al007

39 minutes ago, simon43 said:

 

 

 

I also have that plan from HCI (with the $2,000 deductible).  Do I understand your comment correctly that if you have an accident, then you propose to claim from Bangkok Insurance to cover the deductible for treatment under HCI?

 

I'm no lawyer, but I'm not sure that would 'fly'. Bangkok Insurance pays for accident costs, not deductibles.  Is a deductible an accident cost?

 

I'd be grateful if you could clarify this.  I hope you're correct, because I could then also take out this policy with Bangkok Insurance.

I have some experience of health insurance I used to sell to expats from Guildford Surrey, together with financial advice and pensions

My observations are that if it is an accident then the accident insurance should cut in

The possible problem is when there are two policies the risk gets shared so whether the accident insurance could be used to cover the $2000 excess I would need to talk to a loss adjuster

However at worst if only $2000 not covered then surely not a big deal, I am aware there are those here who may not be able to find that $2000 but in all honesty they are very big fools and irresponsible not to be in their own home countries

3 hours ago, Sheryl said:

Self-insuring is an option but it means having AT LEAST 2 million baht set aside for health care that you can then replenish if spent, more if you want the option of using private hospitals.

Sheryl is very correct to be insured is  highly preferable, I would say the 2 millon baht figure rather high, unless the only option is Bumrungrad 

However I am well into 18 months of cancer treatment and surgery and will get out way below that figure, hopefully well under 1.Om bhatt, hopefully around 700,000, and all the time I could have flown home to UK, and saved all I have chosen to spend

Please do have accident insurance it is pretty cheap and covers that fall or accident on the roads, rebuilding after a major accident could be very expensive, but once stable maybe go back to UK

Lets look at some costs, open heart surgery 300,000 to 400,000,  are figures I have heard , my cancer treatment maybe 700,000,( chemo, radiation and colorectal surgery ) hip replacement say 100,000 plus or minus

An immediate reserve of 500,000 can go a very  long way, I only refer to using government hospitals, and using the funds very carefully, remember for UK citizens government hospitals maybe better than the UK, NHS,  SUBJECT to selecting your doctor very carefully, also this last option not possible in uk

I had prostrate surgery and all including flights to India was under US $ 4,000

Eye operations are not expensive

An individual needs to think what is the worst and what might it cost to fix, for female hysterectomy I would GUESS maybe 80,000/100,000, maybe some one comment on this figure

It would be interesting to have a list of possible surgeries and potential costs

Thailand is and can be very reasonable with medical costs unlike the USA

There are many situations when you may be well enough to return to the UK

I am still at the stage I could get on an aeroplane and go back to the UK

I also have a living will that says no expensive life support

On 10/20/2017 at 11:58 PM, jimn said:

Please dont scaremonger and make incorrect statements. It is actually 6 months out of the UK and that is if they acually know you are out of the country and you are not maintaining a UK address and not still be registered with a doctor.

I like this reply there is too much scaremongering, and comments coming from posters with limited knowledge

Remember, if you are a UK citizen and tell the hospital you are returning permanently you are eligible immediately, I have checked this out as it might just be necessary for me as a last resort

I have also been told by reliable sources you have to provide no evidence, just state it categorically you are back to stay, which when you make that statement is very correct, at the stage you are being admitted say very little, do not volunteer you have a wife and children in Thailand, it might just confuse matters

Now in the event one might have a change of heart later, like too cold in UK and you change your mind, you will not be given a bill for the earlier treatment

I have a lot of faith in both the UK and Thai systems, if you have a little money the Thai system may even be better, you have choice over consultant, in the UK this is not the case

Non UK citizens are probably qualified to comment on the UK system

I am not qualified to comment on the system in the USA, however I believe if you have no money you are still likely to be taken care of, as was my ex mother in law

4 minutes ago, gamini said:

Yes I have written three books. Ecstasy of the Deep is now free on Google. (Quite a bit about Thailand). A charmed life in Ceylon and my last book Freeediving to fame and Fortune.

