gentlemanjackdarby

16 hours ago, skatewash said:

Vanguard and Fidelity are brokerages that do business in the US.

 

 

 

 

This article explains the basic process of using these companies to transfer money outside the US:

 

So from the perspective of wire transfers Fidelity (in most cases) beats Vanguard for cost.  In most other respects, however, I believe Vanguard is the superior company.

The difficult thing with either of these is getting it set-up the first time.  They want to make very sure it's you who is setting this up and so for example, Fidelity requires a Medallion Signature Guarantee, which is kind of a pain in the neck, even if you're in the US.  You can apparently also visit a Fidelity office instead, but again I believe only in the US.

 

Vanguard requires a signature guarantee too, but I've heard that it's possible to overcome this hurdle by answering security questions over the phone.  I haven't tried this myself yet but will be doing so shortly.

 

It's hard to get accounts like this set up if you are not a resident of the US.  Therefore, a very good idea to do so before you leave the US.

 

 

I have brokerage accounts at Charles Schwab, Fidelity, and TD Ameritrade

The Charles Schwab and Fidelity accounts I set up about 3 years ago and as I recall, I did everything online except for possibly the signature cards, which may have been mailed to me for signature.

Just signing signature cards can easily be handled from outside the U.S. with a mail forwarding service or a trusted relative.

One thing that I find aggravating is that my brokerages, as well as my banks, all like to send something once or twice a year to me via U.S. mail even though I've tried and tried to get them not to, so it's a good idea to have some sort of mail forwarding service to ensure that their mailings aren't returned as undeliverable. My opinion is that the reason brokerages and banks send something via U.S. mail is to verify one's physical address, which seems to have become a much bigger deal in recent years.

As far as medallion signature guarantees go, they can become serious pains-in-the-ass since most banks don't do them and some credit unions require them in order to send an international wire.

I don't have a lot good to say about the heavy-hitter banks, but one thing I'll say in their favor is that it's really easy to send an international wire online through their websites. A lot of banks and credit unions require one to fill out a form and fax it to them or, worst of all, visit a branch to make a wire. Even USAA, which really ought to be more friendly in this regard, requires one to fill out paperwork.

17 hours ago, Date Masamune said:

 

This is not true I know many Americans have the international investors account who live aboard. The service is excellent. Schwab does need to know where your income comes from.

 

 

 

Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

The Schwab 'International Account' is different from the 'Schwab Account' for folks who are resident in America.

The biggest thing is that the 'International Account' requires a minimum of USD 25,000 to open while the 'Schwab Account' has no minimum; as well, one's residence address must be outside the U.S.

Folks who have the 'International Account' are restricted from some investment options.

And yes, Schwab (as do other brokerages) care very much from where one's income comes; when completing a brokerage application, there are a lot of questions about income source, employment, etc.

Likely the Thais are just getting around to doing it like other countries do, but Thailand is (for now) easier.

For example, Malaysia requires a fixed deposit that can't be touched for the duration of one's visa of MYR 150,000 (about USD 37,000) AND a monthly income, of which 75% must be from a lifetime pension, of MYR 10,000 (about USD 2,500);

In the PI, one 'flavor' of their retirement visa requires a fixed deposit of USD 20,000 AND a monthly pension of USD 1,000.

Indonesia requires a monthly income of USD 1,500, proof of medical, life, and personal accident insurance, minimum monthly expenditure for an apartment, hiring of a maid, etc.

For now, Thailand is easier.

At least in Thailand if one is choosing the fixed deposit method and the IO asks about monthly living expenses, one can probably BS their way through it since, for now, their is no WRITTEN requirement that both are required.

3 hours ago, xylophone said:

Ah, wish I had found your post earlier Suradit69, as I have been contacting my pension providers as well as the Bangkok "branch" in London as to ways that I could get my pension to appear here as an "International Transfer" and I posted about it on probably the wrong thread!

 

Currently my UK pension provider sends my pension in pounds to the Bangkok bank "branch" in London and they send it here after converting it to baht, and it appears on my statement as just a transfer, nothing international about it, so I was worried that the IO might not accept it.

 

On enquiring, I found that if the London "branch" transferred my pension in pounds to Bangkok bank here, then it would register as an international transfer, which is just what I want, so I appear to have solved that problem.

 

So problem solved BUT........the total fees they charge at the London end and Bangkok bank in here in Thailand amount to 6.6% of my pension amount!!! So not sure whether it is a good deal or not and before I commit to letting this happen I am investigating more avenues.

