dttk0009

I really don't have time to read through all of these pages.

Are we talking about the Central World Plaza, opposite the Big C mall, the one that used to be called The World Trade Centre, before 9/11?

Isetan one end,(sorry about the spelling of this Japanese dept store, if it's wrong) and Zen the other?

That's the one.

This photo in particular is the most concerning to me. I asked one of my Thai friends if he knew anything more about it. And it seems these are not the "fake monks" that everyone has been talking about, but the actual monks of the temple that is near the protest site at Rajprasong. Apparently when the army came in, they were rounded up, thrown to the floor and cuffed until it could be determined that they were real monks. I saw another photo of them somewhere yesterday from a Thai newspaper, laying on the floor with their eyes blindfolded in front of the soldiers' feet. If you understand a little about Thai culture and the respect for monks, especially them laying at the feet of soldiers, I believe you understand where my concerns come from. I'll try and find the other photo again, as well.

If you understand that red shirts were disguising themselves as monks as a way to conceal weapons and potentially explosives, you would completely understand why these measures had to be taken, especially in a sanctuary for non-combatants. The military is not to blame, the red shirts who dressed themselves up as monks are. If you want to point a finger and talk about a disgusting act in Thai culture, you should go there first. Soldiers were trying to make sure that no one in there would get injured and the red shirts STILL managed to presumably wreak havoc on innocent bystanders there. It goes to show how determined they are and how low they are willing to sink to achieve their goals.

"CRES shows pictures of evidence confiscated

The CRES has just gone on tv along with Khunying Rojanasunan. The team have shown evidence of weapons found in the red shirt encampment including M16s and bomb-making devices (fuel, igniters, scraps of cloth and other ingredients).

Both soldiers and police, in a joint effort, went in to the Ratchaprasong rally site and Sarasin Road where they found several chemicals. Photographic evidence now being shown on television. "

Yep, no organized terrorism in the red shirt movement whatsoever.

He seemed as real as the rest of the reds there. If he's so clearly fake and against what they stand for why does he blend right in with the other guys you see wearing black, sporting their UDD bandannas and brandishing weapons? Why is not a single real red shirt calling them out? Saying 'we don't approve of this' is not what I mean. No one has openly denounced them or claimed that they don't belong to the movement, because they clearly do. This isn't some disapproved part of the organization. This is a well equipped, well organized wing of the UDD that knows exactly how to recruit and who to recruit. They're also well funded enough to arm them. This didn't just fall from the sky onto the 'poor red shirt movement'. This was planned. I agree that this guy looks like a repeat offender. A no-life who thrives on the suffering of others. I think he would be a perfect recruit for any extremist paramilitary organization. Back home he could well just be some neo-nazi.

He blends right in because anyone can wear a black shirt. And the black shirts with the UDD logo are available for anyone to buy, just like the bandannas and the wooden stick or knife also doesn't mean anything. Sure there are armed UDD members, but how involved were they with the core of the UDD leadership? We don't know. There are a lot of Mafia groups in Bangkok who are just waiting for the opportunity to create chaos. Take the Narcotics Suppression Center burned down, for example. There is 0% interest of the red shirt movement to burn down that building. The only interest in that is from the Mafia groups that sell drugs.

No doubt that many took advantage of the state of chaos last night, these kind of things snowball even in our 'democratic, fair and just' home countries. However, the initial blazes were carried out with such accuracy and there is so much evidence out there pointing at the red shirts (numerous videos of leaders listing locations that were burned, red shirts at the scene of the fire, cheering, annoying white guy with stick claiming to know what will happen, etc) that this is either painfully obvious or a gigantic conspiracy theory. So far, I see very little evidence for any conspiracy and a lot of evidence that points to red shirt terrorism. If I can be shown evidence otherwise I will change my mind accordingly, but not until then, though I believe that I have quite thoroughly looked at all angles of this debacle, having been a little sympathetic to the red shirt cause initially myself.

Well, that British guy certainly seemed like a fake red to me. Attaching himself to the red shirt movement and hoping for a 'carte blanche' to riot when the army moves in and the crackdown starts. I'd check into the history of this guy back in his homeland, probably not the first time he'll be arrested for rioting or burning things.

He seemed as real as the rest of the reds there. If he's so clearly fake and against what they stand for why does he blend right in with the other guys you see wearing black, sporting their UDD bandannas and brandishing weapons? Why is not a single real red shirt calling them out? Saying 'we don't approve of this' is not what I mean. No one has openly denounced them or claimed that they don't belong to the movement, because they clearly do. This isn't some disapproved part of the organization. This is a well equipped, well organized wing of the UDD that knows exactly how to recruit and who to recruit. They're also well funded enough to arm them. This didn't just fall from the sky onto the 'poor red shirt movement'. This was planned. I agree that this guy looks like a repeat offender. A no-life who thrives on the suffering of others. I think he would be a perfect recruit for any extremist paramilitary organization. Back home he could well just be some neo-nazi.