Let me get through the next ten days, currently I am trying to stay calm,  and I will be back in Touch, I see you are from HuaHin, it has fond memories for me and is where I also met my wife

I have started my book but maybe while in hospital I can do more

I very much enjoy your observations, stay well

There are some  incorrect  and misleading statements made in this thread

read my post No 77 in the thread below it may help a little

First of all there is tax residency and tax domicile very different things, I only refer to UK law

No one is liable for inheritance tax, it is the deceased estate that is liable, and tax clearance is require before probate can be granted and until granted assets frozen and can not be distributed ( the executors can sell and deal however) some IHT can become due before some assets are sold, like a house, it is not unknown for beneficiaries to have to fund the IHT before they receive their inheritance

Transfer in an estate to a wife are exempt  from IHT so long as she is domiciled, wife living in Thailand definitely not domiciled

Thai wife living in UK is tax resident, but could still be deemed to be non domiciled so the exemption might not be available

If the OP moves and become tax resident outside of the UK in say Thailand he is likely to retain his UK domicile, unless he does a list of very specific things and thus liable to IHT on his worldwide assets, including those in Thailand, if there is property in the UK then probate can not be granted until the IHT liability is agreed, any professional acting on your behalf who might not include say a Thai property risks becoming personally liable, BE VERY CAREFUL

There is a basic exemption of around £320,000 ish available to every estate, so if the estate of the OP is below this then not a problem

Any good UK lawyer should know the answers and not need to go to expensive brief to check

I Write as a retired Chartered Accountant

On higher value estates £750,000 and up proper planning and forethought can save a lot of tax, and proper advice from a well qualified Lawyer or Chartered Accountant is preferable, , In the UK tax generally falls under Chartered Accountants, in the US Lawyers play a bigger role, Financial Advisers are not properly qualified to give this specialist tax advice

Some very interesting posts

Some rather upset posters

An interesting point we had a puppy dog obviously dying and  very weak; we went to the animal hospital at KhonKaen University ( we have many dogs and frequent the animal hospital a lot) and requested they put our loving dog down, they categorically refused

We went home and with a lot of persuasion got the local vet to do this, but even this was a fight

Even more interesting is the topic of euthanasia for humans and the criteria to allow it to happen

1 hour ago, Old Croc said:

Could be bursitis, I suffered from this after a time sleeping on a hard Thai mattress.

Get an xray to remove doubt about the cause. If the hip joint needs replacing don't dither. The relief of chronic pain is immediate, you just need to recover from the wound.  I've had two hip replacements in Australia.

I have put this  hip problem a little on the back burner, due to more pressing forthcoming surgery, however

I check into Chula on this coming wed, and have wed/ thursday before my op on Friday, when I am sure they will be purging my insides, with that awful stuff to drink

However maybe I can get a hip XRAY at this time, and also enquire about costs for Hip replacement at Chula, also the type of surgery

Or send my wife off to investigate, but she might just come back with something completely different

I hope to report back later

Make sure before going to the airport in the USA you have a fit to fly certificate better to err on the safe side, maybe preprint one and get hospital stamp at your last visit

It is a very big step forward to be returning here

On arrival if long queues at immigration, go to the disabled line much quicker, I can use it as I am rather old, or preorder wheel chair can even be ordered when on the aeroplane

I even have disabled sticker on the car, that helps in parking in the big supermarkets

I could not decide where to put this so I started another thread, there are so many good and bad things written about doctors and surgery here in Thailand, I thought this merited its own thread, when I see him shortly I am going to suggest they try and have subtitles added in English, I personally believe this is a very positive statement for both the Chulalongkorn and Thailand

A fascinating you tube video

I am having this minimally invasive  operation by this same surgeon shortly, very  very shortly !!

I do not speak Thai but it is worth getting someone to interpret it for you, the philosophy and dedication of this man is truly remarkable, he talks about his wishes to see Thailand at the Top of this sort of surgery

I believe and trust he is exceedingly able, I have a strong vested interest

20 minutes ago, NancyL said:

Nope, this isn't the plan the Bangkok Bank Kad Suan Kaew branch is offering to older customers.  They have a better plan they've sourced from Bangkok Insurance.  It's a bit more expensive, but has a much higher upper payout.  As I said in a previous post, Bangkok Insurance's website is only in Thai.

Nancy's deal sound very good, at 7000 for cover of 200,000, if the overal cover a lot lower, some of us would continue to self insure, and the 7000 bhatt very ok, 200,000 if used sensibly can go a long way, still do not let the ambulance take you to Bumrungrad, go to Chula where for the same money you can stay longer

I am going to buy it and I always evaluate carefully before spending, and also believe in self insuring in many cases, slipping and falling alone for us older ones has big risks attached, stairs in Thailand are all too steep and bad handrails, a mini bus in Bangkok going flat out the wrong way under and expressway nearly got me one day!!

