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22 hours ago, Nick Carter icp said:
Wait right there .
Israel did support Hamas BEFORE the terror attack .
Israel supported Hamas 20 odd years ago when they were the good guys doing beneficial things for Gazans
Ireland, Spain and Norway support Hamas AFTER the terror attack .
There's a huge difference between supporting a non terrorist group and supporting a terrorist group
What utter nonsense. Israel imposed on embargo on Gaza when Hamas won the election in 2007. Because it explicitly said that Hamas was a terrorist organizaion. It helped support Qatar when it was giving aid to Hamas to the tune of 30 million dollars a month. Netanyahu said he was doing that to prop up Hamas against the PA. Hamas needed that propping because it had become so unpopular in Gaza.
Stop making things up.
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1 minute ago, coolcarer said:
What’s worse than being used as human shields by Hamas?
Or.
"But if there were a Palestinian state now, it would be run by Hamas, and we would have a Taliban-like state. A satellite state of Iran. Is this what the progressive movements of the Western Left want to create?" he asked. His comments suggest that while the aspiration for Palestinian self-determination is legitimate, the reality of Hamas’s governance would starkly contrast with the values espoused by many of its Western supporters.
I get it. Hamas is using civilians as shields. So the way to deal with that is to starve those civilians to do and deny them medical supplies. That way, they'll be worthless as shields.
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2 minutes ago, coolcarer said:
Everything. Who would they be better under.
That's your argument? It would be worse? You take no account of why Hamas got to be popular in the first place. And you take no account of how unpopular Hamas was before October 7th. And how Hamas might not be in power now if Israel hadn't help to keep it there.
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7 minutes ago, coolcarer said:
Because the way Hamas treats its civilians is so much better right?
Hmmm...Hamas...Isn't that the group that Israel helped to support as a counterweight to the PA? Or is it some other Hamas you are referring to?
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3 minutes ago, coolcarer said:
Because the way Hamas treats its civilians is so much better right?
What has that got to do with Hanuguma's know-nothing claim about Palestinians should be begging to be part of Israel's economy?
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15 minutes ago, Hanaguma said:The west bank and Gaza have been oppressed for a long time. Oppressed by their own leaders in the PA and Hamas. Oppressed by having zero regard for human rights and dignity, by killing LGBT people and by keeping women firmly behind. If they had any common sense, they would beg to be admitted to Israel and enjoy the benefits of being part of a first world country.
You think Israel would let them be part of their first world economy? The explicit policy in the West Bank and Gaza, when Israel occupied it, right from the start was to keep the Palestinians economically suppressed. In the West Bank there are 2 sets of laws. One that governs Palestinians and one that governs Israelis. Anyone with any knowledge of this situations knows how the laws have been used to suppress Palestinian development. Clearly, you are not one of those in the know.
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41 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:Why odd, Hamas are over the moon. They want and always wanted a Palestinian state, they just don't want an Israeli one to exist, hence Oct 7th. Very strange that Norway has even admitted to this yet is now recognizing one and rewarding Hamas.
Gloating Hamas hails 'important step' as Ireland, Norway and Spain become the latest nations to recognise a Palestinian state - but Israel says 'twisted' move 'rewards terrorism'
'The terror has been committed by Hamas and militant groups who are not supporters of a two-state solution and the state of Israel,' the Norwegian government leader said. 'Palestine has a fundamental right to an independent state.'
Sure. The way Israel has prosecuted this war and it deepening of oppression on the West bank has nothing to do with it? For a long time the Europeans more or less looked the other way at how Israel treated Palestinians, but Israel's conduct during this war has made that impossible. If Hamas has succeeded, that's because Israel has played right into their hands.
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5 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:Hamas celebrating the success of their atrocities on Oct 7th and their leverage of hostages still being held.
“These successive recognitions are the direct result of this brave resistance and the legendary steadfastness of the Palestinian people. … We believe this will be a turning point in the international position on the Palestinian issue,” Naim told AFP.
