MyPenRye

Canada...? Maybe that explains a lot.

I don't smoke, but I see smokers as the last line of defense in some ways between the well-intended fascist majority in America from getting at me (e.g. regulating alcohol and fat intake). I miss the days when one could go to the back of the plane and spend quality time with people who, to generalize, are a much more fun-loving crowd than non-smokers.

Luckily, most of Asia is far, far away from infringing on freedom like that.

Live and let live. Don't worry. Mai pen rai...

Not sure about the ... "Canada ...? Maybe that explains a lot." comment ! Not sure what kind of inference you can make about Canadians as they come from all over the world, but ... maybe you are right,... all Canadians are idiots!

Fascism and regulation of alcohol, tobacco, and fat intake? Yikes! Believe me! I am far from being a fascist and I believe in legalisation of drugs (all of them)! You can drink what you want and smoke what you want, as long as you don't kill me while driving and don't kill me with your smoke! If that's the kind of regulation you are talking about, then, yes, I am for that, and if that makes me a fascist in your eyes, so be it ! You see, your freedom ends where mine starts! I hope you understand! But,... I think this is off-topic!

I hope all enjoy dancing at the Lotus!

Thanks for the kind words and support. Non-smokers have the right to support each other, considering Thai laws, which seem to change for the better. Hopefully, night clubs will be included soon in the anti-smoking laws.

I hope the dancing and the music at the Lotus is enjoyable. (It might be a good idea to advertise this place to other people as I am afraid that it needs a lot of people to make it worthwhile going, as not many people know about it and as it is a bit out of the way).

Where are the figures to support your statement that NON smokers are the majority. I assume youare talking about Chiang Mai. In my experience the majority of Thias smoke!

In Canada, smokers are a minority (http://www.hc-sc.gc.ca/hl-vs/tobac-tabac/research-recherche/stat/ctums-esutc/fs-if/2003/2003-smok-fum_e.html). I do not have --nor do I need-- stats for Thailand as it is clear that a clear majority of Thais (women and men) are non-smokers (probably lower than in Canada). That's another reason I love this country. If only the whisky manufacturers could be prevented from advertising their products in movies and elsewhere, then Thailand would be paradise on Earth, because --sadly-- Thais have been brainwashed to drink and get drunk. But, I digress.

On a previous post, I wrote that I was sad that most Asians do not seem to like to dance on a dance floor. I apologize. I meant most Thais. I have seen many Chinese and many Philippinos, for instance, who seem to enjoy dancing on dance floors --outside of Thailand, that is.

By the way, I do not wish to change Thai culture, although I think ALL cultures --like people-- need to grow and evolve sometimes. I am not advocating here that Thai people would be better off if they were to dance like we do in the West, by the way). I was just describing my own feelings about what they like or dislike. I do not wish to transform all Thai night-clubs into Western-looking establisments. That would be silly and inconsiderate. I like Thailand because it is different from other places around the world. Do I like everything that Thailand has to offer? No. I do not like everything that my own country has to offer. However, I would think that most Thai people do NOT like barking dogs at 3 a.m. ! I also think that many foreigners do not like drunken bar customers killing other while driving here or in Thailand ! ALL cultures need to change to make certain aspects of their culture fair and liveable for most people. That is why we have laws and laws are arbitrary and change all the time.

My original post was written to inform people who enjoy a dance floor (and preferably non-smoking dance floors), music/songs with words that they can understand, that there is such a place. Considering that there are few places in Chiang Mai where one can dance on a dance floor to English music (period), I was hoping to bring people who are non-smokers to the Lotus, giving non-smokers a non-smoking alternative. If smokers want to go to the Lotus, fine. I cannot prevent this. Personally though, if smokers were to want to smoke there, it would clearly show those people's lack of respect for non-smokers. There are 2 places where smokers can go to. I have seen many somokers respect others and smoke outside. The weather is such that this is not such a bad experience. Is it too much to ask to have one place for non-smokers? I think this is reasonable considering that non-smokers are the majority. Sure, the law is such that anyone can do what they want. I wonder though if people would be more reasonable (like I feel I am) whether or not we would need draconian rules like the ones that are being legislated in many countries around the world.

I would appreciate if people would post their experience at the Lotus.

