IsaanAussie

Many years ago the Australian Farmers were represented in Parliament by the Country Party. Later the party was absorbed into the Liberal Party with the leader becoming deputy PM. The change need him good because memories of an exchange in the house faded after the coalition merged. He said once defending the Farmers "...and I'm proud to be one myself and to represent them, proud to be a Country Member." The response was "Yes we remember"

I think all of you will remember Inspector Dreyfus in the Pink Panther films, im getting a bit like him with a nervous twitch and a snigger when mrs tells about the labour.

cheers, lickey..

Lickey AKA Dreyfus,

Only one question with Chaimai's recent post in mind. Do you have a leesonse for that minkey?

Cheers

Isaanaussie

Paul,

It appears you are serious about pig farming. Just like me going against a trend here. Good on you.

OK, first consider what you can do to reduce feed costs. You appear to have enough land to do that quite easily. I have corn and sweet potato crops growing at the moment and will be testing farm produced feed with the aim of achieving greater than 30% self sufficiency.

Second, look at integration of the whole operation to maximise the value add. For instance treatment of the waste to produce organic fertiliser. Using chicken manure as a mineral source and fish meal for protein in feeds. Treated wastes as liquid fertiliser on crops and solids for worm bedding with the worms used as pig chicken and fish food and the castings as potting mixes for mushrooms etc...

If you are growing rice, consider purchasing a mill. No great profits here but the ram is valuable as feed.

Good luck with your planning, happy to share my plans if your interested. Drop me a PM any time.

Isaanaussie

Greetings,

Anyone knows of a decent woodworker who specializes in teak work, I live 40kms SW of Nong Bua Lumphu. I have some woodwork remaining to finish off the house the stair well, concrete uprights and the TV / living room needs to be finished off with teak panels.

Any forum members who have had similar work conducted with satisfactory results please let me know.

Regards,

Steve.

I've got the tools, you got the teak?

Isaanaussie

Have been quoted a very high price to repair the air conditioner in my Toyota Soluna by the Toyota workshop. Can anyone recommend any independent repair shops/air con specialists in the above towns.

Thanks

Try any radiator repair shop, or place that recharges air cons. They will get it done. Parts the same as older corollas. Same issue with Ford diff, 40K at Ford 10K local parts place, including new bearings seals and brake shoes. Check the manufacturers name on the boxes. Original will be Denso probably

Hello,

I am thinking of farming pigs on some of our land so a couple of questions.

The land in question is about 500m by 700m and partly woods and field what has had veg grown on it and a pond next to it. I will be fencing all this area off and part of the pond for this.

The questions i have are:

1. In the pond we farm fish to eat and sell, will the pigs make a problem for us to carry on ?

2. On the size of the land what would be the max number of pigs i could have on it? ( As i want the pigs to be free on the land)

Thanks

Paul

Paul,

I would think about this a while longer. 200 Rai is a good size piece of land and difficult to keep an eye on. I have not seen a free range pig farm here in Thailand. If you know of any I would be interested in taking a look.

Many of the members here will agree with you that the pigs will be free alright. Free to the first midnight shopper who comes along. Fencing will need to be just as good at keeping the pigs in as it will the tempted out.

Integrated farming here is the norm with pig wastes feed into ponds to fertiliser the pond. Fish such as Pla Nin do well in those ponds. What you are suggesting is different and foraging pigs will damage the pond.

Stocking numbers will depend on how you intend to feed and house the pigs, do you intend to breed or just grow them to market weight? The question is like asking how long is a piece of string.

The first issue is climate. Sunburn is an absolute show stopper here in Thailand. So you will have to keep them in the shade. Pigs like to sunbathe so the idea of free ranging becomes near impossible here unless the area is roofed.

Assume that you stocked at a rate similiar to the US farms, lets say 1 pig per rai. Thats 200 pigs and you would have to have at least two or three full time employees to support such an enterprise. If you plan to grow forage crops to feed the pigs then the rate would be far less and very dependant on the local conditions. The crops need to be harvested and feed to the pigs because of the sun.

