UKresonant

Interesting question, I've no idea about that one. I've only been Thai tax resident for one year in the past. But was always UK Tax resident.

£17k tax free quite possible if configured correctly For info https://www.gov.uk/apply-tax-free-interest-on-savings Starting rate for savings You may also get up to £5,000 of interest and not have to pay tax on it. This is your starting rate for savings. The more you earn from other income (for example your wages or pension), the less your starting rate for savings will be. If your other income is £17,570 or more You’re not eligible for the starting rate for savings if your other income is £17,570 or more. also....... Personal Savings Allowance You may also get up to £1,000 of interest and not have to pay tax on it, depending on which Income Tax band you’re in. This is your Personal Savings Allowance. To work out your tax band, add all the interest you’ve received to your other income. Income Tax band Personal Savings Allowance Basic rate £1,000 Higher rate £500 Additional rate £0 Interest covered by your allowance Your allowance applies to interest from: bank and building society accounts savings and credit union accounts unit trusts, investment trusts and open-ended investment companies peer-to-peer lending trust funds payment protection insurance (PPI) government or company bonds life annuity payments some life insurance contracts also... https://www.gov.uk/capital-gains-tax/allowances Capital Gains Tax allowances You only have to pay Capital Gains Tax on your overall gains above your tax-free allowance (called the Annual Exempt Amount). The Capital Gains tax-free allowance is: £3,000

Oops that could be a problem then. How could you ever get a tax number, without having a bank account to pay the income into, if it is all from overseas I wonder if it shall affect existing accounts, in any way?

Currently if your not over the 179days in the calendar year, not an issue for remittances. But can you be sure you will be under the under 179days, unless your final, (say) 19 days is upto 31st Dec. Thinking of possible sickness, accident, or flight disruption. The pre-2024 savings '162/2566 thing' is only currently relavant if you exceed the 179 days. Good to have a few packets of pre-resident savings, for when you do exceed the 179 days scenario.. One of the family does 3 x 59 days per year, but one visit straddles the tax year boundary in Dec / Jan, which could be adjusted slightly if required.

Interesting aspect, never thought of that aspect, I can visualize that for some acquaintances, far in the past. Yes, that could be a risk anticipated for some couples, in the event of a fall out. The the previous rule of remitting only savings from past tax years also perhaps mitigated the risk of 'do this or I will report you to RD' possibilities. (Luckily I can trust my wife implicitly, a spat is when I get the silent treatment for a wee while .)

Was thinking, if the wife filed, and I had tipped over the 179 Days, and I was noted on her form as filing separately. Would that flag up if they could not see a submission from myself I wonder?

https://www.legislation.gov.uk/uksi/1981/1546/schedules/made Yes will Article 23 3) of the UK TH help with those pension (or not)? '(3) In the case of Thailand, United Kingdom tax payable in accordance with this Convention in respect of income from sources within the United Kingdom shall be allowed as a credit against Thai tax payable in respect of that income. The credit shall not, however, exceed that part of the Thai tax, as computed before the credit is given, which is appropriate to such item of income. (4) For the purposes of paragraphs (1) and (3) of this Article profits, income and capital gains owned by a resident of a Contracting State which may be taxed in the other Contracting State in accordance with this Convention shall be deemed to arise from sources in that other Contracting State' But if not all income is remitted to Thailand, declaring all your income to calculate your relief per pound could be a pain. RD could make the credit relief Impracticle, depending on the extent of supporting documentation required.

It depends what the THB1.6m consists of, but if they are to sell their primary residence and other large transactions in the UK, perhaps best NOT becoming Thai Tax until it becomes savings in the UK or rebased investments (perhaps including those within UK S&S ISAs, depending on their composition).

If you have the paper trail to show the funds were pure pre-2024 or non-resident savings, perhaps it would just be the interest on the 'large amount' that needs consideration in respect to filing?

We had it on good authority (from the UK .gov) that it changed to 60 days previously, and then it changed back again. So now have a tourist for August, will check again for Xmas to see if it happens. Now waiting on their Visa re-organisation and streamlining mentioned for September-ish.

If the mney has arrived in Thailand, by whatever transmission method from assessable source, of course it should be on your return . Some Experts seem to be discussing the detectability Anything digital is tracable if linked to the conventional banking system, if attention is drawn and effort above and beyond is thought worthwhile. If you have filed a plausible return and paid the tax, other minority peripheral items may be in a Grey area, that do not warrant the further attention. But you can visualize some that take money from the credit card, bank it and then the inbounds, just don't add up, compared with the declared

Scenario '2' But the Non-O ME was/ is for folks that had a need to go out of Thailand often. My shortest border bounce was 7-8 days back to the UK!

