pookondee

7 hours ago, jacko45k said:

You complain when people try to help you out?

I must admit the idea of killing visas is an odd thing to say...they 'expire'....

 

No, of course not. Certainly appreciate all the free help. 

I was commenting on when asking a simple yes or no question..

People will tend not to just say yay or nay..

instead they go on with a lot of

un-decipherable claptrap that indeed proves how much they know, but still doesn't really answer the original simple question.

we are not all immigration experts!!

21 hours ago, Andrew Dwyer said:

Yup, definitely staged, all the trash is relatively clean and easy to sweep up.

Where is the Pepsi or Coffee stains or the half eaten noodles or som tam ??

 

Either the tenants tried to stage some protest ( without actually doing any damage ) or the landlady has a beef with the tenants and created this “ show “ ( again without damaging her own property ) .

Who knows ??, but more to this story than she is telling.

There is an endless amount of possible scenarios..

The guy could have discovered his gf was crazy, and did a midnight runner.

The Gf, left alone, could have then trashed the place in revenge, or just in rage..

and left, since she would not want to be left to pay rent.

It wouldn't be the first time a guy has left an appartment and forfeited the deposit because of a crazy gf.

The things scattered around

(like the air-freshener for example)

hardly look to be the typical kinds of things that dirty slothfull people would keep.

The power bill is also suspicious.

How the หell can a condo rack up a 4k monthly bill with no-one there ?

Could be a revenge move, someone turning the aircon on and leaving it to run 24/7.

So yeah, maybe something else going on..

1. They have every foreigners address reporting on thousands of papers.

Also we must all go to immigration or pass through a border or airport sooner or later. 

Why can't these people (supposedly) not paying bills be caught up with??

I seem to recall, even a few Ex Isaan GFs claimed they could get me stopped and in trouble at the airport. 

So why cant the authorities do it? 

lol.

2. I currently read about this Thai 30baht health scheme...

So surely millions of Thais are getting free health care, 

which must be what is essentually a "loss" of billions upon billions?

Consider the amount of foriegn currency being brought into Thailand by tourists, longstayers and money in bank for visa..

Then consider the loss of a few foreigners not paying bills against a nation of Thai people racking up billions on free healthcare..

it must be minuscule in comparison.

Nup, this is just a nasty, nasty move, however you want to look at it.

Its virtually saying:

" Thailand is for Thais..

 we dont care how much you farang bring in, support our poor (whom we dont care about)

buy homes you cant own..etc etc..

you farang will NOT be allowed to get away with 1 satang"

21 minutes ago, Tayaout said:

Agree with that but they don't seem to care about denial stamp at land border. If denied at a land border at least you get to walk back instead of being detained and having to buy a last minute ticket. 

Ok, i can now see where you are coming from on that point. 

19 minutes ago, Tayaout said:

Yes, I was on my way to marry my pregnant girlfriend when I was denied. If the situation was different I would've moved elsewhere. 

ok, sorry to hear that.

That is very poor form by Immigration then.

Did you try to get the officers to talk to your GF on the phone?

1 hour ago, Max69xl said:

The O-A incl. ME the first year. The second year you need a re-entry permit when leaving the country and coming back. Without the re-entry permit you will kill the O-A when leaving. What's confusing?  

I got that, but it seems whatever is written, someone else will pipe up with a different theory.

and then others muddy the waters by  arguing over terminology.

Many questions like mine could have been answered with a simple

 "yes thats right"

or

"no, thats wrong"

-but instead people waffle on with a lot of hogwash, that still makes one second guess

7 hours ago, Tayaout said:

The problem start when you had previous long term visa or you stay often for long period of time on tourist visa which isn't the case for most visitors. If you are at risk of being denied for these reasons then flying to KL might save you a lot of time and money. Then you can still get back via land border. I'm talking from experience! 

Amazing Thailand must have something very amazing for you to go to those lengths.

I will sooner go to Vietnam, Phillipines or Laos, out of principle, if/when Thailand does that to me.

15 hours ago, baboon said:

But they would be sent back to KL / Ho Chi Minh or wherever. Not their home country. 

And then what?

Try to get back into Thailand again, through the back door?

If the IMM officer stamps something not so good in his passport, or puts a note on his file, 

he could get rejected again at an entry point and be in trouble again. 

9 minutes ago, lkv said:

I get it, you don't, and keep using wrong terminology.