In terms of cost, an adult pig consumes 2 to 3 Kgs of feed per day, currently around 350Baht per 30 Kg bag on average across the range. A lactating sow will eat up to 10Kgs a day. As a rule of thumb a pig consumes some 250 kgs of food to reach market weight, or in terms of cost over 3000 Baht. So over the seven months to raise the pigs you could have 200 pigs consuming 700 kgs of feed at 15 Baht/kg/day, in round figures 1050 Baht per day. Pigs fed with lesser quality materials will not achieve the same food conversion rates, take longer to grow and suffer more disease problems. The mortality rate, especially for weaners and piglets would be high, perhaps over 20%.

On the returns side, pork is selling for over 100 baht per kg but live weight sales are around 55-60 baht when you can make them and often less if sold locally. So you buy pigs at 25kgs or large enough to survive the conditions, for 1500 baht each, spend 2-3000 feeding them and sell at 100kgs six months later. Do the maths and there is not a lot of room for errors without even thinking of vet costs, land improvements and buildings and farm wages.

With the greatest respect, I would suggest you rethink the scheme.

Isaanaussie

One night in Isaan all was quite and a thief was at work downstairs in a neighbours house. As he snuck around in the dark, he heard a voice in the blackness. "I can see you and so can Jesus". "Who said that?", says the midnight shopper fearing it might be a ghost. There it was again, "I can see you and so can Jesus", so the tea-leaf strikes a match and gasps in relief when he sees it is only a colourful parrot sitting in the corner on a perch. "You had me going there for a moment, but you're only a parrot." "Yes I am," replies the parrot adding, "... and Jesus is only a bull terrier"

Thanks for the tips, Ball.

We've been doing just that -- knocking on doors and talking with the owners.

We're learning a lot!

We're still open to recommendations though, from anyone, before we make a decision...

Thanks again,

~~z

Dear Zap,

Can I ask you who is going to supervise the construction? How will the specifications be agreed? I have found many people who ended up with a house which resembled what they wanted but was far from what they thought they were getting. In nearly all those cases the owner spent little time on sight, and in most the price of corrections was expensive. Building here is as they say, largely "Up to You".

Isaanaussie

I think there is another perspective to rural land purchases in the near future.

Yes I completely agree that the baht is way over valued currently and surely must fall. But if you have been into a supermarket lately you will find most "non-essentials" especially imports and foreign owned, local company produced items have risen sharply. That seems odd to me. Couple this with the enthusiastic plunge into rice and other crops this year by many farmers after the last rice surge. Many of these people followed the traditional funding route of 3% per month to purchased fertiliser via the merchants, again after very steep increases in fertiliser prices. Now with rice prices are dropping, costs continuing to escalate as the government relaxs controls, and with debt levels rising again, I believe the bottom may well drop out domestically before an international influence causes it.

Either way there are liable to many "Hot Money" cheap deals looming. If it isn't land, then it will surely be repossessed tractors that seem to be growing in number fastest than cassava plants and rubber trees.

For me, I am tending to look at renting land rather than buying more. Consider this, you buy a reasonable 2nd hand excavator with the intention of digging dams for say 200K. You negotiate mid term leases for land (dry season only) with a condition that you build a dam on the land, rental at say 1 to 200 baht per rai/month over 5 years. Do the maths, on a single ten rai block or even a few smaller holdings totalling ten rai, I find it hard to justify purchasing. What I need is more feed for animals and the cheapest way of obtaining it....

Just a thought....

Isaanaussie

Do you know what the difference is between OP's on the Farming Forum and those in the general area of TV?

Well the farmers talk about hormones

The generalists talk about whore moans.........

http://www.bangkokpost.com/290908_Business...p2008_biz27.php

Ethanol benchmark price looks set to rise 22% in Q4

YUTHANA PRAIWAN

The ethanol benchmark price is likely to rise by 22% in the fourth quarter to 24 baht a lire, according to the Energy Policy and Planning Office (EPPO).

Thailand uses Brazil's Sao Paulo market as a reference in setting local benchmark prices, which are reviewed each quarter. Based on current trends, the fourth-quarter price would rise to 22 baht a litre from 18.01 baht at present, plus transport and premium fees of more two baht a litre.

The rising popularity of ethanol-based fuels in Brazil, Europe, North and South America is the major factor behind ethanol price increases, said Viraphol Jirapraditkul, the EPPO director-general.

But Chalush Chinthammit, assistant vice-president of KSL Group Plc, Thailand's fourth-largest sugar producer, said ethanol prices were still very competitive and would remain so unless crude oil dropped to US$40 a barrel.