 

Hopefully I can find a better way, at least one that doesn't rip the arse out of my pension, so I will be scouring more threads to see if anyone can come up with a cheaper way of transferring UK pounds to here, with it showing up as an International Transfer........ 

6.6% in fees - that's scary

For someone just making the THB 65K cut, which is about USD 2,100, that's almost USD 140 in fees per month or about USD 1,700 per year.

Well, that's why I posted the question about simply depositing a check, drawn on one's home country bank in home country currency, into a foreign currency account in a Thailand.

Since my OP, I tried to find if Thailand banks will clear a foreign check and if so, how much, and reviewing a couple of banks' fee schedules, it appears that it can still be done.

I looked  at Krungsri Bank's fee schedule and I have to say, they lay out their fee schedules beautifully and logically - probably better than any fee schedule I've seen from a U.S. bank.

Krungsri Bank charges the equivalent of USD 10 to clear a USD or CNY (surprised seeing that!) and they convert at the daily TT rate, which is good.

It appears that one **might** be able to deposit a foreign currency check directly into a THB account, which means there would almost certainly have to be detail, such as the conversion rate, that would prove the deposit originated outside Thailand.

One thing that may not be so good was that in addition to their USD 10 fee, they also made note of 'plus foreign bank fee, is any so it's likely there's other fees as well

A start at least 

5 hours ago, adam1948 said:

Could you be so kind as to explain "Vanguard" and "Fidelity" thank you very much ... I appreciate the time you take to help others ????

Vanguard and Fidelity are U.S. brokerages.

I know folks have been mentioning Vanguard's USD 10 wire transfer fee, so I took a look at their site.

The 10 USD wire transfer is for a one-time redemption from a Vanguard mutual fund account, so it's different than making a wire transfer from a bank account into which one might have, for example, their monthly pension deposited.

One other than isn't mentioned when mentioning Vanguard's USD 10 fee is that Vanguard requires one to provide a correspondent bank when requesting an international wire transfer - what that means is that one will incur an additional fee from the correspondent bank.

USAA does the same thing - quote only their fee without including the cost from the correspondent bank.

It's not really as inexpensive as it looks, although Vanguard does send the transfer in USD, but it's likely the correspondent bank will perform a currency exchange at rates not as good as one would get if USD was wired directly to a Thai bank and the conversion executed there.

2 minutes ago, Suradit69 said:

All of my SwIft transfers are in US $.  If you send Thai baht it won't be recorded as a foreign sourced deposit. Bangkok Bank receives the dollars and converts that to baht which is credited to my account. I receive a message on my phone showing the dollar amount, the fees, the exchange rate and the amount deposited in my account.

 

You should always transfer foreign currency and let your Thai bank do the conversion.

Good point - Thanks!

7 hours ago, skatewash said:

 

Not sure I understand this point from the OP.  If you SWIFT transfer USD to Thailand, then surely it is the Thai bank that performs the conversion at its own exchange rate (nothing to do with American banks at all).  That's why the Thai banks charge 0.25% fee (min. 200, max. 500) for doing the conversion of USD into THB.  If you SWIFT transfer USD to Thailand into a FCD account then there's no conversion that occurs at that time and no Thai bank fee.  If you are SWIFT transferring baht to Thailand, stop doing that.  This last transfer is the only one that American banks have anything to do with the exchange rate.  The best buying rate for Thai baht is where Thai baht is the official currency, Thailand.

In my OP, I was trying to find a simple, inexpensive way to make a monthly deposit into a Thai bank account that would prove that the deposit originated from outside Thailand.

I'm an American and American banks charge a fee in the range of USD 40 - 50, with some charging more, to make an international wire (SWIFT) transfer.

On top of the fee, most U.S. banks need to use an intermediary to perform a foreign currency conversion and they add a percentage for themselves, resulting in a poor exchange rate which is nothing more than an additional cost for the transfer.

Transferwise is often mentioned, but some of their transfers, even though they originate outside Thailand, they are coded as domestic transfers leading to speculation that those transfers won't be accepted by an IO at retirement extension time

Some folks mention low cost international wire transfers from their brokerages, but in my experience there is usually some sort of 'catch' - usually it's a high 'total relationship balance'. J P Morgan Chase offers free international wire transfers for their 'private client' banking customers, but one must have a 'total relationship balance of USD 250,000, which is likely a non-starter for the folks needing to rely on the income method.

I hadn't seen the idea of depositing a physical paper check, drawn on one's home bank, into a Thai bank account discussed.

