rethaired

I am wondering which of the 2 I should apply for: a 2 months tourist visa or permanency, sponsoring her?

We got married in LOS after a 3 years relationship during which we lived together for an aggregate amount of 1.5 y. (on and off). She has acquired my surname. We have evidence of our relationship by way of pictures and correspondence. She has been working for 4 years in the tourism industry and has a university degree in that field. She works on a contract basis. She bought a new car this year, which she has started to make payment on. She intents to use it to decrease her dependency on contracts/individuals by getting other jobs that necessitate a car and increase her ability to weather low season idling time. We live in an apartment for which she has a yearly contract for and has had for a couple of years now. She might not have a lot of money in her bank account due to the fact she is making car payment and times are tougher in the tourist industry at this time, but I could help a little! I have and she has no intention of staying abroad. The purpose of the visit would be to meet parents and visit. If it can be done, we might be able to organize and have a ceremony. I work abroad for 5 months and then go back to LOS. I have done this for the last 3 years. I have a condo abroad, all paid for. I have a contract to work abroad part-time for the next 2 years, in the same manner that has occurred in the past. We have not had any official ceremony in LOS or abroad. It is difficult to organize the ceremony in LOS at this time because she might be required to work, she might not have the time to get things ready (work contracts are 3 or 4 days long/ 15 hours long, and often back to back), and I am leaving in less than 3 months. It could take place, but it might be hard to pull off. Maybe we could do something smaller here in LOS.

I was suggested by the consul to apply for both. I fear that this might not look good as we want to live in LOS and not abroad. Of course, permanency might help whenever she wants to visit, saving us to do the paperwork every time. I think it might be wise to request permanency the 2nd time she comes abroad.

I am aware of the list of requirements for visa and permanency procedures. I will of course provide the necessary evidence to establish our relationship. She will show that she has assets in LOS (car).

I would pay for her 2 way ticket. Should I buy it with cancellation provisions in case the visa does not go through, with the idea that supplying this evidence will help establishing that she will leave after 2 months?

Should I apply for both the visa and the permanency or just the visa?

Should I seek advice from a lawyer?

What do you suggest?

I think that is truly a great list and will be used by many to help women in dire situations.

Do we have a similar list of organisations to help men in dire need?

I don't know of any!

There are organizations for dogs though!

I find it odd that there are organizations for dogs and women! Men don't run into problems?

But, if in need, I suppose men could refer to the list for pubs, casinos, bingo halls, or churches (temples, mosques,...)!

If that fails, refer to the list for hospitals, jails, or cremation services!

Sad, but true!

PS: The same could be said for the lack of resources for men in need in Western countries, BTW! BTW, who pays for all of these organizations?

Why is everyone in Bangkok and those planning on travelling to bangkok so bloody scared? Relax people Bangkok is in the south but I guess you bangkok people have the map upside down. There is more to Thailand than Bangkok, and Pattaya.

When did the govt move Bangkok to the south???

Wait.Always been there?? Is my wife dumber n farang. All this time she has stuck to the claim that Bangkok is central.

I think what the original poster was trying to say was that, in terms of direction, BKK is south of the those regions that were stated as being in danger. He or she is right in that respect! In terms of position, BKK is in the center of LOS. So, both of you are right! Can't people be a little bit more open-minded and generous? Why do we have these on-going intellectual fights with some members? Methink it is all about people have complexes of superiority! Are you that enlightened? We live in LOS! Most of us are retired. No need to compete anymore! No need to denigrate another anymore! Relax! Be nice to each other!

The guys whose wives let them cheat do so because they are repulsed by them and do not want the responsibility to sleep with them. Those who actually love their husbands will not be happy about them sleeping around.

Sorry to burst the farang delusional balloon.

With this i totally agree,...".Those who actually love their husbands will not be happy about them sleeping around."

Love? Or fear to lose!