In my opinion, most of these posts are knee-jerk, idiotic responses to what seems to be face-value information. The darkest parts of human nature are exemplified here in these posts. It staggers the imagination. There are really some sick foreigners here; people who take such ghoulish delight in the Thai troubles that are going on as if it were some sort of blood-letting sporting event.

The largest mall in SEA is burned. Of course the red-shirts are blamed. Who else would the mercenary media blame? It is almost as controversial as the 9/11 truth movement. How does a building so massive and sprawling get invaded by farmers with enough accelerant to get it burning out of control - fast enough, so that the fire department cannot respond in enough time to put it out? I wonder if the owners of this mall are friends of Larry Silverstien? Those are a lot of Bahts to be collected in the insurance claim, after all.

How is it that I cannot go anywhere in Thailand at all without there being a Thai behind a bush, in a tree, peeking through a window, etc. and gawping at me, and yet there was mysteriously no one around to witness this event transpiring? Practically every Thai I know has a mobile phone skin grafted to their hand. You mean to tell me no one phoned in any suspicious activity in a Mall that was vacant, unsecured, and apparently ripe for the pickings and a tinder-box waiting to go up to boot?

I seriously doubt that most red-shirt Thais wake up every morning these past few weeks with the mindful intent to burn, pillage and kill; much less in an organized effort that could avoid detection as seamlessly as this operation demonstrated. This is simply too obvious, and the propaganda and idiotic, callous responses do not go unnoticed, along with the fleeting, spectacular demonstrations of intelligence and tactical ops by a bunch of - how do you critics say it - backwoods, greedy country-bumpkins.

If you truly believe this then you simply have not looked hard enough at the evidence. Just moments ago a video was posted from 4 days ago, where a foreigner who sided with the red shirts claimed that he would burn Central World to the ground. 4 days beforehand. I will agree with you that these incidents of arson were well planned, but that the red shirts are responsible there is more than enough evidence of. They are the ones seen throwing rubber tires and gas canisters into the flames. They are the ones seen cheering while others run in fear.

Wow, what an idiot. He will probably get a permanent visa extension for Thailand. But that video strengthens my belief that most if not all of the rioting, burning and damages were done by "wanna-be-red-shirts" that attached themselves to the movement instead of the peaceful supporters that sat there for weeks and months listening to the speeches.

yeap definite the high quality british tourist we all like so much (has the football season in the UK ended already?)

May I dare use the word "fake red"?

There is no such thing, lilkitty. You are either a peaceful protester or an armed insurgent. Both can be part of the paramilitary group known as the UDD. There is no such thing as 'fake reds' unless you seem to think that they are agents provocateur, which I have seen zero evidence or even claim of. Far too many of the red shirts, even the peaceful ones, condone, approve and even applaud the chaos their terrorist wing is causing.

Wow, what an idiot. He will probably get a permanent visa extension for Thailand. But that video strengthens my belief that most if not all of the rioting, burning and damages were done by "wanna-be-red-shirts" that attached themselves to the movement instead of the peaceful supporters that sat there for weeks and months listening to the speeches.

yeap definite the high quality british tourist we all like so much (has the football season in the UK ended already?)

If you guys haven't already done so, please call the government CRES hotline and inform them of this video and its url. I have already downloaded it in case the uploader is threatened by red shirts. They must find this man and question him. He knew a lot of what was going to happen and no doubt still does.

Anyone who supports the red cause now is a terrorist. No other way to put it. They are the SEA equivalent of Hezbollah now. I dread the day they seize power, for it will bring the darkest days in Thailand's history. No organization with a well funded terrorist wing must ever be allowed to function.

Funny you should metion Palestine.. I seem to recall they also had an elected govt labelled as 'terrorists' by certain western countries!!

haahaha. lets have en election, and see who is in charge. oops, forgot, the farang elite want the junta... I blame hollywood!

Up the reds! (in a civilised fashion of course )

Are you retarded? Google Hezbollah and then try again. Actually, don't. You've already shown your complete naivety in political know-how.

I agree that the Red Shirt leadership were foolish in not accepting Abhisit's compromise without trying to attach ridiculous conditions, but fail to understand how their surrender yesterday meant they abandoned their followers. Were they supposed to encourage their followers to fight to the death?

