LevelHead

The red shirts have done as expected and not got involved with anything to do with the coup and what has gone on after.

The NCPO have made a large mistake in my view. It is quite obvious that you cannot go out on the streets (when Martial Law is lifted late next year) and march against the coup, the new charter etc.. if you have been involved in the process to set up the new charter.

The NCPO should have involved many red shirts into the process, by not including them they have set the stage for red shirt protests in the future.

The PDRC won this round of the battle, but what is going on now will set the stage for the next battle in the future - when all the anti-PDRC people put on their shirts when Martial Law is lifted and come out on to the streets yet again.

If anyone had any intention of resolving the countries problems you simply HAVE to involved everyone in the solution.

If all your aim is is to grab power back and make sure you cannot be out of power in future by elections, then you go about as is happening now - but that will only make all the problems much bigger and lead to bigger problems in the future.

It is quite clear from the ongoing process that the majority of those involved are NOT doing it for the good of the country, their actions so far give away totally that its all being done for the good of themselves and their business associates in the future.

Putting a few rose petals on top of a pile of manure cannot hide its manure underneath.

In a similar way having a sprinkling of non-related people/so called independent people amongst a massive majority of appointed people will not hide the fact that its all the appointed buddies doing things their way.

So is my opinion.

That's your opinion, you're entitled to it. Mind you, the member name 'levelhead' seem to conflict with your opinion although really fits the red only avatar.

There doesn't seem to be much 'level' and 'objectivity' might be totally missing. A lot of assumptions are present though, mostly stated as facts rather then opinion.

The rejection to co-operate and help define a better Thailand seems to be either political motivated, or just plain ignorance. To just say and assume "the others don't do it for Thailand' is like sticking your head in the sand. It's like you want the situation we had before the coup to just continue endlessly. Its like 'if not my way than no way' and 'obscenity' the others.

The red shirts of the topic seem to complain just as much as you. Refuse to help and probably annoyed not having been simply appointed to help. The red-shirts that is, not level headed people.

I think you will find the red shirts have not refused to help, as you claim.

They have adapted the simple attitude of :

If this is really about fixing all the problems - then many red shirts will be asked to join in.

If this is really about fixing the power between the elites and excluding the peoples desires and removing democratic free and fair elections in the future - then no red shirts will be asked.

And guess what............... I think we all know what has happened and this backs up what informed people know.

Mark my words, Martial Law will continue in Bangkok in 2015 and there will be no election in 2015 either.

So is my opinion

"Its work would take shape in six months to bring the country back to normalcy." SNAFU I think that mission has already been accomplished. 555

Takes longer than 6 months to fill your pockets to the brim.

It is quite clear from the start there has been the intention to NOT hold an election again for a good few years - and to never lift martial law in Bangkok for years too.

Mark my words now - there will be no general election in 2015.

Martial law cannot be lifted either as the moment it is then anti-PDRC will all come out to protest on the streets and shut down Bangkok.

Martial Law in Bangkok and No Election will walk hand in hand for many years to come as the hold on absolute power continues and is made stronger and stronger.

So is my opinion.

The red shirts have done as expected and not got involved with anything to do with the coup and what has gone on after.

The NCPO have made a large mistake in my view. It is quite obvious that you cannot go out on the streets (when Martial Law is lifted late next year) and march against the coup, the new charter etc.. if you have been involved in the process to set up the new charter.

The NCPO should have involved many red shirts into the process, by not including them they have set the stage for red shirt protests in the future.

The PDRC won this round of the battle, but what is going on now will set the stage for the next battle in the future - when all the anti-PDRC people put on their shirts when Martial Law is lifted and come out on to the streets yet again.

If anyone had any intention of resolving the countries problems you simply HAVE to involved everyone in the solution.

If all your aim is is to grab power back and make sure you cannot be out of power in future by elections, then you go about as is happening now - but that will only make all the problems much bigger and lead to bigger problems in the future.