Hamas welcomes Palestinian statehood recognition from Ireland, Norway and Spain
Israel has made it easy for those countries. after taking actions like this:
Israel announces largest West Bank land seizure since 1993 during Blinken visit
Israel’s far-right finance minister, Bezalel Smotrich, announced the seizure of 10 square kilometers (3.8 square miles) of Palestinian territory in the West Bank on Friday. The move marks the single largest land seizure by the Israeli government since the 1993 Oslo accords, according to Peace Now, a settlement watchdog group.
“While there are those in Israel and the world who seek to undermine our right over the Judea and Samaria area and the country in general,” Smotrich said Friday, referring to the territory by its biblical name, “we are promoting settlement through hard work and in a strategic manner all over the country.”https://archive.ph/VKF2s#selection-667.0-675.306
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13 hours ago, Hummin said:In my eyes there is no way back for Israel now, and I know I make the risk of being cancelled once again, I will say it carefully so it is understandable and not step over a fine line.
Israel have to finish the war, and make no options for a two state only one state with future equal rights. It is a far shot, but, there is no other realistic options really. Continue with a two state solution will create another potential terrorist state controlled by the Israelis, and just another open prison for the next decades.
And what is Israel's plan for ending the war? Does it even have one?
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46 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:
Take your placard with news elsewhere. It's also a forum where I am not obliged to reply to your baiting posts
You are just as free to ignore my posts as I am to address yours. And vice versa. Who said otherwise?
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34 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:
So what?
I don't care what you are responding to. My post was not for you. Rattlesnakes article had to be read first to see the significance as an update.
I got exciting news for you. This is an open forum. If you care to carry on a private colloquy with another member, that's what the PM function is for.
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1 minute ago, Bkk Brian said:
That's not the update though.
So what? I was responding to part of what you quoted. Just not the part you prefer gets paid attention to.
And what do you think the significance of that "update" is?
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22 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:
What has that got to do with the specific update the French gave?
What has this got to do with the specific update the French gave?
"Israel’s Foreign Minister, Israel Katz, speaking in Paris at an event attended by Séjourné, urged him “to announce loud and clear that the decision of the Chief Prosecutor is unacceptable to you and the French government – regardless of the authority of the court.”
“This is what our friends around the world did, and this is what I expect from our friend, the French government,” Katz said, referring to denunciations of the prosecutor’s move by US President Joe Biden among others."
You're the one who introduced it into the thread. Not me.
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10 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:What assumptions would those be that need clarifying from the article rattlesnake posted and the update I posted for him to read?
That a member nation can find a decision of the ICC unacceptable. It's one thing to disagree with a decision, it's quite another to find it unacceptable.
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7 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:
Actually, you didn't claim anything.
Correct. So why?
It was a response to the poster I was replying to, a clarification from the French themselves updated from the article he posted.
Therefore not to have its assumptions questioned?
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9 minutes ago, Bkk Brian said:
Even if one crime is greater than the other, that still doesn't mean they aren't both crimes.
Bravo
did I claim anything else?
Actually, you didn't claim anything.
Maybe you didn't read what you quoted?
"Israel’s Foreign Minister, Israel Katz, speaking in Paris at an event attended by Séjourné, urged him “to announce loud and clear that the decision of the Chief Prosecutor is unacceptable to you and the French government – regardless of the authority of the court.”
“This is what our friends around the world did, and this is what I expect from our friend, the French government,” Katz said, referring to denunciations of the prosecutor’s move by US President Joe Biden among others."
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1 hour ago, Bkk Brian said:Bit of clarification from the French
Day after backing ICC, France says there’s no comparison between Israel and Hamas
Changing tone on Tuesday, Séjourné stressed that Hamas is “a terrorist group that celebrated the October 7 attacks” in which it killed some 1,200 people in southern Israel and took another 252 hostages. Israel, by contrast, is “a democratic state that must respect international law in the conduct of a war that it did not itself start,” Séjourné noted.
Israel’s Foreign Minister, Israel Katz, speaking in Paris at an event attended by Séjourné, urged him “to announce loud and clear that the decision of the Chief Prosecutor is unacceptable to you and the French government – regardless of the authority of the court.”