My first thoughts were along the lines of "Hey, you're in Thailand don't expect a Lyceum ballroom round every corner. If you want your favourite piece of farangville set in Thailand set it up yourself".

Then I thought that no, the guy doesn't like certain places, OK no worries mate, and has found one he likes. Problem is it has not sufficient custom to support it long term. So he's on TV drumming up some support, no problem in that.

>> Thank you for trying to understand my motives and my post. You are almost right! While I understand that Thais prefer the night-clubs where there are tables around which they can drink --or get drunk-- and dance, I also understand that there are many foreigners who are non-smokers who prefer to go to a night-club to dance like they are used to in their own country. I would think that there are many foreigners, many CUSTOMERS that do not like cigarette smoke, getting cancer, and dancing around a table/drinking around a table. In my country, smokers are a minority.

But then his final paragraph indicates that he welcomes smokers only if they smoke outside. Is this his rule or that of the said establishment? Thailand does not prohibit smoking in all public places, it sensibly allows for personal choice unlike the pussy whipped europeans that feel government is there to impose restrictions on freedom.

>> I am not too sure what you are complaining about. There are at least 2 places where smokers who enjoy dancing on a dance flloor can go to in Chiang Mai. 2. Us, non-smokers have none. ZERO. And I think I have found a place which has a dance floor and a place which has the potential for clean air, and you think it is alright for you smokers to come there too to kill us. I think this is very inconsiderate --and criminal, in fact-- to oblige others to breathe your smoke. I wonder how would you feel if I came with a stink ball in those places where smokers are happy to make the air unbreathable for others? In fact, I wonder how would you feel if I came in your neighbourhood with some radioactive plutonium in my pocket to talk things over coffee? Now, I understand that you are seeing the writing on the wall. Many countries in Europe AND a few countries in North-America are forbidding people to smoke in public places. PERIOD. As a non-smoker (as you might have guessed), I appreciate these laws, but I think there are too draconian. I think that establishments should/could advertise themselves as smoking or non-smoking and let customers go where they want. If some inconsiderate smokers would go to a non-smoking establishment and start smoking, then the police would come and fine them or remove them. Societies need to have rules so that people can find ways to deal with others' desires, preferences, or criminal behaviour in the fairest way possible for all. By the way, I am flabbergasted that anyone could equate smoking with being brave. While it is brave to die for a cause, I think smoking is a pretty pathetic cause to die for. I would think that there are many other worthy causes to die for. Even so, philosophically speaking, I think it is debatable whether or not even the notion of dying for a cause is a positive respond, as I think --at the end fo the day-- it usually exacerbates the situation.

Anyway this aint an smoking/non-smoking thread so I'll shut up except to say that is is the establishment owner/manager that should set the rules based on his/her knowledge of their customers. Maybe if they went for a tour of their competition they'd change the music style to hip-hop, techno etc and get some custom.

>> You mean ... customers, I think. Again, this is a matter of public health policy. No one would accept someone to go in a public place with a gun and start shooting people. This is what smoking is about. Smoking kills people. (I hope you know so.) And, by the way, I would hope that designated smoking establishments would choose employees who smoke to work there. It is true that these people have a choice to work there or not, though. But, I think that it would be the role of the government to help people know which establishment is non-smoking or smoking so that emplyees --and customers-- can make the best decision.

I am glad to read that there are some people who appreciate a good dance floor, a good band, good songs that have a variety of rythms, and a non-smoking environment. It is too bad that most Asians don't seem eager to dance on a dance floor. However, is it a case of smart night club managers/owners to not offer a dance floor and playing the music so loud one cannot speak, forcing --in effect-- people to drink and spent? What's next? Salt on the floor? Sauna-like temperatures? Semi-naked women dancing the night away?

I have lived in CM now for 2 seasons and have been disappointed with night clubs. If it is for Thais, there is not a dancing floor and the music/songs are in Thai. When there is a bit more of a dancing floor and English music, it is hip-hop and/or a club with no smoking restrictions (like Bubbles and Spicy). Riverside does not have much of a dance floor.

So, where can one dance like in the old country in CM?