It is quite clear from the ongoing process that the majority of those involved are NOT doing it for the good of the country, their actions so far give away totally that its all being done for the good of themselves and their business associates in the future.

Putting a few rose petals on top of a pile of manure cannot hide its manure underneath.

In a similar way having a sprinkling of non-related people/so called independent people amongst a massive majority of appointed people will not hide the fact that its all the appointed buddies doing things their way.

So is my opinion.

There is still one thing missing here..... DSI

Everything pro-gov has been neutered in one blow of the axe, but no mention of what is happening with the DSI, which was also a very aggressive department of the PTP / Thaksin lacky club.

The last I read, Tarit was after senate speaker Surachai... wondering what will come of that now.

If the situation with respect to that upgrades to the DSI being told to wind it's neck in also, then we can all safely assume there will be a newly appointed PM and cabinet and Suthep wins.

I suspect if the government changes, so will DSI.

I think you will find everything Anti-Government is neutered in one go.

Judiciary now have now power. PDRC no power. Suthep no power. Fake monk no power, Blue Sky shut down, ASTV shut down.

With those all neutered an election can now finally take place.................. as was said by caretaker government people on the 16th, as per the Nation report on why the caretaker government wanted Martial law.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Surapong-voices-support-for-martial-law-30233791.html

.

The caretaker government wanted Martial Law - it is the only way to have elections and stop the PDRC/Suthep/Fake Monk.

This is why Thaksin says its expected............. it was, totally expected. The only way to stop the Judiciary from protecting the PDRC was Martial Law........... now its in the Judiciary are powerless and the army can oversee elections. Was it Martial Law agreed over Skype ?

This is what Surapong said on the 16th of May........

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Surapong-voices-support-for-martial-law-30233791.html

"But they may control the situation to prevent violence by declaring martial law, which is not a coup," Surapong said.

"If martial law is declared, the military will run the operation to maintain security and the CAPO will not get involved. And I believe that if the martial law is declared nationwide, the election can be held."

I think there must be some deluded PDRC supporters around............. Martial Law is all about stopping the PDRC and fake monk from doing any more damage to the country, and they think its about a couple of rifles in someones car.........

After Army found war weapons in car of reds MP, it's normal ML has been invoke.......

have they revealed who this was?

Who cares, they found a couple of guns (was it just two)............. so what ?

The PDRC had war weapons inside popcorn bags and shot people dead with them.................. and PDRC protestors were wearing popcorn T-shirts happy that their guards had war weapons..............

Martial Law is all about stopping the fake monk, Suthep and the PDRC from doing any more damage to Thailand.

Martial Law now means the Judiciary are powerless to prevent the disbanding of the PDRC.......................... the Judiciary stopped CAPO from doing it by revoking the Emergency Decree - the only way to stop Suthep was to invoke Martial Law - which has now been done - thankfully.

Notice a few days back Surapong and other caretaker government people wanting Martial Law.............

The caretaker government wanted Martial Law................... Suthep and the PDRC and the fake monk do not want it.............it now stops them dead in the their tracks.

http://www.nationmultimedia.com/politics/Surapong-voices-support-for-martial-law-30233791.html

Surapong voices support for martial law Former deputy prime minister and foreign minister Surapong Tovichakchaikul on Friday expressed his support for the declaration of martial law by the Army.

Surapong said if the Army were to declare martial law nationwide, the new election could be held smoothly.

Army Commander-in-Chief Gen Prayuth Chan-ocha indicated Thursday that he might have to resort to martial law if political violence escalates, saying the army might have to deploy troops to control the situation.

"Martial law is the highest level of measures to ensure security. I believe the armed forces have prepared measures to enforce it," Surapong said.

Surapong was speaking to reporters at the Centre for the Administration of Peace and Order. He said he would continue to work as the CAPO adviser until the order for him to be removed from the post is announced in the Royal Gazette.

He said he would like to thank the Army chief for issuing a statement Thursday to warn political opponents to behave or the Army might have to deploy a full force of troops to keep security.

