RayC

Racism is an incorrect word. Xenophobia is more accurate. If you want some evidence that some Brexiters you need look no further than this thread (go back +/-20 pages, work your way forward and I think that you find examples) ".. losing an argument.." ???? Were all the jokes in your box of Christmas crackers that good?

I'll reproduce the post in question with my challenge/ question(s) to you in <> after each point. "1. I don't know about the UK poverty rates , but any increase since 2020 (Brexit) would have been primarily due to Covid and Ukraine " <Where is your evidence to support the "fact" that Covid and Ukraine have had a bigger effect (than Brexit)? (Note: A bigger effect on the overall UK economy will do for me).> " 2 Food bank usage decreased last year , although the previous increases were caused by the pandemic and lockdown and last years decrease was caused by pandemic restrictions being lifted ." <Again. Evidence to support these "facts"?> "3 Again , I have no idea about UK exports" <Fair enough. Let's move on.> "4 British people can no longer go and live in the E.U and also E.U citizens cannot now go and live in the U.K and this will benefit British kids with things like housing availability and the jobs market in the UK" <Where is the evidence to support the "fact" that housing and jobs will be more accessible for Brits (kids or otherwise) as a result of the restrictions on EU immigration?> "5 More housing and jobs available in the U.K " <Again. Supporting evidence?> "6 Both sides gave a biased opinion /prediction of how the UK would be effected by Brexit " <Bias in what ways? Outright lies? Examples? Evidence?>

It has been six and a half years since the vote to leave and there is still no semblance of a plan or even a vision of this Brexit future. Why shouldn't Rees-Moog (Minister for Brexit) and his department have continued to work on Brexit related matters during lockdown? What's inflation got to do with it? The claim - backed by data - is that Brexit has had a negative economic impact on the UK. You can lead a horse, etc. We can present evidence. You can stick your head in the sand, stick your fingers in your ears and chant 'Ra Ra Ra, can't hear you' or whatever your preferred method of avoiding inconvenient truths is or, alternatively, you can be rational and think 'You know what, they might have a point'. The world has moved on from the 1940s and '70s. Imo it's highly unlikely that what worked then - especially in terms of foreign policy and trade - will work in the 2020s. Unless of course it isn't, and the UK finds itself in an even worse mess.

You are doing it again. You provide no evidence but you, nevertheless, phrase things in such a categorical way "...would have been..", "..was caused by...", etc. that it reads as fact. It is not. It is simply unsubstantiated opinion.

Talking of facts, care to provide some to support the statement that ".. any increase since 2020 (Brexit) {in child poverty rates} would have been primarily due to Covid and Ukraine"? Sense of humour shut up shop for the festive period. Scrooge on duty.????

Someone has to given that you seem incapable of doing it yourselves.

Oh for Pete's sake. I have no idea if all UK supermarkets were full over Christmas ???? On second thoughts, I give in ????️ Have it your way. Every supermarket in the UK was full over the Christmas period. Your experience is all the necessary and sufficient proof needed for any proposition. If you tell me that you saw a fairy and a leprechaun arguing at the bottom of your garden about who gets first ride on the unicorn then I'm a believer.

It's unimportant. I was being facetious.

I doubt that many people read every report but one only needs to read the newspaper summaries to get an idea of what's going on. You say that you have little interest in the effects of Brexit and can't make a valid comment, but you have nevertheless continuously stated that Brexit has had a lesser effect than Covid and the war in Ukraine on the UK economy. Yes it is complex, which is why there shouldn't have been an over-simplistic 'In'/'Out' referendum. Perhaps the economy should have been the major issue (unless 'Leavers' are content to see themselves made poorer)? Different factors affect individual nations to differing degrees. I have no evidence to support the following - I can't be bothered to search for it - but I would imagine that the war in Ukraine has had a greater effect on mainland Europe - especially Germany and Eastern Europe - than the UK. Likewise, Brexit has probably negatively affected Belgium and the Netherlands more than it has Croatia. Again, I have no evidence to support this statement. No. Why would I suggest that? Again, I lack evidence but I imagine that Brexit has had some effect on EU inflation; however, it will vary from member state to member state. I have no idea how big the effect might be in each of the member states.