Well! There is this little gem. It is located on the second floor in the Lotus Hotel (near Kad Suan Kaew, off Huay Kaew Road, behind the Chiang Mai Orchid). There is a 5 band member Philipino band singing and playing English classic English or Latin songs (if you request them). The floor is huge. The sound is not too loud. The lighting is not too bright or too dark. There are plenty places to sit. The place is huge and I would think smoking would be dissipated fast into the air. The buffet is not great, but some of the a la carte dishes are not bad. The drinks are the usual price for a night club (a bit less than Bubbles though). I think the band plays every night except one. Starting time is 10 pm. The singer is a good-looking woman with a good voice and a real presence. The guitarist is real good.

People,... support this place before it dies. There are not that many people going to it because the marketing sucks. Go there instead of Bubbles (which has DJs playing hip-hop all night long in a smoky atmosphere and drinks that are in the 100 Baths for beer and such). If you are so inclined go to Spicy after, but beware of the smoke and the withdrawal symptoms the day after.

PS: Smokers: Could you please do everyone a favour and smoke outside so that WE non-smoker do NOT get cancer, headaches, and do NOT have to wash our clothes the next day? Thanks for your cooperation.

Issues:

Watch out for at least one of the guards, who goes by the name of Lucky. I tried to establish a friendship with him and he tried to exploit the situation. He --and his uninvited relatives (the old lady runnning the little shop)-- got a free dinner, but they lost a whole lot more.

The staff tried to ding me for some damages that were present before I rented the one apartment. I took pictures of the damages (with date stamp) with my dig. camera and that made them changed their mind.

A package that I left with them for a friend disappeared in spite of clear information given.

Doors of apartments need some kind of sound proofing.

It is a bit of a pain that it is forbidden to put posters in one's apartment without being asked to pay for the holes in the wall. They should think of running a wire so that people can hang pictures.

The restaurant owner is the most unhappy and unappreciative fellow I have ever met in my life and his wife/GF is as straight as a hullahoop. She was unable to tell me something that she thought I could not do, but told her husband who then proceeded to reprimand me the next day. These people do not have a clue how to run a business. Where are the umbrellas for the tables? WOuldn't that provide more business during the afternoon?

And BTW, if you are so easygoing, why do you insist that things be done your way? I think you failed logic 101.

1) The discussion starts at a certain time (+/-15 min.).

2) They deal with one major topic.

3) Participants can speak or listen, but when they speak, they should not speak for hours.

4) Participants should order something from the restaurant.

If one judges how long your replies, one wonders if you are really that easygoing, as you claim, or it is all part of a show? Knowing you, I'll take the latter.

BTW, if you have not figure out yet,... my name is not French guy, but MyPenRye. Were you a bully in an earlier life?

I am running this free, using my own time, and I have to put up with this nonsense.

For a guy who states time and time again that everyone should be more relax, I wonder why youy cannot be more relax about the few rules that are intended to make the discussions fair and pleasant for all involved.

Just show up, follow a few rules (to make things fair for everyone), talk and listen, and then continue your stated course of action for the night.

Much ado about nothing ... as far as I am concerned.

T22:

I have stated my position. You have stated yours. We do not agree with each other. We are at an impasse.

Since you seem to have lots of time on your hands,...

Here is my advice:

1) Reduce the amount of time you spent on TV and channel all that energy in a different way,

2) Start a new group in the location you want (since you complained about travelling that far), using the terms and conditions you want, instead of trying to change an event to suit your needs and desires.

3) Don't show up to my event, if you don't like it.

SIMPLE. NO?

I've heard that "Riverside" and "Spices"'are night clubs were one can actually dance on a dance floor (as opposed to around your own table), making it actually possible to connect with people. Any others? Thanks.

Although I have found most tuk-tuk drivers duplicitous in applying budhism philosophy, most accidents of this sort do occur because of the rampant scale of alcoholism brought upon by unbearable living conditions of Thai males and Western males (slaves of women [sic]), corporations, materialistic brainwashing, and greed AND tuk-tuk drivers --at the end of the day-- having ALSO to pay for having sex with Thai girls!

As long as woman will continue to charge men for having sex with them and men be stupid enough to pay, this and other events of the sort will occur. I think it is important to dig a bit deeper to find the real causes of these and other issues. However, I do think also that a fair system for all for charging for fares would be to the benefit of all, except the tukl-tuk drivers who scam new tourists, of course. If one is happy for the service (no scamming), then it would be a good idea to reward the tuk-tuk driver with a bit of a tip.