An Energy Ministry source said Shell had delayed a plan to sell E20 fuel because its major ethanol supplier, Thai Alcohol, declined to offer new supplies as it believed prices would rise soon.

Thai Alcohol also is facing more demand from its liquor subsidiaries ahead of the year-end festive season.

Ethanol shortages are becoming a serious concern as the popularity of alternative fuels surges. Current regulations cover inventories and product safety standards but officials cannot directly control producers' business activities.

There has been a proposal to put the Department of Alternative Energy Development and Efficiency (DEDE) in charge of the industry with full authority to regulate all types of alternative fuels.

The source said another shortage could occur after the next sugar harvest season, given rising ethanol demand, not only in Thailand but also in Japan, Korea, the Philippines and China.

Dear K,

I have an interest in cassava, not as a grower but as a consumer. The last time I looked the local prices were arounf 1.9 baht per kg. At that rate I am happy to buy from farmers and prepare pig feeds myself, much better than average of 15 baht commercial feeds. At that rate, I could never produce near break even volume on the meagre land area I have.

Can I ask you as a grower and someone who follows this issue closely, what is the future here?

Will the delayed ethanol plants usually be built?

Can farmers profit from growing cassava? (I am assuming that we are talking small holding Thai farmers with traditional equipment and limited cash.)

Is the traditional starch industry still growing?

Locally, considering the drop back in fuel prices, what's the production costs comparison now?

Note: I have an interest in alternate fuels, but biodiesel and oil seed not ethanol.

Hope you have some time to share your views

Isaanaussie

So, Issan aussie......sounds like you are in the same situation as me. My pullets are [approx] 18-20 weeks old and are housed in a bamboo and grass roof shack with a cement floor. I do let them free range for a couple of hours in the afternoon and having been caged raised, it's funny to see them learning how to scratch.

I do know the value of the rice hull litter as a soil amendment to the clay soils we have up here and would like to simply add it to the compost pile then into the garden. Would the 'EM' enzyme speed up the decomposition and possibly salvage the nitrogen that will disapate??

Sorry mate, pass me on enzyme treatments. I treat the hulls as a carrier if you like, they last longer than other vege matter and keep aeration OK. Apparently they absorb the nitrogen first then release it, again not a chemistry set in sight. If you are thinking about worms, feed back as protein to the chickens, perhaps you could set aside (fence so you can regulate the chickens) a space near where they scratch and work the litter and lime into the soil. Perhaps a 2-3 00mm deep trench then mix soil and litter and put it back. Extend the trench as you have more litter. You should have worms by the bucketload in a month or two and the now "crappy" soil would be used for your vegies.

IA

HI Aussie

"�� Insect repellent for use on plants, crops and even on humans

�� Stops the toilet smelling when mixed with the water in the cistern

�� Improves excema and skin conditions when mixed with bath water

�� Aids digestion in humans (Pastor Kae-Nu averted the need for surgery which he could not afford by taking a thimble-full a day)"

these lines sound like you're describing Neem.

Gungadin,

Probably true. Anything to knock the edge off pig urine smells is worth a look. My plans have been developing for a number of years and there are now a few "closer than I would like" sty neighbours. I am putting in a sprinkler system for the pigs (cooling and piss dilution) and will try this pig potion in that water.

IA

now that I have my 20 Rhode Island Red layers at 18 weeks, looking healthy and good temperament, i am using rice hulls [klab] for litter and change it weekly and add hydrated lime to keep odors [amonia]. I'm wondering what is the most sanitary way to deal with my growing pile of litter and to speed up the composting process?? should be great stuff for the veges this winter!!! Will composting sanitize the poop against avian flu and other possible pathogens??

I have 30 odd pullets about ready to start laying. Still living under the rice store until their house gets finished (unfortunately). I plan to spread netting under the roosting area to collect the droppings. Two days sun drying then grind and bag. The sun treatment supposedly fixes the pathogen problem. Finished material goes into farm made pig feed (high mineral content). Litter in the feeding area and scratch pen will go into compost (vermicomposting) or straight into the ground as hulls/lime/gypsum make a great soil conditioner in clay soils. My hen house has a full concrete floor and the plan is to water wash as required effluent going into a pond or biodigester.