As I said in my OP, I would expect that Thai banks use some sort of code to show that a deposit into a foreign currency account was a check drawn on a foreign bank - proof that the deposit originated outside Thailand.

I know that quite a few retirees in the PI deposit a paper check into their bank account to fund their retirement and it doesn't cost much; as well, the bank gives a much pretty good exchange rate when (if) they move some of their foreign currency into a PHP account.

I've also read some blog posts of people doing that in Thailand, but the blog posts were several years old and I don't think the posters were on a retirement extension

I was simply wondering if any of the forum members had looked into that method 'cause I've sure seen a lot of talk about the changes and possible ways to do things to comply, but nothing on that method

38 minutes ago, ChouDoufu said:

what about cambodia?  you can open a $us savings account with a tourist visa and a hotel receipt.  according to ABA website, swift under $9k costs $15.

 

deposit four months of thai monthly required cash, send a swift monthly to your thailand account.  the online chat rep says it's possible to send a swift online if you set up their internet banking.  every 90 days collect your transferred cash, use whatever service to transfer back.  ....or go in person to cambodia to re-deposit and avoid 90-day reporting.

 

lather, rinse, repeat.

 

 

An idea I hadn't thought of, but it still leaves me with getting USD to Cambodia from the U.S. since I'll need to live on something; I made the OP trying to address the problem faced by folks who can't meet the THB 800K fixed deposit and who likely wouldn't have much beyond their monthly pension to be able to meet the THB 65K monthly income 

Moneygram will do USD transfers to Cambodia, but it's strange: If the funding source is a U.S. debit card, the transfer fee is 15 USD; from a U.S. bank account, it's USD 125.

Even at USD 15 from U.S. -> Cambodia and USD 15 from Cambodia -> Thailand, that's approaching a wire transfer fee from the U.S. direct to Thailand.

Thanks for reading and replying and especially for mentioning how easy it is to set up a bank account in Cambodia

18 minutes ago, Huayrat said:

I do a swift transaction everymonth from GBP in London to GBP to the Bangkok bank so it's not sent in foreign currency.. Been doing this for 7 years

Thanks for taking the time to read my post and reply and it's my mistake for not making it clearer in my OP, but I'm an American using USD that would be transferring from the U.S.

'jonwf1963' replied earlier that he pays GBP 9.60 for a transfer, which is a lot better than the fees us Yanks are stuck with - usually in the neighborhood of USD 40 - 50

19 minutes ago, Airalee said:

I transferred $35000 for something like $35 or $45...can’t remember exactly.

That sounds about right for BofA!

It wouldn't bother me to pay that amount for a one-time transfer of USD 35,000; that works out to just over one-tenth of one percent (O.00129 - 0.129%), which is essentially free.

The purpose of my post was to see if maybe my method would be of help to folks whose financial situation dictate that the rely on the income method for a retirement visa extension

After all, if one is relying on making a monthly transfer of, generously and for easy calculation, USD 2,500, BofA's fee would be about 1.8 percent - a different animal altogether and a fee which, taken annually, would likely be money folks relying on the income method could put to better use.

14 hours ago, kokesaat said:

You'll have Medicare if you're 65 and enrolled in part B.  If you have a stroke or heart attack in Thailand all the Medicare in the world won't pay your bills overseas

Absolutely right!

It's amazing how many folks, some of whom are living outside the U.S. and ought to know better, don't realize that, except in extremely narrow circumstances related to Alaska, Canada, and CONUS (Continental United States) and Mexico, Medicare ends at the U.S. border.

One little thing - If one has enough quarters of Medicare coverage (40 or about 10 years of covered employment), Medicare Part A (Hospitalization coverage) is free and one does not have to sign up for Part B (Outpatient coverage) to get Part A coverage

However, one MUST sign up for Part A (and Part B and Part D if one chooses and wishes to pay for), ideally during one's initial eligibility window.

2 minutes ago, Airalee said:

Bank of America will do swift transfers in USD 

OK, but what's the fee?

And after re-reading my OP (Post #1) and thinking about, would an IO even care if one's check (home country FCA deposit) was cleared (available) during a specific month?

It's likely all an IO would care about is seeing a deposit, in my case in USD, go into an FCA account each month and that that deposit, when converted to THB at the date of his choosing, is equal to or greater than THB 65K. 

1 hour ago, johnwf1963 said:

Would a single SWIFT transfer not work? It would only cost me £9.60 flat fee to transfer UK GBP to GBP FCD account? 