PS: I have had as good and positive experiences with Thai people as I have with other people of other cultures as I have had bad experiences. People are people. Let's remember that +/- 10% of the population of any country does own +/- 50% of the wealth of a country. Most of them are men. And most are men because most women tell all men that sex has a cost and most women have outrageous and dysfunctional needs. (Of course, things are more complex than this, but I am not going to write a book here.)

Are you real? "tuk-tuk drivers duplicitous in applying budhism philosophy". <deleted> are you talking about?

I respect budhism as a philosophy, but it has to go beyond the nice FAKE smiles and the accompanied lie that most foreigners have to endure. That's the duplicity I am talking about. True! Not all Thais lie. Poverty/greed/showing off might be a reason for some of them to lie. Paying for their sexual gratification --considering how frigid most Thai (normal) women are-- might be a reason why they feel a need to oversell and over-represent themselves (lie). Many tuk-tuk drivers, especially in the South seem to have a propensity for lying (the place you are travelling to is always 2 km no matter where you are) and harassing people. Do we need to have to respond to their "tuktuk, Sir" (like we have to endure the "you handsome"" lies from the greedy bar-girls from Patong)? We are not all stupid.

Although I have found most tuk-tuk drivers duplicitous in applying budhism philosophy, most accidents of this sort do occur because of the rampant scale of alcoholism brought upon by unbearable living conditions of Thai males and Western males (slaves of women [sic]), corporations, materialistic brainwashing, and greed AND tuk-tuk drivers --at the end of the day-- having ALSO to pay for having sex with Thai girls!

As long as woman will continue to charge men for having sex with them and men be stupid enough to pay, this and other events of the sort will occur. I think it is important to dig a bit deeper to find the real causes of these and other issues. However, I do think also that a fair system for all for charging for fares would be to the benefit of all, except the tukl-tuk drivers who scam new tourists, of course. If one is happy for the service (no scamming), then it would be a good idea to reward the tuk-tuk driver with a bit of a tip.

PS: I have had as good and positive experiences with Thai people as I have with other people of other cultures as I have had bad experiences. People are people. Let's remember that +/- 10% of the population of any country does own +/- 50% of the wealth of a country. Most of them are men. And most are men because most women tell all men that sex has a cost and most women have outrageous and dysfunctional needs. (Of course, things are more complex than this, but I am not going to write a book here.)

It is clear that you prefer this to be a chat group, but I prefer something a bit more structured, where people delve into the chosen topic on a deeper level. Please see the annotation below. If this does not suit you, feel free to start a group that fits what you want.

like what i had told you .. i will be at the meeting . but will be late .. the same answer which i had for you the last 2 meeting .. notthing had change .

>> This is news to me. If you told me, I did not understand that. This was not clear to me at all.

we did not go over a older topic during the chat .. and i did not request any backdating . of the topic ..

>> BUT, how would you know what you talked about was not already talked about?

for me is just chit chat any topic would do ..

>> FOR YOU, but we are not YOU. We know what YOU want. I don't want what YOU want. I created this group and I know what I want. There is a time for superficial discussions wandering from one topic to another and there is a time when some people might be interesting in delving in a topic on a deeper level.

too much rule here . making it boring ..

>> FOR YOU, but some people like rules, especially when others break them. Rules are useful to make sure that things are fair and safe for all involved. Some people don't like to be interrupted. Some people don't like to sit there just listening to one person speak. That's why we have rules. Rules are sometimes good.

the chit chat is alot of fun . is all this rule needed ?

>> YOU like chit chatting, I find it really boring. Repeating banalities and unrelated facts on unrelated topics is boring for me.

can't it be a free and easy thing .

>> You are more than free to start your own group where you set that rule that there should not be any rules ! In the meantime, I tend to prefer something a bit more structured. This does not mean that I do allow groups to wonder off, but at some point of time, it is useful to bring things back to explore the chosen topic fully. There is nothing boring about that.

especially when is like a causal meeting . unless this is some kinda lab test .

