, Not so good at every day routine lying and definitely not used to ever being called out. Anyhow, just keeps it fresh in my mind that the lies have been numerous from the cops from day one.

If a police officer takes the lead on a double murder investigation it would be normal sensible and common practise to have him remain until the investigation has concluded, to have him abruptly removed and transferred whether already on the cards or not was unprofessional and wrong, the reason for this is obvious and well proven

I agree. Panya and his team were just gaining traction and about to indict two top suspects. His Bkk superiors ordered him to desist and indict Burmese instead. He did (probably reluctantly) but it was too late. The wheels of the Scapegoat Locomotive had already started turning. He was yanked off the job, given a pay raise (and a cash reward?) and a desk job in Bangkok, and ordered to not utter anything more about the case. Notice, he hasn't been mentioned by the prosecution, let alone called as a witness. He was chief investigator on the case during its initial 11 days, yet RTP and prosecution don't want the court to hear one word from him.

Why don't the defense call him as a witness?

Even if they did, which I guess they have, who says he will show up? He's a subordinate in all of this so I imagine he does whatever is best for his career and family... So, he likely won't ever be heard from in the matter.

Feed them to the mob.

Possibly, the RTP promise guys like this the moon and no jail time if they play along for the public, Once they have "confessed" they're boned anyway. Why would the guy just give up and confess when the cops can barely figure out a homicide case? I mean, maybe he is just that stupid.., sure I'm skeptic of all the work done under this govt'. Why not have the guy show where he got his disguise from and have him run by the cameras as per usual RTP procedure?

I hope they do have the bomber(s)... But, color me skeptical.

I think you have all said enough now. What ever you write will not change anything that happens in the Thai court. Personly i find most of your comments

offensive and disgraceful. The Miller family have stated in the JEP ( Jersey evening post ) that they were hoping that the press and forums such as these

would have respect.and leave the matters to the lawyers and other people involved.

That's not discussing the topic.. And no matter how many times people try and use guilt to get people to stop posting on the topic it isn't going to work. Reminds me of JTJ, Honestly.

Social Media is the RTP's worst nightmare.... Of course they want it restricted, One Gateway, anyone?

Are you aware of Brazil's approval of "lynching"?

75% of the public condone the practice.

I recently returned from a BASE trip there.....and even the girls and lads I was with are aware of this atrocity and the subsequent ineptitude.

I said "tell your friends and family not to come here".

I've also told all of my Aus family and friends.

I'm tempted to hand out flyers down Khao San Road asking travelers to boycott Death Island.

Lynching...you catching my drift?

I must go to Chidlom Monday and plan to drop in to RTP Headquarters.

I have the greatest respect for the positive contributors on this thread but now wish to act proactively myself and within the bounds of the law.....whatever the <deleted> that is.

Well, good luck with that:

Thailand's top cop warns of legal action over critical Koh Tao social media posts

BANGKOK: Royal Thai Police Commissioner Pol Gen Somyot Phumphanmuang has warned of tough legal action against anyone posting false information on social networks criticising the handling of the Koh Tao murders case by the police.

He said such posts could cause rifts and be a threat to the Thai economy. Posting information which is inaccurate and false could breach Article 14 of the Computer Crime Act, which carries a penalty of five years imprisonment and a B100,000 fine, or both.

And this is the same Somyot who said (commenting on the arrest of the BKK bombers) that the Thai police force are the best in the world. Maybe he should take a look in the mirror.

JoopJoop, you are taking a risk. At best they'll humour you.

I'm terrified!

Holy cow, The jails will be full of opinionated farangs soon won't it Those kind of threats may work on the local population, or some of them but it's not slowing anyone here down.

I'd like to know exactly why the DNA documents are still being withheld from the defense. Without that the case against the B2 is weak-sauce at best. I'm beginning to think the goal is to keep as much evidence as possible out of the court and if they lose the case, so what? They will appeal the verdict eternally and the case will be buried just like Kristy Jones's case.

Dispicable indeed.

There is a very big difference in having an opinion that differed from others and having an agenda, you can change opinions as facts are presented agendas well....

just want to add that it seems that the most posts in this thread come from those 3 or 4 posters.

Explanation?

obsessive?

agenda?

paid?

and it's not about adding new and so far unknown facts

it is only about saying everything that is said with good common sense is wrong - baiting

I am still wondering why the mods are tolerating them

Mods just said, discuss the topic not the members. Let's do that.

"Forget the sex part"

Hmm. Rejection maybe?

I wonder if they also asked Andy where the passport the Defense magically produced in December came from ? Why he told everyone in his fundraising page the B2 had been in Thailand for 3 years when in fact this is a lie.

below are three different links confirming it ,they had in a interview with Charlie Campbell frim time.com and in the court said that they were here for 2 years.

http://jerseyeveningpost.com/news/2015/07/07/trial-of-two-murder-suspects-in-thailand-starts-this-week/

https://www.dvb.no/news/koh-tao-murders-zaw-linn-details-police-torture-burma-thailand-myanmar/56989

http://time.com/3955081/thailand-koh-tao-murder-david-miller-hannah-witheridge-zaw-lin-wai-phyo-burma-myanmar/

Hello Samui_csi, why don't you just come out and say what you're personal problem with Andy Hall is? Get it off your chest mate! While you're at it, why are the RTP withholding the DNA? Surely they have the B2 dead to rights, No?

smedly

Reasonable Doubt is not Irrefutable Evidence, which you fail to grasp. It is the questioning by a reasonable person as to if the facts presented if worthy of a conviction or not.

You constantly keep saying the Defense does not have to prove there case but behind your back they are trying to do this every day. Doesn't this suggest something to you?

it suggests to me that you have absolutly no clue what you are talking about and there is plenty of evidence to prove that

That's it really... He either cannot or will not ever get why the case against the B2 isn't convincing.

B2 had no motive.

B2 didn't do an immediate runner.

B2 are not confessing, when doing so would have a huge impact on their sentences.

David wasn't killed with a hoe, it was a blade

GB can't cite a single piece of evidence that can be verified, That takes some serious faith in the RTP's work. Says all I need to know.

Interestingly it is nowhere mentioned that the hotel asked him to pay the bill. Just accumulating the charges is not a crime as long as the hotel let him do it. But maybe the reporter just forgot to ask this critical question.

Uh, are you sure you read the article? They tried to get him to pay the bill unsuccessfully and that's when they got the cops involved.

Nobody thought it a bit odd that he claimed to drive for the Sinaporean embassy yet owned his own "company" selling airplanes? Business must be rough

In this clip at 1.37 there is a hoe with no broken blade have the RTP switched the murder weapon at some stage or is it just there for reference.

So you know think the RTP switched the hoe, then put 2 peoples DNA on it who are not the B2 ? I thought they are meant to be stitching up the B2 not helping them get away with murder.

My thoughts exactly.

Oh Yeah! Many Garden Hoes in Thailand come with a pointed blade and not just flat. Just Google Thailand Hoe and get an image. They are not broken. They are just made this way. I had one myself.

Wow. Maybe try again with your spectacles on? The hoe pictured on the beach is missing part of its business end. Top right corner Buggy..... Go have a look.