Surapong said he would like the Army chief to take action against leaders of the People's Democratic Reform Committee, adding that troops are also officers who could make arrests.

He said the government's opponents would like to encourage the military leaders to stage a coup but the top brass has made it clear that it would not seize power.

"But they may control the situation to prevent violence by declaring martial law, which is not a coup," Surapong said.

"If martial law is declared, the military will run the operation to maintain security and the CAPO will not get involved. And I believe that if the martial law is declared nationwide, the election can be held."

It was essential to shut down Blue Sky and ASTV (and to be fair also the red channels).

Blue Sky and ASTV just pumped out nonsense 24 hours a day.

Anyone seen Suthep by the way ????

Suthep is correct. There is no legal acting PM right now, so the who ever reach the finish line first gets the job. Suthep, with the support of millions of real people is in a clear lead to be our supreme leader by far.

Sorry to disagree

1) Suthep, with the support of millions of real people

Yes is correct, the support to get rid of a corrupt government

2) is in a clear lead to be our supreme leader by far.

Exists only in your mind, as he has stated many many times his job is to reform the country and has no thoughts of being the PM

The same people wh0 support him would turn on him if he breaks his word to the Thai People

Sorry to disagree.

1/ The support for reform to eliminate corruption is big - but the majority of these people are not PDRC supporters - most of them hate Suthep as he is cor................

The support for the corrupt PDRC and their plan to replace the corrupt PTP government with their own corrupt PDRC version is very small - which is why you see just a few thousand PDRC on the streets now with their whistles.

2/ Suthep is an old man, he does not want to be leader but of course he would love his sons to be leaders - this is why he keeps saying he will not run, but then refuses to rule out his family members......... who are of course politicians with the Democrat Party, just like he is/was.

Nepotism only seems to be headlined by the PDRC if your name is Shin............. if you are one of the Suthep clan its perfectly fine for your family to be involved and a push for your sons to be fast tracked to being future PM's so old man Suthep can pull the strings in the background...................

Suthep has been outplayed - he has lost - but he wants to save face now. Abhisit is trying his best to save the face of his buddy Suthep - but PTP are wise to the games being played, they have major support at their backs this time preventing a coup and they just need to keep trying to hold elections and make the PDRC and their backers appear more and more desperate and stupid the longer it drags one.

what other choice do we now have

No matter what we do we are in trouble

don't do and the protestors get upset

Do and the red shirts get upset

The Senate are proving Thailand is now in no man land, and we are all going down hill

We need to find a way we can both win and loose

and that is an acting Caretaker who has no affilition with either side and has a good knowledge of the law

and put us on a course to reform and new elections

Choice ? There is only 1 choice that is legal and in line with the constitution. That is an election.

The protestors are just that, protestors. Many of them have broken the law. What has to happen now is the law is brought to bear on all protestors and protest leaders - as it has on Yingluck and the Cabinet Ministers/

And an election HAS to happen now, before any reformation.

PTP and the UDD know it IS IMPOSSIBLE to appoint any unelected PM.

Firstly it is against the law/constitution to do so whilst there is still a caretaker PM in power.

Secondly there is no chance that any neutral appointed PM will last - PTP and the UDD are fully aware that its very likely a "neutral PM" would be appointed BUT THEN after a few weeks he would be visited by Popcorn men in the middle of the night and told to get into the waiting ambulance as he is very ill and needs a long stay in hospital, under armed guard of course but he will get a nice compensation package for his stay there. Now, with PTP no longer caretaker government and the agreed appointed neutral PM now in hospital with a pretend illness - its all free and open for those who want to gain power to to now replace the neutral appointed PM who is now "ill" with their non-neutral pro-PDRC appointed man. As PTP would be out of power already, they would have zero say on who the replacement was for the now ill neutral PM.