This is a stupid and irresponsible editorial.

Thai wife would like to give her opinion

Well this they preached on Red shirt stage

Now we see truth, rich cowards paid to make north thai people give up lives

I like to see Farlang that supported this pay some penalty, they helped to make Thai man violent and think he hero, same Farang cause many Thai to die

Hope these men can sleep good at night, now many Thai cry for lost man

If think this is about help Thai, you need new brain

look poster written in Farang language, all about get attention of Farang not for Thai people

I see many write to help Protest, Now you burn my county stop my sistars work, stop us make money to help family

Now you go leave Thailand we no want you here

Stay only good Farang who will help repair Thailand.

==========================================

How long will it be before all Farang get the blame for what happen

and this I agree with my wife, there are many on TV they have given support to the protestors that will now be seen to place a lot of blame placed on westerners

Anyone who supports the red cause now is a terrorist. No other way to put it. They are the SEA equivalent of Hezbollah now. I dread the day they seize power, for it will bring the darkest days in Thailand's history. No organization with a well funded terrorist wing must ever be allowed to function.

Do your best to spread this video please. This man is a terrorist and a danger to innocent citizens. He must be caught and trialed on terrorist charges. He was clearly high up enough to know of the red shirts plans. All must be done to find this man. I wouldn't even be shocked if he was one of the pro-red TV posters.

Come on - you didn't need to be a phophet to know what was going to happen. It could have been avoided if the government had moved at the very beginning - they DIDN'T - it would have been avoided if the Police and army acted earlier and decisively - THEY DIDN'T. I wonder why - maybe they feel a bit guilty about how they came to power (banning a polititian for apearing on a cooking programme, removing Members of Parliament because of a Court ruling which was rather one sided) - maybe they couldn't act quickly because they had totally failed to do anything about the Yellow folk occupying the airports and doing damage equivalent, in economic terms, to 10 Central Worlds. The Government and the cabinest and the officials have handled this badly - they should resign and call fresh elections - OOPPs maybe that is what they should have done at the beginning to make them legitimate - maybe having the guy who ran the Yellow protest movement in charge of Security wasn't a very good idea. Maybe assasinating a rebel general with a sniper shot in the head was something that made folk just a little p'ed off.

If the current Government stays on after this it will have no authority - if the current military planners and commanders stay on after this they will have no respect - If there is not a major change in how Thailand is run after this - the country it will have no regional respect and if these required changes aren't public and universally acceptable to all the population - Thailand ain't going to recover from the damage this has done to the country's image. 24 - 7 on BBC and CNN. People are asking why is there so much anger in the Land of Smiles. Ask yourself

wonderfully said... but, who knows after fresh elections... those STUPID IDIOT YELLOW SHIRTS will do something again... if the election goes in favour of Red Shirts..

How much are they paying you per post?

Interesting article:

Thai soldiers shoot unarmed man outside gates of temple refuge, then shoot monk trying to retrieve the body

Funnily, you quickly concluded that Thai soldiers shot them. Don't forget that army is not the only guy with the guns.

But don't you remember? The red shirts only have handmade guns. The damage on those is so limited! They would have to have been within 10 meters. Clearly the terrorists here are the soldiers who have vowed to protect the innocent civilians, who are under constant watch from both local and international media.

There is so much proof that the red shirts are nothing but an extremist political faction with an armed terrorist wing I'm surprised that anyone here can still even stand on their side, no matter what ideology they previously had.

I think you'll find the insurrection is borne of desperation from desperate folk.

Rome once burned.

Paris burned.

Leningrad burned.

Greece has come close (and that chapter is not yet closed). Portugal, Spain, Italy may be next.

Easy to sit with a cool beer and pontificate (as I am doing). But if my kids were all but starving and with next to no future prospects of advancement whilst my UNELECTED government took financial care of those that already have more than I could dream of, then I might be tempted to torch a shop in protest.

Because, as has already been said, it's just a shop.

People died over this, just because they protested. Correction, they didn't die - they were murdered by the very people sworn to protect them. Unarmed against tanks, armoured vehicles, rapid-fire rifles, tear-gas etc., etc.

I'd torch a shop (so would you, I'd bet).

Vandalism, terrorism and hooliganism equates to democracy? Tell us more, please.

You're abhorrent, and with your words shit on the blood, sweat and tears it took to make Bangkok what it is today. There is no way you live in this city.

Perhaps you could tell us where your kids go to school so we could let your beloved UDD'ers spread democracy there next.

I'm kind of wondering why the fire extinguishers in Central World didn't work. Possibly because the government turned off the water?