 

Start using terms like "permission of stay".

 

That's what he is "killing".

Id say you 2 guys arguing the toss over terminology is actually more confusing than anything said anywhere.

I for one have read both your arguments and am totally confused.

I thought you could get a normal O-A, (at one price) which is "killable" as you say..

but its also possible to get multi-entry O-A ( at a higher price) which i suppose is not killable??

37 minutes ago, kingofthemountain said:

It's exactly what i am saying

when you are on extension of stay with 800 000 bahts in a Thai bank

there is no difference between an initail OA holder and an intial O holder

except one need insurance and one not, can you explain to me why?

You answered it yourself.

The classes you mention both have the money in a THAI bank.

The new O-A (got from another country) has money in the bank back home.

Quite obvious, its easier for a hospital to pull a patients funds out of a Thai ATM here

Rather than gamble and wait for money being sent from abroad 

I think its that simple.

22 minutes ago, Max69xl said:

Yes, but now let's assume we're talking about applying for each Visa on Monday. Guy B now knows he needs an insurance covering at least 400k. Depending on where he's from, it will cost him. The age factor is really important. Just above 50 isn't that expensive, but from 65-66, it starts to get real expensive. Will this guy go for an O-A Visa? 

 

Guy A has the money and can afford parking them in a thai bank, like you and I. He'll go for his O Visa, and if he isn't that old,he can get an insurance in Thailand with better coverage than 400k and cheaper. 

So, i guess you are saying it comes down to the quality/price/value, of the insurance?

I'd say most people are aware that typical insurance companies ALL try to negate every possible thing you might claim on.

And they will only pay once for any new condition, after that its a "pre-existing" condition.

In any in any case, premiums skyrocket IF you get a claim.

It really is money for nothing IMO.

(but thats an argument for another day)

If i am forced, Id sooner pick the absolute cheapest, because i expect ill get xxxx'd around in any case when going to claim or renew.

Really, Governments everywhere dont always consider all the issues when making these such "blanket" decisions.

Lets hope all these issues somehow reach the ears of the Thai decision makers.

I cant possibly think of an answer for the very old "uninsurable" or those with pre-existing conditions the companies wont touch.

1 minute ago, Max69xl said:

A)

The person with the O when extending it 1 year needs at least 800k in a thai bank and "can never go below 400k". No insurance needed,but 400k in a Thai bank.

B)

The guy with the O-A when applying at home shows the money, at least 800k he's got in a bank back home, but then he can spend his money from day one (if he wants to of course). He's got "no money in a thai bank". Insurance covering minimum of 400k needed. 

 

Do you understand what I'm getting at? 

 

I know you werent talking to me, but

It also depends IF he can get long term cover for a stay in Thailand.

Many western companies just flat-out refuse to honour claims from places like Thailand. 

For me, id sooner keep money in Thai bank (knowing i can eventually spend all) instead of giving xxxbaht to insurance companies for BS policy.

18 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

Reminder on posts about persons denied:

 

- Post #71:

 

- Post #112:

 

- Post #112:

  14 hours ago, rickudon said:

Heads up for those of you who originally entered Thailand on an OA and then got an annual extension - have a friend who was forced to take out the Thai 400,000 baht insurance to get his extension - even though he has been on extensions for 9 years. It was either that or leave the country and start again.

May have just been a rogue IO WITH THEIR OWN INTERPRETATION OF THE RULES but maybe not ....

I think the OA visa is now effectively

dea

18 minutes ago, Pattaya46 said:

Reminder on posts about persons denied:

 

- Post #71:

 

- Post #112:

 

 

10 minutes ago, Peter Denis said:

Good point!

That would explain why the health insurance is only required when applying for an OA type Visa.

Previously (before Oct 31), after validity of the original O or OA Visa expired, the requirements for extension of stay of both type Visas were identical.

However if IO now requires health insurance for extensions of stay from an original OA, and does NOT require health insurance for O-type Visa extensions based on retirement, while all other requirements for both permissions to stay are identical, that's rather strange.  If that would indeed be the case (waiting for more real live cases to have it confirmed), for sure OA Visa holders that need to apply for an extension of stay will now consider what road they want to go:

1. Apply for extension of their original OA Visa, and grudgingly pay for the almost worthless thai insurance;

2. KIll their original OA Visa by leaving Thailand without a re-entry permit (or simply letting it expire), and then apply for a Non Imm O Visa based on retirement and then apply for an extension of stay of their new O type Visa (as that does NOT require thai health insurance).