Spot the difference: "Well, I am quite sure that it wasn't just the supermarket that I went to which was full of shoppers and its the same up and down the Country in all the supermarkets ..."

Took me a bit longer than I thought it would but here you are (from p.77): "Well, I am quite sure that it wasn't just the supermarket that I went to which was full of shoppers and its the same up and down the Country in all the supermarkets ..."

Mods, Please introduce a 'Sigh' button.

Mac, You have never acknowledged that Brexit has played a SIGNIFICANT part in the UK's economic woes, neither have you produced any evidence to support your claim that Covid and Ukraine have had more effect than Brexit.

I am not doubting what you say you have seen. I can only repeat myself once again. The point - which you either cannot or refuse to grasp - is that you cannot extrapolate your experiences and claim that they apply to the rest of the UK without supporting evidence. These experiences may - or may not - be representative of the rest of the country.

No smoke without fire.

Please spare me the sanctimonious, victimised claptrap. If you've posted this link previously why didn't you simply point this out in your original reply and direct me to your original post? Alternatively, are you suggesting that I accept each of your pronouncements as factual without question? If so, this is (misplaced) arrogance personified on your part. There are far too many counter-examples to allow me to do that e.g. your continual refusal to accept that Brexit has caused significant damage to the UK economy despite the wealth of data presented to support this view. Good supporting evidence (provided by a link to a Guardian article!). Looking forward to similar links to support your other contentions.

A purely altruistic venture on the part of you and your organisation? Highly commendable. Actually we don't as there doesn't appear to be an agreed definition of "globalization" or it's attributes/ aims. Your interpretation doesn't match mine. No lobbying done by your company then?

I think that you are a Brit who lives and works in Thailand? If so, you are the living embodiment of globalisation and imo it's unfair if the rest of the world are laughing at you for living this woke, white, middle class Liberal fantasy of yours.

???? So you're reduced to trolling yet again. On the off chance that is not the case, I will try to explain one last time the problem with using personal experience as evidence for the wider population. All of what you state is correct with the exception of the final phrase ("... that is common for the whole of the UK"). Taking your post at face value. I received a utility credit; I know people who have cut back on utility usage and I have seen busy supermarkets so yes, you're right, two of us have experienced the same thing: it's not just you. Your statement is logically correct. However, you cannot then extrapolate our shared observations and say that it ".. is common for the whole of the UK" (unless "common" is defined as a minimum of two people). In order to reach that conclusion, you would need to analyse the data from a statistical sound survey e.g. a survey of individuals who are representative of the UK population as a whole, not just two individuals based in London. The comments that you are posting are personal opinion and not facts as you infer. They have less validity and are less reliable than findings from survey data.

That definitely is a matter of opinion (poll or no poll)

Said Del Boy to Rodney

Maybe but it doesn't make it any more or less true than good news.

The point that I - and others who reply to you - are making is that you, me or anyone else cannot use our individual observations and experience and pass it off as representative of the UK as a whole.

That's as maybe but plenty remain (HSBC for one): The IT industry covers a multitude of disciplines, many of which are not customer facing. Of course, no way of knowing, but I'd wager on a net transfer of jobs out of the UK. In any event, it's all hypothetical. There is no sign of a trade deal being done with a large nation any time soon.

Yes. Some do, some don't. Again no doubt true in some cases not in others. To a lesser or greater degree, yes but what's the point of this whole theme? That your experience is the 'mean' and/or 'median' experience of the UK population? And the other side of this coin is that if you were to believe the claims of Brexit supporters living in Thailand, the streets of London will be paved in gold some time in the (undefined) future.