Probably because armed red shirts were preventing firefighters from getting there before the fire spread, as has been reported, but you'll say ANYTHING to relay the blame onto someone else. Please stop posting. This isn't your city. Let us who grew up here mourn the loss of what is our home to a bunch of drugged up terrorists on a revenge spree. What exactly are you trying to achieve with your posts? You want to enrage posters? Be controversial? Just fuc_k off already.

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I am happy those leaders came to their senses and did the right thing, both for their own followers and the other people of Thailand. I hope they get a fair trial and sentence.

Red shirts are burning down buildings on (I think) Rama 4 now.

Fire Rages at Soi Ngamduplee

UPDATE : 19 May 2010

A fire is raging at Soi Ngamduplee off of Rama 4 Road.

It is still unclear whether the building that is on fire houses a Kasikorn Bank or that it is a building near the bank itself.

http://www.thailandoutlook.tv/tan/ViewData...?DataID=1029477

This is absolutely horrible. Please everyone be safe if you live in this area. What kind of animals set fires like this in densely populated areas?

Just heard from a colleague that Chula Hospital was set on fire.

Can anyone confirm this?

Near Chula. Not exactly good for any respiratory illness patients.

Smoke from burning tiers rises near Chulalongkorn Hospital in downtown Bangkok, Thailand, Wednesday, May 19, 2010. Thai troops and armored vehicles converged early Wednesday around the barricaded encampment of anti-government protesters in downtown Bangkok and opened fire in what appears to be a final crackdown to disperse them.

Where's Amnesty International on this one?

Its a pity most people on TV are so poorly informed, seems most people that come to Thailand or have an interest in this country only know what happens now (and not even that) and are totally clueless about the Thai history and how the current situation is a result of past decisions and actions. Ah well, its history repeated, like always, people never learn from it.

Just wished THAI VISA would ban those people that call for violence, but it seems THAI VISA knows very well who their master is, and you never bite that hand.

Hehehhehe what will happen to THAI VISA if the reds win in some years, they will loose this battle surely, but it aint over yet ;-)

LMB

Is this a threat?

It may not be a machine gun or automatic weapons but is certainly appears to be a rifle that the guy is firing randomly under the cover of the fire crackers. If true, then it is clear the army is likely not the ones who pulled the trigger on many reds, reporters or medics ... one also has to wonder who has gained and who has not from reporters and medical workers being shot.

ITS A BROOM HANDLE! and you like bush thought it was a weapon of mass destruction.

you rank amateur!

you and your pathetic bloodthirsty gang who call for the spilling of thai blood have been caught with your pants down spreading falsehoods yet again.

So, JC, now that the evidence is on the table are you finally prepared to admit that its the army who are killing innocents, in addition to Reds?

Earthpig. Think of the most democratic, fair country in the planet. Picture it. Now:

Go there.

Find a military barracks.

Grab a couple of friends and build a barricade there made up of tires.

Light a couple of them on fire.

When they tell you to disperse, tell them to go fuc_k themselves and provoke them.

Start lobbing molotov cocktails, shoot large caliber fireworks at them through a pipe, but make sure to hold it like you would an rpg launcher.

Make sure that visibility is minimal between yourself and the soldiers from the tire smoke.

Get a broom and pretend it's a gun while mimicking shooting it at them while your buddy lets firecrackers mimic the noise.

Let us know how that goes. Thanks.

I can't tell if that guy is shooting or not. The video is too blurry and low resolution to make that out. If he is, he's firing pretty indiscriminately and all over the place, and would very likely just be hitting innocent bystanders or his own buddies. If he's not shooting he's just trying to fool the military into thinking he is. Either way, can anyone really be shocked that they were shot back at?

There has been a staggering amount of deaths and casualty.

Staggering? If the army did not exercise so much restraint, I think there would be hundreds more deaths by now. They are still firing only single shots aren't they, and not automatic?

The protesters should simply go home, as they have way overstayed their welcome (if you could call it "welcome").

I would like to know out of the 279 injured how many of those were shot by the army I bet its 80% of them

This is a complete and utter assumption based on absolutely nothing factual. What exactly was the point of your post?

That man disgusts me. What's scary is that his outright lies will be what the Westerners hear and what they'll most likely believe. Thaksin is winning the war of the media, which may lead him to prevail in the long run.

Because thailand has no credability when they remove a democratically elected Pm by a military coup and install there own government and then wangle it so the yellows can get back in without holding elections

I could have sworn that the current government offered to hold elections 6 months from now.

That man disgusts me. What's scary is that his outright lies will be what the Westerners hear and what they'll most likely believe. Thaksin is winning the war of the media, which may lead him to prevail in the long run.