The second reason is why you now see a massive push for the so called neutral PM - its not because that is what they want long term, its because that is their "key" to the door of opening the way for a pro-PDRC man to take over, once the appointed neutral man is "neutralized" after being put in power.

Abhisit/Suthep and the PDRC are pushing only 1 agenda but with two methods :

Method 1 is the caretaker government resigns and so they can appoint their pro-PDRC man as the new PM.

Method 2 is the caretaker government agrees to a neutral PM and gives up power - then they will replace the neutral PM once PTP are out of power with their pro-PDRC man as PM.

Different ways - but the same agenda.

The PDRC/Suthep/Abhisit know that they cannot just appoint a neutral PM as it breaks the law - which is why Abhisit now keeps asking and asking for the caretaker government to resign - and he and his cohorts will boycott elections forever more with the support of the PDRC/EC to stop them happening in the South and the Constitution Court to keep annulling them as problems in the South.

Its now at stalemate stage................. there can be no elections due to PDRC/Abhisit and there can be no new government without an election.

The problem simply is the PDRC - they are breaking the law by blocking elections - which is causing the problem - what it needs is the police to arrest all PDRC and lock them all up - then have an election - then reform.

Would Kasit Piromya make a good Prime Minister for Thailand, I actually think he would, I don't know much about the man apart from the OP but I'd guess he is respected both Nationally and Internationally

Try investigating him assisting those shutting down the airport in 2008 ? You will find quotes of him saying it was "fun". You might learn he is one of the elite yellow PAD - and from that you can perhaps understand his opinion piece in the The Nation.

Respected ? Yes by Yellow shirts, PAD, PDRC, Suthep, Abhisit etc.......... perhaps.

All in my opinion of course.

This is from the man who said it was fun (party) to shut down the airports in 2008. Who spoke on stage and partied in front of a closed Bangkok Airport.

The Nation disgraces itself again by publishing an article from such a person.

All in my opinion of course.

Is the SOA is lifted the Army get out.

They are not a law unto themselves, they are only the army and they have to follow the law. The law is there is no troop deployment if there is no SOA.

So as the SOA is lifted there must be an order now to remove the troops. Or are the Army going to defy the Constitution and the Law of Thailand ?

He is correct they do not move until ordered, but once the order is given, they must get out.

All in my opinion of course.

I thought he said this would be all over months ago, many times ?

He is a liar, he has lied to his people many times about "the end" and the "final rally" and all sorts, and yet they still beleive the liar and his continued lies ?

A lair is someone who says something that is proven to be untrue. He is therefore a liar.

The only time being wasted is by him and his PDRC, they are wasting the time of many people, civilians and police.

All in my opinion of course.

Why is anyone giving any credence to Suthep ?

Why should be be asked to name people ? He is a criminal, who has broken the law many times in the past months as had the PDRC itself.

You do not reward law breakers by asking them to be involved in any way at all. The PDRC should be arrested as per their arrest warrants.

Asking them to be involved is utter lunacy by people who are proving to be complete idiots and plain stupid.

All in my opinion of course.

The problem is not about democracy here, the problem is about which side will get the power and of course the money.

Exit Suthep and Shin family, let's Thailand find new politicians with real value of honesty, I still hope new elites for the country, maybe just a dream.

Its simple, you have an election and you resepct the outcome of the vote.

The trouble is the ones who lose and keep losing will not accept the result. So they continually use the army, the courts and the Democrat party members (past and present) in order to create unrest in order to grab back power.

Thailands problems will perhaps be solved in about 50 years, when sea level rises have meant that Bangkok is finally totally submerged in water and gone.

Not long to wait now, just another 5 decades and Bangkok and its divisive effect on Thailand being neutralised by the sea

Suthep is just a puppet. A puppet of others. They pull his strings and he dances on stage to their tune. Of course he rejects civil war, whats the point of a fight where you can lose everything. He and his masters just want a little unrest with which they can via the courts and military threats grab back power of everything or at worst just wait another month or year before trying again. They absolutely do not want any scenario where they could lose everything and so its no surprise for Suthep and his masters to get very agitated and uncomfortable when the subject of secession or civil war is raised.

