monkeycountry

The army will not turn out for a coup... they are in Thaksins pocket now. Your chosen side has assasinated many innocent people before...so a couple more what prick your conscience. Very vociferous for your first 2 posts. Surprised you have not posted before...

Please give evidence where anyone but the reds or the army have killed people since say ... 2009?

The army killed on the instruction of the government of the day. Abhisit 2010 (only if you believe he was the leader and not just a puppet)

Again, please hand your evidence to the DSI. They really need it.

The orders will have been put in writing and many people will have a copy. Nobody is going to instuct his soldiers to shoot to kill without the orders in his back pocket. It will come out at the trial...Over to you

Yet out of all those people with a copy of the written orders, none have sent an anonymous copy to any newspaper or the DSI. Even you must find that strange :-)

The army will not turn out for a coup... they are in Thaksins pocket now. Your chosen side has assasinated many innocent people before...so a couple more what prick your conscience. Very vociferous for your first 2 posts. Surprised you have not posted before...

Please give evidence where anyone but the reds or the army have killed people since say ... 2009?

The army killed on the instruction of the government of the day. Abhisit 2010 (only if you believe he was the leader and not just a puppet)

Again, please hand your evidence to the DSI. They really need it.

This is exactly what this grub Suthep is trying to do . He does not give a stuff if one of his sheep gets shot, just as long as he can get a dead body to use for his defense on the 20th. He has "upped the anti" hoping to get a dead body so that he can say that Yingluck is a murderer like himself and Abisit.

Well he's got that now, so you're implying that they can all go home and get on with life?

You're havin' a laugh...

Sent from my iPad using Thaivisa Connect Thailand mobile app

One colour shooting another is not the fault of Yingluck as she has given no orders to use live ammo or shoot protestors. Where as Abhisit and Suthep did

All those of you who know which orders AV and ST gave should really bring your info and evidence to the DSI. They might even give you a reward :-)

so if I'm reading this thread correctly and all the information provided is near enough correct -

some anti government protestors attacked a bus transporting redshirts with stones and whatnot then the redshirts opened fire with lethal weapons in retaliation and shot some young guy dead

but the redshirts don't carry weapons and didn't shoot at police and army in 2010........right

so who is the DSI going to charge with this murder ?

I am quite sure Tarit from the DSI is charging Abhisit as we speak :-)

She wont order the army to open fire on unarmed civilians killing 90 of them that is why Abhisit is seeing the courtrooms nothing more.

Really?? Do you think it might be because the protesters are not burning down the city and not occupying hospitals? You right, it might be hard to order to shoot at peaceful protesters . Though might be easier if say someone created some mess . Say-....... Gun shots, dead person

PEACEFUL ? try reading the title of this thread and try to keep up they are not peaceful but she still wont be giving the order to open fire.

I copied the thread title for you , where does it say that the aniti government protesters are the violent ones ? There are pictures on the forum from red shirts carrying a load of weapons, haven't seen one from an opposition protester holding a weapon.

Thai political protests turn violent, one dead

Try watching the NEWS worldwide (BBC CNN) ALL REPORTING Anto government demonstrators ATTACK RED SHIRT BUS

does writing with capital letters mean you are yelling?

Btw, danish news report the police shot and killed one protester and wounded 3 others. I would not put too much trust in foreign news sources :-)

YOU ANTI THAKSIN supporters have to admit now that the agressors are the demonstrators YOU cant blame the red shirts for this since its clear they were the ones attacked and if it turns out they shot the kid dead then it was obviosuly in self defense while being attacked by a MOB. there is also a video just posted of these so called peaceful protesters attacking a taxi and the driver

figured I would post the video to show who the aggressors are

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-chbv56ZvPE#t=0

Come on Yingluck stop pussyfooting with these scumbags and enforce the law

Lol, some one shot at red shirt camp and you instantly blame the opposition?

May be it was the red shirts who shot opposition member, ever thought of that?

I hope and looking forward to Yingluck being charged after army enters the city

I guess you cant read too well can you

I said IF it turns out to be a red shirt so I had considered it

Why would she get charged she has been EXTREMLY PATIENT up to now allowing them to break the law THEY ARE NOW BECOMING VIOLENT and need to be stopped, I doubt she will goe as far as the yellows did by killing 90 people, she has way more sense than that.