>> I don't envisage anything of that sort. YOU are making a caricature of what I want. I am not as rigid as you would like me to be or the structure of the discussions to be. I like a bit of a structure. I recognized that on one occasion I got carried away with too much structure. To be fair, there were 2 non-native speakers that might have made this happen.

i am sure most people had their perosnal commitment too .

>> Yours might be different than others.

and most people is here to relax . and find more friends i believe .

>> True, but not entirely true. But, also some people would like to be challenged intellectually. NOt all of us want superficial analyses of things.

.

The group i was in , seem to be doing well cos we are sitting very close .. and giving alot of attention to every speaker.

>> Not all people were pleased. Some people felt that some people spoke too much. And, In my group I felt that some people had a tough time hearing some people's comments. This is why I prefer smaller groups. This is a way to meet people and to get to know what they really think on a deeper level.

so far i don't see any problem..

>> I do and I am not the only one.

how about your group . seem to be sitting kinda part . and also have 3 non english speaker .

your group might be harder .

>> Yes! more difficult.

we chit chat abit on the the iraq topic and we freestyle onto other topic ..

>> Other topics? YOu mean sub-topics?

i think the key factor is people get to meet up and enjoy a good evening .

don't be so rigid . so what if some come late or early

>> YOU are trying to shape this group into what YOU want. As I said, I want something a bit more structured. I want to learn something from others beside making potential friendships with others.

everyone have their choice plus .. like i said . i don't mind joining a group and just listen ..

unless someone ask my view of cos .

let reply on forum .. so your view can be shared also ..

notthig to hide of cos as usual .

relax is just a meeting ..

>> YOU keep repeating things. It feels like brainwashing. I am not that rigid. I resent you trying to make me look like I am. I think you are too lax.

you don't even get paid for it . is not a job . is not a service .

>> That's right! I do this for free and I would like all people to have the best experience. I don't see a group made up of 8 people condusive to a good experience. As I said, some people cannot hear well. SOme people might not be able or want to shout also.

is just meeting people . have some heart and relax ok

>> I don't enjoy seeing some people's mouths noving and not being able to hear them.

this would make everything mroe wonderful

>> I disagree.

oh yeh i will be at the meeting LATE again . how late i don't know .

>> Thanks for the warning. Now I can plan the groups accordingly.

as and when i finsh my Task . and have time for relaxing evening chatting i will be there .

>> I am not sure what this is about.

Thanks very much for --again-- responding publicly to a private message (even though I explicitely asked you to respond privately). Could you please --at least-- phone me at 6:45 pm or before to let me know what your intentions are? I don't think all people enjoy someone coming late and/or someone who might be repeating stuff that was already talked about. Supposing that all people have the same attitude than you have, groups could be made larger than they need to be as people come as they wish. I think other people are coming on time or making an effort to do so. Had I known that you (and 2 other people who showed up late too), groups would have been made up of 4 people VS 7 people. When there are 7 people in a group it is sometimes hard for people to talk and/or be heard and for some people to understand or hear (if one does not have good hearing or if one does not have a good understanding of English.) Your behaviour is affecting other people's experiences. It is making my life more difficult too. Thanks for your cooperation.

OH yeh .. in case you are not sure ,I WILL BE GOING to the Meeting 90 %

in case i am too busy , too lazy , too tired , too tie up with girls , too drunk , still sleeping or death .

i might not go .

if i am , free, finsh my stuff , felt like meeting more people , ( i do enjoy the chit chat )

have the extra time , no visiting friends from other country . miss everyone that i chatted with ,

feel like meeting even more friends .. lonely , bored , notthing better to do , have time to kill .

no cars group meeting , no girls asking me to go out ,

so more or less i am 90 % confirm .

i will be late but will TRY to be early .

i don't mind joining any group .. or just sit in to listen without making any comment .

i don't mind . waiting .

i don't mind speaking if no body saying anything ,

i don't mind .translating ,

i don't mind what ever topic ,

i don't mind if it good or bad ,

i don't mind not having the topic in advance to pre-work on

i don't mind if you don't e-mail me .

i don't mind if the group i am in is old , young , native speaker or what ever

i don't mind almost anything as Long as nobody trying to be Rude .