The 3rd option being to return to their home-country, and re-apply for a Non Imm OA Visa and - grudgingly - pay for the health insurance.  That 3rd option would get them the benefit of 2 year IO hassle-free stay in Thailand without the money on thai bank-account requirement.

Note: For those holders of OA Visas or permissions to stay based on original OA Visa, that are over 75 or 80 years of age, only option 2 remains, as they would not be able to qualify for the restrictive thai health insurance.  When in future - as some are predicting - the health insurance requirement would also be imposed on permissions to stay for O-type Visas based on retirement, the only way to stay in Thailand would be to make quarterly border-runs to apply for a new Non Imm O type Visa or go for an Elite Visa.

 

I still hope that the requirement for health insurance on permissions to stay for original OA Visas issued before Oct 31, will be dismissed as a misunderstanding by over-zealous immigration officers, but the first case of someone being denied his permission to stay on the above is already in so it doesn't look good...

 

 

 

 

Someone has already been denied extension of stay for not having Insurance?

Can you please share the source/thread you heard this?

2 hours ago, GeorgeCross said:

 

yeah thats what i thought - kind of blows the whole "thai insurance money grab" conspiracy theory out of the water

 

 

Maybe, but consider how long the bombardment of insurance adds on our social media, and where they come from..

Also, if it turns out that many people will need insurance for an extension of stay,

i will wager many of them end up lining the pockets of the Thai insurance company execs,

who, for a long time, must have been lobbying the government and poking the hospitals to lie and exaggerate the losses of these farangs that skip bills

Remember, its not only the insurance companies that profit, but the bigger companies that "under-write" them,

the hospitals who charge more for farang..

and probably even authorities getting kickbacks..

There are many mouths getting a piece of the pie in the insurance scam,

especially when farangs are the target!

if you want further proof, consider this..

there are millions of Thais getting essentially free healthcare on this 30baht scheme..

so in effect they are "loosing" billions of baht there,

comparing that loss to that of (supposed) farangs running out on bills must be miniscule..

(and Thais on 30baht scheme would not spend as much, and certainly dont bring other currency into Thailand)..

so who will be loosing out? with this chasing away of farangs?

The Thai authorities are acting like your typical farangs ex-Thai GF with all this.

Many a farangs ex GF didnt know how incredibly good and easy they had it with free money and everything else...

until the farang left for good..

then there were tears!

22 minutes ago, sometimewoodworker said:

You are dead wrong, and have confused the OA visa and an extension of stay.

 

what I said was "At the moment the best choice for most people who have had an OA that has been extended”

note if you have an extension you DO NOT have a visa it has expired 

 

It is specifically required for an extension of stay and people who have gone into immigration offices are being told that the insurance WILL be required, police order 548/2562 section 2.22 item 6

I did not address the point of current visa holders before.
 

However if you currently have a valid Non-OA VISA entry during it’s validity is being stated as not requiring insurance so you may well have a grace period, that depends on the date it expires, of up to 2 years. Though if you have to extend it you WILL need insurance.

 

 

Your last sentance is quite bold,

making a statement of what WILL happen, when your talking about Thai immigration! 

Since itseems nothing coming from individual officers or even IMMs itself is even clear or consistent as yet.

No offence, but as i said, i would wait to see what happens before taking any strategic action. 

Judging by the sad responses here, no wonder Thai women act and think the way they do.

Many no-hoper farangs here just trawl websites with the ultimate goal to get (what they know as) "free sex".. from a "normal" girl.

Its a big challenge, since they (quite rightly) are used to paying for it..

and maybe its best that way, if the animal urges appear and they

have no want/intention for anything else.

Strangely enough, ladies here (and also in other places) believe sex is a commitment that leads to other expectations..

Strange they should have the ability to see straight through the "belt notchers".

they seen it all before i think

BTW,

As a rule, the normal Thai are not big on kissing.

If they are, it might be a red flag that they have been westernised, by either completely innocent ways, or by having been with many farang or working in certain other industries.

On 10/26/2019 at 9:00 PM, sometimewoodworker said:

At the moment the best choice for most people who have had an OA that has been extended is to leave THAILAND at a convenient time before renewal without a reentry permit to the nearest or most convenient embassy/consulate then get a Non-O and extended that either on the basis of marriage (if married) or retirement if not. 
 

if you already have a reentry permit then you need to take your trip so you will arrive at the consulate or embassy after your current extension finishes.