Lol, because if Abihist can be charged after putting up with city being held hostage for a month, she most certainly should be charged after 1 week wait

She wont order the army to open fire on unarmed civilians killing 90 of them that is why Abhisit is seeing the courtrooms nothing more.

You obviously have some evidence of this order, so why not do your red brothers a giant favour and give them the evidence? :-)

YOU ANTI THAKSIN supporters have to admit now that the agressors are the demonstrators YOU cant blame the red shirts for this since its clear they were the ones attacked and if it turns out they shot the kid dead then it was obviosuly in self defense while being attacked by a MOB. there is also a video just posted of these so called peaceful protesters attacking a taxi and the driver

figured I would post the video to show who the aggressors are

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-chbv56ZvPE#t=0

Come on Yingluck stop pussyfooting with these scumbags and enforce the law

Shall we compare track records of the reds and yellows re: mindless violence, chucking buckets of human blood over buildings ( that was soooo gross ) inciting crowds to burn Bangkok, invading hospitals...... you feel ok with that?

Yeah, pretty ok with that.

The blood thing was petty asian third world stuff, shamanistic and all a bit emotional and blurry, but we are in Asia ( i hope)

Who burned Bangkok is still debatable.

Anybody convicted yet ??

"Invading" , or is it checking out (?) a hospital after someone used the building to shoot at you ??

Understandable, i think.

Government using snipers to murder unarmed demonstrators ??

Are you ok with that lemonjelly ???

"Government using snipers to murder unarmed demonstrators ??" - anybody convicted yet? :-)

Talk about shooting yourself in the foot :-)

YOU ANTI THAKSIN supporters have to admit now that the agressors are the demonstrators YOU cant blame the red shirts for this since its clear they were the ones attacked and if it turns out they shot the kid dead then it was obviosuly in self defense while being attacked by a MOB. there is also a video just posted of these so called peaceful protesters attacking a taxi and the driver

figured I would post the video to show who the aggressors are

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-chbv56ZvPE#t=0

Come on Yingluck stop pussyfooting with these scumbags and enforce the law

Really? Obviously self defence? Pray tell how you know this?

The report states the red shirts but was ATTACKED BY THE DEMONSTRATORS duhhhh that means if a red shirt on that bus was the shooter it was in self defense of course its all speculation right now since nobody knows exactly what happened.

The truth is though the demonstrators have started TROUBLE AND GOT VIOLENT time to send the Army in with water cannons and tear Gas and deal with them as any other Government would.

Why are the red shits bringing guns to peaceful demonstrations? :-)

How was this determined? From ticket cancellations?

It can't be due to hotel cancellations because we were told just a couple of days ago that there haven't been any.

Today is Wednesday. The protests began when? Last week? Last week they were claiming that the protests won't have any effect. 22mn tourists is approximately, wait for it, 423,000 per week. So they have seen a 75% drop in a week? Now someone is telling some porkie pies. Are the resorts or the airports a complete wasteland?

I really wonder who these statements are aimed at anyway? The international press? Do they care? The thai hoteliers? Well they know whether they are full or not? The general public? What do they care? They have had tsnumais and floods to deal with. Who cares whether Thailand has 21 or 22mn tourists?

You ask "22mn tourists is approximately, wait for it, 423,000 per week. So they have seen a 75% drop in a week?"

Well, as I see it, the tourists "lost" is by counting both arrivals and cancellations, which can spread over the next 4-6 weeks, maybe more.

If the number of tourists expected in the last 5 weeks of 2013 was 2.5 million (it's high season), than a 300,000 drop is only 12% - and this seems reasonable.

Please do let me know how the TAT knows the cancellation numbers? Only the hotels and airlines know these numbers, and besides perhaps THAI Airways, they are not reporting them to the TAT daily or weekly. In fact as far as I know they do not report them at all.

I'm going to just wait and get the "official" numbers from the TAT, which will be a 200% increase in tourism since the protests began.

Since TAT is the government why would they do that? That would be the opposite impression of what they want to create. I'll simplify. Red shirts have the government and the majority. Yellow shirts want the government but don't have the majority so they want to appoint a government with no elections like Napoleon in a polo shirt sort of.