I don;t mind how others felt about me -

i don't mind if anyone is trying to judge me

i don't mind if you can't speak english i might speak yours

i WOULD

speak out . if i feel like - but respect the group if i am not spoken to .

come and go as i wish , we are not kids . but with respect to the places and the people .

agree and disagree to my wishes , i don't believe in lie to make thing better

Respect everyone . if i am gaven the same respect . if you don't respect me i will not hit you

listen and learn ,and share what i know when it right

alway be who i am

.

hope this clear up some air about who i am .

why guess let meet up .

i

Isn't it outside the realm of possibilities that some of these guys might use the massages as a diversion to add to their income by having one of them reaching into your back-pocket and helping himself to your wallet, expecially if you have had too many to know the next morning --or that night-- how much you'd spent that night? Has anyone had any bad experiences?

While the outside may be stark and uninviting, the insides are beautiful! Quiet, relaxing lounges, a lovely, although somewhat narrow swimming pool, rooms with beautiful views of the river as well as the garden being built around the old British Consulate which has been turned into a nice bar and restaurant. The Indian foods served there are well made, nicely presented with excellent service, and of good portion size. In fact, the service all through the Chedi was fast and unobtrusive.

The prices may be a bit steep for some, but you do get what you pay for. As for the outside looks.... well, perhaps thats only a problem for those who have to remain outside. I doubt that the Chedi management worries to much about them. When you go to a hotel, isn't it the inside comforts and the service that are of more value than the exterior design?

The Fly Fisherman

Clearly what such customers pay for is to be seated next to equally wealthy and pretentious people.

Wealthy they must be, but why do you assume that they are pretentious? Or are all people who stay at expensive hotels pretentious? Do you have valid reasoning behind calling them as such?

There must be a LOT of pretentious folks around, as they've just opened 4-5 hotels large just in Chiang Mai in the same price range. I have a feeling there are more of these hotels in other areas as well. On the other hand, they've opened more bars filled with lots of inexpensive bar girls on Loi Khroh too. If you wish, (not meaning you personally, of course, ) you can sit next to people who have to buy their friends. Balance in all things.

The Fly Fisherman

I do not find all wealthy people pretentious, although many are. But sorry, I did find your description of this particular hotel to be reeking of pretentiousness, something worthy of a kite flyer more than a fly fisherman.

I do not believe wealthy people have a monopoly on pretentiousness and I am sure I could find many equally pretentious people at the bars along Loi Khroh. However, I fail to see the connection as my experience would indicate that wealth is not a factor relative to the need of many to purchase short-time satisfaction.

Excuse me John, but I still don't see your definition of pretention anywhere in your post. What is it that makes you call this place pretentious? If not the prices, was it the good food well presented or the good quality service?

You seem to put kite flying as pretentious and fly fishing as not. Wouldn't this make Malaysian culture, Japanese culture and Balinese cultures pretentious in your judgement? In all three, kite flying plays a major part of their heritage. Why do you judge others at all?

The Fly Fisherman

I could not resist giving my opinion on this topic, although it is a bit off-topic.

I don't have a problem with people paying that kind of money (to be in an environment that they could easily find at home --ironically), but I do have a problem with the way thé great majority of them appropriated the funds to do so. While the wealthy of this world would make us believe that they achieved success by making huge sacrifices, making extraordinarily intelligent decisions, and working harder, the preponderance of evidence shows that they are not any smarter, any more industrious, any wiser than the 90% of the people representing the masses of people who cannot afford this lifestyle (assuming that this is what we should all strive for, of course). We know that the wealthy of this world did it by exploiting others or situations illegally and/or unethically and/or living of the estates that their family passed on to them. Research by Linda McCuaig of Canada --and others-- does point out that wealthy families of today are issue from families which appropriated capital or land in the past by luck or by deviant (illegal, unethical) means. The rest gained their wealth by other means like the Kennedies (and countless others) during prohibition and so on. Of course, this does happen today and will as the wealthy can pay lobbyists and buy people to maintain the status quo. Our democracies are oligarchies of a few wealthy people or corporations, financed --ironically-- by the a good number of the 90% of us who have a pension plan of some sort, although we know that many people don't. Maybe those wealthy pretentious people should be less dysfunctional and giver some of their money to the less fortunate in our society and ... live in more normal places.

My 2 cents ...