I think we should define "love" because it is so often used to describe that superficial feeling that one has about the other person's beauty. Infatuation is often what people refer to love. Do you honestly think that many men (and women) pair up because they love each other? For women, money and security are what love is. For men, it is more about beauty. Initially it is because they find each other attractive or are attracted by how generous they are (and millionaires are made naturally always generous ). After, depending on how attractive or how wealthy the other person is (and how good their personality and intelligence are), many will try they hardest to attribute qualities for flaws they possess or try to mitigate their flaws. There are many fat and ugly women (and many small and "unwealthy" men) who would deserve to be loved on the basis of their personality and intelligence.

In any case, if one loves someone, they should want the best for them, not keep them from experiencing life and prevent them from having their needs met. That would be selfish, I think.

OK I'll take the plunge. In my case the well has dried up so to speak. I am allowed 1 night stands, but choose normally not to. I did stray the once. I stay with my wife because I love her. The sex side was great until she went through the menopause.

You would think that if you wife was not up to it, she would allow to have fun on the side! To love someone is to want the best for them and since marriage is about sex --mostly-- and she cannot do it, why would she (or anyone) prohibit from being able to get your rocks off? Maybe women would not stray (because they do not need it, but who knows with them), but if one's wife was not able to eat sweets, would that mean that she could prevent another from eating it! Sex --INMHO-- is just another necessary physical need that some men and women have. If a woman does not need it, why would she prevent another person from having it?

That's not love, that's hate!

The biggest drawback in buying a house (apart from the fact that one has to find a bogus scheme to ensure it is not a bad investment) is that there is no zoning in CM, which brings in the added worry of having a big hotel or apartment building being build next to you. Of course, this is not so much of an issue in moobans, but is the security at the gate really a bonus or a liability AND is the structure of moobans actually one that enable friendship and networking. I find apartment and condo better in some instances as you do actually cross path with these dwellers in the elevator, which allows you to create connections, some more meaningful than others.

The second most aggravating investment drawback for anything, apart from air pollution, is the noise pollution, namely dog barking and religious chants and ringing of all kind disturbing the peace and quiet.

Yes, I know I should learn to tune them out or close my window!

I hear that air pollution is being addressed. When is dog pollution going to? As far as the other kind, well, of course, I should be more tolerant. But, why can't they?

Buyer beware!

That is what the MFA charge for the certification.

I think the cheapest translation serviece I have seen charges about 400 bant per page.

A quote ot 1600 baht does not sound that unreasonable to me. How many pages are being translated?

One page.

100 words.

400 B. a page might be reasonable based on what there is on that page. The affidavit in question has about 100 words and 90 % of them known by a 5th grader. "I", "bearer of Canadian passport no.", "issued at" "on". "was born" "in", "and my address is". That's just a small sample. If this was some complicated scientific or engineering doc., I could understand.

The MFA charges 200 B. for the first 100 W. This is still a rip-off, but more in-line with what I have heard is the going rate.

I have done translation and can tell you that, for Thailand, 400 B. for this kind of document is excessive, considering that they probably (if they are smart, which is not a given, however) have a digital version in which they can put the variable personal info in. All told a good typist should be able to do this in 5 min., which is 4000 B + an hour!

So, 1600 B. seems a bit of a rip-off, considering the above. Of course, it is not a rip-off if you have the overhead and costs of living of the Western world, but we are not in the West, last time I checked.

BTW, am I dreaming or is this right that they do translation of documents for 200 B.?

For what it's worth, here is my experience since posting earlier in the year. We have a unique situation in that my wife's birth date was changed at her amphoer of birth. (really long story) ThaiVisa search doesn't seem to work so I can't find the thread I started talking about that issue. Anyway, we decided to change my wife's name for personal reasons because, well, we're married. Also we decided to change her name so that all legal documents would match and just make life easier hopefully.