 

(The bank that did the for me FCD would not, unfortunately, open a THB account without a work permit, as one of the promoted features was exactly that, facility to exchange directly from FCD to THB accounts!)

One of the problems with U.S. banks is that it's possible to find banks where one can transfers USD to a USD account at a foreign bank, but most banks will only make SWIFT transfers in foreign currency, which is understandable since the bank makes money by offering a relatively poor FYO exchange rate (FYO rate - '<deleted> You Over).

And even for a USD to USD transfer, U.S. banks still charges a hefty wire transfer fee, usually in the neighborhood of USD 40 - 50.

You're lucky to have a fee of only GBP 9.60 (USD 12)

I know some folks have thrown out that Charles Schwab charges only USD 25 for an international wire transfer, but that is at Schwab International and they do not disclose their forex rates until one wishes to make a transfer, a clear red flag that the rate will likely not be competitive with options like Transferwise.

While Charles Schwab is to be commended for offering U.S. expatriates (those who are bona-fide non-U.S. residents with a non-U.S. address) an option to maintain a relationship, Charles Schwab International is not the same as Charles Schwab for U.S. residents, which does not offer international wire transfers; I'm not complaining since Charles Schwab gives us a great debit card.

Charles Schwab International requires a minimum balance to open an account of USD 25,000, which is a non-starter for those folks in the position of having to use the monthly income method to qualify for a visa or visa extension.

4 minutes ago, garyk said:

@ jentlemanjack You need to be careful if you are spending most of your time here. If you have a permanent US residence you are good to go. 

Personally I would not advertise it! You are in a very good position, don't take any chances.

 

Thanks - appreciate the concern!

52 minutes ago, garyk said:

Unless you have a home in the U.S. or really know how to fool Schwab you are living on borrowed time.

I also have the brokerage investment account, and Schwab is actively seeking out and promptly canceling all investment accounts that live overseas! And I do not blame them. 

The Schwab account lets you transfer overseas at 25 dollars a transfer. So that is 350/yr transfer fees. 

Again unless you have residence in the states and go back to the states for a few months a year Schwab is on to you, and you will eventually be terminated.

 

Also good luck opening a Schwab account from abroad. 

This post is good in theory but a joke for 95% of the guys that call LOS's their home. From the US.

I have also looked into other banks that offer transfers and ATM rebate's.

I hate to say this but, if you have burnt your bridges in America. And I don't care if you are a millionaire or a pauper, it is going to cost you!

You're absolutely right about having a residence in the U.S.

However, it's my understanding that if one has a Schwab account and become resident outside the U.S., they don't necessarily liquidate one's holdings and close one's account if the account is a retirement account - they simply won't allow one to change one's holdings. Not necessarily a bad thing for a properly structured retirement account.

And if one had a retirement account, it may be possible to have a Schwab Bank account and the debit card.

I'm also aware that Schwab has something called 'Schwab International' that is designed for U.S. non-residents - I looked into that a bit last week, but there wasn't a lot of information on the website and the website directed anyone interested to call for more information. Probably not wise to call attention to myself even though I'm still in the U.S. and will maintain a U.S. residence after I retire and spend a significant amount of time abroad.

There are several banks and federal credit unions that will rebate a significant amount of foreign ATM fees each month, although not necessarily the VISA network ISA fee, which is currently 1%. The best of those is USAA (for vets and family of vets), Alliant Credit union (which is currently paying 2% on their high-yield savings account and I don't recall a significant minimum balance) and State Department Federal Credit Union.

It's easier to get membership in Alliant compared to SDFCU, but neither is particularly difficult. 

1 hour ago, rott said:

What are the fees for Vietnam please. Initial plus extensions and what limit to extensions?

 

 Cheers

It depends on your home country.

I'm an American and I've been getting familiar with requirements for Vietnam, so I'll mention what's applicable to Americans.

Strangely enough, the website for the Vietnamse embassy in Washington D.C. doesn't give cost for the visa; it says to call the embassy.

For Vietnam, Americans must have a visa when they arrive in Vietnam; there is no visa waiver (visa on arrival) and since one must have a visa, there are no extensions (visa waivers can be extended; visas cannot be extended - they expire on the 'enter by' date).

That being said, American passport holders are eligible for a 1-year, multi-entry visa in which each entry is no longer than 90 days. The stamping fee, upon arrival in Vietnam, is USD 135 so even including an embassy or agent's fee, not very much. Other visa types cost less.

That visa is only available in the U.S., but the Washington Embassy's application is all on-line; for successful applicants, the loose-leaf visa is sent by U.S. mail.