Fun as it was .. i think those with english as a second learner .

the topic is too heavy for them .. and may not be as up to date to the current news as you think ..

- me forming 5 on a table .. - whahha - i saw you tale with 5 people also ..

YOU , ELI , THat green shirt guys and that 2 Girl .. = 5

don't worry so much ..

- there a saying .. DO no evil fear no evil ..

......

i should be droping by next week if i am free.

the time to meet up is 8 pm rght ?

or did i come at the wrong time .

- i don't take this too seriously .. cos is really a program to meet more people .

too much rule and make it boring ..

i did enjoy the long chat ..

for me it take me time and i got my commitment ..

i don't stay next to the cafe .

will try to be on time ..

if i may suggest ,,

POST

DATE - 11.11.2006

TIME - ????

LOCATION .....

While i was chatting on the other table ..

English is not easy for the native to understand .. and is hard to enage in more serious topic ..

as much as the topic of culture is interesting . but it lack the fact that - unless there understand the context .. is hard to relay any message to them .. as most would only pick up unrelated context from our chat ..

thanks -

Hey!

I enjoyed our little after-meeting chat. I think everyone learned something that night.

BTW, I did send you a private message and you responded by an open message on TV. I would have prefered to keep it private as I asked to clarify what your email address was. The email address allows me to send you a reminder in a mass-emailing manner and let you know of any changes. Could you please let me know if you are willing to do give it as I could not make it out when you gave it to me last time. Thanks.

About the non-native speakers: they do have the choice of coming or not and once they are registered they can research and get prepared for the topics. This might be better for beginners like they were. Sorry about the "interpretation work" that you did. That's certainly not what I want people to have to do. This is just a conversation meeting.

I thought that communication and cultures was a perfect topic, but the two people that showed up are not at the stage where they can come to a discussion in English. I doubt that they will show up again, but if they do, that would be ok, although I would not expect anyone to "teach" them. I will make that clear to them should they wish to attend next meeting. Perhaps they are able to understand more than they can speak and might be ok wigth that. I don't think we can please everyone involved and catter to all people's needs.

I don't see why I should post time and date in a different way. Most people can read it the other way.

Time is 6:45 pm BTW, not 8 pm.

The number of people per table was a joke.

Have a good day!

My Pen Rrrrrr/lllllye

I enjoyed it very much, but if there's a complaint that it was a bit too structured, maybe that's true. But I'll try to make it next Wednesday, as well.

Thanks for the input.

Yes! I agree with you. I think I went overboard with the subtopics. Too much time on my hands! : Next week, I will limit the discussion aid/subtopics to the questions found on TV.

I hope this answers your concern.

Ciao!

13 people showed up last night, 6 of those being non-English-speaking people (of various abilities).

I had a great time and I think most people did.

I was especially please with the fact that we got 3 tables outside, enabling us to hear each other better than last time. I think the grouping of 4 people worked well too.

I am suggesting the next topic: crime and punishment. Should Saddam Hussein be killed? Should anyone? And, what about governments --and their corporate lobbyists-- should their leaders or CEOs be killed too? What about the murderer of a close relative? Has capital punishment any use? What about false accusations and verdicts, as assessed by DNA tests? Why do crime occur and how can society control the perpetrators? Should we lock ourselves behind bars, making us prisoners? What role does drug abuse has to play in crime? Poverty? Greed? Jealousy? Isn't crime a sign of some dysfunction?

If anyone is interested in joining us, please message me (if you are not yet registered, of course). More details will be given to you, then.

Next meeting is WED. NOV. 15th. at 6:45 pm.

I expect an even better turn-out as more signs have been posted around universities and in the complex I live in.

Have a nice day.

I have just started looking at several condo's and was wondering if any Forum members had opinions good or bad about the condo complexes in question.

I have looked at Nakornping Condo's, Hillside 3, 4, 5 also the Hillside condotel near Payap University ( one beer to many reformatted the brain cell that stored the number, Hillside 7 or 8 me thinks) RimPing condo's, Galare Thong Condotel or Galae as most Thai's refer to it. I am also set to look at a few more in the coming days.

The unit's I am interested in are typically between 60-105 sq meters, with prices between 1.3-2.5 million baht. Any Insight about Chiang Mai's condo market would be appreciated.