First we went to the U.S. embassy to get our marriage certificate notarized. Then we went outside and had it translated for 150baht. Then we drove straight to the Ministry of Affairs Legalization Division. We showed them the certificate, her current ID card, and notary letter from the embassy. 4 hours later, we got the appropriate documents and headed home. My wife will now to to any amphoe of choice to change her last name on ID card and then passport. I still don't get the household registration book. We still pass around her father's to whoever in the family needs it. I don't know how changing her name will effect that, but hopefully we won't have to deal with this document crap for awhile. I've spent way too many hours sweating in government offices.

Can you tell us the name/web address of the person or company. I guess it does not cost anything to get the paper from the ministry. Right? But, how does one do if one is not in BKK. The Canadian consulate says you can send them the 2 affidavits, but must pay them some fee by way of money order. Is there anyone who has done it this way? How does the Thai citizen do in this instance? Does she need to send some paper/copies to the ministry as well? I will email the ministry, which might give me some answers. Thanks.

Found some info on the website:

Legalization Fee (per document/stamp)

ท Certified genuine signature 200 Baht

ท Certified true copy of document issued by Thai authorities

200 Baht

ท Certified true copy of civil and family registration document

200 Baht

ท Certified translation of judicial document

* First 100 words 200 Baht

* Every 100 words or the remaining of the next 100 words

200 Baht

ท Certified other documents (documents prior certified by other Thai authorities concerned) 200 Baht

Normal Service: The certified document is ready for collection within 2 working days after the date of submission;

Express Service: The certified document is ready for collection within the same day of submission. The fees are double of normal service fees.

(The applicant is advised to submit the application within 15.30 hrs.);

Postal Service is available for your convenience;

Remarks: Legalization of a document issued in foreign country cannot be processed without prior legalization by the Royal Thai Embassy or Consulate in that country or by the Embassy or Consulate of that country in Thailand.

The consulate indicates that both signatures need to be recognized/certified by the ministry, but I find this a little bit too contrived as this would mean that the translator would need to go back to the consulate for notarization and have the Thai translation translated back into English, to make sure all was proper! In fact, the consulate states that "only the English declaration must be notarized". "Notarized" is a fancy term lawyers use to make themselves more interesting. It really means signed and stamped by an official person. In any case, I hope this helps others. I have been quoted a 1600 B. fee to have the whole process done from CM: translation to certification at the Ministry. Thsi was the fee given by the top company listed on the consulate form. I cannot remember if we can name companies or not. Is there anyone who has some experience or more info about this process?

On the consulate form, it is indicated that one can mail the forms for a fee by way of Laksi Post Office. I would not be surprised if that is what the translation offices did, but I could be wrong there. In any case, 200 B +, say, max. 300 B. translation + some post office expenses make good business, especially considering that the form really contains 100 words, most of them really easy words to be translated. Maybe they make a 1000 B profit on this? Am I right or am I missing something? Ok! 1000 B. minus the small extra fee at the ministry perhaps! Wink! Wink! Especially if they have the exact form already translated and all is needed is to fill in the blank. Ok! OK! Initially they had to translate! Jeesh! I think I am going to open a company!

BTW, I suspect that the fee is only 200 B.: certification of the signature, since this is what the consulate indicates is necessary!

Finally, beware that the list of translation offices given on the form was pathetically out-of-date. While it is nice that the consul gives us such a list, it would be helpful if they kept it up to date or just not give any (false) lead. On the other hand, the "2004" at the bottom of the form should have been a clue!

I hope this to be helpful. Any questions? Comments?

To understand these statistics. the key question that needs to be asked is how many of the illegal taxis and guides arrested were soliciting ARRIVING customers. From what I could see, all the authorities did was target the unregistered limousines and cars from hotels and other drivers from Pattaya and Bangkok who were DROPPING OFF passengers ie easy targets and a fairly honest bunch.

Of course, the real thugs targetting the ARRIVING passengers are not touched. An arriving passenger is a golden goose - who wants a departing customer who has already discovered the pricing and currency in Thailand? You need to get them "fresh" to really rip them off.