Unlike some I could pay the 200,000 but this is a risk I will happily pass to others to pay

I like low cost insurance with potential big payout and this falls into that category

Interesting my travel insurance I referred ti in post 37 covers me for some accidents but not when at home or locally, I still like this at 7000, however I only buy it for myself not my wife as well she has 30bhatt scheme

16 minutes ago, NancyL said:

Health Care International, the group plan offered by CM Expats Club. 

NancyL, you have stated something here rather interesting, mentioning a G R O U P  Plan, generally these are more competitive as the risk is also less for the insurer as the risk is more spread

It might be a way in for older people, join the C M Expat Club and become eligible for a group plan on medical, often the restrictions on Group plans are not as bad

Does anyone else know of any other Group plans

Your accident insurance with the Kad Suan Kaew branch of Bangkok Bank sounds very good deal to me, I will specifically ask my Bangkok Bank branch here in KhonKaen about this specific plan from Kad Suan Kaew branch, I also have a contact high up in BKK Bank  at head office and I will ask her about this specific product

Travel and Accident insurance

I have a bank account with Lloyds Bank international Isle of Man, it is offshore but closely linked to the UK, it has a couple of benefits free international Transfers and free travel insurance upto the age of 75, the account is an International premier Account

My wife is joint on this account so even when I am over 75 she will still have cover

My registered address with them is KhonKaen, the policy is underwritten by AXA

Interestingly it also covers me and my wife for travel in Thailand, so long as I have pre-booked hotels which I usually do

It is not an easy account to get, but it might just help some of the older people around

Accident and Emergency at the biggest government hospital close to you, as a starter

Very few are qualified to give you proper advice on this forum

12 minutes ago, gamini said:

I have been in thailand 30 years. I am 86 and need a lot of medical care. So does my wife. In and out of hospitals all the time. I have no insurance.I have limited savings. All hospitals have good and bad doctors. My medical problems started 6 years ago and i have worked hard to find the best doctors at the best prices. First i try to make friends with the doctor. I tell him frankly about my financial status. I have lots of close Thai friends who help reccomend good doctors. I used to go to Bumrungrad but they are now too expensive. I see some of their doctors at government hospitals for 1/10 the cost. I buy all my medicine wholesale rom the Chinesees pharmacy opp Sri Raj. They post it to me. If you have a Thai wife then use government hospitals epecially Sriraj, but find out from friends which doctors are best there. The best doctor I have ever experienced was at a gov. hospital.

I go to the follopwing different hospitals for the best and cheapest teatment even if it means travelling long distance

orthopaedic - army hospital

serious major medical Sri Raj. Also skin cancer

Minor medical with hospital  stay small private hospital

Heart doctor and treatment Pacharat Hospital Petchburi

Urology, and other medical problems of non serious nature government hospital

Eye problem Chula

heart operation. Fly to Chiangmai Siripat Hospital.

 

I would not pay too much attention to some of the posters advice on this forum. The big mistake they make is to judge a hospital by a single doctor. They dont bother to find the best doctor. If you go to any hospital especially private and ask to see a doctor you will probably get the worst one.

Hope this [post was of help

Nice post Sir, or maybe I should address you as Young Man !! well 86 yrs young !

You are doing exceedingly well, and long may it continue for both you and your wife

You share and give a lot of valuable information, I am too much an open book but do it so as to pass on information to others

The value of TVF so I believe is directly related to the quality of its members, and Sheryl is probably TVF greatest asset

You  Sir, Sheryl, myself and the brighter ones, say very strongly its about the quality of the specific Doctor, absolute number one priority

I live KhonKaen, but my colorectal surgeon is in Bangkok, like you I follow the man, many say why not KhonKaen hospital!!

You must have many wonderful stories to tell have you started your book yet !!

20 minutes ago, NancyL said:

rather slip-and-fall accidents at home or on footpaths or being hit by a motorcycle as a pedestrian.