I see you do not know much about how the TAT works. Yes, the TAT is part of the government, but it also has it's own agenda. High tourist numbers generally tells the government that the TAT does a good job, which means more funding for the TAT next year. And like you, the government does not question the numbers given by the TAT. The TAT is infamous for pushing up the numbers for that exact reason, and if you ever talk to hotel managers, even at big hotel chains, you will find that not a single one of them believes anything the TAT says - including Thai hotel managers. They are providing raw numbers to more reliable private agencies and associations who then process the figures for them.

To Monkey. Sorry I didn't notice. My posts was directed and I quoted bigbamboo. I have no desire to engage you in a logic argument. If you know the Thai numbers are wrong post the right ones. If not I don't see the purpose of a discussion with you.

I would not discuss logic if I was you either :-)

Anyway, the right numbers are 800 tourists, causing an estimated loss of 3 million baht. My source is the same as the one referred to by khun Suwat Sitthilor in the OP. Hope this helps.

Three hundred thousand lost tourists already?

Borrocks!

So how many have not come already? If you know the number is wrong surly you must know the correct number. The correct number is?

What makes you think anyone knows the correct number? Does it not strike you as odd that the government is unable to calculate rice losses, even after all this time, but suddenly manage to calculate tourism losses within days? A loss that btw is much harder to calculate, as it involves many more parameters than the rice scam.

Could it be that they do not want to calculate the rice loss, as they are to blame for the loss, but that they are very eager, and apparently capable of calculating the tourism loss due to protests, as they can blame the opposition for that?

There is a correct number. But you are saying any number the Thais come up with will be wrong. Rice has nothing to do with it. My question was, how do you know the correct number. If you know that the Thai number is wrong you must logically know what the correct number is. Or am I correct in assuming you think anything the Thais do is wrong?

You are correct in assuming that I think Thai logic is very different from actual logic.

To continue your analogy. You are saying that if I know that a given number is wrong, then I must logically know the right number. This has nothing to do with actual logic, but sounds about right for Thai logic. To help you understand that there is no actual logic in your statement, have a look at the following examples.

I know the sun is not 1 meter in diameter. However, it does not mean I know the actual diameter.

I know you are not 800 years old. However, it does not mean I know how old you actually are.

I know there is not a billion baht on my bank account. However, it does not mean I know how much there is on my bank account.

I know there is not 100 million tourists (or tourist cancellations) in Thailand this year. It does not mean I know how many tourists (or tourist cancellations) there is.

I can keep going, but I'm sure you get the point

First of all, it is just a number the PTP government made up, they have no factual numbers to back up their statement.

Secondly, even if it was true, then big losses is usually not a concern for the PTP government, who is currently losing a similar amount of tax payer money each month on the rice scam alone. So I do not know why they are suddenly concerned about losses in the tourism industry?

Oh Abhisit what a nasty nasty man you are.

Has not your upbringing and your education taught you that this is no way to treat a lady.

The lecturers and your fellow students at the prestigious schools you attended would be appalled at your disgusting behavior.

Tomorrow you must apologise profusely to the lady and never ever treat her in this way again.

Another paid employee of the government. You really think WE will fall for your nonsense?

I think he was being sarcastic. It is true that Yingluck can barely talk. She messes up almost every speech she does.

On the other hand, K'Abhisit has not shown any evidence yet backing up of all his accusations.

It is very hard for the opposition to provide evidence of government corruption, when every single government balance sheet is kept secret by the government.

Imagine if private companies were allowed to keep their balance sheets secret from the revenue department, how on earth would the revenue department know how much tax was due, or how much the private companies had cheated?

Her speech would be a lot more credible if she could name just one anti-corruption case her administration has started? Especially one where some VIP has been tried and/or convicted. Personally I cannot think of even a single case?

Remember, this man also has a murder charge hanging over him. Not a nice man.

I am hoping you just don't know any better?

The OP is coming as a tourist and looking for an "awesome" time, he is basically a 2 week millionaire, he aint retiring here.

Agreed, but that's precisely why I made the comment about not trying to hand the guy a number. It wont take him long to realise that neither his wallet nor his body will stand up to night-after-night in 2-week millionaire mode over 7 months. That said, I think a realistic figure is closer to Tolley's 100K per month than the rather frugal 40K mentioned earlier. Take out the cost of the room, laundry and the odd visit to Central World and you're left with an entertainment budget of 15-18K per week : doesn't take much to put a serious dent in that over 7 days.