The crackdown is a joke - everyone in the airport is in on the scam. Similarly, have you ever tried to find the "cheap" river taxi on the Chao Praya river in Bangkok? Every single person you ask, be they an official selling the ferry tickets, to the flower sellers , to the police, will guide you to the long-tails waiting to give you a private tour of the river at an inflated price (to pay off everyone in the chain).

Come on, Thailand, all this corruption is hurting the country more than you can imagine. And its like a slap in the face to those who their work diligently and honestly.

Very good point!

Is this crackdown an exercise in "marketing" or show or is it a well thought out plan to remove the problem and remove the problem FOR GOOD!

How many tourists in Thailand can claim not to have been ripped off when arriving for the first time in LOS? While I can understand that taxi drivers are probably rolling into millions of B., it would help the public transport system to evolve with all the positive consequences that would imply.

This is a positive development, but let's see if it will change things for the long-term.

For what it's worth, here is my experience since posting earlier in the year. We have a unique situation in that my wife's birth date was changed at her amphoer of birth. (really long story) ThaiVisa search doesn't seem to work so I can't find the thread I started talking about that issue. Anyway, we decided to change my wife's name for personal reasons because, well, we're married. Also we decided to change her name so that all legal documents would match and just make life easier hopefully.

First we went to the U.S. embassy to get our marriage certificate notarized. Then we went outside and had it translated for 150baht. Then we drove straight to the Ministry of Affairs Legalization Division. We showed them the certificate, her current ID card, and notary letter from the embassy. 4 hours later, we got the appropriate documents and headed home. My wife will now to to any amphoe of choice to change her last name on ID card and then passport. I still don't get the household registration book. We still pass around her father's to whoever in the family needs it. I don't know how changing her name will effect that, but hopefully we won't have to deal with this document crap for awhile. I've spent way too many hours sweating in government offices.

Can you tell us the name/web address of the person or company. I guess it does not cost anything to get the paper from the ministry. Right? But, how does one do if one is not in BKK. The Canadian consulate says you can send them the 2 affidavits, but must pay them some fee by way of money order. Is there anyone who has done it this way? How does the Thai citizen do in this instance? Does she need to send some paper/copies to the ministry as well? I will email the ministry, which might give me some answers. Thanks.

Family and children section is always a good place to ask questions abut that. But it really depends on what you want to know.

I thought of searching there, but the title of the forum gave me the impression that it is about children and the extended family as children are usually part of one's family (making the word in the title redundant). Any thoughts of making a dedicated forum for "marriage" or adding the word "spouse" to that forum?

Nope, not that kind of voice. Sorry. And really, surely you know who Alan Rickman is?

No, but surely you do not know ... Chomsky, Camus, and Marquez!

The translation has to be certified by the Ministry of Foreign affairs.

Is there an office in Chiang Mai?

So, did you go to a translation office and did they mail it to the Ministry of Foreign Affairs? Who did it and what was the fee? Any issues?

Thais grow up with these sounds and you're right they don't notice, or at least react, to them.

There's a Thai expression that is often used to describe ignoring someone (usually a farang) complaining. A rough translation is that the complaints are as noticeable as barking dogs and crowing cocks IE they have switched off and don't notice them.

Buddhism teaches that it's your reaction to something that makes it annoying FOR YOU. Thias don't react, therefore many things just don't bother them. They're not bottling their emotions, they just don't care.

The reaction is not annoying, the action is. Buddhism does not teach me anything! Logic does! I just might add that the consequence to the reaction might be quite pleasant: dogs' owner charged for nuisance. Does B. teach people not to bother others?

my advice dont do it, it will all end in tears, why get married just live together instead, far less hassle

Of course, it is less trouble, but women know that by 40 (or earlier) they will be younger bodies looking to hook up with you with the bothersome consequence that you GF of 40 y. o. will get ditched for the younger one, hence marriage to dissuade the fly-by-night guy/girl who is only concerned about his/her own interest! BTW, dissuasion is often not sufficient, hence the term dissuasion.