This is an exceedingly valid and good point

One of the greatest causes of death of the elderly in the UK is slipping and falling

My closest and dearest friend slipped one night and broke his leg, he spent two months in hospital before dying he was 81, his cause of death was not recorded as an accident or broken leg

At very much the same time my mother, 91, whilst in a top class private hospital, near London went to the bathroom, at night and slipped also breaking her leg, and died in the same hospital within the next three months, her cause of death was not put down to the broken leg or accident

Over the last few months there have been a few on TV who have fallen at night

Accident insurance even for the elderly is sensibly priced, and for those without medical insurance, at least this risk would be removed

It is a must have,  if of course you are not too old

We stayed in a small hotel recently and the bathroom floor was so dangerous, polished tiles with plenty of water and soap, do not think the hotel will have liability insurance this is Thailand and you make your own luck

However catch 22 yet again, I just contacted and checked all those on Sheryls list above, and most cease cover at 65 and none will give cover at my age 72, the premiums below 65 are very reasonable

Anyone any ideas for us oldies

15 hours ago, AboutThaim said:

OK thanks Sheryl I will check them out.  I currently return to Australia every year and take out travel insurance to cover my time here.  Would be good if I can get accident only full time at around the same or less cost.

Read the small print very carefully, like to be covered on motorbike do you have to have a valid Thai licence, do you have to be wearing a crash helmet what does it say about alcohol blood levels etc etc

Also read the exclusions clauses

If in doubt ask and get written confirmation

Suggestions

Do not get stressed, relax and enjoy

If your wife has government employment you may be able to piggy back on her medical cover

I guess you young man get your wife to get quotes for you to peruse

Leave wife and kids on 30 baht scheme

Stay healthy and be happy, you can always go home  ! !

Even some accident cover for you not expensive  and covers the bigger risks of motorcycle cover

Talk to expat friends same age as you see what they do

At least you are thinking about it

Good luck

I am taking the liberty of cutting and pasting a PM I received, that has a lot of wisdom and relevance to this thread

To protect privacy I have edited out anything that will show where it came from

I am from Canada, the land of mythical free healthcare that far too many die waiting for. Having lived here for six years and having had far too much experience with hospitals here but so far, skirting the very serious issues that you are. I consider what you have shared on TVF a public service as I too have found many "potholes" in navigating quality healthcare with reasonable costs, both of which do exist in Thailand but are increasing in cost at an alarming rate. And TVF is rife with those who THINK they know. 

Should you wish to discuss and exchange thoughts and issues, I would be pleased to do so. 

I agree with your thoughts on needing a living will so as not to waste money on life support, I also would rather my wife have the funds to secure her future here, You indicated that if anyone wants a copy of the one you put together as a combination to PM you and you will send...... I so request of you.I have always uunderstood that such a document bears little weight in Thailand, and the attending doctor's inclination will not be overriden by it. In my country, I believe that many in the care of hospitals suffer pain as they pass on, to a degree that would have protestors marching in the streets were it a dog being so shoddily treated. I can tell you by first hand personal experience categorically that it is true for those in emergency care. Life support is an issue for me, but an exit from this life for me or those in my circle of life fraught with ununnecessary levels of pain as I have witnessed is to be avoided at all costs....... but how?? 

I have had several requests for a copy of my advance Directive/ Living will, I did not post the final version as I did not want to waste space on TV, but have now found out how to do it with a link

Please note it has not been approved by a lawyer, but so far Chulalongkorn have agreed to put it on my file and this has now been done, I also asked my surgeon about this document and he said he does his best to conform with a patients wishes

I have attached it in word format although I work with pages and Apple

I am and always will be happy to assist other members via PM

There is also a thread running in 

This thread also has some very relevant information

Advance Directive27 09 2017 blank.docx

There are many who thing we are morbid but we are only facing reality, too many have no plan, have little money or reserves, no insurance, and fudge the system that requires 800,000 for retirement extension, in my view they should be sent home, end of story

Again I know it upsets many but I like Donald Trump and most of what he says, he also like me does not suffer fools gladly

On 10/16/2017 at 7:23 PM, MrPatrickThai said:

It's my understanding that an alcoholic drinks alcoholically all of the time.

Or do you mean when you were young, you didn't drink alcoholically but when you reached a certain age you did?

 

Do you drink alcoholically now?

 

 

Going to meeting doesn't keep an alcoholic sober. 