The problem with rice hulls is they are pretty inert and take a long time to breakdown using a fair bit of nitrogen in doing so. Apparently a lot of that N becomes available again like a slow release fertiliser once the hulls have started to rot. The hulls make great mulch but unless they have started to breakdown can take a ton of water to get wet. If you use them check on the level of penetration when your water your vegies

You could try a compost tumbler (closed oil drum on an axle) which will allow you to mix up the compost, adjust the moisture content and keep temperature up higher. That should accelerate the deposition and take care of smells. Adding other organic matter that rots a bit quicker would help.

Isaanaussie

Thanks for the info. We had a lot of Som O (Thai grapefruit?) fallen from trees and rotting on the ground. The guy who is looking after our land suggested collecting them to make this liquid. I thought they would be too acidic, but have given it a go. I've also added some other weeds from the garden, but nothing with fruit.

Do you think this will work or is there too little sugar? Also, the area we have them in is difficult to make air tight, could this be a problem?

Any links on the composting technique or info on where to buy the 'dark green liquid' would be much appreciated.

Below is the only formula I can find, thought I had kept others but cannot find the notes. This one is used for sanitising pig deep litter in Cambodia or Laos. As far as I know it is the same.

Very hesitant to post, but here goes. Enjoy.

It all sounds bog-standard. But. It is possible that she's on the up and up.

Here's the old Thailand wisdom that I have a small problem with. 'She will NEVER put you before her family'.

After 5 years with my wife, I can categorically state that it isn't true in her case. (Howls of laughter in the background... Look, he says mine's different )

I am a pretty cynical not-so-old bastard. I didn't come to this conclusion easily, but I am not willing to lay out our life story on the net.

Furthermore, I also know a couple other Thai females for which this holds true.

I know Thai culture is this great monolithic unmovable thing in most peoples minds, and it holds true for the vast majority of Thai people, but it doesn't mean that ALL Thai adhere to it religiously. There are a growing number of people here that are changing their views and personal culture. A great deal depends on you, whether you can establish a personal contact - not easy if faced with cultural and language problems, not to mention the mutually-advantageous-contract style of a lot of relationships.

I wonder (maybe a poll) how many guys married to Thai females for a while would have found this after a few years together. I suspect there are a few.

ORE,

I fully support your view point and fall in line as one of the converted. Our relationship continues to strengthen as does our individual relationships with our in-laws. We are learning to appreciate the cultural differences which continue to narrow.

I honestly don't know why I read all 4 pages of posts on this issue, fascinated I suppose, or maybe because most Farangs living here for a long time have been through or seen all this before and for me it is like memory lane.

To the OP Steve, mate, life is for living. You can spend it looking in the mirror if you wish. The medical issues are easily addressed, the cultural issues are widely published, if you are serious then get educated, if not or you're a troll, get back under the bridge.

Isaanaussie

This is actually based on fact, yes it almost happened just like this....

I was up in Isaan continuing building the pig bahn last week. We had been there for a week and the last of the concrete posts had been set in place, tomorrow we would come back to Bangkok, so there I was having a quite beer when these two guys pull up on a bike. Now my Thai is pretty lousey but I could make out that they car was bogged and they wanted me to take either the 4WD or the tractor up to pull them out. Well, OK, what sort of car is it? It's the local shitties truck and she is brim full. Rule out the pickup, so where's the keys to the tractor. BIL has them in his pocket and he has gone to bring the cows home. OK guys you'll have to wait a bit. Ten minutes later with the herd of cows milling around the yard the story of the sewage truck is repeated to BIL, who promptly waves these two fine smelling guys off like flies with the comment Battery Mot, indicating tractor wont go. After they left, BIL repeats the comment adding Ching Ching. Sh-t why do they always tell the dramas just when you are ready to leave, TIT. No forget the cows, lets get this thing started. Needless to say, battery not mot, tractor wont start. So yours truely starts trying to find the problem. A voice from behind says, bet its the fuel system. Spinning around I find myself talking to one of the buffaloes. I am dumbstruck, head spinning I look at the watching Po Yai Bahn and say did you hear what that buffalo said. Response, dont listen to him, he knows <deleted>-k all about tractors......

And to finish off, one from back home....

A Texan farmer goes to Australia for a vacation. There he meets an Aussie farmer and gets talking. The Aussie shows off his big wheat field and the Texan says, "Oh! We have wheat fields that are at least twice as large".

Then they walk around the ranch a little and the Aussie shows off his herd of cattle. The Texan immediately says, " We have longhorns that are at least twice as large as your cows".