Here's the character you're looking for: ฿

So that'd be for example ฿1,900 to apply. Or ฿30,000 to fly to Hawaii.

Store it somewhere safe & special, ready to copy & paste.

Or, it's also on your keyboard, when you switch to Thai then you hit Shift-7 (the ampersand) This will also give you a ฿

As a special bonus, here is the sign for Lao Kip: ₭

Thanks, but I think this is much too complicated when you know that you can press Cap Lock and "b" and add a "." for good measure. I would think most people would know what we are talking about!

My 2 B.'s worth!

PS. I prefer to put in after I type the number because I say 500 Bahts not Bahts 500. Not sure what is "acceptable", but rules that are totally illogical and/or not pragmatic don't get my seal of approval! I think the rule for USD is $ + #, which is in my view a bit too anal for my liking. What about other currencies? Let's see who has the most logical and pragmatic rules!

As far as the UK is concerned, there is no requirement for a wife to take her husband's name upon marriage. Keeping her maiden name will not have any effect upon her rights as a wife; the marriage certificate will provide all the proof that is needed of her status as a wife.

Whether the situation is the same in Thailand, I'm not sure. My wife changed her name on her ID card immediately after our marriage, but did not change the name in her passport until it expired and she renewed it at the RTE in London, 4 years after our wedding and her arrival in the UK.

We have recently bought property in Krung Thep and her having a Farang surname has not caused us any problems.

In case any one is wondering, a legal marriage in Thailand (i.e. the ampur registration) is legally recognised in the UK and the Thai marriage certificate, with certified English translation, is all the proof of the marriage one needs in the UK.

Thanks! I agree there is no need for her to change her name in many Western countries now. But, it is cumbersome to carry a marriage certificate to prove and show that you are married to a foreigner and I don't think many people do take their certificate when going through customs! Right? Having the foreigner name might expedite matters a little. Good info about no having to change her name though on her passport.

As far as the UK is concerned, there is no requirement for a wife to take her husband's name upon marriage. Keeping her maiden name will not have any effect upon her rights as a wife; the marriage certificate will provide all the proof that is needed of her status as a wife.

Whether the situation is the same in Thailand, I'm not sure. My wife changed her name on her ID card immediately after our marriage, but did not change the name in her passport until it expired and she renewed it at the RTE in London, 4 years after our wedding and her arrival in the UK.

We have recently bought property in Krung Thep and her having a Farang surname has not caused us any problems.

In case any one is wondering, a legal marriage in Thailand (i.e. the ampur registration) is legally recognised in the UK and the Thai marriage certificate, with certified English translation, is all the proof of the marriage one needs in the UK.

Thanks. I agree! But, it is cumbersome to carry a marriage certificate and I don't think many people do when going through customs! Right? Good info about no having to change her name though on her passport.

I have a Thai passport and I have a thoroughly Anglo Irish name that I was born with, am six foot one and have two blond haired, blue eyed daughers, also with Thai passports.

Name, height, face, looks etc....not an issue

But if you are Thai and look like Thai and have a Thai name, then immigrating might be an issue, but if you have a foreigner name, it might be easier. It shouldn't, of course. I guess,... you would not know!

"On the other hand, we know how much a farang would pay if there is a car accident..."

I don't know. How much?

If you hit a motorcycle or the opposite, the other person can make things difficult by going to the police and indicate one was in the wrong. Apparently, this lady brought some "bikers" she knew to dissuade my GF to talk to the police, but --apparently-- one needs to involve the police. It might be the case that one needs to pay a fine because one was in the wrong and --apparently-- some Thai make things even more difficult, claiming fictitious injuries,... I don't know. I am restating what I was told. Can this be true?