Thailand does seem to be on course to be a 179day per year destination for many. If I we're 100% in Thailand and the DTA was simple in opperation, not such a great worry, though more tax. Can't see that happening though. One of the family has kept to 177days +/- 2days for about 20years. I've only once exceeded 179 days, but all previous years remittance, remaining compliant.

Can I say it seems that the debate is trying to achieve a one size fits all conclusion. There could be Lifo Fifo relating to progressive sale of segments of a single stock or insurance bonds or the like. But I think the vast majority of transactions will be proportional (remitted P+G in the applicable ratio%), like sale of houses in home country, it's a single transaction at a point in time (so it's all out).

Sale price - purchase price= gain. How could you have recieve the sale proceeds without the gain? All the gain will belong to Thailand if your tax resident..just a matter of taxing your remittance until all fully remitted ( unless a DTA article helps out) But wait on the.further clarification from TRD when it comes out, sometime after next weekend, and that will confirm the situation ( for all that are having a tax resident qualification party next weekend ) That will prove your point perhaps .

UK relative, I'm assuming that Thai RD cannot look inside SIPPs (UK invested pensions) as the taxable event is only at withdrawals. I'm proceeding on the Basis that ISAs would be similar, dividends would not be tax exempt in Thailand (as they would be in UK). But looking inside the UK tax exempt .wrapper could become. very difficult,

Was thinking of various scenarios e.g. Non tax resident of Thailand, no Thai account, in hospital, requires a bill to be settled. Money, say 100000 THB, sent to Thai national, tax resident to settle the bill, if they keep the receipt from the hospital, no tax to pay? (or assume potential 35% tax.) No benefit to Thai tax payer. Not gift, though it could be tagged that way.... Any thoughts.

To legalize so many documents would not be viable, perhaps a legalised bank statement, showing corresponding pension payments, at worst. Not even sure some docs are on the list of items possible to legalize in the UK. I think the totals of all you mention gross (ex principle perhaps), could feature, especially if tax credit relief is involved. ( But if within exempt and allowance my just listing actual net remittance to Thailand would be OK? maybe with P60 or similar)

I would need a float of money equivelent to being double taxed and not having that money for a good few months thinking of the Thai/UK scenario. The bottom line may be no double tax, after filing all the forms out ( and losing how many days ).

So if it went global it would make it very complex, what would they make the criteria for tax residence, would it drag like the UK into more than one year. It may be difficult to maintain a non-resident bank account perhaps. Could only then rely on ensuring fiscal domicile under article 4, in the UK, more time there than in Thailand. But with staggered tax years, many scheduling complications. Would be weird paying Thai tax if spending at least half of your income back in the UK, 'no double taxation' but substantially more complex. I take it the OECD did not think about any State Universal Health care in their criteria 😊 I wonder if this will reflect in the Visa revisions announced, scheduled for September apparently, detail unknown 🫠.

Keeping the pre-2024 principle without interest co-mingled might take a bit of attention to detail. Also not being able to create new similar savings, unless from the income stream whilst not Thai tax resident...

I'll be keeping mine as long as they let me!

Yes it's put a quite spanner in the works for retirement planing....

The O-A went off my options menu list in October 2019, my longest time in within 12 months Thailand has been 245ish days in one year, my longest single entry was <84 days. The broker agent of a major Health insurance provider, said they could not honestly sell me a Thai Policy to supplement my 92 day per trip Travel insurance because the must be in Thailand clause in the T&C's of 6 months in 12 of the policies, Vs my stay pattern in Thailand would imply I would flux in and out of coverage. With my luck I would probably be under the 180 days when it was needed 🙂. Unaware that this situation has changed. If they started saying you must also buy a practically worthless Thai Insurance policy, to get a Single entry Non-O Marriage Visa that may be another negative issue for me!

I get the impression there is a large section in the wait and see camp , and still some oblivious to the Tax changes. The impact of attitude to Thailand, the Tax changes bring, may not show until 2025, or yes they may not show any great an affect at all. April May 2025, may make things clearer, after the Tax Filing period, and before they become tax resident 2025. Many have burnt bridges for other options or are to late in life to contemplate substantial change after being in Thailand so long...