But what if the insurance is NOT required for already existing O-A holders?

You have gone to considerable expense for nothing, 

and thrown away a perfectly good means of using extensions of stay,

on what MIGHT happen.

There is a lot of silly scaremongering going on here.

The order has been repeated many times that its for new O-As from ones own country.

"NEW" visa, as in the opposite to an O-A already in your passport..

Another hint, they are saying:

"when entering Thailand"

So, when you go to get extension of stay, on your old O-A, are you actually entering the country?

Again, the vetting of the insurance papers (written in your language) 

 for your "NEW" O-A will be done in your own country, by the Thai consulate that issues the new visa. 

There has been nothing in the orders that suggests already existing O-A holders will need insurance.

Only a few 2nd, 3rd and 4th hand reports that some IMMs officers have said they will..

and that is not worth banking on IMO.

if it was me, and providing i had time left on my extension, id be waiting to see what happens.

1 minute ago, Max69xl said:

Why would the info come from western embassies/consulates? People who are interested in visas to Thailand are supposed to visit Thai embassies/consulates websites all over the world. I and also others still think that O-A Visas issued earlier won't need an insurance when entering Thailand October 31 or later.

Umm..because it is western consulates who are issuing the Non O-A visa?

No Thai consulates in my country have added anything about any health insurance requirement to their list of documents you need to produce to get the visa.

6 hours ago, Peter Denis said:

It's less than 36 hours before the new requirement will come into force.

For sure all Immigration officers that are expected to enforce the new health insurance regulation, will have been briefed by now on how to deal with OA Visa holders entering Thailand from Nov 1 on.

And surely there must be several TVF members with connections to Immigration officers, that queried them on what will happen.

So why do we not hear anything from them?

Or maybe the whole thing turns out to be a re-make of the last episode of Twin Peaks (it was nothing but a dream).

 

Possibly wishfull thinking from a health insurance exec/owner who has been encouraged by..

well..umm...lets just say people who make money off social media clicks?

consider this:  if this rule is to be enforced end of October, then why havent the foreign consulates been notifying people applying weeks ago?

and why isnt there any mention of it on the foreign consulates websites?

 advising of the new requirements? 

If people have been recieving O-As in their passports in the last few weeks (without insurance) and unbeknown about the whole thing, does that mean they all will be denied entry tomorrow?

I think weve all been conned

4 hours ago, fcbkk said:

yep all points ring a bell for me too. Would you have a link or a name to good lessens that you would recommend on Youtube?

you can start to search for

"ThaiwithMod" 

She is quite good and covers a few issues that im sure youll get something out of.

"SpeakThaieasy" is another girl who makes amusing vids.

but "Thaipod101" probably has the biggest collection of no nonsense lessons

I don't care what anyone says,

"Hearing" is definately a harder a skill than memorizing and speaking, simply because you cant really study for it.

In our own language, our hearing is not honed, since we don't have to listen intently to every word said to get the jist

of the conversation.

In Thai, you need to know the different tones of many similar words, (sometimes only helped by knowing the context of the sentance/subject).

Also confusing when they are shortening words, mixing Isaan words in, or using slang.

Then even English loanwords can throw you off (with the Thai pronunciation) if you are expecting a Thai word..

(like "series"= SeeREE)

The only thing for it is time and experience and talking/listening to Thais talking, amongst themselves,

on TV etc

There is no substitute, although there are many Thai people doing great lessons on Youtube.

40 minutes ago, the guest said:

Hopefully EU will also follow suit, time to show Thailand that the world dissaproves the way it treats foreigners.

Except it has absolutely nothing to do with how Thailand treats foreigners.

US revoking the favourable way they have treated imports of Thai seafood would suggest (as they are saying) that it is all about labour practices and the human rights abuses in the Thai seafood industry.

43 minutes ago, SteveK said:

Whilst applying for my first non-O extension, I overheard a conversation between an IO and an Australian gentleman doing the same. She very clearly told him that next year he WILL need insurance to renew the extension so it will be applying to existing extension holders, at least at the Ubon office.

 

Surely it should be money in the bank OR insurance?

So they are applying their own rules?

Sounds like many will have to wait see what rules their local IMMs office want to make up, then move provinces if needs be.