My first serious boyfriend had a deep voice, he called me once, after I'd moved away and my housemate (a woman) said, there is some seriously sexy sounding guy on the phone. It was my ex.

So, yes voices are nice too. I think Alan Rickman has the most amazing voice

Smokers?

We are considering whether or not my Thai GF (soon to be wife) should change her name as get married.

Of course, it would be simpler if she did not have to make changes in banks, get a new passport, new ID, professional licence,...

But, one must consider the implication in terms of going abroad, being questioned at customs,... Would custom officers feel different if the Thai woman has an hyphenated name? Would they less likely to be suspicious,...? Would she be seen mre favorably if she was asking for permanent resident status?

On the other hand, we know how much a farang would pay if there is a car accident in LOS and the name of the car has a farang name on the car registration!

What are your experiences and thoughts?

Hi,

I’ve been itching to respond to the various replies to my original post for some time, but held off until I have had some time under my belt. I can almost hear some say ‘’ he’s only been here 5 minutes and thinks he knows it all’’ Not true, I accept I have much to learn but am trying very hard.

In the very early stages I read a great deal on three forums and the underlying trend was of cynicism and negativity with a great emphasis on the money grabbing ways of the average Tai girl. This didn’t help our relationship very much at the beginning because I found myself analysing everything my girlfriend/fiancé/wife was saying and doing. Any discussion regarding money was treated with great suspicion, and I was questioning many of her motives. One of my wife’s overriding ambitions is to be very rich, she makes no bones about it, and I had to wonder if it was to be achieved at my expense. Fortunately she is an excellent diplomat and was able to rise above it; otherwise our relationship could have been doomed before it got started.

I am pleased to say that I had no cause to worry. Although not static her average income exceeds mine and our capital assets are very similar. I was wrong in my original post about her work, she is actually a free lancer working for several contractors who contract to local government (does that make sense!?)I have suggested that maybe she stop working and spend more time with me but she is reluctant to do so, although she has reduced her working hours and delegates more than she used to. The cost of building the house, together with furnishing, is being shared equally between us.

I have settled down very well inUttaradit since I feel it would have been criminal to take her away from her friends, family and work mates. I am studying the Tai reading, writing and speaking with a vengeance, and playing regularly at the army golf course when she is working, which answers the question from Loaded.

Ulysses.G. Yes I did anticipate taking up from when I left the UK and, by and large that is the case. Before my wife died of the big C I was well looked after by a very dutiful lady, I played a lot of golf, did a mass of reading and otherwise led a fairly quiet domesticated life. Life is very similar here. I do get well looked after, I do play golf and I do read a lot. The difference is that I have a much younger wife and my friends speak a foreign language. The first difference is a great asset and the second is slowly being overcome. Of course there are disadvantages. I miss the camaraderie of my friends back in my old golf club. After a game of golf I am soaked in sweat. The Tai food is taking some getting used to. There are very few farang here so I HAVE to learn the language and I find it a difficult language to learn. The Tai T.V. programmes are absolutely appalling. The soaps are watched from 8.30 to 10.30 each evening and I am sure that the choreographers would be unemployed in the UK. Fortunately this will be overcome in the new house since we have one room which has been designated for me ( even thebuilder refers to it as ''Chris's room'')where I can have some peace (they DO like crowds around them) and watch programmes in English.

Uttaradit, I agree, is a quiet town, but that suits me, and we travel to Phitsanalok regularly for the big shop, maybe Cinema or bowls. There are very few farang although I do meet one occasionally for a drink. My wife and I often visit the farang restaurants New York or Swiss Gardens, so I can still get a good steak now and again. It would be good to meet up with one or two English speaking farang in the area, who play golf, but by and large I am very happy and life here is much, much better than the one I left behind in the UK

It would have been helpful if your original post had described some of the info given here because it appeared --at first-- to be an unbearable situation.

In which forum one should post/ask questions about marriage to a Thai?