In other words, it isn't necessary to send one's passport to the embassy to have the visa sticker affixed to it.

A couple of things to keep in mind, courtesy of the embassy website:

Although the visa is a 1-year, multi-entry visa, the website makes it clear that it's at the discretion of the IO upon arrival in Vietnam how long one is permitted upon each entry; while the website doesn't specifically say it, it goes without saying that the IO may not allow entry at all if he has a a reason not to - maybe if he believes one is a perpetual tourist, working illegally, etc. The same things that some folks are whining about on this forum.

And the embassy website also cautions about using agents - at first I didn't think that, in most case, that would be an issue, but when I looked carefully at one agent's site, I noticed that it's TLD (top-level domain) was 'govt', which is not a legitimate TLD for a government (*.gov). In other words, a bit of trickery. As well, I found another site using the TLD of 'org' which is a bit misleading.

39 minutes ago, BritManToo said:

I met loads of guys there in April last year, they weren't having any problems getting VISA's at all.

Maybe you should visit there, and not just read posts on forums.

They all used agents, so 'denial' is just a river in Africa.

Well, I'm not sure where you mean by 'there' since you didn't state it.

Nowhere in my OP did I say anything about anyone having problems getting a visa, either to the PI or Vietnam

Keep in mind RIF - READING IS FUNDAMENTAL!

Since most folks who go to the PI enter on a visa waiver and don't get SRRVs (an SRRV is a real visa), I have no choice by to assume you meant Vietnam

And I did not read WORD ONE about Vietnam visas on a forum nor did I say that I did in my OP.

As for what I wrote about Vietnam, I read THAT on the official website for the Vietnam Embassy in Washington, D.C. which is pretty close to the horse's mouth.

And I don't share your disdain for forums - I will admit that there are a lot half-baked and crackpot postings on all the forums, but most adults know enough not to believe everything they read and to perform their own due diligence before jumping. I'm also not so arrogant and self-assured to believe that I know so much that someone else's experience or opinion is of no value to me.

In the past, on this very forum, there were a lot of people posting about the eventual and inevitable crackdown on perpetual tourists, those abusing education visas, increased scrutiny on marriage visas, and finally those using 'liar's letters' and other methods to strengthen their financial bona-fides to meet retirement extension standards. And lo and behold, all of those things have come to pass and look at the situation in which some folks find themselves.

Glad I had sense enough to pay attention and act on what I've read on forums. 

14 hours ago, nchuckle said:

Investment trusts,tracker funds, ISAs etc. beyond your comprehension? P.S. they spread your investment so you’re not just buying into one company. 

You get the trophy for the economically illiterate.

Damn, that was a harsh reply to what was a good point.

And I'm not sure why you think tracker funds (what we in the U.S. call 'index funds') have less risk than an individual stock- the whole point of an index fund is to buy the market as a whole or possibly a small target slice of the market and I can tell you from experience, when the market takes a nosedive as it did a couple of months ago, most of the time index funds take a bigger fall (or rise in a rising market) than some actively managed funds or individual stocks.

There's a saying in investing - 'when the market dives, the good stocks get beat up along with the bad' and that goes double when one owns the whole market.

14 hours ago, DepDavid said:

 

I have been transferring from Chase to BBNY for years. So now come April I will not be able to do this?

I ask the next question because this is the first I’ve heard of this. What is the most economical way to send money from Chase to my Bangkok bank account after April?


Sent from my iPhone using Thailand Forum - Thaivisa mobile app

 

This thread is very long so it's likely your question has been answered, but on the off chance it hasn't:

There is no way to make a transfer from Chase to BB NY because BB NY is a commercial bank not authorized to accept retail deposits in the U.S.

The only way to make a transfer from Chase to BB Thailand, which was the destination of your previous transfers (BB NY was just a stop on the way) would be a wire (SWIFT) transfer and with Chase there will be a wire fee (not cheap) as well as a poor exchange rate adding insult to injury.

If your previous transfers were part or all of a payment from U.S. Social Security, because SS makes international direct deposits conforming to IAT standards, you could change your bank from Chase to BB NY and transfers would happen as before, albeit with SS the entire payment goes to one bank which is not ideal if you don't want the entire amount in a Thai bank.

It's also possible that the source of money to your Chase account might send their ACH transfers in conformity with IAT standards, in which case your transfers could continue.

If those aren't options, the best option is to look into Transferwise - their exchange rate is pretty good and their fees are lower, so it's likely a better option than a wire (SWIFT) transfer.