“This is what our friends around the world did, and this is what I expect from our friend, the French government,” Katz said, referring to denunciations of the prosecutor’s move by US President Joe Biden among others.
Even if one crime is greater than the other, that still doesn't mean they aren't both crimes. And the alleged criminal conduct of netanyahu and gallant are both grave, regardless of what the leaders of Hamas have inflicted.
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2 hours ago, Bkk Brian said:Looks like some sanctions will be coming
US signals support for possible ICC sanctions over Israel warrants
US Secretary of State Antony Blinken has suggested he will work with lawmakers on potential sanctions against the International Criminal Court as its prosecutor seeks arrest warrants for senior Israeli officials.
Mr Blinken told a congressional hearing he was "committed" to taking action against the "profoundly wrong-headed decision".
His comments come amid a Republican push to impose sanctions on ICC officials, which may see a vote as soon as this week.
Without even seeing the evidence that the ICC investigators have gathered.
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What Spencer isn't saying now but what he and other experts in this kind of warfare maintain is that it isn't enough to just to defeat your opponent in battle, , but you also have to occupy the territory they held. Otherwise they come back. . Israel hasn't followed that policy. Which is why they're fighting again in the North. Israel may simply not have the resources to occupy all of Gaza.. Which is why they're trying to outsource it to some Arab force. Why would any of the regimes in the Mideast want to wade into this mess and bail out Israel?
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This should come as no surprise:
Israeli soldiers and police tipping off groups that attack Gaza aid trucks
Individual members of Israel’s security forces are tipping off far-right activists and settlers to the location of aid trucks delivering vital supplies to Gaza, enabling the groups to block and vandalise the convoys, according to multiple sources.
Settlers intercepting the vital humanitarian supplies to the strip are receiving information about the location of the aid trucks from members of the Israeli police and military, a spokesperson from the main Israeli activist group behind the blockades told the Guardian.
The claim of collusion by members of the security forces is supported by messages from internal internet chat groups reviewed by the Guardian as well as accounts from a number of witnesses and human rights activists.
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11 hours ago, impulse said:
You mean the Constitution that makes it a President's duty to protect the borders?
Making things up much?
" Ultimately, the Constitution did not create an enumerated power to control free people’s immigration into the United States..25 The Constitution enumerates other powers that are considered inherent to a sovereign, but the Founders did not include immigration as one of them."
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10 hours ago, Skipalongcassidy said:
Perfect opportunity for the mullahs to get rid of this thorn in their side...
Why do you think he's a "thorn in their side"? Are there lots of mullahs in Iran who are secretly secular humanists?
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2 hours ago, Hawaiian said:
Houthi attacks have dropped in recent weeks due to U.S. airstrikes. Because the attacks are not as frequent as three months ago I am assuming that that it will happen, albeit not as quickly as we would like.
The U.S. has to be careful to avoid civilian deaths, aka collateral damage, otherwise they will be accused of committing some type of "atrocity," similar to what Israel is facing. The Saudis had that problem. What a screwed up world we live in. I say if you are going to fight a war, fight to win.
Whether or not Houthi attacks have dropped in recent weeks doesn't seem to matter to Maersk, the first or second biggest oceanic shipping company in the world. It's the effect their attacks have on shipping that counts.
Maersk Says Expanded Houthi Attacks Are Forcing More Delays
The shipping company said the militia had recently tried to attack ships farther from the shore of Yemen, putting more strain on logistics.-
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6 hours ago, Hawaiian said:
I was hoping for the U.S. to step up its interdiction of drone and missile components from Iran and also continue to hit launching sites.
Unfortunately, this will not happen overnight.
It hasn't happened for more than 3 months since this topic was posted. Which is a bit longer than "overnight". Apparently, you are operating under the assumption that it will occur.
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Ireland, Norway, & Spain to Recognize Palestinian State Amid Ongoing Israel-Hamas Conflict
in World News
Posted
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