Thanks

Pricing seems about right. Be careful though and be sure to take a good look at the construction standards. Whilst this is not altogether a simple matter some condo's have glaring examples of shoddy construction i.e. wide cracks in floors. The worst examples of this that I saw were in some of the buildings on the canal road north of Huay Kaew.

Do you know of any reputable engineer or assessor?

Thanks.

Hi all!

Thanks very much for the nice comments from all.

I enjoyed the night as well. We had about 10 people showing. I forecast an even better turn-out as signs have been posted in two English university departments and signs will be posted tomorrow in the complex here at Huay Kaew Residence.

The topic is communication and culture. It is wide-open to interpretation, but I make the suggestions that we look at how cultures tackles conflict resolution, be it personal or others. We might look at eye-contact, body proximity, and taboo subjects being brought or not into conversations. Groups could discuss how certain cultures resolve conflicts and/or couples made up of different cultures bridge the communication gap inherent in communication between people that have different sets of values and protocols (coloured of course by personality and experience, of course). Censorship could be a topic that could be tackled as well.

If you are interested in coming, please understand that it is important for me to know how many people will be showing so I can plan the event better by contacting the owner who can then set many more tables for the event, maybe even reserve tables for us. I will make an attempt to secure the tables outside. This will be easier if I can say that they will be used. So, send me a personal message if you are interested. Thanks for your cooperation.

When: Wednesday, 6:45 pm

Where: Huay Kaew restaurant (seraphee) located between the 2 entrances, located beside the Orchid hotel. Parking is available at the end of the street for Central shoppers.

A respectful suggestion MPR is that you add the date i.e. 08 Nov, as this would help prevent any confusion that some had with the first event.

I am pleased that it went well (might even poke my nose in at some time, after of course advising of my intention to do so)

Good suggestion. Thanks.

I look forward to seeing you there, but, yes, do let me know if you are going to show up, preferably before noon on the day of the meeting as this is the last time I check my messages or Thaivisa.

Thanks.

Hi all!

Thanks very much for the nice comments from all.

I enjoyed the night as well. We had about 10 people showing. I forecast an even better turn-out as signs have been posted in two English university departments and signs will be posted tomorrow in the complex here at Huay Kaew Residence.

The topic is communication and culture. It is wide-open to interpretation, but I make the suggestions that we look at how cultures tackles conflict resolution, be it personal or others. We might look at eye-contact, body proximity, and taboo subjects being brought or not into conversations. Groups could discuss how certain cultures resolve conflicts and/or couples made up of different cultures bridge the communication gap inherent in communication between people that have different sets of values and protocols (coloured of course by personality and experience, of course). Censorship could be a topic that could be tackled as well.

If you are interested in coming, please understand that it is important for me to know how many people will be showing so I can plan the event better by contacting the owner who can then set many more tables for the event, maybe even reserve tables for us. I will make an attempt to secure the tables outside. This will be easier if I can say that they will be used. So, send me a personal message if you are interested. Thanks for your cooperation.

When: Wednesday, 6:45 pm

Where: Huay Kaew restaurant (seraphee) located between the 2 entrances, located beside the Orchid hotel. Parking is available at the end of the street for Central shoppers.

The 1st discussion groups meeting will take place this Monday, at Huay Kaew Residences' restaurant. This apartment block is just beside the Orchid hotel which is itself located near Kad Suan shopping mall on Huay Kaew road. As planned ... 7 pm ... Please email me to confirm if you have not already. Thai, tourists, expats,... anyone is welcome, anyone who would like to express his or her point of view or improve his or her listening or speaking skills in English.

OK! Mea culpa! I don't know why exactly this occured, but the 1st is not a Monday! Maybe it is a farang computer!

Due to the confusion, I have changed permanently the day that those discussions will take place. They will now take place (until further notices) EVERY WEDNESDAYS at 7 pm at the restaurant at Huay Kaew Residence (beside the office and between the two entrances of the apartment complex. Turn left just after the Orchid hotel, on a "Y" island/entrance. There are so far a minimum of 6 English-speaking people who have indicated an interest, but there is likely to be more. I am trying hard to involve more Thai people, but have no ways of knowing how many will be showing up. Hopefully a good number.

Have a good day.