All in my opinion of course.

The talk of secession is rather like the talk of a military coup.

The military can talk of a coup (an act of treason) as they have all the guns and can kill in order to carry it out. They only need to threated death and killing with their guns in order to claim power.

So here we have others talking of secession, in order to counter the military and their weapons and their talk of the high treason crime of a military coup.

Lets not forget, the only reason the military have any power is they have more guns than anyones and they throughout history have killed civilians to win power and stay in power.

The question is why are the PDRC not in jail already for their breaking of the law and the constitition in blocking voters and elections - which is an act of sedition in itself.

All in my opinion of course.

Is this the same PDRC who have violated the law and the constitution by obstructing voters from voting ?

They have already committed serious offences against the Thai people and the Thai constitution and yet the PDRC are allowed to carry on and the courts give them the thumbs up ?

Thailand and its juducial system is looking more and more ridiculous every day.

The military chief refuses to rule out a coup (and a coup is sedition and treason and breaks the constitution) and yet then he himself complains at others who discuss (and discuss only) another form of treason.

Treason is treason.

Military coup is treason - why does the same man not rule a coup ?

Blocking votes and elections is against the constitution - why are these PDRC people and leaders not already not in jail ?

All in my opinion of course.

The most interesting aspect of this in my view is that -

The army cheif says that talk of seperatism is against the constitution and sedition.

And yet HE HIMSELF refuses to rule out a coup. A coup which is against the constitution and an act of sedition/treason.

So by refusing to rule out a coup he is in effect supporting non-constitutional means and yet he then chides others for talking about breaking the consitution.

Pot - Kettle - Black

In my opinion of course.

"hardcore red shirts declared to secede the country’s north and northeast regions to establish what they called “Isan-Lanna” state"

Like I said in an earlier thread. A landlocked "Isan-Lanna" state bordering with the landlocked metropolis of the PDR Lao would be nothing short of a economical dust bowl. The north are kidding themselves if they think they can get by without commerce hub Bangkok, the resource rich southern provinces and those other provinces bordering the Gulf of Thailand and the Andaman sea.

Why would it be landlocked ? Lots of access to the sea from Chonburi all the way to the Cambodian border.

The north and central provinces generate pretty much most of Thailands GDP.

The north generates pretty much all of Thailands electrical power.

The north controls all the water flows through the country.

A seperated North/Central "Lanna/Isaan" block would have all the electrical power, all the labour, all the water and generate loads of money.

Without the Central/North block Bangkok and the south would have NO water, NO electrical power, pretty much NO labour - and soon all the factories would move out of Bangkok/South.

This is why Bangkok and the South get so upset about talk of a divide - they offer nothing and live of off the North/Central area's. power generation, water flows, crops, GDP generation etc...

All in my opnion of course.

They talk about Lanna plus Isan. Central Thailand is not a part of that. Neither is Chonburi. They would have no access to the sea, very little industry and the least productive agricultural areas.

I think you are not on the ball here in regards to what has been discussed in many places.

Take a look at the map on the link below :

http://www.correntewire.com/random_observations_on_the_situation_in_thailand

That map shows the often of late dsicussed split. A northern red coloured "Siam". A middle bit Bangkok and the South being "Thailand" and then the problem area in the south.

From that you can see the North/Central area has all the power generation, all the agri-land, all the GDP generation, all the water and all the labour.

Bangkok and the South would be pretty much useless, just some Palm Oil and Rubber sold to Bangkok traders to sell on - if they had an electricity and of course any water and indeed any labour ?

Of course this is being discussed purely as a discussion point, nobody is saying it will happen or has to happen.

All of course is just opinon and discussion.

Also interesting to cross reference the map on the link with a map of where 2014 Feb 2nd elections were successul and also the last election results. You will find the 3 maps similar in many ways.