The conversation has, meanwhile, almost died when the Texan sees a herd of kangaroos hopping through the field. He asks, "And what are those"?

The Aussie asks with an incredulous look, "Don't you have any grasshoppers in Texas"?

An Isaan farmer's son was returning from the market with the cardboard box of chicken's his father had entrusted to him, when all of a sudden the box fell off the motorbike and broke open. Chickens scurried off in different directions, but the determined boy walked all over the mobahn scooping up the wayward birds and returning them to the repaired box. Hoping he had found them all, the boy reluctantly returned home, expecting the worst.

"Po, the chickens got loose," the boy confessed sadly, "but I managed to find all twelve of them."

"Well, you did real good, son," the farmer beamed. "You only left with seven."

A bus load of Thai politicians were driving down a country road one afternoon, when all of a sudden, the bus ran off the road and crashed into a tree in a farmer's rice paddy.

Seeing what happened, the farmer went over to investigate. He then proceeded to dig a hole and bury the politicians.

A few days later, a local policeman came by, saw the crashed bus, and asked the farmer, "Were they all dead?"

The old farmer replied, "Well, some of them said they weren't, but you know how them politicians lie."

A Thai Politician had a "Tacky" background and was back in the country secretly, travelling on minor roads in southern Thailand canvassing votes for his relatives. The chauffeur accidentally hit and killed a pig that had wandered out onto the road. Tacky told the chauffeur to drive up to the farm and apologize to the farmer.

They drove up to the farm, the chauffeur got out went into the house. He was in there for what seemed like hours. When the chauffeur came out, Tacky was confused about why his driver had been in there so long.

"Well, first the farmer shook my hand, then he offered me a Mekong, then his wife brought me some food, and his daughter showered me with kisses." explained the driver.

"What did you tell the farmer?" Tacky asked.

The chauffeur replied, "I just told him I was your driver and I'd just killed the pig."

(adapted to suit.....)

They make that type of fertilizer here in Loei. The finished product is a clear dark green colored liguid. I don't know how they make it. My wife says they use the effluent left over after making methane from hog manure. Sugar cane is also a big part of it.

Correct Gary about the biodigester effluent. The liquid fraction is a great fertiliser both for crops as well as fish feeding. The solids get dried as treated manure or used as worm bedding material and then the castings are used as potting mix. The liquids from the worm beds I mentioned above.

I believe the liquid fractions can also be used in aquaculture.

isaanaussie

You can also get liquid fertiliser via a vermicompost or vermiculture bed. The liquid effluent (dark brown) that drains out the bottom of a raised worm bed is good stuff. Dilute with water again. Just watch the water level in the bed is not too high as the worms and the compost will suffer. Again plenty of info on the web.

Isaanaussie

A few weeks ago we visited a farmer who was making his own organic liquid fertilizer. I'm not sure of the exact details, but from what the guy was saying it seems rotting produce/organic matter is put into a blue barrel, then left for a while. When it is partly decomposed two substances are added. One is called 'GM' and the other 'Gut Numtarn' (?? sugar).

The containers are then sealed and the organic fertilizer is created.

Does anyone have a clue what I'm talking about? I know it's really vague, but things are never clear in LOS. It looked very interesting.

Dear SS,

They use banana and a number of other fruits with high sugar levels and the fermented liquid is then diluted for a range of uses from tonics to fertiliser. Bit like brewing beer, can explode depending on the sugar added.

If you want a simple organic liquid fertiliser then you can make it by putting raw manure in a drum of water give it a mix and wait until it decomposes a bit and some of the pathogens are gone. Keeping the air out is the trick to get rid of the nasties and make the nitrogen content more useful. My Dad used to keep a drum of water with cow shit in it in the corner of his vegie garden and just ladle a bit out when needed. His wasn't that scientific simply keep the manure content stable and the drum full of water with the lid on.

With the fruit versions there is quite a bit of web material on it. One I can remember from Cambodia which was also used to reduce the smell in pigsites as well as a fertiliser.

Isaanaussie

I/A,

Is the forage cutter just a knife drive or would it be disc with a blower?

F/J

p/s same my rainfall post many new dryland farmers but nobody studies it.

FJ

See attached spec sheet, description of the cutting system and blower is pretty basic, sorry. Oh, can I have the link to your rainfall post, sounds interesting. Water "is" farming in my part of Isaan.

Star_Frail_Cutter_brochure.pdf