We all have different views

In my earlier years I drank every day, was a functioning practicing alcoholic, I would binge on top, some alcoholics only binge drink

I drank alcoholically from the beginning

Do I drink alcoholically today , occasionally, but can today walk away from bottle with some still left, a good caretaker helps, regardless of whether we are drinking or not my wife always drives home, hence I do not drive drunk

Am I sill an alcoholic today, honest answer I am not sure sometimes yes and sometimes no

Is alcohol a problem in my life no, do others complain about my drinking NO

What keeps an alcoholic sober none of us really know, I personally believe going to meetings and SHARING can work, some use the meetings as their sponsors

The first step I did was thirteen, and had 14 years very happily married

Today I do not attend AA meetings, but that could change any time

Well of course I have to take the bait

It is good enough for the Queen Mother and the quality of  the best surgeons is first class, admin and waiting could be improved substantially

I also trust them, and am very grateful to them

I hope they do a good job on me next week when I am on the table !!!

3 hours ago, glasswort said:

Interesting but rather verbose post. For those in Pattaya Queen Sirikit Naval Hospital in Sattahip. Stent operation there cost me THB179k., Bangkok Hospital Pattaya wanted 650k. No brainer.

Thank you sir, sorry if a bit long winded just wish to help others and maybe better too long rather than too short, as a  badly dyslectic man English is not my strength

Be lucky

4 hours ago, rosst said:

Thanks Al, I read and did my best to digest all that, I have a house in Thailand and also the Philippines and Australia where I maintain basic hospital private cover, it is a worry to all us old farts, keep up the good work. 

Your kind words appreciated

I wish you well

45 minutes ago, DogNo1 said:

Thanks, Al.  Your post is a real wake up call for me.  I have been blindly absorbing Bumrungrad's increasing costs but I will need to shop around if I have another cardiac blockage or serious illness.  I have Japanese health insurance and spend half the year in Tokyo but if something serious happens to me in Bangkok, I may not feel like jumping on a plane back to Japan.  I like my cardiologist at Bumrungrad but may not be able to afford him any more.  A friend uses Samitivej but I've heard that it is also quite expensive.  Another friend used St. Louis Hospital for a carpal tunnel operation that was botched so I'm not confident that it can be trusted.  According to the OP, the service at Chula can be pretty terrible what with having to argue with the nurses and fight for correct pricing and keep your own records.  At least Bum has all of my records on its computer going back ten years and my doctor's assistant runs interference for me if there are any problems.  I have noticed that Bum's quality of care seems to have been going downhill for the past several years so it's an opportune time to make a change.

 

If I can survive for five more years, I'll move back to Little Saigon (Westminster, CA) where I have Medicare and my daughter and friends can arrange all kinds of services within the Vietnamese community.  My daughter is a social worker who handles a case load of elderly Vietnamese patients since she is a Vietnamese speaker.

Look I am overcritical

I also try to do medical on a shoe string

Chula has weaknesses on admin, and waiting times, HOWEVER in my humble opinion the underlying care and expertise can only be described as the very best, my personal budget is limited, so I choose Chulalongkorn, if my budget were unlimited I would still chose the same surgeon but at a different location

I also believe Chulalongkorn is a safe hospital unlike some but not all private hospitals

good luck sir

2 hours ago, gamini said:

Commenting on your post. You have made some valid points, India for example. How long have you been in Thailand? . Do you speak Thai? Do you have good Thai friends? The latter will always point you to the best doctors. Speaking Thai helps a lot in government hospitals.

You made no mention of Siriraj hospital which is the best in Thailand?  Chula is not that good.  You seem to think you know a lot more than others on this forum.  But I dont seem to feel that you have been here a long time. No offence intended.

You are correct I have only been here ten years, not a long time

I have in that time taught my wife to speak good english

Yes my knowledge of thai is limited but I always have my wife with me

I do not say I know more than others, just I have had unfortunately too much experience of hospitals in the last eighteen months

Sir tell us a little about your experience with hospitals here, so we can understand where you come from, have you spent much time in hospital here, also are you like me with no insurance

I am looking for friends with more hands on experience than I have, maybe you can help

You are maybe correct Chulalongkorn in Bangkok has some weaknesses and waiting times are sometimes slow, however I believe it is the number one Teaching Hospital here in Thailand, also it is exceedingly well priced and a fraction of the cost of say the Bumrungrad, my colorectal surgeon also operates there, he assures me the equipment at Chula is superior, the difference is cost and rather substantial

It is one of the very best equipped hospitals so again in my humble opinion I believe, also the number one cancer hospital in Thailand, and currently building a billion bhatt new cancer facility, with particle radiation

I know the Queen Mother who is not in good health is a regular patient there, so some people in high places have equal faith in it  as do I , why would she go anywhere other than the very best

Thank you for your kind comments, I look forward to your observations