For many retirees, I guess the prospect of being able to average 2-2.5K a day in the bars might seem like a dream come true, but many (Farang) tourists happily blaze through 6-8K and up on a 2-week stay - a guy on another forum complained recently that he cant have night out in BKK any more for less than 12-15K baht, making Patts a relative bargain. I still think his numbers are OTT, but he seems to be the kind of guy who sees nothing wrong with a 1500 baht barfine and the ridiculous drink prices in Nana/Cowboy go-gos .....

I would also caution against settling for an excessively cheap room - the last thing you want to be doing in Pattaya is feeling that you need to 'escape' your own room : that will only cost you more money. Nothing worse than trying to recover from a hangover in the kind of place where the owner clearly expects everyone to spend their days someplace else, and the walls are so thin you can hear his wife nagging him for hours on end. One weekend of that and you'll swear never again. I made the same mistake on a visa run to Penang a few years back and now I just accept that there is a point where saving a few baht/Ringgit is a false economy. That room will be your sanctuary from the blazing sun, endless traffic and the tourist horde - value it accordingly.

OP, I would be very surprised if your own figure each month lines up precisely with anything here - half of us appear to be celibate teetotallers and the other half playboy billionaires - but I'm confident that you will find your own 'level' and opt for a couple of quiet nights to offset the madness of the night before. As 'problems' go, yours is one problem that many of us would be happy to have

i cant decide whether some of you posters just didn't read what the OP said, or you simply can't comprehend of anything else than an alcoholic, whore mongering existence...

The OP said he would stay for 7 months and just wants a room and money for a nice life...i have spoken to lots of expats who spend 7-10k on good rooms, just nearer central pattaya than beach road where the tourist rip offs are (just like you can spend 200 baht on Kow Pat Gai or 40 baht in a non-ripoff place...for exactly the same thing). These people are perfectly happy with their rooms, which are a cut above the lowest levels of 3k or so but far below the nonsense prices quoted on various websites by real estate agents. All that is needed is to walk around and pop into the various condos and apartment blocks, of which there are hundreds. As for thin walls etc, all Thai building are basically the same, it makes no difference whether the OP was to spend 40k a month in VT on beach road or a VT elsewhere at 10k a month or some other apartment block....same method of construction and the cheaper rooms are likely to be used by long stay expats rather than 2 week millionaires, russians, arabs etc who can be a real a annoyance.

40k is enough for a decent room, decent food, hanging around some cafes/bars in the day for coffee/soft drinks, a few beers a couple of times a week and a little XXX every week or so...assuming the guy doesn't drink in the tourist rip off bars on WS etc and isn't an alcoholic...and assuming that figure excludes additional trips outside pattaya, the cost of iphones/laptops etc and major healthcare costs...

the key, by the way, is to have other expats to talk to and hang around with, that is where life is less boring...what is boring in my view is to know nobody and just have the bar girls for company....thats why i think the idiots that say you need 5k a night for drink and XXX are just sad and lonely posers, they have nothing but the pretence of being rich and nobody to really talk to...even if they are surrounded by other expats spending tons...because then they are just surrounded by bar girls and other posers...and getting drunk every night kills the health...adding ill health to their sad and meaningless existences where they lose face if they don't appear rich...what a nightmare...

I completely agree with you. People who think 5k is enough for drinks and girls are idiots.

I agree with the sad and lonely part too, whenever I see guys with a bottle of jack and a couple of hot chicks on their lab playing with them, they always look like they must be thinking "what a nightmare, I wish the girls would leave so I can go talk to the two retirees sharing a leo beer outside" :-)

It seems to me none of the parties have any long term platform, they simply make up populist policies as they go.

Anyway, personally I think it is better to support someone with no platform, than someone whose platform is ruining the country

This happens all over the island all the time. I think the main problem is that most Thais do not know of, nor understand the concept of pollution. In other words, they do not understand that what they are doing is damaging in many ways, which is evidenced by the fact that the offenders usually stand around breathing in the smoke themselves.

As many have already said, the easiest way to collect this fee is through the plane ticket. However, that would mean Thais travelling abroad would have to pay too. Thai based airlines can of course have different prices for Thais and non Thais, but most western based airlines are unlikely to accept different prices for different nationalities due to various discrimination laws.